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Outgoing DNC Chair won't Gavel in Convention; FBI Investigating Russian Hack. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired July 25, 2016 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[14:00:00] WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Our special coverage continues right now.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: And, here we go. Top of the hour. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Happy to be in beautiful Philadelphia. You're watching CNN's special live coverage here from the Democratic National Convention.

Just a short time from now the big DNC will be kicking off and Hillary Clinton gets her chance to respond to Donald Trump. Secretary Clinton poised to become the first woman to headline a major party's presidential ticket and tonight some powerhouse speakers due to take the stage behind me here to address the Democratic faithful from liberal hero Elizabeth Warren, the darling of the left, to first lady of the United States, Michelle Obama, to Clinton's former rival who is here, Bernie Sanders.

And therein lies a big problem for the Clinton campaign, how to get Senator Sanders' supporters on their side. We know he has endorsed her. He wants her to beat Trump come November. But as far as those supporters are concerned, not exactly an easy task considering what we just witnessed at a Sanders' event moments ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (D), FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We have got to defeat Donald Trump. And we have got to elect Hillary Clinton and Tim Kaine. Brothers and sisters - brothers and sisters - this is - this is the real world that we live in.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: That happened moments ago. We've got to talk about that. Also the backdrop of all of this e-mail hacking, a leadership coup and a big bounce for Donald Trump from his convention. No dearth of news on this Monday.

Let's kick things off first with Manu Raju, CNN's senior political reporter, and the FBI investigating Russia's alleged role in an e-mail leak. That has just brought down, in part, the head of the DNC, Debbie Wasserman Schultz, who we have now learned, Manu, will not be gaveling in, in two hours from now.

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER: Yes, and not even speaking either, Brooke. Actually, the Clinton campaign really did not want her to have any role in this convention after those e-mails surfaced suggesting that DNC staffers were trying to sort of tilt the scales to help Hillary Clinton in - even though they were supposed to be neutral in that Democratic primary. I had a chance to ask Robbie Mook, the Clinton campaign chairman - manager - campaign manager earlier today about whether he had any concerns with Debbie Wasserman Schultz speaking. He would not comment, which is very telling about how the campaign felt.

Now, when Debbie Wasserman Schultz herself addressed the Florida delegation earlier today, it was not pretty.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Let's hear from our speaker. We have other speakers as well.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We didn't have our voices heard.

DEBBIE WASSERMAN SCHULTZ, DNC CHAIRWOMAN: Thank you all so much.

We know that the voices in this room that are standing up and being disruptive, we know that that's not the Florida that we know. The Florida that we know is united.

CROWD: Debbie. Debbie. Debbie. Debbie.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: Now the bigger picture here, Brooke, is that the Clinton campaign and folks in the Democratic Party establishment really need to get those Bernie sanders supporters behind Hillary Clinton. They're concerned that a lot of these folks are just not there yet, even though tonight's theme of the convention is unity and that's the whole point of Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders both trying to speak to that progressive base and urge them to get behind Hillary Clinton. But as we saw to date and at that Bernie Sanders event, there's just a lot of folks who just are not quite sold on Hillary Clinton yet.

BALDWIN: You saw the woman in that shot holding up the sign that just read "e-mails." So we'll talk about that with my panel in a second, but let me just ask you, on the bounce from the RNC for Mr. Trump, how big of a bounce was it?

RAJU: It was very significant. Not only did he say that he has a five- point lead, but also really banking on the support of independent voters that went his way. A very significant shift, both independent voters and white working class voters as well, which is interesting to note because the Clinton campaign is going to be campaigning, barnstorming in Ohio and Pennsylvania after the convention to get those supporters back in their camp. So they're hoping that they get the same bounce and erase what Donald Trump gained from the Republican Convention last week, Brooke.

[14:05:19] BALDWIN: Manu Raju, thank you so much. Let me bring in my panel now. I have Susan Page, who is with me here,

Washington bureau chief for "USA Today," David Catanese, senior politics writer for "U.S. News & World Report," and our own Eric Bradner, CNN politics reporter.

So just, you know, out of the gate, I mean we just learned about this Debbie Wassermann Schultz news. I mean we - we had heard about the boos this morning, but the fact that she is now not only gaveling this entire convention in as the DNC chair, she's not speaking. Are you surprised by that, Susan?

SUSAN PAGE, WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF, "USA TODAY": So, pretty messy start to this convention.

