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Trump Remarks on Immigration; New Judicial Decision on Clinton Emails. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired August 22, 2016 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[14:00:00] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Hi there. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thank you for being with me on this Monday.

Let's get to it. And really what - we begin with the news of what could become the biggest flip-flop yet in the race for the White House. Donald Trump, he's pushing back on reports that he may be softening his stance on immigration, a signature plank in his rise to the GOP ticket. Questions about Trump's policy were raised after a weekend meeting with Hispanic advisors to his campaign where Trump reportedly said he wanted a, quote, "humane and efficient way," end quote, to deal with undocumented immigrants in this country, leading a lot of folks to wonder if he is perhaps backing down from his early ambitions.

Just a reminder to all of you, up until this point, Mr. Trump has always said that the 11 million undocumented immigrants in the U.S. need to go, leave the country by force if necessary. Here's a reminder.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: We are going to have a deportation force. And you're going to do it humanly. Very inexpensively.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, are they going to be ripped out of their homes? How?

TRUMP: Can I tell you - they're going back where they came. If they came from a certain country, they're going to be brought back to that country.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're rounding them all up?

TRUMP: We're rounding them up in a very humane way, in a very nice way, and they're going to be happy because they want to be legalized.

They will go out. They will come back - some will come back, the best, through a process. They have to come back legally.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Kellyanne Conway, Trump's campaign manager, admitting here on CNN the release of a specific immigration plan has gone - has gone from ASAP to TBD. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KELLYANNE CONWAY, TRUMP CAMPAIGN MANAGER: As the weeks unfold, he will lay out the specifics of that plan that he would implement as president of the United States.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Will that plan include a deportation force, the kind that he just - you just heard in that soundbite and that he talked about during the Republican primaries?

CONWAY: To be determined.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Thus the conversation.

Meantime, Hillary Clinton has her own steep hill to climb with breaking news in the investigation into the use of a private e-mail server. The State Department, we're hearing now, could release thousands upon thousands of new documents uncovered in the FBI investigation just before the November presidential election.

We have both sides covered for you, of course. Let's begin with Sunlen Serfaty, who joins me now in Washington on the Trump camp.

You know, we know that Mr. Trump, Sunlen, has just told Fox News that he wants a fair but firm immigration system. What exactly does that mean?

SUNLEN SERFATY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that's a good question, Brooke. We have the same question, too. And I - we await right now Donald Trump's definition of what "fair and firm" actually means because, quite frankly, right now, there still are a lot of mixed messages coming from Trump and his campaign. We heard him this morning a bit on the defensive saying, look, I'm not flip-flopping on this, insisting that he's not having a change in policy. But then on the other side, you do have this meeting that he convened this weekend on Saturday in New York City with this newly formed Hispanic council made up of his supporters and leaving that meeting - some sources in that meeting told CNN that they weren't clear what his position on immigration is and many also indicated that he could - they thought he might be softening many of his positions.

And then you had, as you pointed out, Kellyanne Conway, his campaign manager, saying that his policy that he had during the primary for a deportation force is TBD. So, i.e., not set in stone at all. You know, Trump will give a major address on immigration reform at some point this week where we believe that there will be some clarification for this. But certainly there are more questions than there are answers. And all of this is so notable, not only where we are in this race, but for the fact that immigration is such a core part of Donald Trump's campaign. From the very beginning, it's been such a hallmark, especially the hardline stance that he's taken. So it sets up the potential to be a big reversal.

BALDWIN: We will listen to those details Thursday. In the meantime, we know Trump is in the battleground state of Ohio

today, where a new poll has just been released. I understand Hillary Clinton has a lead, but by how much?

SERFATY: Yes, this is interesting. A big battleground state, of course, always seems that Iowa - Ohio really is the state in the end. Right now, Clinton has a small edge, four-point lead, not by much. When you're just looking at the horse race numbers, there you see them, 43 to 39. I was also struck when we're talking about these candidates going to Ohio, reaching out to working class voters, I was also struck with one other number when you look at who has - who's looking out for the little guy. They asked voters, who looks out for you. So important to Ohio voters. Neither, frankly, did very well, but Clinton has a slight edge. She polls at 42 to Trump's 38 percent.

