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Trump Dominates Polls In South Carolina And Nevada; Ted Cruz Message To Donald Trump; Trump Leading Among South Carolina Evangelicals; Trump Responds to Cruz; Interview with Rep. Peter King. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired February 17, 2016 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: Hello, I'm Wolf Blitzer. It's 10:00 a.m. in Las Vegas, 1:00 p.m. here in Washington, 8:00 p.m. in Accura (ph), Turkey. Wherever you're watching from around the world, thanks very much for joining us.

We begin with a very dramatic escalation in the battle for the race for the White House. Ted Cruz is now calling out Donald Trump over a threatened lawsuit. Cruz saying Trump's threat stems from a Cruz T.V. ad. The ad uses comments Trump made to NBC back in 1999 when he said he was, quote, "very pro-choice." Ted Cruz's message to Trump, sue me.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TED CRUZ (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Donald's lawyer sent our campaign a cease and desist letter. And this letter, I will say, having practiced law for many, many years, this letter is one of the most remarkable letters I've ever read. Mr. Trump's lawyers contend that that advertisement you just saw is, quote, material -- "is an attempt to materially mislead the public." And indeed he provides a little bit more detail. He says that this attack ad, is what he calls it, is, quote, "not only completely disingenuous but replete with lies, false, defamatory and destructive statements and downright fabrications."

Mr. Trump's lawyer's letter goes on to say, the ad, quote, "blatantly misrepresents to the public that Mr. Trump is pro-choice. And nothing could be further from the truth." And the letter concludes, by threatening if we will not pull down the ad, that Mr. Trump will seek immediate legal action to prevent the continued broadcast of this ad, and to hold me jointly and severally liable to the fullest extent of the law for any damages resulting therefrom.

You know, I have to say to Mr. Trump, you have been threatening frivolous lawsuits for your entire adult life. Even in the annals of frivolous lawsuits, this takes the cake. So, Donald, I would encourage you, if you want to file a lawsuit challenging this ad, claiming it is defamation, file a lawsuit.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLITZER: Our Chief Political Analyst Gloria Borger is with us now. She was over there at the Cruz news conference in Seneca, South Carolina. Gloria, let me play a bit of that ad that Cruz is talking about and then --

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Sure.

BLITZER: -- we'll discuss.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CRUZ: I'm Ted Cruz, and I approve this message.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Life, marriage, religious liberty. The second amendment. We're just one supreme court justice away from losing them all.

TIM RUSSERT, ANCHOR, NBC: Would president Trump ban partial birth abortion?

TRUMP: Well, look, I'm very pro-choice.

RUSSERT: But you would not ban it --

TRUMP: No.

RUSSERT: -- or ban partial birth abortions?

TRUMP: No. I would -- I am -- I am pro-choice in every respect.

RUSSERT: We cannot trust Donald Trump with these serious decisions.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLITZER: All right. Gloria, the -- Cruz went on to say that if there is this lawsuit, he would welcome the fact to personally depose Donald Trump in a court of law under oath. He says, look what it did for Bill Clinton back in the 1990s when he was deposed under oath that he was -- he was making a similar analogy to Donald Trump right now. A really dramatic escalation in this war between these two --

BORGER: It was.

BLITZER: -- Republican front runners.

BORGER: It was. You know, and Cruz's argument is, as he said, quote, "repeating someone's own words, you know, cannot be defamation." And you see the ad which is an old Tim Russert interview from a Sunday morning, I believe in 1999.

And what this is all about, Wolf, is Cruz wanting to portray Donald Trump as someone who cannot be trusted on the social issues. Our poll yesterday showed that Ted Cruz is 20 points behind Donald Trump with evangelical voters. Evangelical voters, while not a monolith, certainly care about the issue of abortion. And this is one way for Cruz to say, wait a minute, look at his own words. Point attention to his own ad, and say to Donald Trump, bring it on. [13:05:00] You know, he also took the opportunity to take a whack, I might add, at Marco Rubio, saying that Marco Rubio, in calling him a liar, is behaving like Donald Trump with a smile. So, he managed to take on both of them in one presser, get some advantage here by getting this kind of attention. And pointing out this lawsuit, which he says, of course, is frivolous, just like he believes Donald Trump's candidacy is.

