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Obama Unveils Executive Action On Guns; Tearful Obama Reflects On Gun Deaths; New Measures Expand Background Checks; Plan Will Potentially Save Lives; GOP Candidates Blast Obama For Use Of Executive Power; Congress Braces For New Fight On Gun Control; U.S. Chopper Attacked And Service Member Killed; Interview with Rep. Mick Mulvaney; Interview with Rep. Mike Thompson; White House Addresses New Gun Control Measures. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired January 5, 2016 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, I'm Wolf Blitzer. It's 1:00 p.m. here in Washington, 9:30 p.m. in Tehran, 10:30 p.m. in Kabul. Wherever you're watching from around the world, thanks very much for joining us.

High in emotion, high in ambition and hope for change. Executive actions announced in the past hour by President Obama aimed at helping prevent what the president calls the next mass shooting.

As you may have seen live here on CNN, the president was joined in the east room of the White House by gun violence survivors and victims' families. He lamented the failure of Congress to pass new gun laws after repeated massacres, even after Newtown, a day he would later call the worst day of his presidency. Here is a bit of what he had to say with an emotion we don't often see from an American president.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Second amendment rights are important. But there are other rights that we care about as well, and we have to be able to balance them. Because our right to worship freely and safely, that right was denied to Christians in Charleston, South Carolina. And that was denied Jews in Kansas City. And that was denied Muslims in Chapel Hill and Sikhs in Oak Creek. They had rights, too.

Our unalienable right to life and liberty and the pursuit of happiness, those rights were stripped from college kids in Blacksburg and Santa Barbara and from high schoolers at Columbine. And from first graders in Newtown, first graders. And from every family who never imagined that their loved one would be taken from our lives by a bullet from a gun. Every time I think about those kids, it gets me mad. And by the way, it happens on the streets of Chicago every day.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: The new measures announced by the president aim to clarify or tighten enforcement of laws already on the books. They center on the criminal and mental health background checks that federally licensed gun sellers are required to perform on buyers. They clarify that you don't need an actual gun store to be called a dealer and dealers online or anywhere else are required to be licensed and do background checks.

The plan broadens the database against which potential gun buyers are checked and seeks to hire hundreds more examiners to do the checking. It proposes $500 million to increase access to mental health care and orders the defense, justice and Homeland Security departments to research and develop new gun safety technology.

Our Senior White House Correspondent Jim Acosta is joining us. Jim, we saw a wide range of emotions from the president today. But as we've been pointing out, it's not every day you see a president actually choke back tears.

JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Wolf. This may have been the most emotional President Obama has been throughout his presidency when he was lamenting the country's inability to pass any kind of meaningful gun legislation, gun control legislation, especially in the aftermath of tragedies like the one in Newtown and all of the others that we've gone through in these last couple of years.

And, Wolf, what the president was proposing today basically boils down to this, and I'm holding it right here. This is new guidance that is being issued by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms. It's going to go to gun sellers across the country and basically say, if you are the business of selling firearms, you have to get a license and you have to conduct background checks on your customers.

Now, there are hobbyists and small scale collectors who might sell their guns from time to time. They are not going to have to get a license and conduct background checks. But there are people who print up business cards or have Web sites or in the business, as the ATF calls it, of selling firearms. Those people are going to have to start doing background checks. And as the president said during his remarks today, there is a threat of prosecution if those people don't start conducting background checks.

And in addition to that, Wolf, there was a political message. You heard the president going after Republicans, at one point, saying 90 percent of Democrats voted for universal background checks a few years ago. 90 percent of Republicans did not vote in favor of it. The president is very much trying to tee up an issue for the upcoming presidential campaign for the expected Democratic nominee, Hillary Clinton.

And, Wolf, he also went after his long-time political nemesis here in Washington, the National Rifle Association, saying the NRA, the gun lobby as he called it, can cold -- can hold Congress hostage but it can't hold the American people hostage.

[13:05:10] So, a very emotional moment for the president today, but also a very sharp political message from the president during these remarks earlier today -- Wolf. BLITZER: Yes, it was. Jim Acosta at the White House. Thank you.

And the president's announcement of these executive actions to combat gun violence here in the United States hits very close to home for our next guest.

