Return to Transcripts main page

WOLF

FOX Cancels Monday's Republican Debate; Trump Predicts Riots if Denied Nomination; Clinton Scores Big Wins; Clinton's Strategy for Trump in General Election; Cruz: I'm Best Candidate to Beat Trump. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired March 16, 2016 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[13:30:00] DONALD TRUMP, (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE & CEO, TRUMP ORGANIZATION (voice-over): I don't think you can say that we don't get it automatically. I think it would be -- I think you would have riots.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: That's generated some commotion, riots. What did he mean?

STEPHEN MILLER, SENIOR POLICY ADVISER, DONALD TRUMP PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN: I think he meant that a lot of people would be upset. Obviously, he was speaking metaphorically. But if you have millions of people, many voting for the first time, rallying behind Donald Trump, and there's an effort to deny him the nomination, obviously, outrage would be the response.

I would just note, Donald Trump isn't just winning. He's winning in spite of an unimaginable flood, a tidal wave of special interest spending against him. I think it was $40 million in the last two weeks in Florida. He's not just winning these votes and these contests, but winning them in spite of a coordinated all-hands-on-deck effort to try to deny him the nomination and try to deny voters their choice of their nominee.

BLITZER: Even if he doesn't get 1237, that's the number you need to be guaranteed the Republican nomination at the convention, the Republican convention in Cleveland, let's say he gets close, you think they should still give it to him even though he hasn't reached that magic number?

MILLER: Absolutely. But we're expecting to reach the magic number, and right now, the delegate math look very good. After last night's crushing defeat, the crushing of Marco Rubio in Florida and picking up those 99 delegates, and the other state wins. And Ted Cruz, of course, didn't win any last night. And now we're heading into a part of the map that's even more favorable for Trump, so the delegate map looks great, and we really do expect, and we really do -- I want to emphasize this -- expect a coming together behind Donald Trump in the coming days, so we expect to wrap it up before the convention.

BLITZER: I want your reaction to what Haley Barbour, former chairman of the Republican National Committee and governor of Mississippi, said about this Trump phenomenon. He told Yahoo! News, quote, "A lot of people want to send Washington the bird, and they think Trump is the most perfect giant middle finger they can imagine."

Your reaction to Haley Barbour's rather blunt comments.

MILLER: If I can speak candidly, my respond is this, this isn't some irrational anger on the part of voters. This is a sincere and profoundly serious discontent with the direction of our country that is justified in every way. So if you look, for instance at one of the Trump's big messages, our manufacturing jobs going overseas, Americans have every right to want to bring those jobs back. This isn't a flipping the bird at Washington, D.C. This is asking for a change in policy to revitalize middle-class wages, a change in policy on trade, a change in policy on immigration, a change in policy on health care. So these are very real, serious policy disagreements, and GOP voters and Democrats and Independents are saying the policies in Washington, D.C., have been hollowing out our middle class, and we want to change those so we can have a better future.

BLITZER: Donald Trump had a very, very impressive night last night. We'll see where it goes down the road next Tuesday. There are more contests including in Arizona, in Utah.

Stephen Miller, thanks very much for joining us.

MILLER: Thank you.

BLITZER: Stephen Miller is a senior policy adviser to the Trump campaign.

Up next, Donald Trump calls Hillary Clinton an embarrassment and says she doesn't have the stamina to be president of the United States. What's Hillary Clinton's strategy for Trump if she does face him in a general election? We'll hear directly from her campaign.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

[13:37:43] BLITZER: A huge win for Donald Trump in Florida.

TRUMP (voice-over): We have to bring our party together.

DONNA BRAZILE, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Donald Trump on the way to the nomination. To try to deny him is stupid.

SEN. MARCO RUBIO, (R), FLORIDA & FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The fact that I've even come this far is evidence of how special America truly is.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The establishment has been completely destroyed tonight. SEN. TED CRUZ, (R), TEXAS & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Tor those who

supported Marco for those, who worked so hard, we welcome you with open arms.

BLITZER: CNN projects that John Kasich is the winner of the Ohio Republican presidential primary.

JOHN KASICH, (R), OHIO GOVERNOR & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I have to thank the people of the great state of Ohio. I love you.

