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New Photo of Mass Shooting Killers; Obama: Congress Needs to Act on ISIS Force; Report: U.S. Intel Reveals ISIS Not Contained; Debate over ISIS Strategy Heats Up. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired December 7, 2015 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[13:31:42] JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, I'm John Berman. Wolf Blitzer is on assignment. Wherever you are watching are from around the world, thank you for joining us.

We begin with the breaking news in the San Bernardino mass shooting. A new picture of the killers has emerged. It shows Seyd Rezwan Farook and Tashfeen Malik entering the U.S. together for the first time in 2014. Almost a year and a half later, the radicalized husband and wife team would later go on to kill 14 people, and wounded 21.

Today, we heard from one of the doctors who tried to save one of the victims and survivors.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. DEV GNANADEV, ARROWHEAD REGIONAL MEDICAL CENTER: My entire career, I have tried to save people, 35 years, and we have seen many terrible disasters, but this is the most horrific ones we encountered. Our hearts go out to the victims. What really bothers me most is that none of the 14 who perished had a chance.

TRUDY RAYMUNDO, DIRECTOR, SAN BERNARDINO COUNTRY PUBLIC HEALTH DEPARTMENT: We are strong. We are a family. We held each other and we protected each other through this horrific event. And we will continue to hold each other and protect each other through what will be unimaginable weeks and months ahead.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Moving. Trudy Raymundo had hid under a table.

Paul Vercammen is in Redlands, California, where the investigation is expanding today.

Paul, what can you tell us?

PAUL VERCAMMEN, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: Well, John, it is quiet here where the couple lived but the FBI made another run at the house of the childhood friend and next door neighbor, Enrique Marquez. It was consensual search, and they were trying to find out if there were any more weapons purchased by Marquez for the couple. He bought the murder's the weapons and rifles. And interestingly Marquez checked himself into to a mental facility right after he heard of the carnage at the government offices -- John?

BERMAN: And we understand that Tashfeen Malik was a pharmacy student in Pakistan. What more have you learned a bit her background?

VERCAMMEN: Well, a lot of things are emerging about her. One, a government official is telling me on camera that she did not raise any alarm bells here, and clean as a whistle. No criminal record. And then back in Pakistan, she was known as a pretty good student.

We talked to Dr. Hussein are from the university, and he said that the students there are so typically busy with the scientific research, it is wondering how he could wonder how somebody could get involved with being radicalized and they would never expect it at his school.

This is what the doctor had to say about Malik.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. SYED NISAR HUSSEIN, PHARMACY TEACHER OF TASHFEEN MALIK: She was obviously studying with the girls, and this is the classes, and all of the girls study together. She was very humble and cool and calm. Very good in study.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[13:35:01] VERCAMMEN: And now back here live, this is where people said that she was a typical housewife, a clear contrast to the crime that was perpetrated at the government center. And one man walked by here, and now this is a kind of the notorious site here in calm Redlands, California, and he said, oh, that is where they had the bomb factory -- John?

BERMAN: Paul Vercammen in Redlands. Thank you, Paul.

To Washington, where the federal government is moving closer to unveiling a new took in the battle against terrorists. At an event this morning, Homeland Security Secretary Jeh Johnson revealed that a new warning system is on the way, possibly within the next few days.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JEH JOHNSON, HOMELAND SECURITY SECRETARY: We need a system that adequately informs the public at large not through news leaks of joint intelligence bulletins to law enforcement, and not through leaks of anonymous government officials, but we need a system that informs the public at large what we are seeing, even if what we are seeing is self-evident to the public but what we are seeing, what we are doing about it and what we are asking the public to do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: It would replace the national terror system, which has never been activated. Johnson said it is not effective because it set the bar too high for alerts. And next, we will talk about San Bernardino and President Obama's

ISIS strategy with Senator Jeff Flake, a Republican member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:40:33] BERMAN: During his Oval Office address on terrorism last night, President Obama called on Congress to act on several fronts, including an assault weapons ban and stricter screenings for people entering the United States without a visa.

Joining me from Capitol Hill is Arizona Republican Senator Jeff Flake, a member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

Senator, the president also called for the Authorization of Military Force against ISIS and you have been calling for it some time, and you have proposed a bill to do just this. What is the hold up?