BLITZER: Stand by for a moment. I also want to bring in our Senior White House Correspondent Jim Acosta. He's in Bluffton, South Carolina. That's where Trump held an event a little while ago. Also joining us from Greenville, South Carolina is our Political Director David Chalian.

Jim, first of all, any reaction yet from the Trump campaign to this latest Cruz challenge?

JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: No, Wolf. And it is rather surprising that Donald Trump's legal team would send a cease and desist letter to the Ted Cruz campaign and yet the Donald Trump campaign has not put out any statements. Their top officials have not responded to e-mails saying what this is about. All we have really to go by, at this point, is this letter that the Ted Cruz campaign has released, saying these are Donald Trump's lawyers saying to cease and desist, to stop running this ad. So, we're waiting to hear from the Donald Trump campaign on that.

But I can tell you, Wolf, that this has been a burr in Donald Trump's saddle all week. He has been very, you know -- he has been very out -- you know, outspoken about these attacks coming from Ted Cruz on the issue of abortion. And earlier this morning here at this event in Bluffton, South Carolina, Donald Trump, once again, described Ted Cruz as dishonest, that he was lying about his record on abortion.

We should point out, Donald Trump did once describe himself as pro- choice in the past. He did so in that interview with Tim Russert back in 1999. He says he's evolved on the issue like Donald -- like Ronald Reagan.

But here's how Donald Trump described it at this event earlier this morning. Here's what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: But Cruz said, he's not pro-life. I said, I'm not? I'm pro- life. You can't lie about people like that. I -- it's just incredible. And, again, I've been in business and I've dealt with some pretty rough hombres, much tougher than Cruz. But I've never dealt with anybody that lied so much. And then, he says he's religious. No wonder I'm winning the evangelicals by, like, two to one.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Now, Donald Trump also had choice words for Lindsey Graham. He talked about George W. Bush. But it seems that this fight -- this very personal fight between Donald Trump and Ted Cruz is sort of overwhelming everything else inside the Trump campaign right now.

And, at this point, Wolf, we're just waiting to hear from the candidate himself. He has not tweeted. He goes on these tweet storms. He's not tweeted about this. We've not heard from top campaign officials confirming that this has indeed happened and explaining what they think their legal standing is because Donald Trump, being a public figure who is running for president, obviously what he has said in the past is fair game. So, what Donald Trump thinks he can gain by all of this is something that the campaign has not explained, at this point -- Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, stand by. David Chalian, this comes on the heels of Trump earlier saying he was going to maybe file a suit saying that Cruz isn't even eligible to run for the presidency, because he was born in Canada. The allegation being he's not a natural-born U.S. citizen. This is a separate lawsuit he's filing now that this ad is, in effect, defamation. If you -- why is this escalating so dramatically right now?

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: Well, what Donald Trump is trying to do here, he's clearing making a calculation because what -- on the -- on the negative side for him, he's giving now free media attention, allowing Ted Cruz to go out there and highlight this letter and bring up the issue of Donald Trump's past pro-choice positions. So, in one sense, he's giving oxygen to one of his opponent's argument.

On the flip side, what I think Trump and his team is calculating here, Wolf, is that, hey, I'm not going to take this lying down. I'm not going to let Ted Cruz, sort of unanswered, just advertise about my past when that is no longer my position.

So, what Trump tries to do by sending this cease and desist letter is muddy the waters here with Cruz. Don't give Cruz just a clean shot, trying to portray him as pro-choice when he no longer holds those positions.