BALDWIN: Yes.

PAGE: You know, they had a chance yesterday to put this to bed by saying she wouldn't speak, she wouldn't gavel it in.

BALDWIN: But they didn't.

PAGE: And they didn't. So this was one of the points we made at the beginning of the Republican Convention, that they didn't settle the controversies that they had brewing, that they let them stretch out over more time than they need to. This this is an example of kind of the messy start that spotlight the divisions in this party.

BALDWIN: It is united together is the theme tonight and this is how this week - you laugh.

DAVID CATANESE, SENIOR POLITICS WRITER, "U.S. NEWS & WORLD REPORT": Well -

BALDWIN: But it's not a good look.

CATANESE: Her position was untenable and if she came out here on this stage, it would have been the biggest scene of the night and all the rest of the speeches, I don't care if Bernie Sanders hit it out of the park -

BALDWIN: Yes.

CATANESE: You guys would be -

BALDWIN: We'd be talking about her tomorrow.

CATANESE: You'd be replaying that video over and over.

I was in the room for the Florida delegation breakfast.

BALDWIN: You were? What did that feel like?

CATANESE: It was chaotic. And you had Florida -- Floridians yelling at each other because you did have a contingent of Debbie Wasserman Schultz supporters and they said, knock it off, calm down, do you want Donald Trump to be president? And they were - they were going at it. I mean you had internal fights on the sides of that room beyond what was going on, on stage. It's something I've never seen. She had to be escorted out by security -

BALDWIN: Wow.

CATANESE: Because people were coming at her.

BALDWIN: Wow.

CATANESE: There were police surrounding her. I mean this is - she was driven out - her own party, figuratively and literally, drove her out of the room.

BALDWIN: Wow. I don't know if - you know, obviously, she won't be on the stage. She's got to be in the room. We know she's stepping down in the wake of all the e-mails, which we'll get into at the end of the week.

But to you, sir, so everyone is thinking, all right, so if it's not Debbie Wasserman Schultz, who is it who will be gaveling it in? Stephanie Rawlings Blake.

ERIC BRADNER, CNN POLITICS REPORTER: that's right, the mayor of Baltimore, Stephanie Rawlings Blake, who is the DNC secretary and is a figure who is much less likely to be booed when she steps onto the stage. Democrats are hoping that they can put this behind them tonight, right? They have Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren, two people who have a lot of credibility with the party's left, speaking. We saw Sanders get a lot of negative feedback earlier in a very pro- Sanders crowd when he declared the need for Democrats to rally around Hillary Clinton and Tim Kaine. Tonight, there will be Hillary Clinton delegates here, right? Those boos will be drowned out by some cheers.

BALDWIN: But let's marinate on the boos for a second. I mean one - my biggest takeaway, guys, I got - hopped the train this morning from New York and just being around downtown Philly before coming down to this whole arena, so many people like decked out in Bernie swag and Bernie gear and that struck me because this week is about Hillary Clinton. I know he's speaking tonight, but to hear those boos this morning, you know, when he was saying, we have to support Tim Kaine and Hillary Clinton, what did you think about that?

CATANESE: Bernie forces are out -

BALDWIN: They are.

CATANESE: In the masses around Philadelphia. I see more pro-Bernie anti-Hillary signs than anything pro-Hillary just walking around downtown Philadelphia.

BALDWIN: Yes.

CATANESE: I mean we made so much about the never Trump movement, right, and it sort of petered out in Cleveland. The pro-Bernie anti- Hillary movement is alive in Philadelphia. My question is, how many of them make it into the room tonight for Bernie's speech? Because you played that tape. His people are against him on this get on board. They're not some - there is a contingent -

BALDWIN: The Bernie or bust.

CATANESE: The Bernie or bust. But how many of them are delegates and how do they act inside the room when he speaks, their leaders speaks? That's going to be the telling moment.

BALDWIN: By the way, we're looking at pictures. So there's this essentially Bernie or bust. I don't know the official name of this protest. And they are going all the way from city hall in downtown Philly down to where we are. I've heard numbers in the thousands. And this is apparently supposed to happen every day.

Susan Page, here's what I'm wondering, whether or not any of them get in this hall is a great question from David, but, too, what does he say tonight to say to these support - you know, die-hard Bernie fans, you've got to - you've got to support Hillary Clinton.

