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CNN NEWSROOM
Special Coverage Of United Kingdom's Landmark Decision To Leave European Union. Aired 2-3a ET
Aired June 25, 2016 - 02:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[02:00:04]
MAX FOSTER, HOST: Welcome to our viewers in the United States, and around the world as we continue our special coverage of Britain's landmark decision to leave the E.U. I'm Max foster.
BECKY ANDERSON, HOST: And I'm Becky Anderson. Well the immediate reaction has been chaotic, especially in the economic sector.
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ANDERSON: World markets have fallen sharply after the decision and the British pound dropped to historic lows against the dollar.
FOSTER: The political turmoil has been swift and severe as well. British Prime Minister, David Cameron, bowing out. He is set to be replaced at 10 Downing Street by October, he reckons. But there's no telling who will take up that mantle just yet.
ANDERSON: That's right. Meanwhile foreign ministers from the six founding E.U. member states are set to meet in Berlin in just under an hour's time.
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ANDERSON: Well our international diplomatic editor, Nic Robertson is standing by in London.
FOSTER: But we're going to start actually with Atika who is in Berlin because all eyes on mainland Europe now right Atika because they've got to find some sort of solution to get through this.
ATIKA SHUBERT, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely it's all about reaction here on the continent.
And what we have today is Foreign Minister, Walter Steinmeier. He's meeting with as Becky noted the founding members of the E.U., the foreign ministers there, that would Germany, France, Luxembourg, Belgium, Netherlands and Italy.
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SHUBERT: This is really the core group of the E.U. And their number one priority today is how to make sure this does not happen again. That no other E.U. member is even thinking or taking steps towards leaving the Union.
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SHUBERT: And so that really means two things. One they're going to be discussing how the U.K. will leave the E.U. as swiftly and as painlessly as possible. And the other is how to reform the E.U. from within. How to make it a more flexible Union, so that if one member doesn't want what others do can they negotiate some sort of a better deal? More flexibility. So those are the two issues they'll begin discussing today. But it really is just the first step in a very long process of trying to figure out how to move things forward and to make sure this doesn't happen.
ANDERSON: And Nic, there are clearly fears about the European project and its future at this point.
I wonder whether you are hearing what I am hearing which is that because of that it may be that Britain can actually squeeze a better deal out of the E.U. going forward, an associated partner country is the sort of thing that I'm hearing. What are you hearing?
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: We not hearing that from 10 Downing Street. Clearly the aspiration whether it's the remain camp or the leave camp is for something that is going to benefit Britain. So whichever way they can achieve that, and what you're suggesting sounds on track with that.
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ROBERTSON: Whichever way they can achieve it is going to be better for Britain. I mean what they don't want to do, what they won't want to negotiate is something that makes it look as if the leave camp got it all wrong. They won't want to be set themselves up for political failure right out of the gate.
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ROBERTSON: So if they can do better of countries like Norway, not a member of the E.U. but does have trade relations with the European Union at the expense of allowing people -- Europeans into the country, then that would be -- that would be the preferred status going forward.
You know there's been a concern in Britain that perhaps Britain would be punished, not so much to punish Britain but as a message to other European nations that they shouldn't try to break out of the European Union.
So if Britain can negotiate some favorable transition and a speedy transition, it's certainly better for Britain in the long run and it's certainly better to get it out of this sort of roiling financial up- and-down that it's going through at the moment and that is expected to even out in the not-too-distant future, before that negotiation of the exit is finally done.
But anything that can smooth that transition and maintain Britain's place as a leading - as a leading nation in the world is going to be favored by whomever it is that managing that exit from Britain.
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[02:05:05]
FOSTER: The question is, what's good for Britain, is it good for like capitals like Berlin Atika?
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FOSTER: Because we've seen on the leave side Boris Johnson talking about a gradual transition but actually that isn't in the interest is it of those capitals there, they want a quick transition, get this over and done with.
SHUBERT: Exactly. They want it as quick and as painlessly as possible. And this is because really the hardest economic impact isn't going to be on the E.U. it's going to be on the U.K. Germany in particular feels that it won't be as affected. Yes, there's a little bit of financial turmoil at the beginning but really the U.K. for example is Germany's third trading partner. The U.S. and France are much more important. So what they're saying is basically you know let's deal with this as soon as possible that way we can limit the damage and we can begin the process of reforming the E.U. without the U.K.
FOSTER: Atika, thank you it's going to be very busy with all that sort of diplomacy across Europe over the next years.
ANDERSON: Absolutely.
FOSTER: Right? It's not going to be months. Global investors also looking towards Monday's trading after Friday's vote plunged the markets into chaos.
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ANDERSON: We saw U.S. stocks lose more than an estimated $800 billion in value. The Dow Jones industrial down more than 600 points.