And now, get into battle with him, where the free media will be about the battle between them instead of simply about Ted Cruz's accusations that Donald Trump was once pro-choice and can't be trusted as a true conservative. I think that's the calculation going on here.

BLITZER: And it comes also, Gloria, at a time when --

BORGER: And one other thing --

BLITZER: -- Gloria, it comes at a time when Trump is way ahead of Cruz in South Carolina, according to our latest poll, in Nevada, according to our latest poll. And take a look at this. Among -- these are likely Republicans, 38, 22. But it's a 16-point advantage there for Trump. But among evangelicals, as Jim Acosta pointed out, he's beating Cruz by 19 points. Trump 42, Cruz 23, among white evangelicals in South Carolina. So, clearly, this is irritating Cruz.

[13:10:08] BORGER: Well, this is exactly, I think, what this press conference was about. You know, to point out that, in fact, whether it's current or in the past, Donald Trump was on the record saying, I'm very pro-life. Now he is not. But it is something that Cruz wants to point out, that Donald Trump has kind of evolved and can you trust him?

And what Cruz also did this morning, I might point out, Wolf, is that he also had a pretty detailed list of Donald Trump's previous political contributions in recent years. And said, look, you can't trust somebody who helped fund the Democratic takeover of the Congress.

So, on those two points, A, he was pro-choice. And, B, he gave an awful lot of money to Democrats. Can you trust him to name somebody to this Supreme Court who would be a reliable conservative if he were to become president of the United States? Again, hammering that home. You can't trust him, he's not who he says he is so watch out. And I think he's talking to those evangelical voters who really, clearly in this state, prefer Trump over Cruz right now.

BLITZER: Jim, I suspect it's not going to be long before we hear directly from Donald Trump. But what is his schedule for the rest of this afternoon?

ACOSTA: Right. He does have an event later on this evening, and so we'll hear Donald Trump at that point. I can't imagine that we're going to go through the afternoon, though, and not hear anything from the Trump campaign about this.

And I just want to add one more thing to what Gloria was saying because I think the other thing that Ted Cruz was responding to, and this has been a key element of the Donald Trump strategy here over the last couple of weeks, is that Ted Cruz engages in dirty tricks, that he can't be trusted.

Donald Trump does not miss a chance at every campaign rally. He goes after Ted Cruz, or almost every campaign rally, goes after Ted Cruz, accuses ted Cruz of pulling a fast one in Iowa. And that was the reason why he was able to siphon votes away from Ben Carson and that was the reason why Donald Trump did not win the state of Iowa. He -- Trump mentions that at just about every campaign rally.

And when I was listening to that press conference that Ted Cruz was delivering there was almost -- he was almost he was lawyerly going through all of these various accusations, because you not only hear them from the Trump campaign, you have Marco Rubio almost echoing nearly word for word the exact same accusations against Ted Cruz. He's even going after Ted Cruz on Ben Carson.

And so, you know, I think that that is something that is clearly -- that has gotten under Ted Cruz's skin. And it is something that is working for Donald Trump, at this point. When you talk to Donald Trump supporters, they often point out, they don't like what Ted Cruz, or they say they don't like, what they think Ted Cruz did in Iowa.

And Ted Cruz goes on to say, and you heard it during that press conference, he has an explanation that has somehow to do with CNN, in terms of what went on in Iowa, which isn't true. But, at the same time, this is something that Donald Trump has done methodically for the last couple of weeks to get under Ted Cruz's skin.

And I think that this -- if this cease and desist letter is confirmed by the Trump campaign, or when it's confirmed by the Trump campaign, Wolf, I -- you know, it is -- let's just call it what it is. It is basically a stunt. It has no legal standing. It's not as if that ad is going to come down because of this cease and desist letter. Donald Trump has said, himself, he was going to take down ads in this state that have not been taken down. You still see them on television here.

