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CNN NEWSROOM
Trump Holds Double-Digit Lead Among GOP; Investigators Focus on Marriage of Terrorists; Protesters Ramp Up Calls for Mayor to Resign; Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl Breaks His Silence; Aired 10-10:30a ET
Aired December 10, 2015 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[10:00:01] PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Shows Trump with a more than 2-1 margin over his nearest competitors. Trump coming in at 35 percent while Ted Cruz is in second place with 16 percent. Ben Carson tumbling to third with Marco Rubio and Jeb Bush each in single digits.
Trump solidifying his lead among the GOP as outrage about his call to temporarily ban Muslims in the U.S. grows. But as he told my colleague, Don Lemon, that ban is not rooted in bigotry.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR, CNN TONIGHT: Here's my question. I asked you last time, I said, and -- some people were shocked, if you were racist. You knew why I was asking you that. Are you racist?
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I am the least racist person that you have ever met. I am the least racist person.
LEMON: Are you bigoted in any way?
TRUMP: I don't think so. No. I don't think so.
LEMON: Islamophobic?
TRUMP: I'm the person -- no, not at all. I'm a person who happens to be very smart. And I happen to have a certain street sense and I know where things are going. I said, take out Osama bin Laden in a book written in the year 2000 called "The America We Deserve." I said you better be careful because I saw this guy Osama bin Laden probably on television. I said, take him out. He knocked down the World Trade Center.
LEMON: So as I sit here with you, you've been very kind to me, right? Introduced me to your family. You've been very kind to me. It has to -- when people say that you're racist or homophobic or Islamophobic or whatever it is, that has to bother you. Or compare you to Hitler. There are newspaper covers --
TRUMP: Do you know --
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Does that bother you? TRUMP: No. If things are true, if that were true, it would bother me
tremendously. OK? But of course, if you're a racist you probably wouldn't care. But if things were true, it would bother me. But if -- it's so false, and honestly, I don't hear it often.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: All right. And Don Lemon joins me now.
Don, good morning. Very interesting interview there.
LEMON: Good morning.
BROWN: So he's saying that he is the least racist person that you know and also said in the interview that he's good to Muslims. Tell us more about that, what he said about that part of things.
LEMON: Well, he said that his Muslim friends and he hears people on the streets, people he talks to, his constituents, his supporters say, you know what, you're actually doing Muslims a service by discussing these issues and bringing them to light, much as they believe he did when it comes to the situation with Mexican immigrants and on and on and on. So he believes that he is on the right side of history with this. Not backing down. Again, he's saying he is not racist and he thinks that this is good for Muslim people.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: What do you mean when you say, if they break this pledge, that you'll break the pledge? What do you mean by that?
TRUMP: Well, if they don't treat me with a certain amount of decorum and respect, if they don't treat me as the frontrunner, by far the frontrunner, if the playing field is not level, then certainly all options are open. But that's nothing I want to do.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: That was in reference, Pam, he's talking about his possible third-party run, which you know the folks are in Washington have been reporting on a lot. He signed this pledge, saying, you know, I'm not going to run as an independent or third-party candidate, but he says now, if the party doesn't treat him with what he says is respect and decorum, and the frontrunner that he is, that he's going to have to do what he has to do, and that means break the pledge. But he's not the only one saying that. There are other candidates who are saying that they would do it, as well.
BROWN: Well, does he feel right now that the party is being fair to him?
LEMON: No, he doesn't. And during the interview he -- you know, he kept mentioning the party and saying, you know, I have an issue with the party. I said, what is your issue with the party? It's almost -- you know, I said it this morning on "NEW DAY." It's almost like Rodney Dangerfield, you remember, I don't get -- I get no respect. He is leading in the polls, double-digits in front of all of the candidates. You could put two candidates together and still would not get the polling numbers that Donald Trump has.
Yet and still the party establishment, they don't want him. They speak out against him. They look for ways to get him out of the race. They look towards other candidates to talk about in a positive light and to bring to the fore. So he does not believe that he gets the respect that he deserves. And if he's not treated that way, as a frontrunner, especially going in now to, you know, the first races and to Super Tuesday and all of that, he says he's going to have to do what he -- you know, what he must, and that may mean breaking the pledge and running as an independent.
He'd like to run as a Republicans, he knows running as an independent would be tough, but if he has to do it, he's going to do it.
BROWN: All right. Don Lemon, thank you for that.
Let's talk about those poll numbers that Don just mentioned. CNN senior Washington correspondent Jeff Zeleny joins me now to discuss.
So important to note this poll was taken before Trump's call for a Muslim ban. But, Jeff, it does show a double-digit surge in support from October. Look at the numbers here. And in those two months, there have been controversies regarding Trump, and a Black Lives Matter protester, as well as his mocking a disabled "New York Times" reporter that he disputed, as we near the Iowa caucuses. Is this an accurate picture of how Republican voters are thinking -- what their thinking?