DAVID AXELROD, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: He has to prove he can win beyond his home state.

BLITZER: Hillary Clinton wins Ohio.

Hillary Clinton, we project, also will win Florida.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is a bitter result for Bernie Sanders.

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS, (I), VERMONT & DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We have come a long way in 10 months.

HILLARY CLINTON, (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE & FORMER SECRETARY OF STATE: We are moving closer to securing the Democratic Party nomination.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think you are beginning to see Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump steamrolling toward what could be an epic fall confrontation.

((END VIDEOTAPE))

BLITZER: Welcome back. Hillary Clinton scoring some major wins last night in at least four key victories, in Ohio, Illinois, Florida and North Carolina. Missouri, by the way, is still too close to call. No final decision on Missouri yet. But those victories do give Hillary Clinton about 700 more delegates than Bernie Sanders. If you include the super delegates, that is a huge number. Without the super delegates, she's up by about 300 pledged delegates.

Joining us is the chief strategist for the Hillary for America campaign, Joel Benenson.

Joel, I know you have some laryngitis, but we'll get through this interview. Thanks very much for joining us.

Let me get your reaction to the news on the other side. FOX News was supposed to have a presidential debate next Monday. Donald Trump earlier this morning said he was not going to participate. He's giving a speech here in Washington instead. They have gone ahead and canceled that debate. Your reaction?

JOEL BENENSON, CHIEF STRATEGIST, HILLARY FOR AMERICA CAMPAIGN: I mean, look, that's up to FOX News. I'm surprised they would let a candidate dictate whether they're going to air a debate or not. They still have a competitive race. Trump has a lead. He's out in front. But Ted Cruz is putting up a strong fight. John Kasich, who's gotten traction late, is not going away yet. I think it's unfortunate when a network decides to let one candidate dictate what they do.

They've got a struggle in their party. More than half the Republican primary voters I know -- Mr. Trump likes to read polls -- saying they aren't satisfied with their candidates. I think that means the candidates should debate more.

[13:40:34] BLITZER: Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders, are they going to continue their debates?

BENENSON: I mean, look, I think our path going forward will see -- I don't even recall if we have any more scheduled right now. Obviously we have more contests, big ones on our side on April 19th and April 26th. But the reality here is that the math, as you just showed, really effectively precludes Senator Sanders from being able to make up this gap in pledged delegates. Hillary Clinton has a lead now in pledged delegates. That's just about twice of what Barack Obama had against Hillary Clinton in 2008, so it is substantial. And, you know, if you look at the 10 states Senator Sanders has won, he has netted about 85 or 87 delegates. You know, we netted that many just out of Florida and Ohio. So the math is just the math. You can't get around that.

BLITZER: Do you want him to suspend his campaign?

BENENSON: No, I think any decisions about his campaign will have to be up to him. Obviously, he's run a strong, spirited campaign. I'm sure they're spending a lot of time today looking over the math and what that means, and if they want to continue, what kind of campaign would they continue? We certainly can't speak for them.

We're prepared to keep competing and win, like we've done. Right now, we've won more states, obviously, the delegate lead, and we've got close to two million more votes, a little more than two million votes than Senator Sanders. So I think that's for them to evaluate.

And we feel good about where we are today, obviously, and where we are going forward, I think, on the past for Hillary Clinton to become the first woman nominee of a major party as president in the United States.

BLITZER: I know you're upbeat as far as that is concerned. She took a swipe at Donald Trump in her victory speech last night. Let's listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: Our commander-in-chief has to be able to defend our country, not embarrass it. When we hear a candidate for president call for rounding up 12 million, immigrants, banning all Muslims from entering the United States --

(BOOING)

CLINTON: -- when he embraces torture, that doesn't make him strong, it makes him wrong.

