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Judge Scandal; Interview With Housing and Urban Development Secretary Julian Castro; Will Rubio Support Trump?. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired May 10, 2016 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[15:00:00]

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Senator Rubio just yesterday tried to quell any talk of him on a Trump ticket, writing -- quote -- "He" -- that is Trump -- "will be best served by a running mate and by surrogates who fully embrace his campaign. As such, I have never sought, will not seek and do not want to be considered for vice president. Instead, I will focus my attention on representing the people of Florida, retaining a conservative majority in the Senate and electing principled conservatives across the country."

So, with that, let me bring in Sara Murray, our CNN politics reporter.

First of all, let me quote the great David Chalian, who said a no in May can still be a yes in July. That said, so far, he's saying no.

SARA MURRAY, CNN NATIONAL POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, he is saying no.

And I think it was really telling in the statement that he put out that he said that Donald Trump should run with someone who can fully embrace his campaign and what his campaign stands for. And it just seems like Marco Rubio is not there yet.

Of course, he's going to be talking to Jake Tapper later this afternoon.

BALDWIN: Yes.

MURRAY: So I think we will get a better sense of where his head is at in all of this.

And I think the reality, when your candidate drops out of the race and you are a former adviser or you were a donor to that campaign...

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: You're looking out for that...

(CROSSTALK)

MURRAY: You're kind of hoping.

BALDWIN: Sure. MURRAY: You're hoping there's another way they could end up on the ticket, that maybe Marco Rubio would be the kind of guy who could help Donald Trump with Hispanics.

And I think that that is a little bit of what we are seeing and hearing right now is sort of this hope that maybe there is a shot that this could all come together, but Rubio seems pretty adamant that that's not the case.

BALDWIN: He does. With regard to, though, these polls, the Quinnipiac polls, these are the swing states.

MURRAY: Right.

BALDWIN: These are the swing states. So, we're talking Pennsylvania, Florida and Ohio. They're neck and neck.

MURRAY: They're neck and neck.

And Donald Trump is actually leading in this poll in Ohio. Trump's at 43. Clinton is at 39. In Florida, it's basically a tie. In Pennsylvania, it's essentially a tie. This is very different from what we have seen from the national polling, which has shown Clinton leading Trump in a number of these national polls and really fueled the fears of a lot of Republicans.

So I think a number of Republicans are going to be looking at these polls and saying, OK, maybe we have a shot here or the very least, even if Donald Trump can't win, maybe this means we don't get massacred in the down-ballot races, which is another thing that a number of Republican who were skeptical about Trump were really worried about.

But, look, I think these Ohio and Pennsylvania numbers are really telling because it means when Trump is talking about the middle class, when he's talking about trade, when he's talking about wages, that's the kind of thing that seems to be getting through.

BALDWIN: And when he's speaking with Speaker Ryan this Thursday, he can say, listen, you got to get behind me. This is a legit race. You can see how close it is in certain very, very crucial states.

Sara Murray, thank you so much.

MURRAY: Thanks, Brooke.

BALDWIN: And so we know he doesn't want to be vice president, but today Senator Marco Rubio did talk about Donald Trump briefly before an audience in Washington, an audience of foreign policy thinkers.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MARCO RUBIO (R), FLORIDA: I don't view myself as a guy who is going to sit here for the next six months taking shots at him.

People know where I stand. They know how I feel. They know what our differences are. He's the nominee of the Republican Party or the presumptive nominee via the voters. I respect and accept it. But that's not going to change the reservations I have about his campaign or about some of the policies that he's established.

But I'm not insisting he change anything. He needs to be true to whoever he is. And that's the things he believes in. And he may have a chance to make that argument to the American people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: All right.

Let me bring in David Catanese, senior politics writer for "U.S. News & World Report," Democratic strategist and CNN political commentator Hilary Rosen, who supports Hillary Clinton and a CNN political commentator, and Margaret Hoover is with me here in New York, a Republican strategist and commentator here at CNN as well.

Welcome to all of you.

And, David, you're up to bat first. You know, all these different threads about Marco Rubio, the RNC meeting in Hollywood, Florida, last week, you know, he's not interested. But things would change. Trump would have to walk issues back. Cut through it all for me. What are you hearing here?

DAVID CATANESE, "U.S. NEWS & WORLD REPORT": Well, look, I think you could have different advisers on different pages for these candidates.

Remember, all these campaigns have lots of advisers and different titles and sometimes as a reporter it's hard to figure out or it's our job to figure out who's the closest person to that candidate. So, I think it's obviously possible that an adviser could have been down there at the RNC meeting feeling out, hey, what's Rubio's next move?

