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Clinton and Sanders Debate; Candidates Briefings; Foreign Policy Debate; Evangelicals Gather to Hear Candidates; Cruz Camp Pulls Ad. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired February 12, 2016 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[14:00:08] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, and off. Top of the hour. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thank you for being with me. Happy Friday.

Here we go to the race for the next president. The current president was at center stage at the democratic debate between Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton. Coming off her thumping, we'll call it, in New Hampshire earlier this week, Clinton used Barack Obama to boost her first prime-time shot at a comeback.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I think President Obama has set a great example. I think he has addressed a lot of these issues that have been quite difficult. But he has gone forward. President Obama succeed in doing was to build on the health care system we have. I think under President Obama we have seen a lot of advances. I understand what president Obama inherited. So I think what President Obama did was to exemplify the importance of this issue as our first African-American president. The fact is that there was a great effort made by the Obama administration. Let's not in any way imply here that either President Obama or myself would in any way not take on any vested interest.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: No doubt she was looking to make points in South Carolina, where 28 percent of registered voters are African-American. And check a Gallup poll taken last week found the president's approval rating among African-Americans is a whopping 92 percent. The Democratic primary in the palmetto state is all of 15 days away.

As for Bernie Sanders and his counter, he embraced the president as well, after pointing out that questioning authority is part of what he does.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Last I heard, we lived in a democratic society. Last I heard, a United States senator had the right to disagree with the president, including a president who has done such an extraordinary job. So I have voiced criticisms. You're right. Maybe you haven't. I have.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Let's begin the hour with CNN politics senior reporter Stephen Collinson.

We pointed out just some of the moments there. How do you think Hillary Clinton did?

STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN POLITICS SENIOR REPORTER: I think she had a good debate, given that the last time we saw her publicly was after the New Hampshire primary when she was obviously giving a speech that was encapsulating her own defeat in that primary to Sanders. So I think it was a good night for Hillary Clinton in that sense. And I think we saw the start of what is going to be a war of attrition between Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton. There was no real attempt by the former secretary of state to land a knockout punch. She did land some telling blows on Bernie Sanders and she began to make this narrative clear that she is the, you know, the favored successor to Barack Obama.

Clearly, as you said, she was having one eye, yes, on the South Carolina primary. Barack Obama is very popular in South Carolina among African-American voters, but also among Democrats generally. And there's no real appetite in this Democratic primary for voters to see their candidates taking shots at the president. So I think she had a good night, but it was - it showed us how the race has changed since Iowa and New Hampshire. We're in for a long haul now, I think, Brooke.

BALDWIN: On that point, though, looking ahead to South Carolina, you mentioned President Obama. I want to get the Bernie Sanders side of things and raise a pervasive issue here. Here is Senator Sanders from last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANDERS: Sadly, in America today, in our economy, a whole lot of those poor people are African-American.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So race relations would be better under a Sanders presidency than they've been?

SANDERS: Race - absolutely. Because what we will do is say, instead of giving tax breaks to billionaires, we are going to create millions of jobs for low-income kids so they're not hanging out on street corners. We're going to make sure that those kids stay in school or are able to get a college education.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: And here's one more piece of sound, Stephen. This is more on Bernie Sanders' tone.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: I think once I'm in the White House, we will have enough political capital to be able to do that. But I am conscious of the fact that we have to also be very clear, especially with young people, about what kind of government is going to do what for them and what it will cost.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Senator.

SANDERS: Well, Secretary Clinton, you're not in the White House yet.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Was he too aggressive there?

COLLINSON: Yes, that was that kind of line sort of maybe think twice, you know, when I heard it. It was perhaps a new side of Bernie Sanders that we haven't really seen. In the previous debate last week before New Hampshire, there were some pretty bitter exchanges between them. But that exchange was one that was initiated by Senator Sanders. It didn't seem to be responding to a particular attack by Hillary Clinton.

[14:05:01] You know, we saw back in 2008 there was several occasions where President Obama sort of struck the wrong note in a debate against Hillary Clinton and was - was - got himself in a little bit of trouble for that. In some ways perhaps prolonged the race and gave her a little bit of extra strength. So I think it's maybe a sign that Bernie Sanders now feels that after winning New Hampshire by such a wide margin that he's on an equal stage of - with Hillary Clinton in this race and doesn't perhaps feel the need to be so differential, as he has been earlier in the - in the campaign.