(CHEERING)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: So is she working under the assumption now, Joel, that Donald Trump will be the Republican nominee and she's going to focus her attention on him?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BENENSON: I think it's important to remember, Wolf, that, if you go back, Hillary Clinton was the first person to denounce Donald Trump when he said he was going to ban all Muslims. That was long before he won any delegates, long before the Republican Party was wrestling with what it means to have him as a front-runner there. What she did yesterday was bring together some of the things she's called out on the stump repeatedly. It wasn't just yesterday. She has said in the last few weeks, you can't make America great again by, you know, not doing the things that made America great in the first place. That kind of language and what she called out yesterday shows that Donald Trump really is not lining up with the values that made America great in the first place. We have been and inclusive strong country because we embrace our diversity, not because we turn our backs on it or use it to divide Americans. I think that message is -- is very an important one for candidates for president who are in the race against Mr. Trump to keep making.

BLITZER: Well, very quickly, I know we're out of time, you know math, politics, strategy. Looking at the math on the Republican side, does he have the nomination virtually locked up?

BENENSON: Well, I mean, if you look at the math, he's got an advantage. He's got -- he still has to win at a high rate going forward, not at high a rate, for example, that precludes Senator Sanders from really making up ground. And the question on that side is, as the field shrinks -- because there are going to be some delegates that Rubio has, Kasich is in the low 100s, mid 100s. If Kasich can stay in, the governor, and Senator Cruz, can they hold down Trump's margins quickly in the upcoming states? Otherwise, that real estate is going to shrink for them as well. At some point, Trump will become the nominee, because the math will work. I think it's not quite there yet, but it's getting close.

[13:45:33] BLITZER: If he's the nominee on the Republican side, Hillary Clinton is the nominee on the Democratic side, we'll look forward to the three presidential debates in September and October leading up to the November election. That could be lively indeed.

Joel, thanks very much for joining us.

BENENSON: Thank you, Wolf.

BLITZER: Coming up, the fallout from last night's primary battles now forcing Ted Cruz to confront an unexpected obstacle -- John Kasich. We'll talk about that and a lot more. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Updating the breaking news right now. Next Monday's Republican presidential debate on FOX News has been canceled. The decision came after Trump said he would skip the debate because of a scheduling conflict.

Right now, Trump holds a huge delegate lead over the field, by 254 pledged delegates. His closest competitor, Ted Cruz, believes he is the establishment's best hope for beating Donald Trump, but he needs John Kasich, he says, to quit and to quit now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[13:50:12] SEN. TED CRUZ, (R), TEXAS & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He doesn't have any chance of winning. It is true, John Kasich might take just enough votes to give those states to Donald Trump. If he sticks around, John Kasich will become Donald Trump's best friend.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Let's bring in our CNN political commentators. Joining us, Amanda Carpenter, the former communications director for Senator Cruz; and Doug Heye, the former communications director for the Republican National Committee.

First, Doug, your reaction to -- it's a pretty significant development. There was supposed to be a presidential debate Monday night in Salt Lake City. FOX News was hosting the debate. Trump said this morning on FOX News he has had enough of these debates. Kasich later said, if Trump's not going, I'm not going. That debate has been canceled.

DOUG HEYE, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Obviously, there is no reason to have a debate if Donald Trump is not there. But each of these debates has gotten more and more important as we have less and less people in them. It's also more time. So it's unfortunate, but a smart decision politically for Trump. It's more time for Trump to speak, more room for error, so he got out.

(CROSSTALK)

BLITZER: Less opportunity for his challengers like Cruz and Kasich to go after him, skipping the debate. He is the front-runner right now. Usually what front-runners like to do that, skip debates.

AMANDA CARPENTER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: It also gives his opposition talking points. Saying this guy is acting like he has the nomination rolled up. He's not trying to earn your vote. He's disrespecting the press. And he doesn't want to air his views anymore. Meanwhile, I'm happy to talk to you anywhere, any time. Donald Trump is avoiding you, therefore, listen to me.

BLITZER: Is it a two-man race, Cruz and Trump, or a three-man? Do you include Kasich as a possible contender? HEYE: It's more of a two-and-a-half-man race right now. I think it was a big win for John Kasich last night, not just to put points on the board, but he made sure Donald Trump didn't run the table. If he had won every state, unanimously for Donald Trump last night, he would have not just a higher delegate count, but a lot more momentum, a lot more to talk about than he does right now.