Navy combat veteran, a retired astronaut captain, Mark Kelly. He's married to former Arizona Congresswoman, Gabby Giffords. Five years ago this week, Gabby Giffords was critically injured when a gunman opened fire during a political event in Tucson, Arizona. In his announcement just a little while ago, President Obama recalled the moments in the hospital after Giffords was shot.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I was there with Gabby when she was still in the hospital. And we didn't think, necessarily at that point, that she was going to survive. And that visit right before memorial, about an hour later, Gabby first opened her eyes. But I know the pain that she and her family have endured these past five years. And the rehabilitation, and the work and the effort to recover from shattering injuries.

And then, I think of all the Americans who aren't as fortunate.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Mark Kelly is joining us now from the White House. Mark, thanks very much for joining us. I know you had a chance together with Gabby to meet privately with the president. I wonder if you could share a little bit what he had to say.

CAPT. MARK KELLY, ASTRONAUT (RETIRED): Well, it -- we had a short visit before the event. And the speech, I think as everybody saw, was really powerful. And I think President Obama explained very well while this -- why this was necessary and explained the steps he's going to take.

And, you know, to be honest, you know, it's really a -- taking a good step in the right direction to bringing down gun violence by, largely, requiring that you get a background check before buying a gun, at least for people who are selling large quantities of firearms.

BLITZER: And so, what you're concerned about, people who are selling firearms at gun shows or online privately, if you will. You want all of those background checks, what the president calls common sense background checks, to be expanded dramatically. Explain what your motive is here.

KELLY: Well, I mean, currently, the understanding is about 60 percent of all gun sales are done with a background check, and probably about 40 percent without. That's what we think. I mean, we don't keep records on this so it's really hard to tell.

And if you're a felon or somebody who's a domestic abuser or dangerously mentally ill, you can go to the gun -- to a show or over the Internet, and you can buy a gun with no questions asked.

And there are individuals that sell large quantities of weapons in this fashion and it does not make a lot of sense. And it adds to a very high incidents of gun violence in this country. And we could do something about it and the president is taking that step today.

BLITZER: Many of the analysts have described the president's executive orders as modest right now. Would you agree with that description?

KELLY: You know, I mean, it's not like sweeping and all-inclusive. I mean, I think it respects the rights of responsible gun owners, like myself and like Gabby, and a lot of people around this country who feel very strongly about the second amendment and also feel that it's their right to pass a gun on to, you know, a son or a daughter or to sell a gun to the neighbor next door without having to get the government involved. And I think that's just fine.

What the president's trying to capture here are the gun sellers that are selling large quantities of weapons on the Internet, and at gun shows and where they operate this like a business. And for the last 25 years or so, that's been able to be done without any government regulation and without knowing who these individuals are that are buying these weapons.

BLITZER: Back in 2013, you and your wife, Gabby, founded Americans for Responsible Solutions as a way to encourage elected officials to stand up for safer communities, if you will. What's been the problem? Why is your organization, other organizations fighting the NRA, have been relatively unsuccessful compared to the NRA's clout?

[13:10:00] KELLY: Well, I would say we've been very successful, not necessarily in Washington, D.C. with Congress but in state capitols around the country. We've been incredibly successful in passing laws that expanded background checks to gun shows and the Internet, laws about domestic violence and gun trafficking and stalking. So, we've had a lot of success.

But Congress, I'll tell you, Wolf, a hard nut to crack there. I mean, politics are more polarized than ever. And I hate to say this, but a lot of members of Congress are incredibly influenced by the gun lobby.

BLITZER: We saw Gabby Giffords at the event in the east room. She looked great but tell us how she's doing.

KELLY: She's doing well. You know, Friday is going to be five years after she was nearly assassinated in Tucson, Arizona. And, you know, she's worked really hard over -- you know, over half a decade now to recover whatever part of her life she can get back. She continues to work hard. She's really excited about today, because our staff has worked really hard over the last year to help the White House, you know, to get to where we are today on these executive actions. So, she's -- you know, she's doing well. She's feeling good and she's excited to be in Washington.

BLITZER: Please pass along our best wishes to her, to you, to your families for a happy new year as well. Mark Kelly, thanks very much for joining us.

KELLY: You're welcome, Wolf. Thanks for having me on.