BALDWIN: OK, Sunlen Serfaty, thank you so much.

[14:05:00] Let me bring my panel in to discuss what TBD could mean and what we could be listening for this coming Thursday. Maeve Reston is with us, CNN national political reporter. Al Cardenas is back, the head of the Latin America Practice Group at the law firm of Squire Patton Boggs. He previously served as the chairman for the Florida Republican Party. And John Phillips is with us, CNN political commentator, talk radio host and Trump supporter.

So great to have all of you on.

And -

AL CARDENAS, LAWYER SPECIALIZING IN LATIN AMERICAN PRACTICE: Thank you.

BALDWIN: John, let me just begin with you. You know we heard Trump today on his immigration policy say fair but firm. We heard Kellyanne say TBD. Do you know what TBD means?

JOHN PHILLIPS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, unless you're little Kim over in North Korea, no head of state is going to get 100 percent of what they want. That's how the system works. It was what James Madison talked about, warring factions going for their own piece of the pie and ending up with a result that all of us can live with. In the primary, Trump took the hawkish position on the border. At the time, the front-runner, Jeb Bush, took a position that was closer to where his brother was. Republican primary voters sided with Donald Trump over Jeb Bush. If he gets elected, he's going to push the country -

BALDWIN: Overwhelmingly, by the way.

PHILLIPS: That's right. He's going to push the country in that direction. But that being said, he knows that at some point he's going to have to take half a loaf. Look at what happened in the battle over health care. President Obama ran on that platform. He said, we're going to have a public option. He said, illegal aliens are going to have health care under this bill. When he started negotiating, when he started pushing through the process, what happened? He took those elements out. That's what happens in America.

BALDWIN: OK, so as I'm listening to you very, very carefully, when you say "half a loaf," that, to me, leads to a potential opening in - you know, I don't know if you want to call it a flip-flop, an evolution, a reversal of a stance of a hard line, you know, a hard line stance on a policy. But are you telling me that perhaps when we hear from Mr. Trump Thursday, that the deportation force may be a thing of the past?

PHILLIPS: I don't think it's going to be a flip-flop. I think if he gets elected, he's definitely going to push the country in the direction of having more control over who comes in and out of the country. A flip-flop would be what Hillary Clinton did on TPP when she said it was the gold standard, then she said she's against it and then sent Terry McAuliffe out to tell donors if she gets elected she's going to flip on day one.

BALDWIN: But on Mr. Trump - I appreciate the TPP note on Hillary Clinton. You're not the only one to point an evolution there out. But actually, Al, let me just bring you in. You're hearing this conversation.

CARDENAS: Right.

BALDWIN: You heard his comment about half a loaf. What are you hearing when you hear "TBD" and "fair and firm" and maybe changing?

CARDENAS: Listen, as someone who wants immigration reform, comments just made are great except that we've been at this for ten years with people a lot more willing to compromise than Donald Trump. And so, you know, my prospects at this time are rather dim that we'll get immigration reform done. The big question is, will he deport everyone? And that's what the whole $50 million population Hispanic community is looking at and we'll see what he says on Thursday.

I can't see him walking away deportation. That's what built this base to win the primary. That's what the people around him in his inner circle are mostly advocating. And so I don't see him moving much. He's advocated deporting everybody and then letting back in those who we think meet certain criteria. I don't know how that works.

The whole idea here is the mind-set and the optics of taking people away from their homes at midnight. That's what got the Hispanic community so upset. He's got less than 20 percent support. He's got less than three months to go. We'll see what he says Thursday.

But, you know, at this point in time, meeting with 17 leaders in the community a year before the election sounded like a good first step, but, you know, we're at this stage where he should be meeting with thousands, not 17. I'm hoping for the best. I'm glad he met with leaders. I like some of those people in the room with him.

BALDWIN: Yes.