So -- but, clearly, this is something that irritates Donald Trump, this issue of abortion and where he stands on abortion. He said -- he has said it time and again, he considers himself pro-life now but that he's evolved on the issue -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Yes, let's see if he backs away from filing a lawsuit on this issue of the ad but goes forward with a lawsuit on the issue of the eligibility of Ted Cruz to even serve - run or serve as president, --

ACOSTA: Yes, that could happen.

BLITZER: -- because he was born in Canada. We'll see if that lawsuit were to go forward.

Guys, stand by. An important note to our viewers. Tonight and tomorrow night, you can hear the Republican presidential candidates, all six of them, make their pitch directly to the South Carolina voters in live -- in two live town halls, moderated by our own Anderson Cooper. Ben Carson, Marco Rubio and Ted Cruz, they'll be live tonight followed by John Kasich, Jeb Bush and Donald Trump tomorrow night. Join us both nights 8:00 p.m. Eastern right here on CNN. The South Carolina Republican primary is Saturday.

He called Donald Trump a poor man's imitation of Michael Moore. Now, Congressman Peter King is standing by. He'll join us live to tell us how he really feels about the Republican presidential frontrunner.

And Democratic presidential contender, Hillary Clinton, won Nevada eight years ago. But a new poll suggests she may have lost some of her appeal. We'll discuss the latest. Our panel, our reporters, our analysts, all are standing by.

[13:14:58]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:18:46] BLITZER: So is the Trump campaign going to respond to Senator Cruz calling out Trump, basically suggesting he's a liar? Let's bring in Katrina Pierson. She's the national spokeswoman for the Trump campaign. She's joining us on the phone right now.

So your immediate reaction -- we're just getting in a statement, Katrina, from Donald Trump. Let me, in fact, read some of that statement to our viewers, then we'll discuss.

Here's what your candidate, Donald Trump, just said, responding to what Senator Cruz said. "Ted Cruz has already had one of his ads pulled off the air concerning Senator Rubio because it was totally false. Additionally, he was forced to apologize to Dr. Ben Carson for fraudulently stealing his votes in Iowa and was embarrassed by his phony voter violation form." Trump adds, "he is a liar and these ads and statements made by Cruz are clearly desperate moves by a guy who is tanking in the polls, watching his campaign go up in flames. Finally explains Cruz's logic." I guess that's -- that what he meant to say. "I do not support taxpayer funding for Planned Parenthood." This is what Trump says. "As long as they are performing abortions. I have been clear about my position on this issue for years. I am also a strong advocate of the Second Amendment and a proud member of the NRA, as are my sons." Finally, Trump says this. "I will repeal and replace Obamacare and I would nominate a very conservative justice to protect our freedoms and conservative values. If I want to bring a lawsuit, it would be legitimate. Likewise, if I want to bring a lawsuit regarding Senator Cruz being a natural-born Canadian, I will do so. Time will tell. Donald J. Trump." That's the statement from Trump.

[13:20:27] So is he going to go forward, Katrina, with two separate lawsuits? Is that what I'm hearing?

KATRINA PIERSON, NATIONAL SPOKESPERSON, TRUMP CAMPAIGN (via telephone): Well, you know, we're going to have to see. I mean this was quite an interesting stretch for Senator Cruz. And I'll just mention, it wasn't even just a Rubio ad that was false. The camp -- Cruz's campaign admitted that one of the imminent domain ads they ran in Iowa was false. So you have a -- you have a tradition here of Senator Cruz trying to gain back some ground that he's lost. The CNN poll that came out showed that Donald Trump is winning heavily with evangelicals, which is, you know, something that Ted Cruz just does not have a path without. So what we're seeing today is Senator Cruz desperately trying to get his message out, which tends to be a message that no one is buying into, because many of the voters have already heard from some of these other candidates.