BLITZER: Republican presidential candidates out on the campaign trail today, they're already blasting President Obama's new plans to try to flex his executive powers when it comes to gun control and they're promising to undo the provisions.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TED CRUZ (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I can tell you right now, those executive orders are not worth the paper they're printed on because when you live by the pen, you die by the pen. And my pen has got an eraser.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: GOP candidates, they're also firing off on Twitter. Carly Fiorina saying, and I'm quoting her now, "Another lawless, unconstitutional overreach. The second amendment is an individual right. How about enforcing the laws we have." And Dr. Ben Carson tweeted this. We, the people, have a constitutional right to bear arms and it is the president's responsibility to uphold that right.

The president's executive action on guns is drawing a mixed reaction in Congress, some Republican opponents vowing a fierce fight. We're going to speak with two representatives about the battle brewing on Capitol Hill.

Plus, we're also following breaking news out of Afghanistan right now. One U.S. service member has been killed after a military helicopter came under attack. We have the details. Lots of news happening. We'll be right back.

[13:12:50]

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[13:16:08] BLITZER: Just a little while ago, President Obama unveiled his initiative to try to curb gun violence through a series of executive actions. The steps will bypass Congress. A move that has sparked heavy criticism from Republican lawmakers. The president will elaborate, by the way on his plans Thursday night during a one hour live town hall with Anderson Cooper. That will air right here on CNN, 8:00 p.m. Eastern.

My next guest is a Republican, very much against the president's executive action, South Carolina Congressman Mick Mulvaney is joining us now. He's here with us.

I want to get your reaction to what the president had to say. Was there anything that the president said you like?

REP. MICK MULVANEY (R), SOUTH CAROLINA: Sure, the stuff about mental health is something that Republicans and Democrats alike have been talking about for the last couple of months and years. If you look at a common thread all the way from Columbine and before to what happened just a few months ago, it's mental health issues. It's not gun control issues. It's not who's buying guns on the Internet. The problem is mental health. So to the extent that he wants us to take a look at doing a better job there, I could support that.

BLITZER: Yes. So will you support the $500 million he's proposing to deal specifically with mental health?

MULVANEY: You mentioned before a friend of mine, who has a proposal, Republican from Pennsylvania, who is offering a plan right now on how to do a better job of mental health. We are looking at that in my office.

BLITZER: You're looking at the $500 million --

MULVANEY: Correct (ph).

BLITZER: That's something you might go for?

MULVANEY: We'll see.

BLITZER: That's Congressman Tim Murphy, a Republican from --

MULVANEY: That's right. I forgot Tim's name. Yes, I feel awful about that. But, yes.

BLITZER: Yes, from Pennsylvania.

MULVANEY: Yes.

BLITZER: But -- so you're -- you're -- you're open to that idea.

What are you -- what would you do to try to curb -- 30,000 Americans die each year from gun violence.

MULVANEY: Yes.

BLITZER: What would you do to deal -- to lower that number?

MULVANEY: Not this. I mean that's the one thing and you talked about it just a few minutes ago on your show is that, of all the things the president says he wants to fix, the proposals that me made today won't do it. The example I come back to is, the president mentioned today that if he -- he would do this to save one life. You and I have talked about before about what happened to Kate Steinle in San Francisco. If he had simply enforced the laws regarding sanctuary cities and ended those, that life would have been saved. There's other ways to actually help people other than do what the president has done today. What the president has done today will fall mostly on the backs of law abiding citizens, not fighting against -- back against people who are not following the law.

BLITZER: What about some of the technology that he's proposing to try to curb gun violence. For example, if you want to use this iPhone, you've got to know a password or you've got to have a fingerprint. If you want to use a gun, there is technology available out there that you could only use that gun if you have the right fingerprint. In other words, if you're a father who legally has that gun, you can fire that gun, but if your child tries to get that gun, because the fingerprint won't work, the child won't be able to fire that gun. Would you support that?

MULVANEY: And if he wants to use his executive authority to expand research on that, which is what I was understanding he's doing today, that's fine. That's his authority as president. If he wants to change the law in order to mandate what you just described, he has the come to Congress.

BLITZER: When he says that if you're engaged in the business of selling guns at gun shows, for example, or on the Internet, you should be required to do a background check. Is that OK with you?

MULVANEY: Yes, that's fine. I think the one thing would could all agree on is that dangerously mentally ill people should not be able to get guns. That's something Republicans, Democrats, everybody agrees on.

BLITZER: What about convicted felons?

MULVANEY: Yes, well --

BLITZER: Sex abusers?