FOSTER: U.K. stocks finished down more than 3% in the end, they had been much lower. Other European indices though saw heavier losses.
ANDERSON: And the British pound fell to a 30-year low against the U.S. dollar. At one point it was worth $1.33.
FOSTER: It did bounce back up as you can see.
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FOSTER: Take a closer look at how the Asian markets did. They saw a pretty panic sell-off, because they got the news as it was coming out. What's ahead of trading in terms of Monday is what lots of people are now looking for. Mallika is in Hong Kong for us.
Mallika what are you expecting on Monday because we're going to get the first taste of the market reaction over the developments of the weekend over there in Asia.
MALLIKA KAPUR, CNN ASIA CORRESPONDENT: Yes, That's right and it looks like we could be in for a few more days of volatility. Because as you mentioned it was a day of chaos for the markets here in Asia because they were the only markets that were open and trading when the results were coming out. There was a lot of nervousness in the market and there were some serious losses across the board.
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KAPUR: We saw massive fluctuation in currency not just the pound which tanked, we saw the Yen rise to a 2 1/2-year high versus the dollar, because the Yen has traditionally been a safe haven and that's where a lot of people have been parking their money over the last couple weeks.
So overall we did see a lot of chaos and a lot of volatility in the markets, which could continue on Monday and over the next couple of days.
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KAPUR: But believe it or not, a lot of people we've been speaking to here in Asia, a lot of market watchers and traders and investors are saying, you know it may not look like this but Asia is in a fairly good position to weather the storm. And the reasons they're saying that really is when you look at trade between Asia and between the U.K. alone, it isn't very much.
Exports from across Asia to just the U.K. account were less than 1% of regional GDP and that's quite a small number. Of course some countries do a little bit more trade. Countries like Hong Kong and Vietnam and we'll see how the Brexit affects them. It will depend on what happens to demand from within the U.K. which might be related to how much lower the pound goes.
But I want to take you back to what Atika was saying just now. The real fear is what if other countries in Europe follow suit? What if other countries want to break away? When demand within Europe gets affected, that's when Asia is really going to be worried. But for now it does look like overall, Asia might be able to weather the storm better than what we - better than what the situation right now is telling us, given so much market uncertainty. Max?
FOSTER: Atika - Mallika, thank you very much indeed. I mean it's a frightening situation and the markets hate uncertainty don't they?
ANDERSON: The nemesis.
FOSTER: That's what politicians -
ANDERSON: The nemesis.
FOSTER: -- stabilize over the weekend, give some direction.
ANDERSON: Well no-one knows exactly how the Brexit is going to play out but here is what we know right now.
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ANDERSON: The outgoing Prime Minister David Cameron said his successor will trigger what's known as Article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty.
FOSTER: It gives the 27 other EU countries two years to come up with an exit deal. Now the U.K. will not take part in those talks crucially.
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ANDERSON: If there's no agreement after - two years, EU countries can vote to go overtime or not. If there is no unanimous decision the U.K. is out of the EU and no deal at all.
FOSTER: Yes, well Andrew Blick, you've got a glimpse of him there ahead - a little teaser there. Lecturer in politics and contemporary history at King's College, London, he's here with us to give us an insight into what lies ahead.
[02:10:00]
ANDERSON: And Angela Merkel yesterday said this, and I quote "There is no point beating about the bush today is a watershed for Europe. It is a watershed for European integration."
We know it was a pivotal moment for the U.K. but I think the bigger story is what happens next, so far as Europe and its project is concerned.
ANDREW BLICK, LECTURER IN POLITICS & CONTEMPORARY HISTORY: Yes, certainly there will be concern amongst those countries that for the time being intend to continue being members of the European Union as to whether this is a contamination that might spread.
At the moment I wouldn't get over excited about it. Certainly certain groups in certain countries have used the Brexit decision in the U.K. as a basis for demanding their own referendums. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BLICK: They're relatively fringe groups. As we know with UKIP, a fringe group can become less of a fringe group overtime and these movements can expand. But we're not quite there yet. I don't think we're - it's not an immediate prospect and a country such as Germany, they don't even have referendums in Germany, they're not allowed to. So it's not quite the same political environment in all of those countries.
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BLICK: However clearly they want to be seen to respond to this. But exactly how they should respond to this isn't entirely clear.
FOSTER: What has changed though in terms of the core of the European Union. We had this system didn't we really where you had the U.K., France, and Germany, the top table, making the key decisions. And you'd have the American influence, coming through the U.K. Also the Scandinavian influence coming through the U.K. That's now changed to France - you know it's a Franco-German headed organization. So that's fundamentally different.
BLICK: Well I suppose one thing about Britain was although it was clearly you could argue one of the big three powers, one of the big three economies in there, it was never fully signed up to everything, as we know. There were various opt-out, most importantly of all the Euro, we were never in the Eurozone and now obviously we're not going to ever going to be in the Eurozone. So we were never fully participated we joined later, we didn't join until 1973 after being turned down twice.
