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Manhunt; Black Lives Matter Plans Massive Protest; Republican Race Tightens. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired December 22, 2015 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[15:00:00]

KYUNG LAH, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: They are quite interesting, because this is really our first public look at this 21-page visa application process for Tashfeen Malik.

Now, this entire process has come under fire. There's been a House committee looking into whether or not there have been any alleged shortfalls. So, this 21-page document release, which was released by this committee, saying that -- the committee arguing that there were shortfalls, specifically looking at a part of the application where there were not translations or some stamps, stamp entries into Saudi Arabia.

And we also reached out to the Department of Homeland Security, U.S. Citizen and Immigration Services, and what we're hearing from them is that Tashfeen Malik passed a number of background checks on all levels, that there were no red flags and the Department of Homeland Security continuing to say that she passed, that there were no problems. That's why in the interview, the emphasis was on whether or not they intended to marry.

And this, Don, is really where it gets interesting. We're seeing and reading in his own words, Syed Rizwan Farook, a statement, an intention to marry. In that statement, he writes that: "My fiancee and I met through an online Web site. After several weeks of e- mailing, we decided to meet each other."

He talks about how they met in person, how they brought their families to a ceremony and he says: "My fiancee did intend to marry within the first month of her arriving in the U.S."

Now, at this point, investigators say they are continuing to still look into this. But at this point, we're still trying to hash out what are the actual politics and whether or not there were actual shortfalls -- Don.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Good reporting. Kyung Lah, thank you very much.

Now to politics. Now to politics, and of course Donald Trump lashing out like we have never heard before while Ted Cruz is closing in, closing his longstanding lead. A new national poll taken a after CNN's debate shows this. Cruz is just four points behind Trump, within the margin of error. That's an eight-point jump for Cruz in just the last month.

Today in Tennessee, the Texas senator welcomed the possibility of a two-person contest.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I did think it was interesting that Donald Trump said a couple days ago that he thinks this race will come down to him and me. I think Donald may well be right. I think that it could easily end up being a two-man race between Donald Trump and me.

And I think that presents a good choice to the American people. This process is a job interview.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: I'm going to now go to CNN's political reporter Jeremy Diamond.

Jeremy, you were at a Trump rally in Grand Rapids, Michigan today. Did e he mention Ted Cruz at all?

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: So, last night, Donald Trump didn't make a single mention of Ted Cruz in his entire speech, instead preferring to go after a lot of other candidates, including Lindsey Graham, who had just dropped out of the race.

Despite that, Trump went after Hillary Clinton, he went Barack Obama. And, of course, there were protesters, as there usually are at these rallies. But last night, there were a lot of interruptions actually. About more than a dozen times protesters interrupted his rally and Trump even fought with them.

So, Trump spared no blows for anybody, including the protesters who showed up at his rally.

LEMON: He did spend a lot of time lashing out at Hillary Clinton, though, even getting bolder. Here's a clip of it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Everything that's been involved in Hillary has been losses. You take a look. Even her race to Obama, she was going to beat Obama. I don't know who would be worse. I don't know. How does it get worse? But she was going to beat. She was favored to win and she got schlonged. She lost.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So, Jeremy, you were there. How did the crowd take this? Did it even register to them?

DIAMOND: I don't know that it registered in the sense of the word That he used, but it certainly registered as far as just another attack on Hillary Clinton, which to Trump supporters is Kool-Aid. It's what they love to hear from Donald Trump. And let's keep in mind

this was not the only vulgar remark that Trump made about Hillary Clinton. He also talked about her bathroom break during the Democratic debate on Saturday night, bringing it up and then saying that it was too -- quote -- "disgusting" to talk about.

So, for Trump supporters, though, this isn't shocking. This is just another applause line that they love to hear at his rallies.

LEMON: All right. Then Trump also said this about journalists after he mentioned that Russian President Vladimir Putin complimented him.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Then they said, he's killed reporters. And I don't like that. I'm totally against that. By the way, I hate some of these people, but I would never kill them. I hate them.

