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CNN NEWSROOM

Trump's Russia Hack; Hillary Clinton Speech Tonight; Interview with Rep. Steny Hoyer; DNC Ratings. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired July 28, 2016 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:30:30] CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: The Trump campaign is doing double duty this morning. The nominee trying to explain himself after he seemingly called for Russia to hack his political opponent, Hillary Clinton, and then redirect the conversation to the investigation into Clinton's use of a personal email server.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: And when I'm being sarcastic with somebody, first of all, they don't even know --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Were you being sarcastic?

TRUMP: Of course I'm being sarcastic. But you have 33,000 e-mails deleted. And the real problem is what was said on those e-mails from the Democratic National Committee.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: All right, so let's talk about this. Our panel is back with us. John Avlon, Hilary Rosen and Scottie Nell Hughes.

OK, so, Hilary, is it possible that Trump was being sarcastic, that he was just joking? And if he was, what's wrong with that?

HILARY ROSEN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: It's possible he was just joking, although he didn't sound it and he tweeted it after he said it and he didn't say he was joking. But, guess what, it's not funny. It's not funny to suggest that the Russian state should hack an American's e-mail. And, by the way, we know that the Russian state already, you know, did infiltrate the Democrat National Committee.

So instead of doing what other responsible leaders would do, which is to say, when I am president, I am going to do everything I can to make sure that our country's cyber security forces are in place and that we have things to protect Americans, he's making jokes about hurting Americans. Not funny.

COSTELLO: Not funny. Well, Mike Pence -- Scottie, Mike Pence released a press release. And in the press release he urged that Russia be punished for hacking into the DNC, while Trump joked or said -- or I don't know, was he joking, but --

SCOTTIE NELL HUGHES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Mike Pence issued the official statement --

COSTELLO: OK.

HUGHES: Let's point this out here.

COSTELLO: But the official statement for Mike Pence went --

HUGHES: We're talking --

COSTELLO: Let me finish.

HUGHES: Right.

COSTELLO: He said, you know, he said that Russia should be punished.

HUGHES: Right.

COSTELLO: While Trump seemingly says -- said to Russia, bring it on.

HUGHES: He said if any foreign country interferes in American elections, they should be punished. But it's funny to say "responsible." Responsibility in this while situation. Mr. Trump accomplished what he wanted to --

ROSEN: You're not going to defend him?

HUGHES: My turn. My turn.

Mr. Trump actually did what he wanted to do yesterday. He reminded people that she broke the law. She sat there time and time again, that she had a private server. That is what -- talk about responsibility. You have a bill right now in the Senate and the House is going to take it up as well, to revoke her security clearance because she's not able and unfit to handle top secrets because of what her actions were. Thirty-three thousand e-mails have been deleted.

ROSEN: Mike Pence didn't even defend Donald Trump on this one.

HUGHES: She had a private -- she had a private --

ROSEN: (INAUDIBLE).

HUGHES: It reminded everybody that she broke the law, knowingly broke the law, and was told time and time again, do not do this and she did it.

JOHN AVLON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Scottie, what -- what -- what we all --

HUGHES: Mr. Trump won on the subject because it reminded the American people they cannot trust her.

AVLON: (INAUDIBLE) Trump (INAUDIBLE) way to keep describing him. Look, I -- Donald -- we all know that politicians, when we talk about their strategy, very -- what they say in public, it's really more often an issue of impulse. And Donald Trump has some impulse control in this regard. He is a great entertainer. And he, I think, plays up a lot of his ability to be controversial and to deflect and distract. But it's not about strategy, it's about the shtick. And the problem is, we're at that stage of the campaign where everything is deadly serious. We're turning into the camera and calling on Russia to hack your political opponent and release the e-mails?

HUGHES: That's not what he did. In your opinion, because that's how you want to spin it --

AVLON: If you -- you can stand this -- you --

HUGHES: No, that's how you want to spin it.

AVLON: No, no, no, no, of course it's my opinion, but --

HUGHES: That's exactly how you want to spin it.

AVLON: But we're all talking --

HUGHES: I thought these e-mails didn't matter. They were just yoga. I thought these were just yoga and wedding e-mails that -- they didn't matter.

AVLON: There are also are facts. This is unprecedented --

HUGHES: The point of this whole thing is --

AVLON: Scottie --

ROSEN: Oh, (INAUDIBLE) Trump --

HUGHES: It was a private server.

AVLON: You know better.

HUGHES: It's a private server.

(CROSS TALK)

COSTELLO: But -- OK. Stop for just a second. Stop for just a second because I want to get into the careless issue. If Donald Trump is accusing Hillary Clinton of being careless --

HUGHES: In actions.