Because, remember, he has lost his Senate seat, so he's going back to the private sector if he's not on the ticket. So, that is probably all a possibility, but more interesting, a sort of macro story in this and how all of these guys are trying to calibrate what's going on with the voters, millions and millions of voters, coming out and supporting Trump, and talk -- and then but also looking to the long term.

Will it hurt them in the long term if they got on board the Trump train and he goes down in flames in November? So a lot of these guys are struggling with that. And I think that is, you know, being displayed in Rubio's remarks.

BALDWIN: Margaret, what do you think?

MARGARET HOOVER, CNN POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: Look, it is hard to imagine -- as David said, you don't know who the reports come from, but it's hard to imagine Marco himself advocating to become the vice presidential nominee.

[15:05:05]

BALDWIN: He might have not even known that...

HOOVER: Right. Exactly.

BALDWIN: ... this person was...

(CROSSTALK)

HOOVER: And so that's what you actually have to think about at the end of the day. You have to think about, who is this candidate? What do I know about them? And is this consistent with who they are and what they would advocate?

The answer is no. Marco Rubio is running hard against Donald Trump. He's philosophically, diametrically opposed to many, many of Donald Trump's positions. It just seems -- it's totally incomprehensible.

So, I think and we all have gotten to know Marco Rubio on the campaign trail. Those of us who work in Republican politics have had plenty of opportunities to interact with him. It just doesn't to me hold water.

BALDWIN: OK.

Let me -- Margaret, let me just stay with you -- Hilary...

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: But go ahead, Hilary. I hear you wanting to jump in.

HILARY ROSEN, CNN POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: Well, I was just going to say I think it may not be Marco Rubio, but, look, Donald Trump is going to find someone, you know, respected in the Democratic Party to be his running mate.

BALDWIN: In the Democratic Party?

(CROSSTALK)

ROSEN: I mean, in the Republican Party. Sorry.

(LAUGHTER)

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Never know.

(CROSSTALK)

ROSEN: That wasn't even Freudian.

(LAUGHTER)

ROSEN: It's inevitable that he will find someone, because, you know, and that, you know, a significant portion of Republicans are going to end up falling in line here.

BALDWIN: Yes. On the Republicans, we know now that Senate Majority Leader Mitch

McConnell, he talked with our political reporter Manu Raju, expressing confidence in Donald Trump, specifically citing the swing state polls, right, so the Quinnipiac polls that are out today showing, what is it, it's Pennsylvania, Florida and Ohio, how, you know, Clinton-Trump matchup is so totally close.

Majority Leader McConnell said he believes the party will get behind the presumptive nominee.

What kinds of conversations, Margaret, do you think might he have with Speaker Ryan, with Donald Trump?

HOOVER: I mean, they're -- look, if you look at who has more leverage in this conversation, if Donald Trump's being honest with himself, Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnell actually have more leverage with him, because...

BALDWIN: Despite the polls?

HOOVER: ... Donald Trump -- here's what -- those polls give him leverage going into that conversation, but those polls, as we all know, are a snapshot in time. They're about this moment.

The Republican Party is starting to coalesce around the Republican nominee. The Democratic Party is still divided. Hillary Clinton is far from the nomination. We all suspect that she is going to get it, but they haven't coalesced. There's still a ton of energy right now right this minute. People are voting for Bernie Sanders, millions of them.

So what -- or hundreds of thousands of them. Smaller states. What we know is that he has to win every single Republican, Donald Trump does, that Mitt Romney one, plus other people. He needs the conservative movement, the movement conservatives, the Paul Ryans, the Mitch McConnells and all of the people who really look to them for their leadership.

That is what Donald Trump faces. He needs to get the conservative movement to at least go along with him if he is going to stand a chance of winning in November.

BALDWIN: But what about, Hilary, on those polls and when you think of Hillary Clinton? It is tough. In a couple of the different states, they apparently trust Trump more on issues like national security, terrorism, economy, and also they both perform poorly when it comes to trustworthiness and honesty and the gender gap, by the way.

That's a mega headline. She does well among women. He does well among men. How does she fix that?

ROSEN: I mean, two quick things, and there's something in these Quinnipiac polls for everybody; 83 percent of all of those polled in those three states do not think Donald Trump has the temperament to be president or commander in chief. So, you know, having said that, you know, you look back to the same

period in 2012. Mitt Romney was ahead of Barack Obama here. So -- and NBC was very aggressive this afternoon in tweeting out that their polls showed exactly the opposite, that Hillary Clinton was well ahead in these states.

So, I think Margaret is right. These polls are right now just a snapshot of confusion.

BALDWIN: OK. Yes.