[10:05:05] JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Well, Pamela, this is an accurate picture. That's a national poll, a snapshot of what the country -- at least Republican voters are thinking. But it is pretty similar in early state polls in Iowa and New Hampshire, although Ted Cruz is a little bit stronger in Iowa. Marco Rubio is a little stronger, as is Chris Christie.
But this is a sense of where the party is right now. And one of the reasons that it is, when you talk to voters out there, and we do this all the time at rallies and campaign events, people like Donald Trump's strength. They like the fact that he is -- calling it like he sees it. That he is not that bought and paid for, as he says, by anyone. So those are the things driving him. But you also hear concerns from voters saying, you know, I don't like everything he says, but, you know, on the whole, we think he would do OK.
But, Pamela, when you look into these numbers and this new CBS News- "New York Times" poll, one other thing really jumped out at me, it's a similarity between Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton.
Take a look at this. 24 percent of voters said that they are concerned about a Trump presidency. And 40 percent say they fear a Trump presidency. It's about the same for Hillary Clinton. 23 percent of voters say they are concerned about a Clinton presidency and 34 percent say they are scared of a Clinton presidency. So that shows you the polarization here on both sides. But going into this, Don is absolutely right, the Republican establishment is concerned and worried about him.
The thing that I'm not as sure about is how committed Donald Trump would be to running as a third-party candidate. It's very expensive. It's very, very difficult. And most everyone believes that it would most certainly hand the presidency over to the Democrats because a third-party candidacy just doesn't generally work. Look at 1992, Ross Perot. That's one of the reasons Donald Trump wants to keep running as a Republican.
BROWN: Yes. And -- correct me if I'm wrong, but a third-party candidate has never won the presidency, right?
ZELENY: You're absolutely right. And it's so difficult to do it given the party structure. So I think it's still very difficult to believe that Donald Trump would actually leave this party system and run as a third-party candidate.
BROWN: Interesting. Jeff Zeleny, thank you for that.
ZELENY: Thanks, Pam.
BROWN: A reminder, you don't want to miss the last Republican debate of 2015 right here on CNN. Wolf Blitzer moderates the debate Tuesday night at 6:00 and 8:30 p.m. Eastern Time.
Was their marriage a sham? That's one of the questions officials are asking in the investigation into the San Bernardino shooters. Sources now telling CNN that Tashfeen Malik was not asked about jihadist leanings during her U.S. visa screening.
Meanwhile, officials are taking a closer look at the marriage between the two terrorists. They believe the marriage may have been set up to help them pull off an attack. The FBI now thinks both were radicalized before they even met.
CNN's Ana Cabrera joins us now.
Ana, tell us more about this. Why wasn't anything about jihad brought up during Tashfeen's interview?
ANA CABRERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, we understand she had already made it through some security checks, background checks, multi- agencies, multi-checks and yet no red flags. But by the time it landed -- her application landed at the U.S. Consulate and she was doing this interview last summer, there were no questions that they felt they needed to ask about jihad.
Now, of course, it would have been on her to be honest and to tell them her beliefs, but they really just focused the questioning on whether she had a legitimate relationship with Farook for her to come here on an fiancee visa and even after that interview we're told she went through two more security checks, her information was put through and again no flags. So unfortunately, this is one of those scenarios where hindsight is 20/20.
And now that officials have been able to access some of the electronic communication between her, Farook and, perhaps, others, they're learning more about the jihadi beliefs, about the radicalization that they now say dates back years prior to the two ever even talking to each other online -- Pam.
BROWN: Part of what is helping investigators piece together this timeline is that the former friend and neighbor of Farook, Enrique Marquez. What do we know about him?
CABRERA: Well, again, he is the friend, the neighbor who provided two AR-15s that were used in this deadly killing. Now he knows Farook because they were next-door neighbors. He has been cooperating with investigators, we're told, in the questioning. He's waived his Miranda rights and he's been really giving them some chilling information, saying that both he and Farook have been radicalized as early as 2011, and that the two of them were plotting an earlier attack in 2012.
Now he says that they had a target in mind, but they never went through with their attack because they got spooked. They got cold feet after learning about some other unrelated terror arrest in the vicinity, in the area, back in 2012. Now again authorities are still trying to verify his account. He did check himself into a mental facility following the shooting attack. And they believe that it's still possible he is telling them this story, trying to deflect any kind of responsibility for the current situation he may be in, having supplied the weapons to Tashfeen and to Farook -- Pam.
[10:10:15] BROWN: It's certainly tough to verify those details from three years ago.