COSTELLO: Could you argue that he's also being careless by making these remarks that voters don't understand whether it's a joke or not? Isn't that careless?

ROSEN: That Mike Pence, his vice president --

HUGHES: With words.

ROSEN: Vice presidential candidate won't even defend. Not a single Republican defended this yesterday. HUGHES: Actually, he came out -- they came actually on the Trump -- it actually came out on the Trump campaign. They are the ones that put the statement out. But can I answer Carol's question, please?

AVLON: But you know that all night (INAUDIBLE) were face palming when they heard this. You know that because it's true.

HUGHES: Because of his comments, because they didn't know.

COSTELLO: I do want -- I do want -- I do want to know (ph) because --

AVLON: (INAUDIBLE).

HUGHES: And I agree, his verbiage and -- his verbiage. But the key isn't on this (ph). This isn't (ph) an election about words. That's the problem. Democrats keep focusing on words. The actions.

COSTELLO: It is a -- but the president's words -- the president of the United States' words --

HUGHES: Do matter.

COSTELLO: He has a huge platform.

HUGHES: But he didn't --

COSTELLO: Everyone in the world listens to the president of the United States.

HUGHES: But he did not say "hack."

COSTELLO: this is part of the reason --

HUGHES: He did not encourage this hack. He said to find them. We've already proven that they have hacked in. And, in fact, the DNC had been told several times before, you have been hacked, and they did nothing about it till it came out. The 11,000 voicemails that were released last night by WikiLeaks from the DNC, those are just as incriminating.

[09:35:05] ROSEN: No. No.

HUGHES: And there's more to come.

ROSEN: Sorry.

HUGHES: Well, I'm sorry, these were just about -- why does Hillary care? What difference does it make? They were just (INAUDIBLE).

ROSEN: Right, there's no -- there's simply no response here --

HUGHES: Yes, there -- yes, there's no response.

ROSEN: That makes it OK not to stand up, if you want to be the leader of the free world, and take a question like that seriously.

HUGHES: And have a private server.

ROSEN: There's no -- I'm sorry, there is no response anywhere --

HUGHES: You sit there and say that his words are words to the private server.

COSTELLO: Can I just interrupt, because I want to ask my E.P. a question. Michelle, do we have the original Trump bite from the presser yesterday ready to go? OK, so they're working to get it and we'll continue to talk about that because I want to play it again so that viewers can listen to it and decide for themselves whether Mr. Trump was indeed being sarcastic or joking.

You were saying.

HUGHES: And then can we compare it with 30,000 e-mails that are missing right --

AVLON: (INAUDIBLE) but, Carol, but here's the -- here's the standard. Scottie, here is the standard for folks at home --

HUGHES: And the security of --

COSTELLO: Well, let John get in.

AVLON: If they're trying to figure out if someone is spinning. Would they be singing a totally different tune if the candidate from the other party said it?

HUGHES: But we --

AVLON: And that's a problem. If Hillary Clinton someone called on Russia to hack Donald Trump, you'd be screaming bloody murder and you'd be right.

HUGHES: But the Republicans would not have a private server in the home of the secretary of state and magically deleted 33,000 e-mails.

AVLON: (INAUDIBLE).

HUGHES: Yoga.

ROSEN: Hillary Clinton actually apologized.

HUGHES: Oh, that made all the difference.

ROSEN: Donald Trump hasn't -- wait a second, Donald Trump might have said this morning, you know what, that was a dumb thing to say. Sorry. Instead, he's saying, I was just kidding, when it's not funny to joke about national security like that.

HUGHES: He did not encourage them to hack.

ROSEN: And put Americans at risk.

COSTELLO: OK. HUGHES: Americans at risk, really? He put more Americans at risk?

COSTELLO: All right, so let's -- let's stop once again, because we do have that bite ready. So this is how Donald Trump said that thing about Russia in the press conference yesterday. So you decide for yourself whether you think he was being sarcastic or joking. Take it away.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Russia, if you're listening, I hope you're able to find the 30,000 e-mails that are missing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Now, Scottie, when you hear that, as a voter, could you determine, whether Donald Trump was joking or being sarcastic?

HUGHES: But the fact that you're saying that he told them to go hack into it is ludicrous. I mean, listen, I hope you're able to find -- he's not saying --

COSTELLO: Was he being sarcastic or joking?

HUGHES: But the question -- he's not saying go hack into -- go find --

COSTELLO: Was he being sarcastic or joking?

HUGHES: That -- you could -- I hope -- I think -- I could see very easily where that could be taken as sarcasm because it's one of those, like, I hope you're able to find it, because she obviously cannot.