SEN. JEFF FLAKE, (R), ARIZONA: Well, it is far too long in coming, and we have been launching air strikes against ISIS for more than a year now, and we have not authorized this campaign, and so we are glad that the president is calling for it now. Congress needs to move ahead. And the president and the administration was pretty slow in offering their own language, but that still came months and months ago, and so it is right in Congress' court now and we need to do it.

BERMAN: And you are right, months and months ago, and it has been a long time since the president did ask for this. And so is it Congress' fault? Is the Republican leadership's fault at this point that it has not happened?

FLAKE: Well, you cannot place it on either party. Neither leadership in both of the parties is reluctant to bring it forward. Members are reluctant to get themselves on the record apparently.

(CROSSTALK)

BERMAN: They are scared?

FLAKE: Yes, it is with what should be no excuse. This is Congress' role. You can't go this far into the campaign like this against ISIS, a campaign that is going to last well beyond this presidency, without authorizing it. So Congress needs the do it. Myself and Tim Kaine, on the Democratic side, introduced a bipartisan language. It may not be perfect. And if people want something different, then use it as a starting point, but let's get something done to authorize it. Our allies need to hear it. The troops in the field need to know that we are behind them, and that we speak with one voice. And our adversaries need to know that we do as well.

BERMAN: Your bill will authorize the Use of Military Force, but it does not call for ground forces, and in fact, it sort of rules it out. But in a new CNN/ORC poll, 53 percent of the Americans say that the United States should send ground troops into Syria to fight ISIS, and 43 percent say no. This is the first time in our polling it has been a majority in our polling, so it is time now to consider ground troops inside of Syria?

FLAKE: Our language does not specifically rule it out. It says that the purpose of the campaign is to support our allies in this fight. So, we have certainly hoped that we don't need a large number of ground troops, because we have some frankly. But, it does limit the duration so that the new president will need to come in and get a new authorization, as he or she should. So we are trying not to circumscribe what the president can and cannot do to win this, but Congress needs to speak, and we need to authorize this specifically.

BERMAN: Senator --

FLAKE: We are working on an authorization that is, you know, from 2001, and it is simply not fitting very well.

BERMAN: It is very old, to be sure, right now. Americans are scared, Senator, after what happened in California. How do you explain to them how what you are proposing would stop the California- style attack? Because those attackers, yes, ultimately the woman did apparently pledge of allegiance to ISIS, but the man had shopped around some. Our sources are telling CNN that he had tried to contact people from al Shabaab and al Nusra. Maybe you can defeat ISIS, but perhaps aren't the proposed terrorists going to find something to follow?

FLAKE: Well, they might. And anything we do cannot completely rule out an attack like this, whether it is directed by or inspired by a terrorist group, but we know that ISIS is the main source of the inspiration right now, as it seems at least. And so the best thing to do is to defeat ISIS, and that is what we need to do. That is what we say that we want to do, what we say our goal is, but we are not making much progress in the goal.

BERMAN: Senator Jeff Flake, thank for being with us.

FLAKE: Thank you for having me.

BERMAN: Just before the Paris attacks, President Obama said that the radical group had been contained geographically. Some U.S. intelligence calling that into question.

Reporter for "The Daily Beast," Kimberly Dozier, writes, "A new report on ISIS, commissioned by the White House, predicts that the self-proclaimed Islamic State is going to spread worldwide and grow in numbers unless it suffers a significant loss of territory on the battlefield in Iraq and Syria."

CNN global affairs analyst, Kimberly Dozier, joins me now.

So, Kimberly, what is this saying about what the White House, the president has been saying publicly about the battle against ISIS?

[13:45:27] KIMBERLY DOZIER, CNN ANALYST: This is an intelligence report commissioned by the White House. They have asked the director of National Intelligence to look at all of the intelligence agencies' reports to come up with something short, which served as a report card on the coalition efforts against ISIS. This is asked for before the Paris attacks, and it was delivered after the president made that comment saying ISIS had been contained. I think that it served as a rude wakeup call for the White House. Afterwards, the president asked his top Pentagon chiefs, Ash Carter, and the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, to come up with new options to fight ISIS, and that is when you also saw Ash Carter announce that sending that Special Operations team into Iraq to conduct raids inside of Syria.