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FOSTER: But it only became effectively arguably when Britain went in, because it became more of a global organization.
BLICK: It was already getting pretty important even before we joined which is one of the reasons we joined. But clearly there's no question, it is a blow to the E.U's importance that the U.K. has pulled out. On the other hand there may be upsides to it. Because often, the U.K. was seen as dragging its feet over certain decisions. Some people might argue it was right to drag its feet but there you go.
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ANDERSON: If you had listened to the remain campaign and David Cameron was very much one of the leading lights of that and he now of course has decided to resign as a result of this vote. But if you listen to them, the U.K. was headed for total financial meltdown and economic stagnation for the rest of time it seems if it were to pull out of the E.U. Is it?
BLICK: Well I think it's important to distinguish between these immediate fluctuation which happen, what goes down can come up again, sometimes several times in the course of the same day. That's happening. Obviously, nobody wants that or certain people will profit from it no doubt but nobody wants that. But it's the longer tendencies that are harder to predict. What kind of investment decisions will the big multi-national corporations make?
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BLICK: There will surely be some gains for the U.K. There will be some investors who are more attracted. But the other question is what are we going to lose. But then a lot of that hinges around what kind of deal we get and things that are going on elsewhere in the world. And at the moment, we really don't know.
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FOSTER: It's not the (inaudible) that's going away is it?
ANDERSON: Not at all. FOSTER: Andrew, thank you.
ANDERSON: It will keep us busy for the next couple of years.
FOSTER: Keeps us in work.
ANDERSON: Keeps us -
FOSTER: The world reacting apart from us to the U.K.'s Brexit vote.
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ANDERSON: What U.S. NATO leaders say about future ties with Britain is coming up.
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PATRICK SNELL, CNN WORLD SPORTS: I'm Patrick Snell with your "World Sport" headlines. The Rio lab that was supposed to conduct drug tests on Olympic athletes has been suspended.
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SNELL: The World Anti-Doping Agency removing the accreditation of the facility due to what it calls non-conformity with lab standards. Now according to WADA the problem involves one unspecified issue. And it's not known if the lab will be reinstated in time for the games which start on August 5th.
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SNELL: To the European football championships in France and the race for a place in the last eight is officially on. The tournament surprise package and smallest competing nation, Iceland. They don't play until Monday in Nice when they face England.
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SNELL: But three matches on the slate for Saturday, including Wales facing Northern Ireland. A team that they failed to win any of their last eight matches against the Welsh by the way. It's the first time either nation has made it to the knockout rounds of a major tournament since the 1958 World Cup.
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SNELL: In Saturday's other matches, the 04 finalist Portugal have won all three of their previous meetings with Croatia.
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SNELL: CR7, Cristiano himself has now become the first person ever to score in four Euros, and he's now just one shy of Michel Papini's record hall of nine for France at this tournament. (END VIDEO CLIP)
SNELL: Also on Saturday, Switzerland/Poland both countries having reached the knockout stages at this event for the very first time. The Swiss have won just once in ten attempts against the Pols.
That's a look at your sports. I'm Patrick Snell.
ANDERSON: Welcome back. Britain's vote to leave the E.U. is reverberating across the Atlantic.
American politicians from both major parties expressed respect for the choice of British voters.
FOSTER: U.S. President Barack Obama has urged Britain to remain well he had urged Britain to remain in the E.U. In the run-up to that referendum, he came over didn't he famously and campaigned pretty much on behalf of David Cameron. But on Friday, he gave assurances that the special relationship between the U.S. and the U.K. is still solid.
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BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I do think that yesterday's vote speaks to the ongoing changes and challenges that are raised by globalization. But while the U.K.'s relationship with the E.U. will change, one thing that will not change is the special relationship that exists between our two nations. That will endure. The E.U. will remain one of our indispensable partners. Our NATO alliance will be a cornerstone of global security.
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FOSTER: The NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg also spoke on Britain's exit vote, saying the U.K. will remain an integral part of the alliance.
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JENS STOLTENBERG, NATO SECRETARY GENERAL: I know the United Kingdom's position in NATO will remain unchanged. The U.K. will remain a strong and committed NATO ally. It will continue to play its leading role in our alliance.
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ANDERSON: Well the U.K.'s decision to leave the European Union has been compared to the rise of Donald Trump in the U.S. since both highlight voters dissatisfaction with the political establishment.
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ANDERSON: Hillary Clinton's campaign is rejecting the comparison saying in part that Trump is more concerned with himself than his fellow Americans. But the presumptive Republican Presidential nominee, surprisingly or not, disagrees. DONALD TRUMP, PRESUMPTIVE REPUBLICAN PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: I really do
see a parallel between what's happening in the United States and what's happening here. People want to take their country back. They want to have independence in a sense and you see it with Europe, all over Europe. You're going to have more than just in my opinion more than just what happened last night, you're going to have I think many other cases where they want to take their borders back.