PAGE: What can he say beyond what he said this afternoon and at the event that got booed from his own people? I mean it's - it's a - it's tough because he's - he certainly has led this movement. But there's an energy around progressives who are really unhappy with Hillary Clinton and unwilling to sign on now. Young people who have not - who have been reluctant to support Hillary Clinton. I don't know what he can say.

Now, they do have, you know, Elizabeth Warren starting this off.

BALDWIN: Yes.

PAGE: She's got some credibility. We think she'll be very positive. You know, there is a sense that if the evening goes well, we'll forget about the Debbie Wasserman Schultz event this morning with the Florida convention.

CATANESE: (INAUDIBLE).

PAGE: But this party had hoped to put a really united front forward, especially after the very divided Republican Party we saw. They haven't done that so far.

[14:10:05] BALDWIN: But, at the end of the day, I think what we learned from the RNC in Cleveland last week, as much as, you know, we chewed on the side stories through the whole week, at the end, it's the message. According to CNN polling, it's the candidates' message. So really it's Thursday night and Hillary Clinton in driving that home.

I'm wondering, though, Eric, with these supporters, is this their final sort of demonstration, sign of strength, but at the end of the day, they will support Hillary Clinton, or are they just -

BRADNER: It's a great question.

BALDWIN: Do we know? BRADNER: Polling so far - polling so far indicates that the most Bernie Sanders supporters are going to get on board with Hillary Clinton, but we have a very loud contingency. These are people who could conceivably support Jill Stein, the Green Party candidate, or who could stay at home. Donald Trump is trying to woo a lot of them, focusing on the issue of trade. Now, on pretty much every other issue there's a big disconnect there. So we don't really know. We kind of expected this to be the night that rallied Democrats, that sort of got them on the same page. But with the way events have played out the last couple of days, it's anybody's guess right now.

BALDWIN: Wait, I should mention, you know, you mentioned Donald Trump, and, yes, he's trying to woo the Bernie folks. He - there's this whole sort of Trump counterprogramming plan for the weekend, including we'll take it live, you know, in the 3:00 hour. He's with Mike Pence. They'll be in Winston Salem, North Carolina. He's apparently doing an AMA, a reddit (ph) on I think it's Wednesday. So, obviously, he's trying to grab the attention to himself as well.

Susan and Eric and David, thank you all so much.

Let's move along and talk about - we'll get the Clintons' campaign reaction to this breaking news that Debbie Wasserman Schultz, the chair of the DNC, will not be gaveling in, will not be speaking in less than two hours from now and we'll talk to them about the boos towards Senator Sanders saying you need to support Hillary Clinton.

Also ahead, we've got to talk about Russia. Is Russia trying to meddle in this U.S. presidential election? The new information about who is behind the hacking of top DNC officials and more on who's speaking tonight, including the first lady, Michelle Obama, who, think back eight years ago, didn't exactly see eye to eye with Hillary Clinton.

Lots to talk about on this Monday. I'm Brooke Baldwin. You're watching CNN's special live coverage from Philadelphia.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:16:23] BALDWIN: And we're back. You're watching CNN's special live coverage. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thanks for spending your Monday with me here. We are live inside the convention hall. The Democratic National Convention officially kicks off in less than two hours. But already some storylines. Let me just fill you in on what's happening here just in the last couple of moments. This is at a time when the Democrats - obviously the theme tonight, united together. We - they want unity when it comes to Hillary Clinton. The spotlight for the moment is on a couple of thing. On an e-mail scandal, on an embattled DNC chair and possible Russian meddling in this U.S. presidential election.

So I've got Brian Fallon with me, press secretary for Hillary for America.

Brian Fallon, nice to see you.

BRIAN FALLON, PRESS SECRETARY, HILLARY FOR AMERICA: Thanks for having me. BALDWIN: Looks great in here.

FALLON: This is quite a venue.

BALDWIN: You can start to feel -

FALLON: Yes.

BALDWIN: Start to feel the energy. But I've got to ask you about Debbie Wasserman Schultz. I mean now we've heard that not only will she not be speaking, she's not even gaveling in. Was that her decision?

FALLON: It was, just like the decision yesterday was her decision. I think that yesterday she made the call that she would step down at the end of the week. She was hoping to eliminate any distractions this week because she's so committed to the display of unity that we want to see here at the convention, have a distraction-free event where we can really communicate our message about Hillary Clinton's belief that we're stronger together versus Donald Trump's agenda.

