Return to Transcripts main page

CNN NEWSROOM

Iran/Saudi Tensions Spread in Middle East; NRA Criticized for Tweet of Image of 2 NY lawmakers Surrounded By Bullets; Affluenza Teen Still in Mexico. Aired 2:30-3p ET

Aired January 5, 2016 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[14:30:00] A.B. STODDARD, ASSOCIATE EDITOR, THE HILL: Trump has a bigger slice than all of those people combined. In some polls, the establishment slice could overtake him, but it's a spoiler effect that benefits him if they don't consolidate the vote.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: A.B. Stoddard and Ruth Marcus, Ladies, thank you so much.

Coming up next, the tension between Saudi Arabia and Iran ratcheting up even further. How does this impact the U.S.-led coalition in the fight against ISIS in Syria?

Plus, the NRA facing harsh criticism after tweeting this image of two New York lawmakers surrounded by bullets. One of those state Senators joins me up next to respond.

You're watching CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Just past the bottom of the hour. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Iran's president is still furious. He said Saudi Arabia cannot hide. Just over the weekend, the Saudis executed the Shia cleric and 46 other people. The government says they were guilty of terrorism. The cleric's death set off massive protests among Muslims in Iraq and in Iran. Secretary of State John Kerry has reached out to leaders of both nations to try to calm tensions, but it's spreading.

Let's bring in Graham Wood, a contributing editor at "The Atlantic."

Let me begin there. Shia/Sunni religious war, that goes back years and years. And this is sort of now manifesting itself not too far away. You have this U.S.-led coalition fighting ISIS. How does what's happening with Iran and Saudi Arabia affect that?

[14:35:00] GRAHAM WOOD, CONTRIBUTING EDITOR, THE ATLANTIC: The coalition that's fighting ISIS in Syria and Iraq is not going to be affected so much, but we have to understand that ISIS is now a regional power. It's trying to --

BALDWIN: Not just in Syria.

WOOD: Right. In Saudi Arabia itself it's trying to overthrow Saudi Arabia. So what we can see is this is a sectarian civil war that's spilling over and has effects in Saudi Arabia itself. So Saudi Arabia is really trying to shore up its radical credentials because it's being threatened by radical Sunnis. When they call a Shiite cleric, by doing that, they say we are exactly as Sunni as you want us to be. So you don't have to overthrow us and replace us with is.

BALDWIN: What's complicated here is in the U.S. relations both with Iran for certain reasons and long-standing friendship with Saudi Arabia. Given what's happening now and our interests in destroying ISIS, what does the U.S. do?

WOOD: I think the big danger is seeing regionally as taking a side in this. Right now ISIS is trying to say that the United States is on the side of Iran. A lot of Sunni Arabs believe that the United States is basically on the Shia side. This is a sectarian war. It's a regional war. The more that the United States is seen as being on one side or the other, the less leverage it has on both sides. It wants to make sure the Iran deal goes through and make sure its regional partners, including Saudi Arabia, remains stable. That means towing a very unsteady line.

BALDWIN: As we talk about that, there's this new ISIS video showing U.S. fighters killing hostages. There's a man dubbed the new Jihadi John. The U.K. is trying to figure out exactly who he is. What do we know, if anything?

WOOD: We don't know very much. We have seen a masked man. We have seen killing and heard an accent. It's an accent shared by a lot of people. There's some talk there might be a particular named individual who is known, but so far we can't say. We know what it's meant to do is to terrify, to threaten, to do the usual things that ISIS videos are supposed to do to audiences who speak English, which is to make us terrified of them.

BALDWIN: That's what they are trying to do with this sort of western British accent?

WOOD: With great success. They want to say we are already in your society. We can already threaten you. And we have people who speak your language and who want to put a gun to your head and kill you.

BALDWIN: Graham Wood, thank you for coming by.

We also have this. Was it a message that went too far? The NRA posting a photo showing bullets next to pictures of these two New York lawmakers. Some are calling this a veiled threat. We'll talk to one of the lawmakers, up next.

Plus, the mother of the so-called affluenza teen will be extradited from Los Angeles to Texas to face that felony charge. Meanwhile, her son is still in Mexico. What kind of conditions is he facing as he is sitting there? We'll explore that, coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:41:22] BALDWIN: As President Obama today unveiled his new initiative to curb gun violence in this country through a series of executive actions, lawmakers in New York are facing backlash to their own gun proposal. The NRA tweeting out this picture alongside an article slamming this bill, which seeks to control ammunition sales in New York. The two state lawmakers are furious that photographs of their own faces appear next to bullets.

One of those lawmakers joins me now from Brooklyn. She's Senator Roxanne Broussard. Also joining me is CNN's Jean Casarez.

Thank you both for being here.

Jean, just to set this up, tell me what this article was about and obviously the backlash to the tweet.

JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You're going to talk to this one in a second and believed the way they can limit and help gun control is by limiting the ammunition that someone can buy for their gun, because without a bullet, you can't shoot a gun. These two legislators have that bill now. If you have a semiautomatic pistol and allows ten bullets in the magazine, you'd be able to get 20 bullets for three months or 80 per year. They believe that will help the situation. They also are saying that in order to buy the ammunition to begin with that you need to have a registered gun that goes with the ammunition you're trying to buy. There would be some checks and balances to make sure you're not buying ammo for a gun you don't own.

The NRA responded to all this. First of all, they said, "It is easy to see that the two lawmakers know next to nothing about the subject of firearms and ammunition. Manufactures don't even package ammunition with such a random number of cartridges in many cases." They also say, "It does absolutely nothing to address crime. How many criminals will really follow such an insane law or any ammo law, for that matter? After all, that's why they are called criminals."

We want to show the picture. This is the tweet that actually had the photograph. But Bill de Blasio said, "Knock it off, NRA. It's suggestive. I stand with the legislators."

And they now have responded. Assembly member, Joanne Simon, said, "Clearly, the NRA is intending to be intimidating with their response to all this." And Assembly Member Roxanne Broussard said, "It's outrageous and there's a subliminal message of violence." And the NRA has not responded.

BALDWIN: Let's hear it from the Senator.

Senator Broussard, I feel there's two issues. One is the language that the NRA is using about you and your colleague, but also I want to ask you just the photo here of your face with the bullets. When you first saw it, what was your thought?

STATE SENATOR ROXANNE BROUSSARD, (D), NEW YORK: Outrageous. It's totally inappropriate for the NRA to have posted that picture. It's given someone who is unbalanced seeing that picture, that's really given them ammunition to do something that the NRA subliminally is telling them to do. BALDWIN: Did you feel threatened? Was that your word?

BROUSSARD: Yeah. Yes, I think anyone seeing their picture posted in that manner and the climate that we're currently living in will feel threatened. It's inappropriate for them to do that. If they are so concerned about legislation that we are proposing, why not reach out to us and try to speak with us. If they think we're heading in the wrong direction, come out and tell us that. Ask where we intend to go with this. Don't make threats across the Internet. That's what they have done.

[14:45:29] BALDWIN: The language calling what you're proposing an asinine law, saying you know next to nothing. When you bring up, you would have liked to have had a dialogue with the NRA, now that you have been vocal about the photo, what have you heard back in response from them?

BROUSSARD: Nothing. Their followers continue to send e-mails and tweets just giving comments. We are living in a society where there's an increase in gun violence. It's our obligation to take care of our communities. And this is one step in taking care of our community. How do we prevent gun violence from escalating? We do not want it to continue. Limiting the amount of ammunition someone can purchase is a first step. It's not going to end violence by any means. But it will prevent mass shootings from occurring. No one who has a legal right to large quantities of ammunition will be prevented from purchasing that ammunition. But then again, we're not looking to have the common person purchase large quantities of ammunition as if they were going to arm a small militia. That's what we're trying to prevent.

BALDWIN: Jean, did you have a question?

CASAREZ: I know that the San Bernardino situation was a basis for this proposal for legislation. They had stockpiled 6,000 rounds of ammunition. What's to stop somebody from taking a little bit longer to perpetrate the attack but to stockpile and get their friends in on it and then would have enough weapons to attack.

BALDWIN: Senator?

BROUSSARD: You know, it's not the best answer or solution, but we have to put a stop somewhere. If your friend is willing to go out and purchase 6,000 rounds of ammunition for you and the seller is not checking putting a stop to how much you can purchase, we have a serious problem there. It starts first with the seller of the ammunition by them checking the amount you're purchasing and placing a stop. You should not be able to go into that ammo store ever two days and say I'm going to purchase six rounds of ammunition. I have a license for a shotgun, but I want to purchase ammunition for an A.K.- 47. It's not correct. The checks and balances need to start with the seller of the ammunition. We're saying we must limit how much ammunition someone can purchase.

BALDWIN: I know the president and after Sandy Hook that was part of legislation nationally, that went nowhere. But we are seeing some change with the president today. We'll leave it. Jean Casarez and Senator Broussard, thank you so much.

All this talk about preventing gun violence in America, President Obama will be joining Anderson Cooper Thursday for an exclusive one- hour live town hall to discuss gun violence in America. We want you to join us Thursday night at 8:00 eastern here on CNN.

Coming up next, the mother of a so-called affluenza teen is in court today. A Los Angeles judge approved her extradition now to Texas. Now new details about her son, who, by the way, is still in Mexico. What's that life for him, conditions? We'll discuss that, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:52:12] BALDWIN: The mother of the affluenza teen will be heading back to Texas. A Los Angeles judge approved the extradition and is due to face charges for helping her son flee the country. They were caught last week in Mexico. Her son, Ethan, was on probation after killing four people in a drunk-driving crash in 2013 when he was just 16. He is still in Mexico today and may soon be fighting efforts to return him to the United States as well.