[02:20:01]
TRUMP: So I think you're going to have this happen more and more. I really believe that. And I think It's happening in the United States. It's happening by the fact that I've done so well in the polls
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FOSTER: Well there you go. He's speaking in Scotland of course where the first minister Nicola Sturgeon said a Scottish referendum is likely on leaving the U.K. Another one. She will be leading a Scottish cabinet meeting in the next hour to discuss this issue.
Phil Black has the latest from Edinburgh.
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PHIL BLACK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Democratically unacceptable, that was how Nicola Sturgeon, the First Minister of Scotland described the possibility that Scotland could be pulled out of the European Union, after the people of Scotland had voted so overwhelmingly in favor of staying with the European Union. 62% of Scottish people voted in favor of that.
The First Minister said it was clearly the democratically expressed aspiration of the Scottish people to stay part of the European Union, part of the common market. And she was prepared to do everything possible to make sure that happened, including calling another independence referendum.
Now it was only back in September 2014, that the Scottish people voted through a referendum on the issue of independence. That vote decided that Scotland should stay with the United Kingdom. Now, the first minister says there has been material and significant change in Scotland's circumstances. Through her political party's recent election manifesto she said under those circumstances, a second referendum would be reasonable. More than that, she now says that her government is already preparing legislation within the two-year time scale that the United Kingdom has to disengage itself from the European Union.
NICOLA STURGEON, SCOTTISH PRIME MINISTER: I can therefore confirm today that in order to protect that position, we will begin to prepare the legislation that would be required to enable a new independence referendum to take place, if and when parliament so decides.
To conclude this is not a situation that I wanted Scotland or the U.K. to be in today. But my responsibility in a climate of uncertainty, is to seek to lead us forward with purpose.
BLACK: Nicola Sturgeon said the Scottish people had clearly voted for their country to be modern, outward looking and inclusive and she felt it was inconceivable for the British government to stand in the way of another independence referendum if the Scottish parliament decided to proceed.
Phil Black, CNN, Edinburgh.
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FOSTER: Well like Scotland, Northern Ireland voted to stay in the European Union whilst Britain as a whole, voted to leave.
ANDERSON: That's right, the Sinn Fein Party which shares power in the Belfast government says Britain can no longer claim to represent the citizens of Northern Ireland. Sinn Fein leader, Gerry Adams, spoke to CNN. This is what he said.
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GERRY ADAMS, SINN FEIN LEADER: My issue is that the north of Ireland is going to be dragged out of the E.U. on a decision made by people made on another island. We did have our referendum here because we're part of the British. But the people here voted to stay within the European Union. And the British Prime Minister, whoever it is that succeeds Mr. Cameron, has no mandate whatsoever to be representing the people in this part of the island of Ireland.
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FOSTER: Yes, and he's using that isn't he to call for reunification of Ireland. So another impact of this. It's unbelievable.
ANDERSON: Well it may take a while for the U.K. to mend after this vote. And that is because almost half of those voting on Thursday were in favor of remaining in the European Union.
CNN's Nick Glass has a look at the journey that led to what is known as Brexit and how the U.K. might heal its internal divide.
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NICK GLASS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: So, after 43 long years, the restlessness has found a voice. Britain has turned its back on Europe, a seismic decision but a vote that could hardly have been more divisive.
The remain campaign in blue took Scotland, Northern Ireland and London. But the rest of the country went red and voted to leave. A map then of stark division. They call it the United Kingdom, but after this, how united is it. Britain's a split. Those who see themselves as British, those who see themselves as Europeans.
Britain joined the European Union in 1973, when there were just eight other members. The conservative Prime Minister Edward Heath signed the document. Within two years, the new labor government was asking voters to think again, should Britain be in or out.
Throughout the 43 years, the relationship's been intermittently fractious. Britain gained economically, but pored over money and subsidies not least under the leadership of another Conservative Prime Minister, Margaret Thatcher.
[05:25:10]
GLASS: In 1992, Britain stayed in the club but declined to join the common currency, the Euro.
CAMERON: It is time for the British people to have their say. It is time for us to settle this question about Britain and Europe.
GLASS: Cameron's evident motive was to quell the Euro skeptic voices within his own party and make the case against U.K.IP, the far right independence party.
BORIS JOHNSON, "LEAVE" CAMPAIGNER: I will be advocating vote leave or whatever the team is called.
GLASS: Superficially, the referendum was a story of blond ambition. A political heavyweight, the Conservative Boris Johnson coming out for the leave campaign.