BLITZER: So -- but I just want to be precise. What Donald Trump, the man you want to be the next president of the United States, is saying, that he might go ahead and file two separate lawsuits. One against this ad that's out there, that the Cruz campaign put out, referring to an interview he did back in 1999 with Tim Russert of NBC News in which he said he was pro-choice, and a separate lawsuit on his eligibility, Cruz's eligibility to serve as president, because he was born in Canada. I guess the bottom line question is, is he going to go file two separate lawsuits? And if yes, when?

PIERSON: Well, I think the answer is quite possibly. Again, this would be a decision made specifically by Mr. Trump himself. And then I'll also say that this is one of the reasons, Wolf, why good people don't run for office because you have so many falsehoods and lies and character assassinations and this would be a way to sort of set a precedent for voters to reject this type of campaigning, if a politician to reject this type of campaigning as well.

BLITZER: As you know, Cruz also said -- he's a former solicitor general in the state of Texas. He said -- he's a lawyer. He's argued cases before the Supreme Court. He said he would welcome the possibility of personally deposing Donald Trump in any lawsuit, getting him under oath, making him answer certain specific questions. And he referred to the fact that when President Bill Clinton was president of the United States, he was deposed under oath, and we all know how that wound up. Is -- that's a direct challenge from Cruz to Trump. How do you think Trump is going to respond to that?

PIERSON: Well, you know, maybe we can have Lawrence Tribe (ph) depose Senator Cruz when it comes to his naturalized -- his naturalization case. And, you know, but -- just getting back to the point here, Wolf, and we're talking about a senator calling out Donald Trump for being anti-Second Amendment, when Mr. Trump is a member of the NRA, his sons have gone hunting. (INAUDIBLE) himself said that Donald Jr. was a better shot than Ted Cruz. And he's actually telling people that Donald Trump -- someone that has a concealed carry permit in the state of New York is anti-Second Amendment. He's still saying that Donald Trump would not support appointing a conservative judge to the Supreme Court of the United States, when, in fact, Donald Trump is the only candidate that's even offered names. Someone like Bill Pryer (ph), who has said Roe vs. Wade is the worst abomination in history. Someone that was endorsed by Senator Jeff Sessions. So Senator Cruz is just now reaching and grasping, as his poll numbers continue to drop. And Donald Trump is going to continue to fight for what he believes will make America great again.

BLITZER: Katrina, thanks very much. Katrina Pierson, the national spokesperson for the Trump campaign.

And that last line from the Trump statement that was just released, let me re-read it. He said, "likewise, if I want to bring the lawsuit regarding Senator Cruz being a natural-born Canadian, I will do so. Time will tell. Teddy." Yes, he calls Senator Cruz Teddy in that statement.

Trump's tone on the campaign trail has earned him a lot of critics. Among them right now, the New York congressman, Peter King. He's a Republican. He's a member of the House Homeland Security Committee, the Intelligence Committee. He was, at one point, thinking of running for the Republican presidential nomination but decided last summer not to do so.

Let me get your quick reaction, congressman, to this fight -- it's a brutal war that's underway right now between Senator Cruz and Donald Trump. Where do you stand? Are you with Cruz or are you with Trump?

REP. PETER KING (R), NEW YORK: Well, on this issue, listen, I'm no fan of Ted Cruz by any means, but he's 100 percent right on this. You have an absolute right to show past appearances by a candidate where he took a different position. In 1999, Donald Trump was pro-choice. And Ted Cruz has the absolute right to show that and let the voters decide whether Donald Trump is being honest then, being honest now or why he changed his position over the years if he is being honest now. That is very, very fair comment and for a guy like Donald Trump, who says he's so tough and he can't even take, you know, seeing himself 19 years ago, 17 years ago, you know, it shows he's not that tough at all. So this is just part of -- to me, like a goon squad mentality that Donald Trump has. When he sees something he doesn't like, he's going to bring a lawsuit. You can't show it.

[13:25:37] In a free society, in a democracy, hey, I've been in campaigns, many of them over the years. People say a lot of things about you. Some true, some untrue. This is true. And a lot of times you just have to explain why you said something in the past. Apparently Donald Trump doesn't want to do that.