CARDENAS: I think they would give good advice. But we'll see if it's too little too late. BALDWIN: Maeve, what about Al's point that what Trump has said in the

last 14 or so months has so totally upset - when you hear phrases like "build a wall" and "deportation force," you know, "drug dealers," "rapists," you know, and we talk about the coalition based upon those phrases, that really he built and, you know, really won those primaries, if he were to soften on his stance, what's the bigger sort of net gain versus net loss between Hispanics and those who like what he had to say?

MAEVE RESTON, CNN NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER: I mean I think that that is going to be the most interesting question that we'll be watching this week as he goes to Colorado and Nevada to deliver these messages. I mean he was incredibly specific about the deportation force. He, you know, modeled it on the so-called Operation Wetback under Eisenhower, which, of course, was using a slur at that time, and a lot of Hispanic voters were really offended by that message from Donald Trump. You know, that was an operation where they literally rounded up people on ranches and took then back on buses and cargo boats. So there's a lot of history here with Hispanic voters that he's going to have to smooth over and explain what he meant when he said that operations like that was the model for his policies.

[14:10:03] CARDENAS: Yes, exactly.

RESTON: And not only that, I mean he is certainly walking a tricky line here where clearly the people that he has brought into his campaign were most fired up by his immigration policies. That is the first thing they will tell you at the rallies when grow and talk to his supporters. And if he softens, you know, a little bit in these last 11 weeks, how much of a risk does he take of losing those people. At the same time, on the other hand, you know, a lot of these Hispanic voters probably won't trust this new message because it's so different than what he said in the past.

BALDWIN: John, what do you think?

CARDENAS: Yes, Brooke, listen, a convention is supposed -

BALDWIN: Go ahead, Al, first, and then John.

CARDENAS: Yes, a convention is supposed to set the tone and the theme of your campaign in the home stretch, the last 90 days. What I remember at our convention is Sheriff Arpaio with a wall in the background as he gave his speech. And I also remember that the most said slogan during the convention by the delegates were - was "build a wall." Now, building a wall is not in and of itself offensive. What it surrounds and what the rhetoric is, is. And so the optics are clearly stated through the convention, how he comes across differently than what was intended at the theme of a convention would take a magician to pull out. I don't think he is one.

BALDWIN: Hmm. John?

RESTON: And he's losing by a huge margin in the Colorado (INAUDIBLE).

PHILLIPS: Well, when you march towards the general election - BALDWIN: I want - let me have John respond to that, to be fair.

PHILLIPS: Yes.

BALDWIN: John, go ahead.

PHILLIPS: When you pivot, you move towards the general election, you're dealing with a different electorate. So there are ways of talking about the issue that have a broader appeal. Even going back into the primaries, when he would talk about the wall, he would talk about the magnificent door that would be part of the wall. When you - when you have greater control over what comes in and out of the country, that not only benefits the United States, there are aspects of that that benefit other countries. He could talk about, for example, the fact that we don't have a lot of control over the guns that unfortunately go from the United States to Mexico that fuel the drug cartel and fuel a lot of the violence that happens south of the border. If you have more control over what's going on, on the southern border, then you can prevent a lot of that violence. He should spend more time talking about those issues.

CARDENAS: Yes. I agree with that.

BALDWIN: But, John - John, do you think - do you think - let's say this Thursday, you know, with this whole TBD, he softens his stance a tad on immigration. Do you - how much - how worried would you be about that group of voters, that coalition that he built during the primaries? Or do you think they are so, you know, supportive of Mr. Trump as is that it wouldn't matter come November 8th?

PHILLIPS: Well, he's still going to push the country into a more hawkish position. Barack Obama didn't lose the left wing of the Democratic Party when he dropped the public option or he dropped health care for illegal immigrants. It's just part of what happens.

BALDWIN: So you wouldn't be worried? That's really my question.

PHILLIPS: No, I think that - I think the Trump supporters are going to be with him moving on into November. He's not going to lose them.

BALDWIN: OK, John Phillips, Al Cardenas, Maeve Reston, thank you very much on Trump and immigration.

CARDENAS: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Coming up next, though, let's talk Hillary Clinton and the headline her campaign did not want to see, this federal judge ordering the review of nearly 15,000 new documents. They're from her personal e-mail server. Why could those come out now? How might that be an October surprise the Clinton campaign would not want?