The cartoonists just reveled in it. Rolling the dice, vote leave wrestling remain down the hill. Steaming down the line, Boris at the controls of the Brexit express an anxious Cameron roped to the rails.
JOHNSON: I believe that this Thursday could be our country's independence day.
GLASS: As a media story, the focus was the gladiatorial battle between conservative politicians. But the truth is, Brexiteers tapped into something, a genuine anxiety about immigration and this in the middle of the greatest refugee crisis in Europe since 1945.
The campaign was sometimes bitter, sometimes nasty. It stirred social divisions between classes, between town and country, between old and young, between generations of the same family.
Back in 1975, when British voters last put an X to a ballot paper on Europe, there was a resounding yes in favor of membership. 67% for, 33% against. What a profound shift now. 48.1% for staying in, 51.9% for leaving.
No one quite knew it until the question was asked. Britain had quietly become utterly polarized over Europe. This referendum has made it abundantly, transparently, divisively clear.
Nick Glass, CNN, London.
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ANDERSON: Well a new reality in Europe starting to take shape in the wake of this Brexit decision. FOSTER: We'll be discussing what's next for Britain. And the Union,
it's walking away from.
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[02:30:55]
FOSTER: Welcome back to our special coverage of Britain's decision to leave the E.U. it feels like a dream almost when you wake up the next day.
ANDERSON: Or a nightmare one of the two. I'm Becky Anderson. The people of Britain have made their choice and it will take years, perhaps decades, to know how and when the dust will settle on all of this.
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ANDERSON: But the early reaction has been turbulent to say the least.
FOSTER: The world markets really did go into a downward spiral at least initially. And many economists say the Brexit will only continue to bring problems.
ANDERSON: Plus, the chaos has already claimed a victim in the political sector. 10 Downing Street, expected to have a new tenant by October now that Prime Minister David Cameron has announced his resignation.
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FOSTER: People are wondering what this means for the U.K. as well as Europe. Andrew Blick, a lecturer in politics and contemporary history at Kings College, London, is back with us.
ANDERSON: That's right. And there are those suggesting that David Cameron's legacy could be not just the breakup of the European Union as people suggest a contagion effect as a result of the U.K. pulling out. But a breakup of this union here in the United Kingdom. Is that a possibility do you think?
BLICK: Well for some time, constitutional nerds such as myself used to float this kind of nightmare scenario in which one or more parts of the U.K. votes to leave such as Northern Ireland and Scotland. While England, being the largest group, votes to leave rather -- one part votes to stay while England being the largest votes to leave which means basically those other parts of the U.K. are outvoted because of the sheer size of England.
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BLICK: Meaning that those parts of the U.K. if they're still part of the U.K. get taken out against their will. Well now this has actually happened. This isn't a nightmare scenario any longer, it's the reality.
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BLICK: Northern Ireland and Scotland both voted to stay in the E.U. England voted to leave. Wales voted to leave so the majority in the U.K. voted to leave. So what happens to those two parts of the U.K.
ANDERSON: Have you got an answer? Because you said you're nerdy about this constitutional stuff.
BLICK: Well quite. I mean the answer is this - that in the Belfast Agreement, parts of the peace process agreed in 1998 for Northern Ireland, there's a provision that Northern Ireland can leave the U.K. if a majority in Northern Ireland vote. So there can be a referendum and they can go. And we've seen with Scotland already in 2014, not that long ago, although it seems like a long while ago now, already had a vote on independence. So there's an established principal now really that a bit of the U.K. if it votes to go, can vote. Just as a bit of the E.U. if it votes to go can go.
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FOSTER: What about the divisiveness of this? Now apart from that, because we've got this picture haven't we where London, Northern Ireland, and Scotland, all voted to remain. And everyone else wanted to leave.
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FOSTER: But that's a confusing picture isn't it? Because they didn't vote to remain for the same reasons.
BLICK: No quite. I mean, well we don't know what anyone's personal reason is. So it's a very complicated position. Obviously Northern Ireland - not only is Northern Ireland now divided from the bits of the U.K. that they wanted to leave the E.U., it's also internally divided. There's an incredibly complex position there as we know going back over many many decades and centuries.
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BLICK: Scotland again is a different position because some of the people who wanted to stay in the E.U. don't want to be in the U.K. anyway so that's more complicated. London, well, there's not a London - an independence movement yet. But who knows, we may start to develop one here.
So they've all got different reasons and it does underline how divisive this whole episode has been and it's not clear that the divisions are going away any time soon.
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ANDERSON: Andrew, pleasure. Thank you.
BLICK: Thank you.
FOSTER: Thank you very much indeed. A key figure who has campaigned for more than two decades for Britain to leave the E.U. is Nigel Farage.
ANDERSON: That's right, he is the leader of the U.K. Independence Party and has been criticized for inciting fears over immigration.