BALDWIN: Did she make the decision today? Could have made it yesterday.

FALLON: Yes. So I think that a lot of folks thought that her stepping down may have eliminated the distractions. I think in retrospect today, she decided she needed to take this added step. And I think it's just a tribute to her willingness to do whatever it takes to have a distraction free convention here so that we can all come together as a party. And there's plenty of evidence that that's happening. I think that Bernie Sanders is going to give a great speech tonight that shows that our party's united. He's endorsed Hillary Clinton and I think that's going to be -

BALDWIN: We just saw him this morning at that event and he was telling, you know, this crowd, you know, we have - you have to support Tim Kaine and Hillary Clinton, but at the same time it was a boo fest.

FALLON: Well, you know, it -

BALDWIN: I mean -

FALLON: Sometimes it takes the supporters a lot longer than it does for the actual candidate. So I remember if you think back to the 2008 convention where Hillary Clinton gave her concession speech, there were tears in the eyes of a lot of those Hillary Clinton delegates on the floor in Denver that year. And so sometimes it's a hard process and it takes time, but -

BALDWIN: They didn't want to let go of Hillary Clinton eight years ago.

FALLON: That's right. That's right.

BALDWIN: And a lot of these people here in Philadelphia walking around with, you know, they don't want to let go of Bernie Sanders. The - something that my panelist just brought up a second ago though is, you could have some of them sneaking into this arena tonight. I mean are you worried about boos from within the convention hall?

FALLON: I can't control what any individual delegate might do, but I think overall we're going to have a great night tonight. We have a powerhouse lineup. When you think about progressives, you think about people like Senator Cory Booker, Senator Elizabeth Warren, Senator Bernie Sanders. They're all going to be speaking tonight along with the first lady, Michelle Obama. And I think that the power of those appearances is going to be - these are people who can vouch for Hillary Clinton's credentials when it comes to addressing issues like income inequality that is such an issue right now with disaffected voters who are still feeling the brunt of the recession.

We've come back a long way under President Obama, but there's a lot of residue of that recession. We still haven't seen wages get going again. And these are some of the best credentialed people to talk about those issues and they're going to be putting all their firepower tonight behind Hillary Clinton. I think that - those will be tremendous surrogates.

BALDWIN: I know you have seen, though, the convention bounce for Donald Trump from last week and I also know that a lot in the Hillary camp, you know, took one listen to his speech last Thursday and thought, oh, no, doom and gloom, that is not our America, and yet, I mean, is it possible that the Clinton campaign doesn't have their, you know, finger on the pulse of what Americans are truly thinking?

FALLON: No, I don't think so. I think that the - there's been a few polls that have come out today and overall the bottom line takeaway -

BALDWIN: Trump, 44 percent, Clinton 39 percent.

FALLON: Yes, well, there was a CBS poll today that has the race effectively tied. I think that the bottom line is that the race is very close. The convention bounces of the past where you saw double digit jumps after a convention, I think those days are gone. But there's probably a little bit of ground to be made up when you have a week's worth of focus on you and your agenda and your party. But I think we're going to have a great week this week and I think that the race will resettle after the two conventions happen and then going into August, I think we're going to hit the ground running right away with a bus tour with Senator Kaine and Secretary Clinton hitting the rust belt -

[14:20:28] BALDWIN: Ohio, Pennsylvania.

FALLON: Battlegrounds of Ohio, Pennsylvania. Those are the voters that Donald Trump thinks he's going to win over and that's going to power him to the presidency. We're going to go out and compete for those rural working class voters in western Pennsylvania and southeastern Ohio.

BALDWIN: Let me follow up, though, on what Robbie - Robbie Mook was telling Tapper yesterday, just on these e-mails and on Russia. I mean, straight up, do you think Russia is meddling with this election? FALLON: There's a lot of evidence that they are. And I saw that the

FBI has now opened an investigation into this breach.

BALDWIN: Yes.

FALLON: This is a very serious thing. For Russia, it's one thing to do espionage and try to collect information. A lot of countries do that. This would be tampering in an election in an attempt to produce a particular candidate. In this case, it looks like they are on the side of Donald Trump. And that would explain a lot considering that Donald Trump is going around suggesting crazy things that are even causing Republicans to blush in terms of suggesting that we withdraw from NATO, suggesting that we shouldn't defend those eastern European nations.