Ana Cabrera, thank you very much for that report.
And right now in Geneva, Switzerland, it is on high alert. Police there now searching for individuals who may be linked to the Paris terror attack. An official telling CNN authorities have gone from a vague threat to a precise threat. It's still unclear how many people authorities are searching for. An international manhunt has already been under way for these two men right here who officials believe are linked to the Paris attacks.
And still to come right here in the NEWSROOM, Chicago Mayor Rahm Emanuel apologizes. Citizens respond with angry protests. Today the city braces for more demonstrations.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTER: How many shots?
UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: Sixteen shots.
UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTER: How many shots?
UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: Sixteen shots.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[10:15:21] BROWN: Well, hundreds of angry demonstrators in downtown Chicago are demanding the resignation of Mayor Rahm Emanuel.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: Shut it down. Shut it down. Shut it down.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: Protesters filling the streets, as we see, sometimes scuffling with police after the mayor gave a speech at city hall about misconduct within the police force. A delayed release of videos of fatal police shootings has fueled allegations of a cover-up.
Rosa Flores joins us from Chicago with the very latest.
Rosa, I can imagine that more demonstrators are expected today if they're not already out there?
ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Indeed, Pamela, more demonstrators are expected to hit the streets. They are angry. They are upset about the ills of the past and they're asking the mayor, Rahm Emanuel, to resign in the present.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTER: How many shots?
UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: Sixteen shots.
FLORES (voice-over): Protesters turn up the heat in Chicago, asking Mayor Rahm Emanuel to step down, following a string of high-profile, deadly police shootings caught on tape.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You covered up a videotape and we want you fired.
FLORES: They hit the streets after the mayor's speech about police accountability and justice at city hall.
MAYOR RAHM EMANUEL, CHICAGO: Your government's first responsibility is to keep you and your family safe, and to make sure that you feel safe in your neighborhoods. And we have clearly fallen short on this issue, and that needs to change.
FLORES: Just a few blocks away, in federal court, city attorneys argued against the release of another police shooting video, this time of Cedric Chatman, an unarmed black teen and carjacking suspect, who was shot and killed by police in early 2013. The city's argument in court, the release could taint a jury pool and among other things be misused by the media.
But the Chatman attorney points to the recent release of the Laquan McDonald and Ronald Johnson videos and calls on the mayor to make the Chapman video public. BRIAN COFFMAN, CHATMAN FAMILY ATTORNEY: If the city of Chicago and
Mr. Emanuel wants to come out and really lead the charge that he wants transparency and he wants change, well, here's his opportunity.
FLORES: In court, the judge said, "There is a lot of interest in this, and for good reason," but decided not to release the video for now, pending a review of the law by both sides.
In a statement the city's law department said, "The city of Chicago clearly needs a new policy around releasing videos that accounts for all issues and we're working on it with the help of the recently appointed task force."
The mayor has replaced two city officials in less than two weeks, including the police superintendent. But as the protesters march, they say the mayor should be next.
(On camera): He said, you know, the buck stops with me. Do you accept that? Would you like for him to stay and try to fix the problem?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Of course not. You know, we already know what he can do behind closed doors. He can hide videos. And we're not having him.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FLORES: Now the mayor is not alone. Protesters are also asking for the Cook County state attorney, Anita Alvarez, to also step down -- Pamela.
BROWN: OK. Rosa Flores, thank you so much.
And let's discuss this further with Aislinn Sol, she is chapter coordinator of Black Lives Matter Chicago.
Aislinn, thanks for coming on. If the mayor is so committed to fixing the police department, as he has said, how would his resignation bring about the necessary change?
AISLINN SOL, CHAPTER COORDINATOR, BLACK LIVES MATTER CHICAGO: Well, it would be the first genuine step towards creating a system that is fully accountable to the population of Chicago. Right now what we have is more akin to a dictatorship than a democracy. Rahm Emanuel has not set up any democratic mechanisms that allow the people of Chicago to have power in the say so of accountability applied to the police force and applied to our government officials.
So Rahm Emanuel's resignation would be the first genuine step toward implementing a new system that would represent the wishes and safety of the people of Chicago.
BROWN: But he has set up this task force. And yesterday we heard him apologize and say, look, you know, we have a trust problem. We're going to work on this. And why, though, did that only spur on the protests even more? SOL: Well, because it's another hand-selected appointed
representative body that is not accountable to the people of Chicago. We have the Chicago Police Board, which is hand-selected by Rahm Emanuel. We have the board of -- public school board, which is another board that's hand-selected by the mayor.
[10:20:09] We have no mechanisms in place currently that allow for a democratic control of our processes. And what that has resulted is rampant police brutality, police violence and police terror in our communities, including the operation of a black site home and square where torture continues to happen to this day.