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FOSTER: The vote to leave is a political success though for him and it's all said by that incredible picture. There's so many of them actually. He had a fantastic day yesterday. Our senior international correspondent Nima Elbagir spoke to him in the middle of it.
NIGEL FARAGE, LEADER, U.K. INDEPENDENCE PARTY: I've been doing this for 25 years. I mean I was in danger I think in the 1990s of becoming a patron saint of lost causes. I mean I was written off as being a lunatic. And politically support for this was absolutely timing. So when we got to 10:00 o'clock last night and the polls closing, I almost dared not to hope that what I dreamt of and worked for 25 years could happen. But it did.
[02:35:20]
NIMA ELBAGIR, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Could you believe it when you heard it?
FARAGE: Not really, I'm not sure I can now to be honest with you. I mean it is, and I say that not just because of my journey, but it's such a big seismic political event. It hasn't just affecting the United Kingdom, it's affected the rest of the European Union too.
ELBAGIR: For those out there who have been concerned that the anti- immigration rhetoric has at times been cover for less savory sentiments. There have been times when like phrases like indigenous workers.
FARAGE: Well I've never used that phrase at all in the past.
ELBAGIR: You have not. But the leave campaign has become a very broad tent.
FARAGE: Well, both sides are a very broad tent. Look, I would say this to you. We set UKIP up, my party is not racist, a nonsectarian party we'd be very successful at doing that and being that, and all we've argued for is an Australian style point system. All we're arguing for is normality.
ELBAGIR: You've seen the market respond quite drastically already, you've heard concerns from around the world pouring in about what it means for all the ways Britain is essential and integral, not least the war on terror. The Foreign Secretary, Phillip Hammond saying he doesn't want to over exaggerate it but he believes Britain is palpably less safe.
FARAGE: Just think about two things; firstly, those (inaudible) rifles that used in Paris to murder about 130 people came from Berlin, through into the Netherlands, through into Belgium, through into France without any checks or any stops of any kind at all. And two, of the eight people that committed that atrocity in Paris had come back into Europe through the Greek islands posing as refugees. Those are real issues.
ELBAGIR: But we already don't have passport free travel in this country so they wouldn't have had the freedom of movement to come into the U.K.
FARAGE: Actually, we do. Actually we do. We're not in Schengen --
ELBAGIR: I always have to show my passport.
FARAGE: Well yes, we have to show a passport but it's still basically completely free movement. I think that even the Schengen zone is finished. I think national boundaries, national borders are going to start going up. I think the population across the rest of Europe is beginning to demand it.
And I want also make this point to Mr. Hammond. The way we deal with things like this, with information sharing and everything else, is you know we act as friends. We have the closest information sharing with the USA. But we don't need to be become the 51st state to do that. I mean I genuinely don't think Obama understands what the European Union is. He seems to think it's like a sort of rather big NAFTA. It's not. Come on, for goodness sakes, we are the closest allies in the world.
ELBAGIR: UKIP of course the U.K. Independence Party. You have independence. What happens now to you and to you --
FARAGE: Well, the first thing that happens is I lead the biggest British delegation in the European parliament. So we're going to watch these negotiations like a hawk to make sure that things are happening properly. And secondly, UKIP does need to stay strong to make sure the government carries out the wishes of the people.
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FOSTER: Nigel Farage, suddenly catapulted into the mainstream who would have thought it? But this is the nature of this incredible story. Even the British Prime Minister stepping down over the U.K. vote to leave the E.U.
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ANDERSON: That's right. We're going to look at what is next for David Cameron? And we will discuss his legacy after this.
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[02:41:52]
FOSTER: Well after the U.K. voted to leave the E.U. the U.S. President spoke with the British Prime Minister on the phone. Barack Obama told David Cameron that the special relationship between the U.S. and the U.K. remains key, a key part of American foreign policy. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FOSTER: Mr. Cameron had campaigned heavily to remain in the E.U. and now he's stepping down and wants a new leader in place by October.
DAVID CAMERON, U.K. PRIME MINISTER: I think the country requires fresh leadership to take it in this direction. I will do everything I can as Prime Minister to steady the ship over the coming weeks and months. But I do not think it would be right for me to try to be the captain that steers our country to its next destination.
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FOSTER: Let's take a look at who could replace David Cameron then as the leader of the Conservative party and who will automatically become Prime Minister.
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FOSTER: First candidate is 48-year-old Michael Gove, the British Justice Secretary. He's always been seen as a close ally of David Cameron but decided to campaign against him for Britain to leave the E.U.
One of the favorites before the referendum was Theresa May. The 59- year-old is the current Home Secretary. May supported the remain campaign but also said that the U.K. should look at further reform on the freedom of movement.
Finally, the bookies current favorite, Boris Johnson, the 52 year old, is the former Mayor of London, he currently serves as British Member of Parliament and Johnson surprised some by coming out as the leader of the leave campaign.