BALDWIN: Stephen Collinson, thank you so much, in Washington.

COLLINSON: Thanks, Brooke.

BALDWIN: More on that.

But on the - thank you.

On the intel front here, CNN is now learning that U.S. intelligence officials are getting ready to brief these nominees from both political parties on critical issues. Let's go to the Pentagon for this to correspondent Barbara Starr.

And, Barbara, this is, you know, what, at some point in the summer they will be briefed. This is protocol.

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: It is protocol, Brooke. It happens. It's one of the biggest signs in Washington behind the scenes that it is election season.

Here's what's going to happen. Once we have the political conventions this summer and there is a nominee from each party, presumably a Democrat and a Republican at this point, both of those nominees are going to start getting briefings from the intelligence community. It's not going to be the most highly classified information, but it will be information not available to the rest of us. And the idea is that the intelligence community has felt for many years, many election cycles, that it's a good idea to brief these candidates so during the fall campaign season, if there is a big world crisis, they're better informed and hopefully they don't say something perhaps inadvertently to destabilize a crisis situation even further. So they will start getting these briefings.

And it's really interesting this cycle of course. You have candidates who have no previous government experience, Donald Trump. You have Marco Rubio, who's actually a member of the Senate Intelligence Committee and knows a good deal about all of this. Secretary Clinton, who's been secretary of state. Bernie Sanders, who's in the Senate, gets some briefings already.

But what the intelligence community has told me is none of that matters to them. Both nominees, Democrat and Republican, regardless of their knowledge and experience, will get exactly the same information. It will be a level playing field. They will get exactly the same intelligence. And once there is a president-elect in November, that person is going to get access to the so-called crown jewels. They will very rapidly begin to brief a new president-elect on the nation's most intimate intelligence secrets.

Brooke.

BALDWIN: Commander in chief time. Barbara Starr, thank you.

Early ratings indicate millions of people watched that debate between Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders. And as he's done in the past five debates, the sixth round, Sanders pushed his domestic policies pretty hard. As far as foreign policy is concerned, voters learned one expert Sanders would never consult.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BERNIE SANDERS (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I happen to believe that Henry Kissinger was one of the most destructive secretaries of state in the modern history of this country. I am proud to say that Henry Kissinger is not my friend. I will not take advice from Henry Kissinger.

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, I know journalists have asked who you do listen to on foreign policy and we have yet to know who that is.

SANDERS: Well, it ain't Henry Kissinger, that's for sure.

CLINTON: I - that's fine. That's fine.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: With me now, the author of "National Insecurity," David Rothkopf, who is also the chief executive officer and editor of "Foreign Policy" magazine.

Hello, hello. Welcome back.

DAVID ROTHKOPF, CEO AND EDITOR, FOREIGN POLICY MAGAZINE: Hi. Glad to be here. BALDWIN: I do want to get back, I'm going to get there with you on who

you think should be or could perhaps be advising Senator Sanders on precisely that point. But first, just, you know, noting the exchange, invoking Henry Kissinger, the fact that, you know, constantly, you know, Senator Sanders comes back to this single issue over and over about economic injustices. How effective that is, though, when you're looking at this from a foreign policy lens?

ROTHKOPF: Well, it's not effective in terms of a foreign policy lens. And he's up against somebody who's one of the acknowledged foreign policy experts in the United States. Not only was she secretary of state, she was a studious secretary of state. She really learned her brief. And when she sits with other foreign policy experts, she tends to know more about these issues than they do. So he's, you know, recognizing that and I think that's why he's going to where he thinks his strengths are because, frankly, on the foreign policy side, he doesn't have a record, he doesn't have many advisers and he doesn't really have a case to make.

BALDWIN: He does keep going back to the Iraq War vote and how he argued - actually we pulled this. This is how he argued against the war. This is back in 2002. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANDERS: At a time when this country has a $6 trillion national debt and a growing deficit. We should be clear that a war and a long-term American occupation of Iraq could be extremely expensive. I am concerned about the problems of so-called unintended consequences. Who will govern Iraq when Saddam Hussein is removed and what role will the U.S. play in ensuing civil war that could develop in that country?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[14:10:13] BALDWIN: Maybe he needs to beef up his foreign policy chops, but he seems pretty spot on there.