BROWN: So Alderman Brenan, I spoke to him earlier and he says the video of Laquan McDonald's killing was actually withheld at the family's request, not because of a cover-up by the mayor. Do you accept that explanation at all?
SOL: No, not at all. The family was actually out protesting with us, so that's just not true. That was a lie that was fabricated in order to justify --
BROWN: So you're saying the family --
SOL: -- withholding of the video.
BROWN: You're saying the family did not ask for that video to be withheld?
SOL: No, they did not. And the same goes with Ronald Johnson. He was killed eight days prior to Laquan McDonald and his mother campaigned for over 400 days to have that video released.
BROWN: So even if the mayor and the Cook County attorney step down, as you all have demanded, what is your ultimate objective as far as reforming the police force? Will that be enough, with all these demands being met, including the Justice Department investigation?
SOL: No, what we want is an entire overhaul of the entire system. What we have right now in the city of Chicago is 40 percent of our operating budget going toward the police force. Half a billion dollars have been paid out within the last four years to account for police misconduct. Meanwhile, we have a supposed financial crisis with Chicago public schools. We conducted the largest public mass school closing in U.S. history. The mayor closed half of the city's mental health centers.
What we have is a political crisis. We need a government that is accountable to the people, and that is represented by the people and that is in place in order to protect the interest of the people. We need a complete overhaul of the entire system.
BROWN: Aislinn Sol, appreciate you coming on, sharing your perspective.
And still to come right here in the NEWSROOM, for the first time we hear Bowe Bergdahl in his own words talking about what happened after he walked away from his army post in Afghanistan and was captured by the Taliban.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[10:26:38] BROWN: Army Sergeant Bowe Bergdahl in his own words. For the first time we are hearing his version of how he was held captive by the Taliban. Bergdahl, who was accused of deserting his post, was freed last year during a controversial prisoner swap. Listen to what he told the popular serial podcast during an interview.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SGT. BOWE BERGDAHL, U.S. ARMY: How do I explain to a person that's just standing in an empty, dark room hurts? It's like, well, you know, someone asks you, well, why does it hurt? Does your body hurt? Yes, your body hurts. But it's more than that. It's like this mental -- like, you're almost confused. You know, there's times that I'd wake up and it's just so dark. Like, I would wake up not even remembering, like, what I was. You know how you get that feeling and that word is on the tip of your tongue?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
BERGDAHL: That happened to me only it was like, what am I? I couldn't see my hands. I couldn't do anything. The only thing I could do was, like, touch my face. And even that wasn't, like, you know, registering right.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
BERGDAHL: You know, to the point where you just want to scream. And you can't -- like, I can't scream. I can't risk that. So it's like you're standing there screaming in your mind in this room. You're standing, like in this black and dirt room. It's tiny. And just on the other side of that flimsy wooden door that you could probably easily rip off the hinges is the entire world out there. It is everything that you're missing. It is everybody -- everyone is out there. You know, that breath that you're trying to breathe. That release that you're trying to get. Everything is beyond that door.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: And meanwhile, a new congressional report accuses President Obama of breaking the law to negotiate a deal that set Bergdahl free. GOP lawmakers say the president not only sidestepped Congress but quietly negotiated his release for political gain.
So let's talk more about this with CNN intelligence and security analyst Bob Baer.
So, Bob, what is your reaction to Bergdahl doing these interviews as he faces a court-martial and even a life sentence in prison possibly?
ROBERT BAER, CNN INTELLIGENCE AND SECURITY ANALYST: Well, you know, Pamela, I'd rather hear from the military, from the psychiatrists, from the general investigating this and the people in his unit. You know, on the face of it, looking at this interview, comparing himself to Jason Bourne, clearly if that's true what he's saying, he's delusional. And I've been in that part of Afghanistan. And walking off base into the hands of the Taliban was an act of insanity.
I mean, there may be something in this to prove it's desertion and he should be tried for treason if it was. But right now it looks like he has psychiatric problems. And I don't think it's very helpful to play this stuff on the Internet. I'd rather hear from the military.
BROWN: Well, it's out there now. And I think people are curious to hear what he has to say after all of this. And he is saying that he left his post to put a spotlight on the situation at his base. And then he later admitted that it was a stupid move.
Meanwhile, Bob, soldiers maintain he was trying -- he was not trying to make a big statement and that he was a deserter. How do intelligence officials figure out which story is true here?
BAER: I would go with the witnesses. The fellow soldiers in that base. Was he talking about deserting to the Taliban, was he talking about sympathizing with their cause? And you know, once they're -- you know, they give their statements, it's going to account for a lot more than what he says about himself and I truly trust the military justice system more than I do Bergdahl --
(END)