Stephanie Elam is outside that courthouse today.

This hearing, what was this hearing today?

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Pretty much it was about four minutes. I took a look at my watch to see how quickly it was done. The judge wanted to make sure that was her signature waiving her right to stop the state of Texas from coming to get her. She will be leaving Los Angeles to head back.

Keep in mind, this is a felony charge she's facing here by getting in the way of a fugitive's arrest. She's looking at up to 10 years if found guilty of this charge -- Brooke?

BALDWIN: That's the mother. We await for news on the son.

Stephanie Elam, in L.A., thank you.

Zeke Unger, let me bring you in.

We chatted last week. You're a bounty hunter, owner of Lil' Zeke's Bail Bonds in Los Angeles. You have arrested more than 4,000 fugitives in your 30-year career. Great to see you back.

Listen, as we talk about Ethan Couch and hearing new details about what life is like in this detention facility in Mexico -- you're familiar with this -- what's his day like?

ZEKE UNGER, BOUNTY HUNTER & OWNER, LIL' ZEKE'S BAIL BONDS: You got to remember it's a third-world country. Of course, their standards are clearly not up to ours here. The human rights people there really don't keep an accounting of what goes on in the prison system. It's a pretty bad place to be, excluding extortion. These are common things that happen in Mexican prisons, especially affluent people there from another country can technically be extorted.

BALDWIN: What's the facility itself like? Can you give me details? He would have access to television, basketball court, that kind of thing.

UNGER: Usually not, they are usually not very sanitary. The cells are very small in size. The food is not up to par. And the conditions are just very substandard.

BALDWIN: Given your knowledge of Mexico and this process, this extradition fighting it, will there be any difficulties getting him back home?

UNGER: The process in Mexico is usually to protect Mexican citizens. This person, the fugitive is a United States citizen, and I do not see the judge granting him a stay there. Although he can appeal it, but I feel he will be back in a week being brought back by the Marshal Service.

[14:55:24] BALDWIN: In all your years tracking fugitives, do you think they thought once they crossed the border they were free to go?

UNGER: In their minds, I'm sure they felt that way. But as you know, the United States Marshal Service is very efficient in what they do. They had their electronic surveillance unit on them relatively quick and apprehended them quickly. As you know in the past, you can see the fugitives very rarely make it. Even the fugitives that are on the lam for large amounts of time are eventually caught.

BALDWIN: Zeke Unger, thank you.

We continue on here. You're watching CNN. Thank you for being with me. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

We begin with what may turn out to be the most emotional moment of President Obama's time at the White House. Today, quite emotional, shedding a tear or two as he announced executive actions on curbing gun violence in this country. It came at the moment that he stopped and remembered the youngest mass shooting victims during his time in office, those 20 first graders killed at Sandy Hook Elementary School.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Second amendment rights are important, but there are other rights that we care about as well. We have to be able to balance them because our right to worship freely and safely --

(APPLAUSE)

OBAMA: That right was denied to Christians in Charleston, South Carolina --

(APPLAUSE)

OBAMA: -- and that was denied Jews in Kansas City, that was denied Muslims in Chapel Hill. They had rights too.

Our inalienable right to life and liberty and the pursuit of happiness, those rights were stripped from college kids in Blacksburg and Santa Barbara and high schoolers at Columbine and from first graders in Newtown -- first graders -- and from every family who never imagined that their loved one would be taken from our lives but a bullet from a gun.

Every time I think about those kids it gets me mad. And by the way, it happens on the streets of Chicago every day.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Let's get to this now from the emotion to the specifics of President Obama's proposal that would mandate people in the business of selling firearms to get licensed dealers -- requiring them to conduct background checks on buyers even at gun shows or online. It would also add 200 new ATF agents to enforce the laws, better mental health treatment, and boost safety technology like guns activated by fingerprints.

Let's explore all of this and the challenges ahead with CNN's senior legal analyst, Jeff Toobin; and also Mike Bouchard, a former assistant director at the ATF.

Gentlemen, good to see both of you.

Jeff Toobin, before we get to the nitty-gritty of executive action and challenges, to see President Obama -- and I have interviewed two of the people standing over his shoulder who each lost their sons. They embraced as the president is wiping tears off his left cheek. It's something you rarely ever see.

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: The president has the nickname no drama Obama for good reason. He is a cool customer. And I think all of us who have covered him and interviewed and spent time studying his presidency, you're just shocked to see this. There are certain subjects that move him. There are politicians like John Boehner who cry all the time. There's nothing wrong with that. It's just part of their personality. That's not him. So to see that sort of emotional reaction. I think it's also a part of -- I think he feels like he's had a successful presidency. He's done health care, this Iran deal, ended the war in Iraq. He has not done what he wanted on guns. I think the frustration of that really came through today.

BALDWIN: Mike, to you now.

On just the specifics now as we talk about --