COSTELLO: Really? There was no smile afterwards. There was no -- you know, he tugs on his jacket when he says --

HUGHES: The question is, where are those 33,000 e-mails. That right here is the question. It's not about whether or not it's a joke or not.

AVLON: Scottie has a difficult job right now --

ROSEN: Yes.

AVLON: I mean to -- to be fair.

ROSEN: To be honest.

AVLON: Because you -- but you know when you heard that, that was not what -- it did not seem to you to be a good idea on the part of the candidate. But, you know, you've got to defend what your guy does. The problem is, your guy it just talking off-the-cuff. He was counter programming the convention and did it very effectively until he said something that was indefensible from a security perspective, from an ethics perspective. And, look, you could right --

HUGHES: But guess what now -- AVLON: You could correctly point out that the server was a disastrously dumb decision, but that has nothing to do with what Donald Trump did yesterday.

HUGHES: But it put the focus back on it. And, by the way, there are more people now looking for 33,000 e-mails that were before. So maybe he did accomplish his goal.

AVLON: So you're saying that if there are rouge (ph) hackers out there, then --

ROSEN: You mean (INAUDIBLE) --

HUGHES: And now we're trying to find where these -- like she said, they were just yoga points, so what does it matter. What difference does it make?

ROSEN: Well --

COSTELLO: All right. We're just talking round and round, aren't we?

ROSEN: I think Americans care about their security. That's what I think.

COSTELLO: All right, I've got to leave it there. Hilary Rosen, John Avlon, Scottie Nell Hughes, thanks to all of you.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, Vice President Joe Biden gets fired up. But did he fire up the middle class for Hillary Clinton?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:42:48] COSTELLO: Hours from now, Hillary Clinton takes center stage and officially accepts the Democratic nomination. No matter where you stand on her politics, tonight will be historic. All week, Democratic heavyweights have made their place for a Clinton. Last night, the former mayor, Michael Bloomberg, tried to sell independence, and while Vice President Joe Biden tried to court the middle class.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: How can there be pleasure in saying "you're fired." He's trying to tell us he cares about the middle class. Give me a break. That's a bunch of malarkey.

Whatever he thinks, and I mean this from the bottom of my heart, I know I'm called middle class Joe. In Washington that's not meant as a compliment. It means you're not sophisticated. But I know why we're strong. I know why we have held together. I know why we are united. It's because there's always been a growing middle class. This guy doesn't have a clue about the middle class. Not a clue.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: With me now to talk about this, Democratic Congressman and House Minority Whip Steny Hoyer.

Welcome, sir.

REP. STENY HOYER (D), MINORITY WHIP: Carol, good to be with you.

COSTELLO: Joe Biden certainly fired up the crowd.

HOYER: And Joe Biden can do that. He gets fired up himself. And I think, frankly, Joe Biden, from Scranton, PA, is a middle class guy and he connects with the middle class. My granddaughter adores Joe Biden. And I think that he speaks the language of people who are striving, who are proud of their country, and want to take advantage. And my phrase is, they want to make it America. And I think Joe Biden speaks to them. And I thought he was very effective last night.

COSTELLO: There was one line that particularly stood out to me. He said, you know, they call me middle class Joe. I know what that means. It means I'm not sophisticated. I know what it means, right? Why can't Hillary Clinton capture just an iota of the essence of that?

HOYER: Well, I think she's going to capture an essence of that. And I think, frankly, the message yesterday was, Hillary Clinton's whole life, from teenager to today, has been working on behalf of the middle class. Now, Hillary Clinton's personality is Hillary Clinton's personality. You're -- when you're with her personally, she is delightful.

[09:45:09] COSTELLO: Yes, everybody says that, but why -- why --

HOYER: It -- it is the fact.

COSTELLO: Why is she unable to project that when she speaks publicly?

HOYER: I -- frankly, I -- maybe it's because I know her and, therefore, you know, you know somebody and so the projection is you know what is -- what is there. And I think she'll do that. But, really, this is not about personality. This is not about how you project Donald Trump can be as bombastic as he wants and, you know, all of that.

COSTELLO: So, but -- so you say it's not about personality, but it really is, isn't it?

HOYER: I know what you mean.

COSTELLO: Of course it is, right?

HOYER: Sure, yes, I mean you've got to connect with people and people. I mean that's why Bill Clinton is so --

COSTELLO: Right. They have to trust you to fight for them.

HOYER: Sure.

COSTELLO: They have to believe you're genuine. HOYER: But they ought to look at the facts and that's what was --

that's what Obama said last night. That's what Kaine said last night of Hillary Clinton. That's what Biden said. And that's what Bloomberg said. The whole pitch was, look, Hillary Clinton has done this for over four decades. This is not a speech for her. This is her life. This is her commitment. And, frankly, that ought to count for something that you just don't talk, you do. You do the walk.