MULVANEY: It depends on if they are violent convicted felons. We can talk another time about sentencing reform or what constitutes a felony that, in my view, if they --

BLITZER: Because a lot of them, they can go to a -- they can go to a gun show or go online and guy a gun without a background check.

MULVANEY: The devil is going to be in the details. Take -- what you want to do is prevent those folks from getting guns, but not prevent my dad from selling me a gun that has been in my family for a long time. So the question is going to be, when we see the details, you haven't seen them, I haven't seen them, the candidates haven't seen them, is what exactly is the president doing? Is he -- is he properly following his executive authority or is he legislating? He can do the former. He can't do the latter.

BLITZER: Do you see a legal challenge to what the president's announcing today?

MULVANEY: I don't think you'll know that until you see the details.

BLITZER: So you're waiting for that. Congressman Mick Mulvaney of South Carolina, thanks very much for joining us.

[13:20:00] MULVANEY: Thanks, Wolf.

BLITZER: One perspective.

My next guest is the chair on the House Gun Violence Prevention Task Force. Democratic California Congressman Mike Thompson is joining us from Capitol Hill.

You just heard Congressman Mulvaney. What's your reaction to his comments?

REP. MIKE THOMPSON (D), CALIFORNIA: Well, I was surprised that -- he sounds like he supports a lot of the things that I'm trying to promote. He said he believed in background checks. That's a good thing. As you know, I have a bill with my Republican colleague, Peter King, that would require background checks for all commercial sales. That would gun shows, newspaper advertisements, Internet sales. It has a carve out for family transfers and the congressman just mentioned that that's what he'd be looking for. So I was glad about that.

He said he supports efforts in mental health. We've made some improvements in mental health. The Obamacare measure provides mental health opportunities for everybody and we need more money. Hopefully he'll support that.

Some of the other portions of the president's proposal to make more efficient the background check system, I can't see how anyone would -- would oppose that. He wants to increase the amount of individuals who -- who do oversight and -- and pursue people who buy guns illegally. That's certainly a good thing. Bottom line, what the president did was clarify existing law. If you're in the business of selling firearms, you need to make sure that you do background checks. And that is the existing law.

BLITZER: Is there any prospect at all, congressman, of getting bipartisan support for tighter gun legislation during the next year?

THOMPSON: Well, Wolf, the bill that I just mentioned, Peter King and myself have had this bill now -- this is our second Congress, it would require background checks for anybody who buys a gun through a commercial sale. We know that background checks work. They stop about 170 felons a day from buying a gun. That is a bipartisan bill. Peter King, a Republican, myself a Democrat, there are nearly 190 co- authors, there's a handful of Republicans on there, that is a bipartisan measure. It's a bipartisan measure that the Republican leadership should allow us to come up for a vote. If that bill were on the floor, it would pass the House of Representatives. So we're just waiting for the leadership to act.

BLITZER: Well, you think they will?

THOMPSON: I sure hope. You know, I work on this -- I spent a lot of my time. I work on it every day. It's important. And, you know, if we can save a life, it's important. And background checks work. We know they work. And we know that they'll save lives. And it should be incumbent upon every member of Congress to try and pass legislation like that.

I -- I'm a gun guy, as you know. I own guns. I hunt. I carried an assault weapon in Vietnam. I'm pro-Second Amendment. Nothing that we're trying to do would prohibit law-abiding people from buying guns. If you're a criminal, if you're dangerously mentally ill, if you're a domestic abuser, you should not be able to get your hands on a gun. And background checks, that's our first line of defense. That's the one thing we can do. We're not going to stop everybody who shouldn't have a gun from getting one. We're not going to stop every tragedy from happening. But, by golly, we ought to try. And the best place to start is with background checks.

BLITZER: Well, one of the downsides of a presidential executive order is that if a new president comes in, on day one, and almost all of these Republican presidential candidates are saying right now, they're going to undo what the president announced today, because you can't get legislation passed. These executive orders could have a short shelf life. How worried are you about that?

THOMPSON: Well, again, I'd be interested in hearing what these Republican candidates fear from this executive order. Number one, it clarifies existing law. Number two, it tries to achieve efficiencies in the background check system. It increases the number of people who were going to make sure that the law is abided by. And it says that we need to spend more money on mental health. What is it that they're afraid of with this?

BLITZER: Congressman, I want to get Congressman Mulvaney's quick reaction, because it sounds, Congressman Mulvaney, as if there are some areas where you and Congressman Thompson can work together to strengthen background checks. For example, to strengthen procedures to make sure people who have mental health issues don't get access to guns.