ROTHKOPF: He was right.

BALDWIN: He was right.

ROTHKOPF: You know, most of the foreign policy establishment was wrong. But being right on one vote is not a foreign policy track record and many people who were wrong at the beginning recognized that they were wrong and they adjusted. In effect, that's a lot of what foreign policy is about. It's about understanding the facts on the ground as they change and adjusting to meet those facts.

BALDWIN: And that's Hillary Clinton's whole point that she keeps going back, her line about, well, that was then and this is ISIS in 2016. Different war, different issue. Is it?

ROTHKOPF: Yes, it's a much, much different issue. It's not just ISIS, it's ISIS in Syria, or it's ISIS in Iraq. It's what's going on in Libya right now. It's -

BALDWIN: It's textured (ph).

ROTHKOPF: Yes. And the region is extremely complicated. And it is not a time when we really want people to be learning this on the job. We've learned that. We've seen that with other presidents who come in with no foreign policy experiences. In fact, five out of the last six presidents have come in with no foreign policy experience and all of them have spent the first couple of years in office scrambling to get up to speed. We live in a dangerous world and one of the big questions for voters right now is whether we can afford that kind of on the job training in this kind of environment.

BALDWIN: So if you're Bernie Sanders and you're talking about all this foreign policy and, yes, he's been in Congress for a long, long time, but who - who would be advising him to the point during that exchange we played a moment ago? Who would a foreign policy adviser be or in the military who'd be telling him?

ROTHKOPF: Well, honestly, you know, I think that's a bit of one of the mysteries of this campaign because if he had prominent foreign policy advisers, he would be parading them out there right now. I think a lot of the foreign policy community gravitates towards Hillary Clinton because they've worked with her in the past in a prior capacity and also because they think she's going to win. And the fact is that it was always thought that he would do better in New Hampshire because he's from Vermont. And I think we're now entering the real phase of this campaign where we're going to start seeing a broader type of state in terms of democrats and political tendencies and I think the view in many of the foreign policy community is, that's going to play to her benefit and they want to be on the winning side.

BALDWIN: David Rothkopf, thank you so much.

ROTHKOPF: My pleasure.

BALDWIN: Thank you. Come back.

In this wild election season, the only thing missing, I can't believe I'm reading this, but it's true, soft core porn. Yes, thanks to the campaign of Ted Cruz, you are about to hear about the actress in this conservative's anonymous circle here in one of his new ads. This happened.

Plus, 17 years ago, her son opened fire on Columbine High School in the school shooting that absolutely shocked the nation. Now, for the very first time, she is speaking out about her son. You will hear from her.

And just in, as the pope arrives there in Cuba, the U.S. now warning about safety, security concerns. Those details ahead. You're watching CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:16:57] BALDWIN: You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

You know a lot of presidential candidates on the Republican side today specifically, they're getting pretty personal. They're talking about how their faith would play in the White House. And they're doing it in the state that is about to give someone a massive boost. Donald Trump, for example, skipping today's forum in South Carolina, speaking this afternoon to Catholics, Jeb Bush and Marco Rubio, along with evangelical Christian Ted Cruz and Ben Carson, Seventh Day Adventist.

Let's talk it all over with Sunlen Surfaty. She is at the forum on Bob Jones University campus there in Greenville, South Carolina.

Governor Bush speaking now. Live pictures. We know, Sunlen, that Jeb Bush decided to give up profanity for Lent. He slipped after one day. Did he mention that today?

SUNLEN SERFATY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: He didn't. Not yet, Brooke. He's still going inside right now. No mention of what he gave up for Lent and how quickly he flipped on that, as you said.

But what he's trying to do right now inside as he speaks before the students here at Bob Jones is to really present himself as a president that would still bring his faith to the forefront. He was asked point blank, what does your faith mean to you, and he really made the transition to describe how he would bring his faith into the White House if he goes on to be president. He said, I don't - I don't believe that you put faith in a locked box when you're in public life. And he said, you know, when I was the Florida governor, I did the same. So really trying to present himself as someone that would continue to bring his belief into the White House.

He later went on and was asked about his definition of religious freedom. He said he defines it as acting on your faith, doing so in a public sphere, doing so with love and passion. This is a very specific, very tailored pitch that he's making here today in front of these evangelicals. Of course, a big and coveted prize here in South Carolina that we'll hear pitches from, from many of the candidates today here, Brooke.