And it is not a TV news network. It is Donald Trump's campaign team, both officially and unofficially. A popular Fox News personality has reportedly just signed on. We'll tell you who.

Plus - (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Look at my African-American over here! Look at him. Are you the greatest?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Remember that moment from a couple of months ago? We'll talk to the man Donald Trump singled out at a rally earlier this year. He is a Republican actually running for Congress in California, African- American voter, not quite decided if Trump is the guy. What does he think now about Trump's outreach to African-American voters in this country?

I'm Brooke Baldwin and this is CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:18:00] BALDWIN: You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

We're following breaking developments into the investigation into Hillary Clinton's use of her private e-mail server. A federal judge today gave the State Department exactly one month to lay out a plan and review and release nearly 15,000 more documents uncovered by the FBI. These are documents not previously disclosed by Secretary Clinton's attorneys. Republicans pouncing on the judge's order. RNC Chairman Reince Priebus just gave this statement which reads in, quote, "the process for reviewing these e-mails needs to be expedited, public disclosure should begin before early voting starts and the e- mails in question should be released in full before Election Day."

CNN's senior Washington correspondent Jeff Zeleny is covering this part of the story for us today.

And, first of all, do we have any idea what could be in this document dump?

JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: We don't exactly, Brooke, but because these are e-mails that have not been turned over, but we have seen so many thousands of e-mails before that, you know, it's likely that most of them are of the same tone, the same variety here.

But, again, the Clinton campaign did not - or the Clinton State Department did not turn them over before, so we don't know if they, a, are hiding something, or, b, they, you know, simply got lost in the shuffle here. Now most people do not believe that that is what happened, that they got lost in the shuffle.

But, Brooke, the bigger picture her is, it is a drip, drip, drip that is going to continue until election day. These are all part of a suit that was filed by this conservative watchdog group. Now, the Clinton campaign has pushed back in a new statement. Let's take a look at that right now. It's from Brian Fallon. He said, "as we have always said, Hillary Clinton provided the State Department with all the work- related e-mails she had in her possession in 2014. We are not sure what additional materials the Justice Department may have located, but if the State Department determines any of them to be work-related, then, obviously, we support those documents being released publicly as well."

[14:20:02] So, Brooke, the challenge here for the Clinton campaign is they are trying to move beyond all of this. They are trying to talk about Donald Trump. That is what she wants her focus to be on, but they simply cannot get around a controversy that, as we'll all remember, it is of her own making when she decided to set up that private e-mail server all the way back in January of 2009.

BALDWIN: Talk to the Trump folks, as you very well know, and they love talking about those e-mails, as I'm sure we will when they come.

ZELENY: Right.

BALDWIN: Let me ask you, too, new developments today on the Clinton Foundation from former President Bill Clinton. What's the development today?

ZELENY: Well, Bill Clinton is outlining more specifically what they will do at the Clinton Foundation. And he said this in a letter to his supporters. Let's take a look at this.

BALDWIN: If she wins.

ZELENY: If she wins, exactly. He said, "if she is elected, we will immediately implement the following changes. The foundation will accept contributions only from U.S. citizens, permanent residents and U.S.-based independent foundations whose names we will continue to make public on a quarterly basis and we will change the official name from the Bill, Hillary, and Chelsea Clinton Foundation to the Clinton Foundation." And then he goes on to say that he will step down from it entirely.

But, Brooke, again, this does not quite questions about the foundation. Donald Trump is calling for it to be shut down entirely. So it simply adds fuel to questions about the Clintons overall. But, again, you know, these are interlinked, the e-mails and the foundation here. But, again, most surveys say that voters who are already skeptical of the Clintons may have questions about this. But, overall, people want to talk about the economy and other things here. So, you know, this is going to be some background noise, I guess, for the next 70 some odd days.

BALDWIN: Seventy-eight and counting.

ZELENY: Right.

BALDWIN: Jeff Zeleny, thank you very much.