No, I think -- no, these people, honestly, I will be honest. I will be honest. I would never kill them. I would never do that. Let's see. No, I wouldn't. I would never kill them. But I do hate them, and some of them are such lying, disgusting people. It's true.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[15:05:15]

LEMON: So, Jeremy, how was that received, not just by the spectators, but also by the news crews at the event?

DIAMOND: You know, the media, us in the Trump press corps who cover him, are used to seeing insults flung our way. We're called scum and scumbags and disgusting and dishonorable at almost every single rally, so none of that is new.

But, of course, last night, it was interesting to see the leading presidential candidate, a candidate who has almost 40 percent support in some of the most recent polls, calling -- raising the question of whether or not he would kill journalists, to actually even bring that up as a possible question.

And it was also a strange segue to go from defending Vladimir Putin against allegations, widespread allegations that Putin has ordered the killing of journalists to then talking about how much he hates journalists, whether he would kill them, and then going back to slamming journalists and talking about how disgusting and horrible they are. So it was certainly a strange moment and a jarring one as well.

LEMON: Must be interesting to be on the campaign trail with him, to say the least, Jeremy Diamond.

DIAMOND: Never a dull moment.

LEMON: Never a dull moment. Great way of putting it. Thank you, sir. Appreciate it. As Jeremy mentioned, Trump didn't just get vulgar. His speech

literally went to the toilet when talking about Clinton. This is what he said in Michigan Monday about Hillary Clinton's late entrance to the stage during the last Democratic debate. She had gone to the bathroom, by the way.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I know where she went. It's disgusting. I don't want to talk about it.

(LAUGHTER)

TRUMP: No, it's too disgusting. Don't say it. It's disgusting. Let's not go. We want to be very, very straight up. OK?

But I thought was -- wasn't that a weird deal? We're ready to start. They were looking. They gave her every benefit of the doubt, because it's ABC and she practically owns ABC. She really does.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: All right, let's talk about this now with conservative commentator and columnist Kurt Schlichter and Donald Trump supporter Terra Grant.

All right, Terra.

TERRA GRANT, DONALD TRUMP SUPPORTER: Hi, guys.

LEMON: Why did he have to go there?

GRANT: Well, that's a good question. I'm still confused as to, A, why it was brought up, why it was discussed at a rally. But I'm even more confused as to why we're still talking about it.

It's definitely gone to the toilet, as far as there are so many other things that we can be discussing about Hillary Clinton, her politics, her ideologies, and we're discussing her going to the potty. I mean...

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: I understand what you're saying, but I think we're discussing the comment and whether it's appropriate for someone who is running as a leader of the free world to make comments about a woman going to the restroom or whether someone was, as he says, schlonged or not.

Mr. Schlichter, what do you think of that, Kurt?

KURT SCHLICHTER, CONSERVATIVE COMMENTATOR: Don, it's going to take a lot more for me to get upset at a woman who enabled a guy who turned the Oval Office into a frat house and his intern into a humidor.

I just don't care. I so don't care.

GRANT: Absolutely.

SCHLICHTER: I would need Stephen Hawking to find the theoretical limit of how little I care about Donald Trump's silly jokes.

GRANT: Absolutely, Kurt.

SCHLICHTER: It's hypocritical, pearl-clutching nonsense that Donald Trump is vulgar and mean and out there. And I can't stand Donald Trump.

I'm the guy who comes on and -- this is why I hate the media, Don, because you make me defend Donald Trump.

(CROSSTALK)

(LAUGHTER)

LEMON: Yet you're here with us. You hate us enough that you're here every time we ask you.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: Kurt, listen, so even though you say you hate Donald Trump, right? Is that -- am I putting words in your mouth?

SCHLICHTER: I don't hate Donald Trump.

LEMON: You don't like him.

SCHLICHTER: Donald Trump is a very nice guy who I don't think should be president.

LEMON: OK. Have you ever heard a presidential candidate say things like this?

SCHLICHTER: No, but I know of a president who, well, turned his intern into a humidor, so I think we set the standard a little lower than Donald Trump has even approached.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: Donald Trump, well, he's not president of the United States yet. Hang on. Hang on. Listen, you're talking about apples and oranges. I understand what you're saying.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: Hang on, Kurt. Will you let me finish?