Let's discuss Mr. Cameron's legacy with Peter Snowdon, he's an historian and a journalist and the co-author of "Cameron at 10."
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FOSTER: And presumably your next book will focus on the fact that Brexit is his legacy. It's inevitable isn't it?
PETER SNOWDON, HISTORIAN AND JOURNALIST: Yes, he will be forever be remembered as the Prime Minister that lost the referendum on Europe. He did win two other referendums of course but - one on Scotland and one on electoral reform. Scotland being of significance, but this will be what he will be remembered for and I don't think he will like that particularly.
FOSTER: Is it fair I mean a lot of the local media are describing him - I mean the headline you often see is the lucky Prime Minister, who finally ran out of luck. Just put that into context for us. Because it seems unfair but he has had a lot of luck.
SNOWDON: He has had a lot of luck. I mean he's been if you compare the record of all his predecessors as tori leader, he's been there for ten years.
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SNOWDON: He's actually one of the longest serving Tory Prime Ministers in the last century, last 120 years. But in a way you do make your own luck in Prime Minister. You don't get to that position and hold on to it for as long as he has, six years, without some degree of political nous and ingenuity.
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SNOWDON: And I think when the dust has settled on this campaign, he will be remembered for other things other than Europe. And I think it's important to put that in context.
FOSTER: So gay marriage is one of them. What are the key elements of his leadership, do you think?
SNOWDON: Well gay marriage certainly is something which was counterintuitive to what many in his party, his grassroots wanted. But I think probably will be what he will - the record he and jointly with George Osborne on the economy and what was then called plan "A" which was basically reviving the economy from the severe recession.
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[02:45:00]
FOSTER: George Osborne, his number two effectively, the Chancellor of the Exchequer, he was seen as the front runner to take over from David Cameron and he's clearly out of the picture now. Because he was such a front man on the remain campaign. Am I right in saying that?
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SNOWDON: Yes, I mean I think his chances are very slim. He's damaged by association. So closely bound in with Cameron's operation. He was right there with him, fighting for Britain to remain and you know he had a very damaging budget politically where he expended a lot of political capital.
FOSTER: But Theresa May was also on the remain side. So what chance has she got against Boris Johnson? Surely it's Boris Johnson's job to take isn't it?
SNOWDON: It's Boris - I agree with that, it's Boris Johnson's to lose. But I wouldn't rule out someone like Theresa May who could be the non- Boris candidate.
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SNOWDOW: The anyone but Boris.
FOSTER: She would be more cohesive within the party.
SNOWDON: She does, she does and remember she's the longest serving Home Secretary now for a very long time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SNOWDON: She has managed to hold on to that brief, without too many skirmishes, unscathed and politically she's pretty shrewd. She didn't play a particularly prominent role in the remain campaign. She was supportive of the Prime Minister but she does have allies across the party.
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SNOWDON: What she hasn't got is a really big group of cheerleaders to move her on.
FOSTER: And just describe this issue that the party has with Boris Johnson. Because he's a massively divisive figure isn't he?
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FOSTER: But inevitably, they feel as though he's got the authority now I mean certainly to have a ticket, whether or not he'll actually get the (inaudible).
SNOWDON: Yes well we talk to David Cameron's great gamble which he lost ultimately. But Boris' gamble was he was equivocating right to the end, we do know that he was in discussions with Cameron right up until the moment where he then stepped out in front of the crowds and said he was for Brexit. And he, a bit like Theresa May, doesn't have a huge band of cheerleaders in parliament.
He's actually quite - he's not a particularly (inaudible) figure in the House of Commons among his colleagues, and he will have to work very hard to muster a strong level of support within parliament.
FOSTER: Just quickly is it -- the new Prime Minister will be in a situation - in situ by the conference. Can it happen before? Presumably it can happen more quickly than that.
SNOWDON: It could but I think it will be by the conference. I think there will be an announcement by then.
FOSTER: OK. Peter Snowdon, thank you very much indeed.
Much more on the fallout from the referendum but first we're going to check some other news stories for you. We'll be right back after a short break.
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MANN: Hello, I'm Jonathan Mann and this is your Road to Rio update.
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MANN: The lab handling all drug testing for the Rio Olympics has been suspended. The Brazilian doping control lab was slated to be open 24 hours a day during the games, but the World Anti-Doping Agency found the lab unfit citing what it called nonconformity with international standards.
U.S. basketball star, Lebron James will not be attending the 2016 games in Rio. The all-star forward played and medaled in the past three summer Olympics. But after his hometown team The Cleveland Cavaliers clinched the NBA championship this week, James said he could, "use the rest."
[02:50:10]
MANN: Transport authorities in Rio de Janeiro have started selling a special travel card to help visitors get to and from the venues for the Olympic and the Para-Olympic Games. The Rio Card provides visitors access to all of Rio's public transportation.