COSTELLO: You do. And I -- OK. So I'm from middle America.

HOYER: Yes.

COSTELLO: I think politicians always go to the state of Ohio, especially Youngstown, Ohio. I think Obama went there 14 times when he first ran for office, right?

HOYER: Uh-huh.

COSTELLO: And Youngstown, Ohio, is still having a problem. So when blue collar Americans like look at the Democrats they say, it's -- in that part of the country they say, OK, you come, you talk to us, but we're still hurting.

HOYER: I'm going to make the case that over the last 68 years, every time a Democratic has been president, America did better. And when Republicans were president, America did not do as well. I think what one of the things that the president did last night, we have to stop talking down America. That's what Trump does. We have to stop talking down our military, the greatest military on the face of the earth.

Talking down our economy. Our economy is in better shop than almost anywhere in the world. It's not good enough because we still have people who are anxious in Ohio.

COSTELLO: That's right.

HOYER: In West Virginia. I like the fact that he talked about coal miners. We have to be concerned about coal miners. You know, sure -- we can talk about global warming. We can talk about air pollution. But those are real people with real jobs who have real anxiety and we need to speak their language. And my view, of course, is that I'm a Democratic. Obviously partisan. I believe Democrats have spoken to that. I believe Hillary Clinton has spoken to that. And I think she's going to make that message tonight and over the next three months.

COSTELLO: Just my final question, because I do find this fascinating. So this idea of a blue collar billionaire, and how that seems to resonate in a certain demographic in America, among those middle class blue collar workers. Why do you suppose that is?

HOYER: Well, I think Perot resonated. Perot resonated because he said, I'm not one of them. Trump says, I'm not one of them. And people are tired of them, meaning us, the elites, you know, who they think have not done the job for them. Have forgotten about them and are in it for their -- themselves.

COSTELLO: Is it -- is it -- is it because Trump doesn't talk like a quote-unquote elitist?

HOYER: I think that's part of it. I mean he's -- he's course. He's sometimes sanctimonious, sometimes ego centric. He's a bully. He's braggadocio. A lot of bad words that the (INAUDIBLE) and that's what Kaine talked about in terms of responsibility, civility, treating one another as you'd want them to treat you. That's the antitheist of Donald Trump. So it's a -- middle and west (ph) values are pretty much -- we -- we follow the rules, we work hard and we play by the rules and we succeed and we worship our god and go to the boys and girls club, and we help our communities. That's Hillary Clinton. Donald Trump is, you know, tear the barn down. And I think everything that he say on a daily basis proves that point. And I, frankly, think the American public and the Midwestern values of which Tim Kaine talked are going to reject that ultimately.

COSTELLO: We'll see. Representative Steny Hoyer, thank you so much for stopping by.

HOYER: Thank you so much.

COSTELLO: I appreciate it.

HOYER: Great to be with you.

COSTELLO: Thank you.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, the ratings are in. So which convention had more Americans tuning in so far? We'll have the answer, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:54:06] COSTELLO: The DNC delivering big stars and big ratings. And I'm just not -- I'm not just talking about last night's ode to Broadway. Hollywood is coming out in full force. Streep, Keys, Cooper, and Bassett. And then there's the political powerhouse, the Obamas, Biden, Bill, Bernie.

And here's Brian. CNN senior media correspondent Brian Stelter is here with a word on the ratings.

Good morning.

BRIAN STELTER, CNN SENIOR MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: Good morning.

Yes, we've been looking to see how the DNC fared versus the RNC because Donald Trump is known to be a ratings magnet. He was, back when he was on "The Apprentice," and he has been again this year, with debates and speeches. But let me show you what's happening, Carol. The Democrats are out rating the Republicans, maybe because of the star power you mentioned. Night one of the RNC, 23 million viewers on the broadcast networks and the cablers. Night one of the DNC, 26 million. It was true again on Tuesday, 19 million versus 24 million for the Democrats. And we're seeing the same thing Wednesday night. The numbers from last night are just starting to come in. It looks like it will be about the same. The Democrats, about 15 percent, even 20 percent ahead in some cases of the Republicans. [09:55:09] Now, this is interesting because Donald Trump said people

would not tune into the Democratic Convention. In his fundraising emails this morning he says, don't watch Hillary tonight. He had about 30 million viewers for his speech. So we'll see how Clinton does tonight. But keep in mind, ratings for the conventions are not always an indicator of who's going to win in November. That we know for sure. So we'll see how the polls do this weekend when we see the first indications of how Clinton did at her convention.

Carol.

COSTELLO: All right, Brian Stelter, thanks so much.

The next hour of CNN NEWSROOM after a break.

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