BLITZER: I talked to Governor John Kasich afterwards last night. He's not going anywhere. He is staying in the race. Very enthused. He thinks winning his home state of Ohio is a huge deal for him.

CARPENTER: Sure. But now he has an obligation to say where else he wins. What is his path? He is an unproven quantity. So far, he has refused to engage Donald Trump. He hasn't faced the wrath of Donald Trump. The only thing that Trump went after is John Kasich on was saying you're an absentee governor and your economy was boosted quite a bit by fracking. That is a very light touch. John Kasich has a temper that he has controlled very well so far. I don't know how that clash works out. I don't see how Kasich wins outside his home state where he enjoys a huge advantage as a sitting governor. He has to show people where he can win. Otherwise, he is just handicapping Ted Cruz.

BLITZER: He says he is in Pennsylvania right now. He thinks he can win next door. Ohio and Pennsylvania, they are neighbors.

HEYE: He could do well in Pennsylvania's steel country. It's been a Trump stronghold, but it's somewhere where Kasich has spillover where he can go into. Kasich should not get out right now. It's the argument that Ted Cruz should make. It benefits his campaign. But after such a big, he has to see now where he can perform. If he can perform well in Utah and other states like that as we go back to some proportional voting, anything that takes away delegates for Trump, if you are a Never Trump or a Never Trump PAC person or looking at those candidates to do so, it helps.

BLITZER: Trump told Chris Cuomo this morning on CNN's "New Day" that if he is close to getting 1237, that number, but let's say he is shy by 100 or something, but everybody else is shy by 500 or 600 and they don't give it to him, there could be, in his word, "riots." You heard him say that.

CARPENTER: Yeah, that sounds like a threat. Certainly this is why people are turned off by Donald Trump. This is why people, even though he leads in the delegates now, don't see going along with his nomination, will do anything to stop him. If he doesn't have 1237 delegate, he has to prove to people he can unify, that he can get delegates from other people's camps. Cruz has been trying to do that throughout the process. This is what it will come down: Who will the people, among the establishment, in particular, choose, Ted Cruz or the crazy candidate that is Donald Trump.

BLITZER: You really like Donald Trump that much, huh?

(LAUGHTER)

CARPENTER: You could have conservative or crazy.

(LAUGHTER)

I know which way I would go.

BLITZER: Do you think there is going to be a contested convention or will it be wrapped up in advance, as is usually the case?

HEYE: If things continue as they are, Trump won't have the delegates to get there. If he doesn't have 1237, then he didn't do what he needed to do to get the nomination, as surprising and as amazing as his candidacy is. Now what do we see from Trump? More rhetoric of violence, more threats to the party. That's what establishment Republican voters, a majority of Republican voters are rejecting in state after state.

CARPENTER: For Donald Trump to get to 1237, he has to win 54 percent of the contests going forward. That's a high standard. This is going to be an open brawl until July.

BLITZER: Rubio drops out. He had support. Where does that money, that support go with the three remaining candidates?

[13:54:54] HEYE: We know where it won't go. It certainly won't go to Donald Trump. Their race against each other was so personal. Some will go to Ted Cruz. There are people who know him in the Senate when he worked together with Rubio. Kasich folks are banking on getting financial support after their win in Ohio as well.

One thing to remember, if you look at Ohio, Illinois, Missouri, last night, more than 40 percent of Republicans in exit polls said, I'll look at a third-party candidate if it is a Hillary versus Donald Trump match up. If that's the case, Donald Trump is not a unity candidate and the party and the voters in the party are not coalescing around him.

BLITZER: We know last night Donald Trump did win North Carolina, Florida, Illinois. Kasich won Ohio. Missouri, we're still waiting. It's very, very close in Missouri. We'll see if Cruz can pull it out, or Trump. He seems to be slightly ahead in Missouri. Not a goodnight for Cruz last night.

HEYE: They will split the delegates in Missouri. It's so close that it will be --

(CROSSTALK)

BLITZER: Ohio and Florida were winner-take-all but not the other states.

All right, guys, thanks very, very much.

HEYE: Thank you.

BLITZER: That's it for me. Thanks very much for watching. I'll be back at 5:00 p.m. eastern in "The Situation Room." The news continues right after a quick break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)