And Brazilian basketball star Janeth Arcain, a two-time Olympic medalist has been named the mayor of the Olympic Village in Rio. Arcain won a silver medal in Atlanta in 1996 and a bronze at the Sydney games in 2000. As mayor she'll welcome athletes and officials to the Olympic Village.
MANN: That's your Road to Rio update. I'm Jonathan Mann.
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NATALIE ALLEN, CNN HOST: I'm Natalie Allen live in Atlanta we're back to London in just a moment but first other stories that we're following here at CNN. And one is Pope Francis, visiting Armenia.
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ALLEN: And he attended a wreath laying at the Armenian Genocide Memorial. He said the mass killing of Armenian's under Ottoman rule back in World War I was a genocide. And this trip is likely to draw the ire of Turkey. Turkey, rejects calling the killings genocide and maintains there were losses on both sides. Some 20 countries do recognize the event of genocide, including France, Canada, Russia, and Italy. The U.S., U.K. and Israel however do not. Turkey and Armenia also differ on the number of people killed. Armenia says 1.5 million died. Turkey says it was about 300,000.
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ALLEN: Brazil's only accredited lab to test for illegal drugs among the Olympic athletes says it hopes to get its license back after it was revoked in time for the summer Olympics in six weeks. The Brazilian Doping Control lab was suspended Friday. Our Nick Paton Walsh tells us why. He's in Rio.
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NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: To be clear we don't know the precise reason why WADA have suspended this key laboratory in Brazil. The Brazil Doping Control Laboratory, where 6,000 samples will be processed or should have been processed during the games. But they are clear, this isn't a series of misdemeanors. Because when these facilities are inspected they can for small issues end up incurring points which when they reach a threshold results in a suspension.
That wasn't the situation here I'm told. This was one issue that was serious enough that merited the suspension. Now a spokesman for WADA when pressed, whether or not this could be clarified before the games, said it is possible it won't be. That this facility will not be used and they'll have to go to contingency planning potentially like they did in the World Cup using facilities in Europe or maybe using facilities in North America.
That will call into question the speed of their functionality. Can they process samples fast enough to satisfy the appetite for clean slates here during the medals process at the games? And also to what really was the issue?
They spent millions on clean new state-of-the-art equipment in that facility that we saw ourselves just a matter of days ago now so maybe there is another issue there. We simply don't know what that is, we may never know what that is, before the games actually start. And we do know the laboratory have issued a very clear statement, saying they believe their work is in the pursuit of excellence and they think the next inspection will enable them to have a clean slate and carry out the test for the games.
One confusing discrepancy, WADA are clear that they told the laboratory about the suspension two days ago but actually the laboratory say they only heard about it from the WADA statement released late on Friday.
So a lot of questions to be answered here still. The laboratory convince they have a clean slate. WADA convinced there's one serious issue. So serious that they can't fill this vital role at the games. But this adds yet another problem to the myriad of issues that these Olympics are facing and it's one that goes straight to the heart of perhaps the most sensitive part of the sports that will be played here, Russia already under great scrutiny here.
Many of its athletes won't be able to compete, many will have to go through increased testing to be able to make it to the games fields here. Kenya perhaps too under similar scrutiny. And now the one facility that was supposed to sweep through all of that and be a shining beacon of clarity here is in severe trouble, if not simply out of commission for the games themselves.
Yet another problem and a very serious one on the list of issues for Rio 2016.
Nick Paton Walsh, CNN, Rio de Janeiro, Brazil.
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ALLEN: Another world sporting event is well under way in France. The Euro 2016 football championship goes on, with three matches set for Saturday.
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[02:55:04]
ALLEN: It is the knockout stage of the tournament and Poland and Switzerland kick things off. Next hot off news of the Brexit at home, U.K. teams Wales and Northern Island meet on the pitch. It is the first time either has reached the elimination stage of a major tournament in 58 years. Portugal and Cristiano Ronaldo round out the day, taking on Croatia.
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ALLEN: We turn now to the U.S. state of West Virginia, where at least 23 people are dead after massive floods.
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ALLEN: The rain lasted for just four hours but this was the result. Some rivers overflowed, houses and cars completely swept away. 44 counties have declared a state of emergency. The national weather service says there's a 1 in a 1,000 chance of this much rainfall in that area in any given year.
In Southern California, it is this that has people worried. A fast- moving wildfire. It has killed at least two people and burned nearly 100 houses. This area is near Bakersfield. That's about a two-hour drive north of Los Angeles.
The fire covers about 30,000 acres of land or some 12,000 hectors and it is only 5% contained. The area also under a state of emergency.
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ALLEN: That's the latest news from Atlanta. I'm Natalie Allen. We'll have more on Britain's vote to leave the European Union, live from London, right after this.