ROSEN: Having said that, Hillary Clinton has a challenge, no question.

She has to be kind of a grownup in the room running in a circus and in a frenzy of uncertainty right now among Republicans and a media frenzy being excited about sort of a celebrity candidate on the other side. There is a lot that Hillary Clinton and her campaign have to get right here. They have to walk this line between reintroducing Hillary Clinton to an America who will give her a second look, the same way they're going to give Donald Trump a second look, once those two become officially the nominees, and being sort of the strong, steady grownup in the room with thoughtful policies that the American people care about, not shifting.

So I do think that that -- that this is not a cakewalk for Hillary Clinton. Any Democrat that says it is, is wrong.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: You know, someone who a lot of people in this country have trusted for years and years, as he used to be on TV every night, Jon Stewart, you know, he was on with David Axelrod on his podcast and they were talking about it, and Jon Stewart essentially said, you know, it was the Democrats who opened the door for Donald Trump.

Here's a piece of what he told David Axelrod.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JON STEWART, COMEDIAN: He is a man baby. He has the physical countenance of a man and a baby's temperament and hands.

[15:10:05]

I'll lay the blame then with the Democrats. The door is open to an (EXPLETIVE DELETED) like Donald Trump because the Democrats haven't done enough to show to people that government that can be effective for people can be efficient for people.

And if you can't do that, then you have lost the right to make that change, and someone's going to come in and demagogue you. And that's what happens.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: David Catanese, is there truth to that?

CATANESE: No, I don't buy it.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: You don't buy it?

CATANESE: No, I don't buy it. I don't really buy that at all.

Look, this is like when people blame the media for creating Donald Trump, because, you know, he is on television a lot, which is a fine debate to have, whether we should be devoting that much coverage to all his rallies.

But the Republican Party created Donald Trump. The voters created Donald Trump. We went through how many states now that have voted? And people have all this information. And you could argue that more information could deter people from voting for Donald Trump by putting him out there and seeing all of his warts and all the controversial things he says.

So, I mean, for Jon Stewart to blame, say, the Democrats, you know, somehow the Obama administration, as he's saying, because their ineffectiveness on certain policies produced Donald Trump, this was to me a roiling, festering boil within the Republican Party that came out and was exposed this year.

And I think the establishment is still trying to reckon with it. They are totally out of step with their voters, just as much as their voters are out of step with their party leaders. But this is a Republican-produced nominee, because, look, Hillary Clinton's going to be the nominee on the other side.

We are not going to see as much of it, as insurgency Democrats are going with what they know. Republicans have an entirely new thing on their hands.

BALDWIN: And, apparently -- let me just jump in. Somebody just handed me this piece of paper. Apparently, Joe Biden has just said -- this is not rocket science here -- but he is saying, "I feel confident that Hillary will be the nominee and I feel confident she will be the next president."

So he's predicting Hillary Clinton all the way.

Margaret Hoover, you wanted in.

HOOVER: No, I just -- it's so interesting that Jon Stewart decides to blame Democrats for the rise of Trump.

But he what does in doing so is sort of demonstrate this philosophical fault line that it is about the role that liberals believe that the federal government should have with the individual. And it's that the government is just one good technocrat way being able to perfectly -- somebody come in and perfectly harmonize all of the inefficiencies in the federal government and fix it, and if we could just find that one magical person, whereas conservatives just clearly believe that that's against human nature.

There is not one person that can align all of these interests and really -- flawed individuals and add the kind of accountability you need in these huge, bloated bureaucracies. And that's why we're for smarter, smaller, more streamlined government. So, Stewart just sort of demonstrates its philosophical moorings more than anything else.

BALDWIN: Let me also be clear when I say rocket science, Twittersphere, I meant that do the math and it looks like Hillary Clinton could get it. I do not know who will be the next president of the United States. That's for everyone -- that's where you all get to figure that out come November.

David Catanese, Margaret Hoover and Hilary Rosen, thank you so much.

CATANESE: Thanks.

BALDWIN: Coming up next, he has been floated as a running mate for Hillary Clinton. We will talk live with the HUD secretary, Julian Castro, about Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders and Marco Rubio.

And what happens when you run for president, you don't get the gig and you have to return to your day job as senator, like Ted Cruz, who didn't get endorsed by many of his colleagues on Capitol Hill? What is that like?

And a stunning case, we have to talk about this today. Have you about this? This judge, he's accused of swapping sexual favors for reduced sentences. But wait until you hear what they found at his house. Spoiler alert, nude pictures of his defendants. That's coming up.

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[15:17:43]

BALDWIN: You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thanks for being with me.