BALDWIN: A lot of talk about faith ahead of South Carolina and it's making its way, I know, into a lot of these ads. We'll talk about it.

Sunlen Serfaty, for now, thank you, thank you, in South Carolina.

Coming up next, the latest controversy here to hit the trail involves, as we mentioned at the top of the hour, oh, yes, a soft core porn actress. What's all that about, you asks? Excellent question. We'll go there.

Plus, despite the blunder, the Ted Cruz campaign with the most memorable ads so far. Have you seen this one? We'll talk about what's effective and what's just not.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:23:55] BALDWIN: Ted Cruz forced to quickly pull an attack ad. The target of the attack, Marco Rubio. Going to play this for you. You see if you can spot the problem.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Has anyone else here struggled with being lied to?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, I voted for a guy who was a Tea Party hero on the campaign trail, and then he went to D.C. and played patty cake with chuck Schumer and cut a deal on amnesty.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Does that make you angry?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Angry? It makes me feel dumb for trusting him.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Maybe you should vote for more than just a pretty face next time.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Vote for more than a pretty face, she says. So this woman here is an actress who appears only for, you know, mere seconds in this ad, who is - this is what's prompted Cruz's team to actually have to pull the plug on this ad because actress Amy Lindsay (ph) has appeared in multiple films with titles like "Erotic Confessions," "Carnal Wishes" and "Sexual Desires." Stop it, Shankman, I'm looking at you. In other words, soft porn films. So let's bring in branding and social media correspondent Peter Shankman, and Republican pollster Kellyanne Conway, full disclosure, who does analytics for Cruz's super PAC.

[14:25:02] I mean you're not laughing because you recognize her?

PETER SHANKMAN, BRANDING & SOCIAL MEDIA CONSULTANT: Oh, well, you know, "Erotic Confessions 2" was really a much better - it had a better plot.

BALDWIN: OK.

KELLYANNE CONWAY, REPUBLICAN POLLSTER: I don't think people would recognize her face either.

BALDWIN: It's Friday, we're going there. So, listen, she - they yanked the ad. Honestly, though, with that aside, I thought it was a pretty creative, crafty ad.

CONWAY: Oh, yes.

SHANKMAN: Yes. It was interesting because I saw a - it had a background that reminded me of Frank Underwood, of that gritty "House of Cards"-ish look. That greish, almost black and white look. It was an interesting ad. They just probably should have done a little better background on who they - who they - who they picked for it.

BALDWIN: Can you walk through the process. I mean why would they - I mean I guess they would have a normal casting call. She's an actress.

SHANKMAN: Yes.

CONWAY: Right. SHANKMAN: They just - you've got to vet. I mean how hard is it to Google these people? Look at their names and see what they've done.

CONWAY: They've admitted it was a mistake, it fell through the cracks. And I have to tell you, as a super PAC, we actually vet our canvassers.

SHANKMAN: Yes.

CONWAY: We vet people who are in an ad and come up and say, you know, I would like the man on the street interview with you. And then if you want to use them, first of all you need their permission.

SHANKMAN: Right.

CONWAY: So I'm sure they did that here. But, secondly, we like to know more about the person because you can always have an interloper, you can have somebody who then says, ha, ha, I fooled them, I'll really for Bernie Sanders and I'm, you know.

BALDWIN: OK.

CONWAY: But so that slipped through the cracks here I think. And I give him a little bit of credit because they could have just left it on the air and said we made a mistake.

SHANKMAN: Right.

BALDWIN: But they didn't. They pulled it.

CONWAY: They paid like $75,000 to I think on the ad or place the ad. So that's -

SHANKMAN: That - yes, that was impressive that they pulled it.

CONWAY: Let me play another one. This is - this is Cruz - we know Cruz mocked Hillary Clinton's e-mail scandal. There's a new ad parodying the classic scene from "Office Space."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Damn, it feels good to be a Clinton. Damn it feels good to be a Clinton. A shameless politician always plays her cards right. Got a crew for the fight on the air waves. Left dogs in the press keep their mouths tight because if Clinton ever needs to explain, why it is what they've done or with who, a real Clinton knows that they're entitled and you don't get to know what they do.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What difference does it make?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What Clinton - what's loaded (ph) and so fat (ph) I will file (ph).