You're talking about someone who is running to be the leader of the free world, someone, if you're Republican and conservative, you would hope that would do -- have better practices at least in the Oval Office than the one that you're mentioning.

So people are judging him by his actions, by his language, by his speech. So, therefore, what he says on the campaign trail is obviously going to be covered.

[15:10:07]

So, my question to you, without mentioning the Clintons and Bill Clinton, which has...

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: Let me finish my statement, yes, my statement -- which has already been litigated and relitigated on its -- on the -- own merits, Donald Trump's statements on the campaign trail, you don't think it's fair that the media should be covering it?

SCHLICHTER: Well, I don't think it's unfair. I just think it's silly. Look, he's running against Hillary Clinton. He's running against the sexual harasser and abuser's enabler. So, again, I don't know why we're not talking about that. It has been litigated.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: We're not talking about that because it has nothing to do with what happened. She's not her husband. Her husband was -- wait -- her husband has been impeached over that.

(CROSSTALK)

GRANT: But Donald Trump is not known to be politically correct.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: Hold on, guys. Both of you are talking over me. Let me finish, and then first, Kurt, and then I will let you respond.

You're talking about something that happened over a decade ago. The man has been impeached for it. She's not responsible for her husband's actions. Yet you're bringing it into a campaign, and it doesn't seem fair.

What if you did the same thing with Donald Trump from something his spouse or his father, if something else did in his family? It has nothing to do with him running for president. We're talking about his own actions, his own individual merit.

So, if you're going to talk about Hillary Clinton, then bring Hillary Clinton's actions into it. Don't bring the her husband's actions into it.

SCHLICHTER: I would like to bring Hillary Clinton's actions into it.

GRANT: Absolutely.

(CROSSTALK)

SCHLICHTER: When she was given the choice being standing with a serial sexual abuser...

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: All right, Kurt, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop. That's not fair.

SCHLICHTER: A serial sexual harasser.

LEMON: That is not fair. That is not fair.

Can we stop that, please?

SCHLICHTER: That is fair.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: It is not fair. It is not fair. It is a low blow.

Is it the -- yes, I want to end this. This is the lowest of the low. And it has nothing to do with Hillary Clinton. It's just a cheap shot that -- can you please stop? Can we stop? Cut we cut him off, please? Thank you. Could we end this?

LEMON: Thank you. We're done. Thank you.

We will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:15:33]

LEMON: Welcome back, everyone. This is news just into CNN.

A gay rights pioneer is the latest victim identified after this week's deadly suicide bombing in Afghanistan. You're looking at Air Force Major Adrianna Vorderbruggen. She is among six Americans killed after a suicide bomber on a motorbike detonated near a joint Afghan-NATO patrol.

Also among those killed, Joseph Lemm, a New York City police officer and National Guardsman.

Meantime, in Iraq, we're watching a huge military push against ISIS. Government forces there are carrying out an operation to take the city's center of Ramadi back from ISIS terrorists, bombers from the U.S.-led coalition backing the operation with airpower.

So, joining me is David Rohde, CNN's global affairs analyst, and Michael Pregent, former intelligence adviser and general -- to General David Petraeus.

So, David, to you first. Do you think the Iraqi army is capable of not just retaking, not only retaking, but keeping Ramadi at this time, holding Ramadi at this time?

DAVID ROHDE, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: That's the big question. This is all about the divide in Iraq in terms of Shia forces vs -- these are Sunni areas and the Sunnis generally have supported the Islamic State.

So, the forces moving in now to Ramadi are just Sunnis. It's taken months for us to train these Sunni forces to come in. And there's hope, according to U.S. advisers, that the Sunnis will be accepted by the Sunni population and they will be able to hold the town.

The problem in Iraq is that we have made very little headway in Sunni areas. We're having trouble getting Sunnis to fight the Islamic State, which is...

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: How much of a role would American intelligence be playing here?

ROHDE: I think it's vital. The key to this all happening is good American intelligence and then airstrikes. They have sort of pummelled the Islamic State forces in Ramadi. Just a couple weeks ago, they managed to surround the town.

This is very much an American-guided attack. It's a positive thing. This is a step forward. This is a rare case of the Islamic State losing a town center. But the big question is, will it last and will the local population welcome these Iraqi forces?