News just into CNN, Vice President Joe Biden just telling ABC News that he is confident Hillary Clinton will be the Democratic nominee and will go on to be the next president of the United States. But who will join him on the Democratic ticket?

One man's name has come up again and again and again. And he's joining me.

Julian Castro, secretary of housing and urban development and a Hillary Clinton campaign surrogate, nice to see you, sir.

JULIAN CASTRO, HOUSING AND URBAN DEVELOPMENT SECRETARY: It's good to be with you, Brooke.

BALDWIN: And we will be crystal clear. You are with me today in a personal secretary, not in the capacity of HUD secretary. We will save the HUD questions for the next time.

CASTRO: Great.

BALDWIN: But in the meantime, Secretary Castro, wonderful to have you on. Out of the gate, I'm ripping the Band-Aid off, are you being vetted?

CASTRO: Yes, I am not. So I haven't heard from anyone. I know that there have been a lot of questions to different folks about that.

And I have said that I'm going to be back in Texas next year. I'm just happy to support Secretary Clinton, because she's an amazing candidate for president. And once the ticket comes about, I'm going to be happy to support the ticket as well. And I believe that she's going to win in November.

BALDWIN: So you would agree with the vice president. Let me ask you one other follow-up and then I promise I will move on from this. But if you were to be offered to be on her ticket, would you say yes?

CASTRO: That is not going to happen. And so, you know, I'm not going to hypothesize about that.

But I do look forward to supporting Secretary Clinton and her running mate in the future.

BALDWIN: OK. I'll let it go.

Let's talk, though, about these new Quinnipiac polls that are out today in these the swing states, Ohio, Florida, Pennsylvania, where they show both Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump neck and neck essentially.

And I realize these polls, a snapshot in time, but, you know, I'm wondering how worrisome it could be for the Clinton campaign. You know, part of the reason folks are really loving Donald Trump is, you know, how he talks about the economy. He does better on the economy. Why do you think that is?

CASTRO: Well, number one, I think anyone who follows this stuff at all would tell you that any poll that's taken six months before Election Day is not a poll that you can really bank on.

And so, it's probably not a good practice to comment on every single poll. However...

[15:20:03]

BALDWIN: Not the only poll that has pointed that out, though, on the economy.

CASTRO: Yes.

With respect to this particular poll, the Quinnipiac poll, at this time in 2012, in May of 2012, Quinnipiac had polling that had Mitt Romney ahead in five or six swing states. And we saw how that turned out. In this poll particularly, they oversampled non-minorities. And so

the sampling does not reflect the likely demographic turnout in Ohio or Florida or Pennsylvania in November.

And I don't know why they did that, why they took the demographic numbers that show one thing, and then turned them the other way. What it adds up to, though, is that it's not a very reliable poll.

BALDWIN: OK.

CASTRO: And, you know, others, including NBC News with their polling, has said that their polls are showing consistently in these swing state that is Hillary Clinton ahead of Donald Trump. And I'm confident that that's going to be the case when the voters go to the ballot box in November.

BALDWIN: What about all of those Bernie Sanders supporters? How do you stop -- ultimately, how do you stop Trump from getting those Sanders supporters?

CASTRO: Well, I think exactly the way that Secretary Clinton is doing.

Today, she is speaking to folks about the need to invest in early childhood education, to make child care more affordable for American families, to ensure that folks have the opportunity so that their kid can get a good, strong start in life with early childhood education.

In other words, at the end of the day, there's going to be a choice to make. And I'm convinced that folks who supported Senator Sanders want to see or have the same vision that Secretary Clinton does for our nation. That's creating opportunity for everyone and not just picking and choosing who gets opportunity in America and who doesn't.

And the problem with Donald Trump for those voters is that, you know, if you're Muslim, you're suspect. If you have to work instead of relying on investment income, then you get treated worse under his tax plan. If you're gay or lesbian or bisexual, transgender, then you can't marry the person that you love.

He wants to pick and choose who gets opportunity, and Secretary Clinton is for opportunity for every American.

BALDWIN: Do you think, though, do you think at this point in time Senator Sanders should still be in the race?

CASTRO: That's his decision. You know, he has I think made a positive contribution to the Democratic race. It was...

BALDWIN: Is it hurting her? Forgive the interruption. But Donald Trump's already pivoted. He's thinking ahead to November and she can't yet, technically.

CASTRO: No. I think that Senator Sanders has to come to a conclusion on when he should bow out of this race. Now, having said that, you know, Hillary Clinton is almost 300 pledged

delegates ahead. She's gotten more than three million votes more than Senator Sanders. She is further ahead at this point of Senator Sanders than Senator Obama was of her in 2008. So it's clear where this race is going.