ZELENY: Thanks, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Let's talk about this here. Let me bring in Mark Preston, CNN Politics executive editor. And just first on this, to quote Jeff Zeleny, you know, the drip, drip, drip of the e-mails. I mean might this be an October surprise that really actually could affect the Clinton campaign?

MARK PRESTON, CNN POLITICS EXECUTIVE EDITOR: Well, strategically, if you are a Republican at this point, if you are helping run Donald Trump's campaign, probably what you want to happen is for this to be discussed over and over again up until October. The idea that something might be hidden, that there might be something in the e- mails that could cause her embarrassment, could cause her pain, could be a political liability, and then you want it to be unleashed in October at that point because it is so close to Election Day.

Now, the question is, is there really anything in there that would matter to the American people? And we don't know because we don't know what is in there. But to Jeff's point right there, at this point this is a nagging injury right now for the Clintons. It could become worse. But most people right now would prefer, I think, to hear about how each candidate is going to deal with ISIS. How they're going to turn the economy around. How they're going to save people's homes and what have you. But I don't want to underestimate how this could be damaging to the Clintons if there is something in those e-mails.

BALDWIN: Yes. And we're hearing about those issue and specifically there was a piece in "The Washington Post" over the weekend, you know, talking about how, you know, pretty confident the Clinton campaign is when you look at the polls. I mean we were just showed a poll in Ohio, you know, laying out - essentially laying out her White House agenda. And while I don't think - I think there was a line in the piece that sort of said, you know, I don't think she's measuring the draperies just yet, you know, for 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, but do you - is this 78 days to go pretty normal for a candidate to do this or do you see this as a tad too confident?

PRESTON: Look, I think that the Clinton campaign, while it may look like they are quote/unquote measuring the drapes or they're looking beyond the election, I seriously doubt that the strategists in Brooklyn right now are thinking that way. We saw just in the last, you know, few hours they laid out their plans, their advertising plans, an $80 million advertising buy up through Election Day in key states that they feel like they need to win in order to win the presidency. I don't think - while the e-mail mess is certainly a distraction, potentially could be harmful to them politically, I don't think they're taking the eye off the ball, nor do I think the Trump campaign is either, as they really are girding for this really 50-yard dash to the finish line in November.

BALDWIN: You mentioned the ads and I'm so glad you did. I wanted to ask you, you know, we know today this one particular ad is hitting the airwaves and it's being compared to the, you know, Lyndon B. Johnson era '64 Barry Goldwater, the famous "Daisy" add. And so let me - let me play first that initial 1964 "Daisy" ad, followed by the Clinton campaign's ad that is on TV today. Here you go.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Five, four, three, two, one, zero.

These are the stakes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In times of crisis, America depends on steady leadership.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Knock the crap out of him, would you? Seriously.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Clear thinking.

TRUMP: I know more about ISIS than the generals do, believe me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[14:25:06] BALDWIN: How effective do you think that will be, Mark Preston?

PRESTON: Well, certainly I think it's effective in the sense that if you're trying to cast doubt on whether Donald Trump is stable enough to have the nuclear codes, is stable enough to be commander in chief, there are certainly folks out there that have some concerns about that. And an ad like that is going to push them that way. And it will be interesting to see what the Trump campaign does, what their ad is going to be, and to counter that. And we now know the Trump campaign, they already have an ad out right now, but they're going to start going on the air. It's going to get really, really nasty, Brooke, as we're going forward. And ads like that, while they look like they're tough, just give us another month, I think they're going to get - they're certainly going to get even more biting from both sides.

BALDWIN: I'm sure you are right. Mark Preston, thank you so much, from Washington.

Coming up next, Donald Trump's vice presidential candidate here, his running mate, talks to CNN. And he says despite new leadership at the top of the campaign, the man in charge has not changed.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. MIKE PENCE (R), VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The man that is running this campaign is now and always has been Donald Trump. And I couldn't be more honored to be standing shoulder to shoulder with him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: You will hear more from Alisyn Camerota's interview there with Mike Pence.

Also, Roger Ailes, Steve Bannon, and now reportedly a top Fox News host, all media power players, said to be in some form or fashioned advising Donald Trump. But why would he rely on people who have never run a political campaign? That's coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)