BALDWIN: And Hillary Clinton jumped on that today at that event with veterans right now.

FALLON: Absolutely. As she should. And he has strangely been going around praising Putin for a long time now. And so it wouldn't be a surprise at all if Putin is, in fact, rooting for Donald Trump in this election and if government sponsors are - of hacking are - and cyber terrorism are engaging in this breach of the DNC. I think that there's a lot of cyber experts that independently have come to that conclusion already and we'll see what the FBI says.

BALDWIN: We'll have a - we'll see with Donald Trump, how he responds to Hillary Clinton responding. He's got an event with Mike Pence next hour in North Carolina.

Just finally on Bernie Sanders speaking tonight, which is huge for you guys, have you all had conversation with him about any of his messaging, or any of the thoughts within his speech? Will you all be taking a look at it before he steps up there?

FALLON: Well, look, I don't think we're going to try to stage manage Bernie Sanders. I think we have a lot of confidence based on the appearance that he did with Hillary Clinton in New Hampshire that he's going to tell a great story about how Hillary Clinton is the fighter that we need against Donald Trump.

BALDWIN: Will you see it ahead of time?

FALLON: I'm not sure. He was kind enough to share his remarks just prior to the New Hampshire event and, you know what, they were perfect. So I don't think there's a lot of concern about what we might here from Bernie Sanders tonight. We have a lot of confidence that he's going to talk about the high stake of the election and he's just going to make the case for Hillary Clinton.

BALDWIN: OK. Brian Fallon, good luck.

FALLON: Thanks a lot.

BALDWIN: Good luck. Day number one here at the DNC. Coming up next, Democrats are hoping the first lady can shift the news

cycle off of the e-mails. We'll talk about tonight's speech by Michelle Obama. What we can expect her to say.

Stay with me.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:27:29] BALDWIN: We are back here live in Philadelphia. Question, is Russia meddling with the U.S. presidential election? Hillary Clinton's campaign, you just heard Brian Fallon talking to me, seems to think so, and they say it's all to help Donald Trump.

Let's go straight to Washington now, to our justice correspondent Evan Perez, who's been working this line for us.

So we know officially now the FBI is looking into the suspected Russians hacking, or their role in the hack I should say. What do you know?

EVAN PEREZ, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brooke, I mean there is strong evidence, according to officials, that indicates that this hack of the DNC was the work of the hackers - of hackers working for Russian intelligence. As you said, the FBI is now investigating this. So far they - people tell me that the evidence points to at least one group of hackers that the U.S. is very familiar with. This is a group that was involved in hacking of the non-classified e-mail systems at the State Department, at the White House, at other federal agencies. Investigators believe that Russian intelligence has been also behind a wave of cyberattacks of political organizations and even think tanks here in Washington.

Now, recently, we sat down with James Trainor, who is in charge of the FBI's cyber security investigations. He didn't want to talk about the DNC hack or the Russians. But here's what he had to say about what he's seen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES C. TRAINOR JR., ASSISTANT DIRECTOR, FBI CYBER DIVISION: Yes, it's fair to say that there's been aggressive targeting of that sector, the various campaigns, think tanks in the Washington, D.C. area, political organizations.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PEREZ: Now the release of the e-mails by WikiLeaks over the weekend adds another wrinkle to this. There's a lot we don't know. We don't know where they got these e-mails from. They're not saying. And we can't say for sure that the Russians did this to help Donald Trump. What we do know is that this is the type of activity we've seen from the Russians before in 2014. They leaked a phone call between a U.S. ambassador there in Ukraine and it was intended to help influence the events that were happening there at the time. It was a very embarrassing issue. We've seen attacks by the Russians in the Ukraine also in the power grid in the past year. So the issue here is, whoever's behind the release of these e-mails over the weekend is already having a tremendous impact on the U.S. presidential elections, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Evan Perez, thank you.

Susan Page, David Catanese, back with me to walk through some of what Evan just reported. And so, you know, first things first, just on balance, I mean do we know of any RNC e-mail hacking or this straight up DNC?

[14:30:01] CATANESE: We do not know of any RNC -

BALDWIN: OK. OK. OK. Just curious. And then, you know, just talking to Brian Fallon with the campaign, he was saying to me, you know, Putin's pal is Trump and this is all just very curious and potentially intentional and especially when you look at