So, again, this is part of the heavy-handed tactics he's been using. And it shows, again -- like I've said, he's always saying what a tough guy he is. I don't think he's tough at all. And if he can't take this, he really shows he doesn't have the guts.

BLITZER: What about the second lawsuit questioning the eligibility of Cruz to serve as president because he was born in Canada? Do you think Trump has any legal standing there?

KING: Yes, I think -- you know, there could be a basis for that. I mean this has not been decided. I -- obviously before. I think it's something that, you know, may have to be litigated. It would be unfortunate.

I know, for instance, a former chief judge of the New York State Court of Appeals, he has come out and said that he thinks that Ted Cruz could have real problems because of where he was born, going through the distinctions of natural-born and how the founding fathers treated that entire issue. So that -- yes, that could be a very legitimate issue, but it shouldn't be used as a threat by Donald Trump. Like, if you don't take down this ad, I'm going to sue you for not -- you know, to say you're not eligible to run for president. Again, one has nothing to do with the other. If you feel that strongly about it, then bring the lawsuit. If not, you know, keep your mouth quiet.

BLITZER: Last summer, when we spoke back on August 24th, you said some nice things about Donald Trump.

KING: That's right.

BLITZER: Let me play a little clip of what you said about him at that time. This is shortly after he announced he was running for the Republican nomination.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KING: He's appealing to real people. And I'm saying this as a New Yorker, he may be a billionaire from the east side of Manhattan, but he talks like the guys that I grew up with in Queens and Brooklyn. He talks like a real person. And that's resonating. Now, how this is going to play out between now and the primaries, I don't know, but I think he's forcing the other candidates to be more real and to get off their talking points and address issues that the American people are concerned about.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: And now you -- obviously you've evolved since then.

KING: That's right.

BLITZER: Now you don't even think he's fit to be president, right?

KING: No. In fact, Wolf, I guess I should sue you and threaten you, you know, to take that down. You shouldn't be showing things I said that are different from what I'm saying now. If I was Donald Trump, that's what I'd be saying.

No, seriously, listen, I did have hope for Donald Trump. Until recently, I thought that he'd be able to galvanize Reagan Democrats and some of his foolish remarks and (INAUDIBLE) quirks, like what he said with John McCain, that these are statements he made. But when I saw what he did over the weekend, that was, to me, the finale for me, whether he was -- when he lied about George Bush about 9/11, about weapons of mass destruction. Either he lied or he's dumb, one or the other. And that, to me, was just a flagrant disregard for the truth. And the shouting and the yelling and the carrying on and also this tough guy act.

Listen, I grew up in Queens. I knew a lot of tough guys. There was a lot of tough neighborhoods. Where he grew up in Jamaica Estates, I can tell you, that was the rich kids. A rich -- no -- no tough guy ever come out of Jamaica Estates. And, also, tough guys don't have orange hair.

BLITZER: Have you endorsed any of these Republicans? Which one do you like the most?

KING: I would think that as far as qualifications, I think Jeb Bush would be the most qualified. Again, a lots going to depend on how he does in South Carolina. Other than that, I would say Marco Rubio. John Kasich is also -- he served in the House. All three of them are more than qualified to be president. Again, I would -- my -- you know closest poll (ph) would be for Jeb Bush. But, again, we have to see what happens in South Carolina and then I think it's probably people are going to have to start making a decision to get behind one candidate who has the best chance. Because, again, between Cruz and Trump, to me, it's like two tarantulas in a bottle.

BLITZER: Strong words from Peter King. Congressman, thanks, as usual, for joining us.

KING: Wolf, thank you.

BLITZER: And tonight, remember, CNN is hosting its first of two Republican presidential town halls. It's a chance for the candidates to get their message out directly to the folks in South Carolina. But with Donald Trump's big lead in the polls, what will it take to close the gap? We'll discuss that with our panel. Stay with us.

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