This is a race between Secretary Clinton and Donald Trump and it's a strong, easy choice for Senator Sanders' supporters, I think, who want to hold Wall Street accountable, who want to make sure that we do something about income inequality, who want to ensure that America is the undisputed land of opportunity going forward for everyone, and not just a select few.

The candidate who has a vision to do that and can execute it is Secretary Clinton. It is not Donald Trump.

BALDWIN: What about -- what about, though -- and I understand, but for -- this question is really for younger viewers who are not familiar as what happened in the '90s, but if the Clinton campaign came to you and they asked you how would you respond to Donald Trump just a couple of days ago calling Hillary Clinton an enabler for her husband's infidelity, how would you tackle that?

CASTRO: Well, number one, I don't believe that millennials are concerned about the future.

I think they're concerned about the future. I think they're concerned about making sure that they're able to afford college. And that's why Secretary Clinton has proposed a new college affordability plan.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Forgive me, but take millennials out of it. How would you -- how should she respond?

CASTRO: Well, she needs to focus on what matters in people's lives.

And that's why she is in Louisville today focusing on how to make early childhood education more available to working families in the United States. That's why she is focused on greater housing opportunity, greater job opportunity.

In order to win an election, you have to speak to people about what matters to their lives. And Donald Trump can be as entertaining and as insulting as he wants, but the thing that he's not doing is that he's not connecting with folks about what's going to make their lives better, about what's going to create more opportunity for them.

He's chosen insults and slogans, instead of an actual plan and creating opportunity. And come November, what that's going to add up to is victory for Secretary Clinton.

[15:25:07]

BALDWIN: On that, I just have to ask you, the Trump taco bowl on Cinco de Mayo, the tweet and the hashtag #ILoveHispanics, your reaction, sir, when you saw that?

CASTRO: Yes. Well, you know, I love bean and cheese tacos or enchiladas or tamales or sometimes even a taco bowl, although that seemed more like Taco Bell than real Mexican food, as much as the next guy.

However, it just continued to show how out of touch Donald Trump is with the Hispanic community. The Hispanic community doesn't need a mocking image of somebody eating a taco bowl. What they need is to understand, how are you going to make sure that there's more educational opportunity out there?

How are you going to invest so that we have greater job opportunity for people of all backgrounds. What are you going to do on comprehensive immigration reform? On each of those, Secretary Clinton has much stronger plans and has walked the walk. And so what you're going to see in November is strong Hispanic turnout in the swing states and everywhere else for Secretary Clinton over Donald Trump.

BALDWIN: What about -- you are talking about Texas, where you say you're headed back next year, and I know deportations are a huge, huge issue in your home state. It's been controversial under the current presidency. What should the next administration do differently?

CASTRO: Well, let me say that I'm very proud of a lot of the work that President Obama has done with and DACA and DAPA. He's gone further than any president before him to try and keep families ore together, try and ensure that dreamers are able to stay in the United States and positively contribute to our economy.

Secretary Clinton...

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Where is he maybe making a mistake or where could the next administration improve?

CASTRO: Well, no, I don't think it's about mistakes that the president has made.

I think it's about building on the work that he's done. And so Secretary Clinton has said that she would do everything possible to build on DACA and DAPA, that she would strongly pursue comprehensive immigration reform in Congress and push for that.

So she gets it. She knows that as a nation economically and just at a human level with 11 million to 12 million folks and all of those families involved, that it makes more sense for us to get comprehensive immigration reform done.

You compare that on the other side to Donald Trump, whose solution is to build a wall, and that's not the best approach.

BALDWIN: Hmm. Do you think that Democrats are at all taking Hispanic voters for granted, politically speaking?

CASTRO: Oh, I don't believe so. And I know for sure that Secretary Clinton is not.

She has spent a lot of time not just in the last few months, but really over the course of her working life, in the Hispanic community. In fact, one of the first jobs that she had in politics was going down to South Texas, my neck of the woods, and registering Hispanic voters to get out there and participate in the Democratic process.

She's also spent a lot of time listening to communities from Nevada, to Florida, Texas about their needs, and that has informed her plans for prosperity in the future.

BALDWIN: Julian Castro, secretary of HUD there in Washington in the Obama administration, talking to me today in a personal capacity as a big fan of Hillary Clinton's, thank you so much. Talk again.

CASTRO: It's great to be with you.

BALDWIN: Thank you.

Coming up next, we are going to take a pivot away from politics for just a minute, the shocking scandal. This judge resigns after more than 4,000 nude photos are found on his computer. Investigators say the people in the frames were defendants in his courtroom. We will talk to Nancy Grace about this stunning case next.

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