LEMON: Michael, do you agree that American intelligence will be playing a big role and American intelligence needs to play a big role here?

MICHAEL PREGENT, FORMER ADVISER TO DAVID PETRAEUS: It definitely needs to play a big role. Thanks for having me.

But the only way American intelligence works is if we're actually on the ground looking at these things. I'm very skeptical of the composition of this force.

Did you mean to say that this is an entirely Sunni force going into Ramadi, Mr. Rohde?

ROHDE: That's my understanding is that they have trained -- that's why it's taken so long.

LEMON: Yes.

PREGENT: OK. That's completely inaccurate.

And the reason I say that is, I actually worked in Iraq for five years with the Iraqi security forces. And in 2010, it was a predominantly Shia force. They kicked out 90,000 Sunnis and Kurds out of the Iraqi army. Those are actually U.S.-trained individuals.

The forces going into Ramadi are predominantly Shia out of the Iraqi security forces, the federal police, and even the counterterrorism service. For it to be a Sunni force means that the U.S. would have had to have trained more than 10,000 Sunnis in the last 18 months. And that just has not happened.

I know that for a fact. It appears to me there's a concerted effort to paint this as a professional force going into Ramadi. And I believe it's going to have a very alienating effect on the Sunni population. ISIS learned from the Tikrit operation to keep the Sunni population in the city.

They are doing that in Ramadi. These leaflet drops on Ramadi warning civilians to flee the city when they can't I think is disingenuous and gives these Shia militias and this predominantly Shia force with about 1,500 Sunnis, I'll give you that, cover to commit the atrocities they have committed in Amirli...

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: Give him a chance to respond, Michael.

Yes, David, go ahead. You want to respond to that?

ROHDE: There's a special force of Sunnis that's been trained to hold the town after it's taken. And it's to respond to the earlier atrocities you have talked about.

But -- and I agree with you. The key issue is, will the Sunni population trust government forces, trust Sunni tribal fighters. And I think time will tell. We have to see how this operation goes, instead of just immediately judging before it's even been completed.

LEMON: I want to move on now and switch gears and talk about Afghanistan right now.

David, this question is for you. There was a deadly attack on U.S. troops this week while the Taliban looks to be closing in on a key city of Helmand province. There are roughly 10,000 U.S. troops in Afghanistan right now, down from 100,000 in 2010.

Is that enough to maintain control there?

[15:20:00]

ROHDE: It doesn't seem to be at this point. There's British troops that have just been sent in today to Helmand, the southern province where the Taliban are on the verge of taking a strategic town called Sangin.

This is bad news. If you want to argue that this is potentially good news coming out of Iraq, things are not going well in Afghanistan. The attack yesterday that killed the six American soldier was the biggest number of American casualties all year in Afghanistan. There's been high-profile attacks in Kabul itself.

The Taliban took earlier this year a major province in the north. Things are not going well. I think the U.S. has to be much more aggressive with airpower in Afghanistan. And you may see more American special forces in Afghanistan, as you have seen happen in Iraq. LEMON: Michael, there seems to be this perception that while ISIS has

been making gains, that the Taliban has been withering into obscurity. Is that really the case?

PREGENT: First off, there's a difference between a clear and a hold force, going back to Ramadi. The force should be Shia, but the clear force is definitely Shia.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: All right. We talked about that, yes. Go ahead.

PREGENT: We didn't finish it, Don. We didn't finish it. And that's important.

All right, so, Afghanistan, with the Taliban making gains. The Taliban is fighting ISIS in some areas and ceding territory to ISIS in others, but it's all based on our U.S. disengagement strategy in Afghanistan.

You don't announce to the Taliban that you're dwindling down to 5,000 and think that ISIS isn't listening. This is an opportunity for them to exploit the U.S. shrinking back to their bases and not being out there working with the Taliban -- or, correction, the Afghanistan security forces.

LEMON: All right, thank you, David Rohde. Thank you, Michael Pregent. Appreciate both of you.

In Kenya, an attack by Islamic militants doesn't go as planned. Muslim bus passengers end up shielding Christians from the attack, telling the Al-Shabaab terrorists, "Kill us together or leave us alone."