MULVANEY: Yes. And Mike mentioned some of the expanded work we could do on background checks. The House, actually two years ago, Wolf, passed something that would have increased funding for improving the background check system. Most specifically allowing the states to work better together to share information from one state to another. It died in the then controlled Senate by the Democrats.

BLITZER: What's your reaction to that, Congressman Thompson?

[13:25:00] THOMPSON: That was my amendment, and I had appropriated about $20 million to make sure that the states got the background information to the next system. It was a good start. We had 70 Republicans who voted with us on that. And I would -- I would for -- I would guess that if we brought the background check bill, the King- Thompson Bill to the floor, we'd have somewhere over 218 members vote for it, and a good number -- (INAUDIBLE) 70 Republican number, a good number of Republicans who would support it as well.

BLITZER: All right. It sounds like -- as if the two of you might be able to get together and maybe have lunch and work out some sort of bipartisan legislation. We'll see if that's do-able.

Congressman Thompson, Congressman Mulvaney, to both of you, thanks very much for joining us.

I want to go to the White House right now. The press secretary, Josh Earnest, is speaking about all of this, answering reporters' questions. I want to listen in.

QUESTION: Mental health treatment. Can you say what the source of that money is and does it have to be in the budget that he's going to send Congress next month?

JOSH EARNEST, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: Well, I certainly would expect that many of the priorities the president discussed today will be incorporated into the budget proposal that he'll present to Congress next month. You know, obviously, we have seen some interest from Republicans who claim that expanding access to mental health care coverage, and better mental health care coverage for Americans would make our community safer. I've described previously why I'm skeptical of those claims, primarily because Republicans are prepared for the 60th time later this week to repeal the very law that actually did more to expand access to mental health care coverage than any other law that's been passed in decades, that is Obamacare. But we're willing to call their bluff. And so the president is certainly serious about doing even more than we've already done to expand access to mental health care for people all across the country because there certainly is a reasonable prospect that that would -- that expanding access to mental health care coverage would make our communities safer, and we look forward to Republicans working with us constructively to accomplish that goal.

QUESTION: You said you're skeptical of their claims. Is the president also skeptical of their claims for wanting more money and attention to be paid to mental health treatment?

EARNEST: Well, again, I think if Republicans were serious about expanding access to mental health care, then surely they would be able to support those elements of the Affordable Care Act that actually do exactly that. There are millions of Americans that now have access to mental health care coverage that they didn't previously have access to because of the Affordable Care Act. And Republicans are attempting, once again this week, to vote to repeal that law. So it's hard to take seriously their claims, that they are actually interested in ensuring that people have access to mental health care, but we're willing to call their bluff, test their proposition and if they actually are willing to work seriously with the administration, to invest $500 million in expanding access to mental health care, that is -- I'm happy to be proved wrong.

QUESTION: Can you talk a little bit about what preparatory work may have been done either here at the White House through the counsel's office or maybe over at the Justice Department to prepare for the anticipated legal challenges to what the president announced today?

EARNEST: A lot of this legal work -- a lot of the legal work on this issue was done at the Department of Justice, and that's why you heard the attorney general talk about many of these measures on a conference call last night. There certainly were White House officials who were involved and I would like to take this opportunity to single out a couple of White House officials who don't get a lot of attention but were certainly instrumental in the successful implementation of these actions. You know, that is Michael Bosworth (ph), who is -- serves as the deputy counsel here at the White House, and Natalie Quillian (ph), who serves as a senior advisor to the White House chief of staff. They were both the points of contact here at the White House for the development and implementation of this policy. And a lot of the -- the steps that the president was able to announce today is thanks to the good work of those officials here at the White House, working closely with the legal experts in the Department of Justice, who, as I mentioned yesterday, were focused on producing recommendations to the president that were well within his legal authority as the president of the United States, but also effective in trying to address some of the problems that exist in the current system.

QUESTION: So as the work was being done to sort of figure out what he could do, the administration was also preparing for legal challenges. I mean was it two -- sort of a two-track?

[13:29:55] EARNEST: No, I wouldn't describe it as a two-track process. I would describe it as a process whereby attorneys at the Department of Justice were looking for ideas that would address the problem that we have identified, which is that right now it's too easy for people who shouldn't be able to get guns to acquire them.