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Listen, you know, this isn't the first time they've really sort of jumped in on pop culture. The action figure ad.

CONWAY: Yes.

BALDWIN: The - jumping the shark - the shark ad. So -

CONWAY: The lawyers crossing the border in their suits and (INAUDIBLE) very funny.

BALDWIN: I mean, do you think - obviously he's trying to grab a younger demographic here.

CONWAY: Yes, no, he is. And, plus, you have to be creative. You must use humor in ads like this. I mean there's the dark, spooky, grainy ads where you try to portray your opponents as scary to the electorate. And then there are the ads where you're using your opponent in their own words in the entire thing so they can't say, oh, it was a negative ad or you lied until you - but this is an attempt at humor and I actually think it's smart for Cruz to take on Hillary Clinton four square at this point because then he is saying, you can picture me against her in the general election. And I think using humor against her at a time when she's really struggling within the Democratic and primary caucus electorate it clever.

BALDWIN: Would - would be effective.

Quickly.

SHANKMAN: You want to have fun really fast?

BALDWIN: Yes.

SHANKMAN: Watch that ad again with your eyes closed and hear how the white guys are so - trying so hard to sound like black rappers. That's the part that kind of killed me is that they - I like the concept but they went a little - they tried too hard.

BALDWIN: OK.

SHANKMAN: (INAUDIBLE)

BALDWIN: So no (INAUDIBLE).

CONWAY: A flattering portrayal of Hillary, though. The person looked - she looked very strong, very tough.

BALDWIN: You think?

CONWAY: Yes.

BALDWIN: Tough on that printer.

Donald Trump. So we know we talked about this, how he was actually yanking an ad that would have gone negative on Ted Cruz. His campaign manager says positive ads worked well for us in New Hampshire primary, won Trump the landslide. So here you go.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I came to hear Donald Trump's business plan for America.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's really cool to hear him speak the truth.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Tells it like it is.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Make America great.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: As a guy who's (INAUDIBLE), Trump is speaking out the truth.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He wants to make America great and that's what I want too.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We have a country that we're proud of and that we love and that we're not going to lose. There is an assault on everything that we stand for and we're going to stop the assault. We will make America great again.

I'm Donald Trump and I approve this message.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CONWAY: Wow.

BALDWIN: So it's a positive ad. It's trying to elicit goose pumps. But here's the but. You know, this is the positive ad, but juxtapose that with the, you know, what he was calling Ted Cruz again today again on Twitter, a loser and questioning his faith.

CONWAY: A nasty guy, a Canadian.

SHANKMAN: Right.

BALDWIN: Which is it?

CONWAY: He's been very vulgar recently on the campaign trail certainly. So he doesn't need negative ads. He can be negative all he wants at the podium and at his rallies.

SHANKMAN: I'll tell you -

CONWAY: The other thing I just want to say quickly is -

SHANKMAN: Yes.

CONWAY: There are websites that are calling that ad to task, the ad about Ted Cruz, that he has since removed, that it was rife with inaccuracies. So before we hand out the magnanimous man of the year award, it was also being called out for not being completely accurate. But these kinds of positive ads work.

SHANKMAN: And keep in -

CONWAY: And we ran one for Cruz months ago.

SHANKMAN: But keep in mind -

BALDWIN: Final word.

SHANKMAN: That the first four images you see in that ad are four different races. That a lot of the people who support Trump, like the neo-Nazi party, don't actually want in our country. So I thought that was really interesting as well. Let's be nice and show the people who actually - people are getting beaten up and being kicked and knocked to the ground saying, you know, vote for Trump.

BALDWIN: Didn't work for you.

SHANKMAN: So, I've got a problem here.

BALDWIN: Didn't work for you.

SHANKMAN: No.

BALDWIN: Bottom line, though, isn't it about feeling whether it, you know, irks you, makes you sad, makes you happy?

[14:30:03] SHANKMAN: But - but just to say, Trump is not that - Trump is not nice.

CONWAY: Or if you want to be part of this movement.

SHANKMAN: If we're going to- if we're going to own - if Trump wants to own Trump, he's not a nice guy. Be not a nice guy. Don't fade back on that, because that just makes you week.

BALDWIN: OK, Peter Shankman, Kellyanne Conway, thank you both so much. We will have more --