CNN's international correspondent is David McKenzie. He reports now from Nairobi.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DAVID MCKENZIE, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Their aim is to cause terror and division, but Al-Shabaab gunmen here in Kenya came up against an extraordinary show of defiance and unity.

(voice-over): On Monday more than 100 passengers were crammed on this bus traveling to Mandera on the chronically insecure border with Somalia.

Bullets ripped through the side of the bus in an ambush.

SYED SEBDOW, SURVIVOR: They were in two groups. One group -- so I see peopling running to the road to stop us and they tell us to get those who are Muslims to come out. Go back to the bus.

MCKENZIE: A man on the bus told CNN there were 12 Christians on board. The gunmen wanted to identify them and execute them. He says Muslim passengers helped hide some of them on the bus and they gave the Christian women head scarves before the gunmen made them line up on the road.

They stood strong said the witness, telling the gunmen, quote "If you want to kill us, then kill us. There are no Christians here." Al Shabaab then fled.

JOSEPH OLE NKAISSERY, KENYAN INTERIOR CABINET SECRETARY: We are all Kenyans. We are not separated by religion. Everybody can profess their religion, but we still we are one country, we are one people as a nation. That is a very good message.

MCKENZIE: Civilians have suffered through countless Al-Shabaab attacks in the border regions of Kenya. Earlier this year Al-Shabaab Garissa University, killing 147 innocent students. Again, they singled out Christians.

More than 20 were killed in a shocking bus ambush last year.

(on camera): Tragically, a man who fled the scene and a passerby were killed by the gunmen, but the death toll could have been that much higher. The Kenyans are praising the acts of their citizens who stopped this terrible attack.

David McKenzie, Nairobi, Kenya.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: All right, David, thank you very much.

Next, a wanted poster now out for the so-called affluenza teen who has been officially missing for a week. His mom suspected of helping him dodge authorities. I will be joined live by a former U.S. Marshal to explain how this manhunt is playing out.

Plus, the Black Lives Matter movement plans a massive protest at the country's largest mall on one of the busiest shopping days of the year. Now a judge is ruling on whether the rally can go forward.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:29:50]

LEMON: We are a week into manhunt for the so-called affluenza teen and his mom, but so far, no sign of the pair.

Ethan Couch was convicted of killing four people two years ago while driving drunk, but a judge gave him probation, not jail, because it -- was convinced Couch was too rich, too spoiled to understand right from wrong.

U.S. Marshals have now released this wanted poster of the 18-year-old. Authorities have also released photos of his mother, Tonya. They think she may be helping hide her son. The Tarrant County, Texas, sheriff says they are tracking all leads.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DEE ANDERSON, TARRANT COUNTY, TEXAS, SHERIFF: We have literally over the past few days run down hundreds and hundreds of leads. Those leads continue to pour in. I know the big question all of you have is, do we know where he is, have we located him? Unfortunately, the answer to that is, no, we have not.

We don't have any solid information. What we're doing is trying to keep everything centralized and know what everyone is doing, which is really difficult when the case is spread out so far.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: So, let's talk about this with a man who has been involved in a lot of searches, and that is CNN law enforcement analyst Art Roderick, Arthur Roderick, the former assistant director of the U.S. Marshals Office.

So, Art, you have hunted down the FBI's most wanted. Here, you have a teen, you have his mom. They're on the run. They have plenty of money and plenty of resources to help them vanish. They may have even gotten a jump on authorities with time. Where do you start?

ART RODERICK, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: There's a lot of places to start.

First of all, these individuals are not career criminals. Career criminals generally know how to hide under the radar. These people have had money in the past. They need resources to support themselves. Now, they might have taken enough cash with them to hold them for a little while, but sooner or later, they will make a mistake because they are not used to being in this type of fugitive hunt.

Now, the thing about this, too, it's very stressful on these individuals to be looking over their shoulder constantly. The amount of publicity that this case is getting, I'm sure they are looking over their shoulder every minute of every day.

So, this is going to weigh on them, to a point where it could cause them just to give up at some point, walk into a police station and say, you have got me.

LEMON: OK. So, you're saying, because they are not your usual criminal, they don't fit that profile, that makes them more probably predictable --