BERMAN: Given what has happened in California. And given San Bernardino, has it changed inside of the Pentagon or the DOD? And are they approaching it differently?

DOZIER: Well, there is a sense of urgency, and also a sense of frustration. They are doing what they can with what they have been allowed to deploy. Some of the limitations put on them by the White House, like limitations on what they can strike, depending on how close civilians might be, but also limitations placed on them by the Iraqi government. One senior U.S. military official told me that we are sending in a small roughly 200-man elite Special Operations force and setting it up in northern Iraq, and we'd like to expand the size, but we have to prove to the Iraqis that it is going to be successful, and that it is not going to be overreaching the authority before the Iraqis will let us grow this operation.

BERMAN: And you know, after the attacks in France, the French stepped up the bombings substantially, but the United States hasn't done -- it does not appear that the United States has done anything specifically in terms of the campaign in Syria in reaction to California.

DOZIER: Well, the White House would tell you that they have already taken some actions that have not started to take hold yet on the ground. They announced that they would send 50 Special Operations troops into Syria to advise the troops there and to make the strikes inside of that country more deadly. Those troops have not arrived and, when they do, they will be busy the first few weeks just assessing how good the allies are at fighting before we see them take hold and the strikes become more deadly, at least that is how the administration puts it.

BERMAN: Kimberly Dozier, always great to talk to you. Thank you so much.

DOZIER: Thank you.

BERMAN: Many of the Republican presidential candidates criticized the president's address on ISIS, but what would they do to battle the terror group? We will discuss it with the political panel next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:52:40] BERMAN: The reaction to President Obama's address on ISIS was swift, with Republican candidates quick to criticize. Shortly after the speech ended, Donald Trump tweeted "Is that all there is? We need a new president, fast." Other candidates took to the air waves with their criticism.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JEB BUSH, (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE & FORMER FLORIDA GOVERNOR: If this is a war, which I believe it is, then we need to act accordingly, and this president doesn't belief it's a war. It believes it's a law enforcement exercise. All of the policy memos he's put in place and the intelligence restraints are making it harder for us to be successful in destroying ISIS.

SEN. MARCO RUBIO, (R), FLORIDA & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He announced nothing new other than we need gun control, even though it would have done nothing to prevent the attack in California.

SEN. RAND PAUL, (R), KENTUCKY & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We're going to take away Second Amendment privileges. Nobody wants a terrorist to have a gun. Myself included. But there has to be a process. And one of the reasons there has to be a process is, you know, Ted Kennedy was on the watch list. So was Cat Stevens. It was a mistake. But would you want to take away their constitutional rights over a mistake?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Let's discuss now. We're joined by former Democratic Governor of Michigan Jennifer Granholm; and CNN political commentator and Republican strategist, S.E. Cupp.

Governor, I want to start with you.

What happened in California is the worst deadliest terror attack since suspect September 11th. What new did you hear in the speech to address this?

JENNIFER GRANHOLM, (D), FORMER MICHIGAN GOVERNOR: Two things were important. A one is an acceleration of what they are doing so that means more Special Operations troops. That means more focus on an air campaign. That means closing the Syrian border, making sure we have all our allies focused on the enemy of is. But I think the other thing he said in addition to accelerating is that he said that we ought to be very careful and the Muslim community has to stand up. So our rhetoric has to be careful about them and the Muslim community has to take responsibility and stand up as well. That's an important message for everyone to hear. He did say acceleration, and that's important for people to hear.

BERMAN: S.E., Republicans have been critical that the president did not go far enough or did not go far at all. But on the Republican side, except for Lindsey Graham, who wants to put ground troops inside Syria for the last year, what do you think the Republican plan is to battle is in Syria?

[13:55:04] S.E. CUPP, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, there are a number of different ones. You're starting to hear people like Marco Rubio and Chris Christie talk more about reopening NSA authority to collect more intelligence at home. You're starting to hear people like Carly Fiorina talk about taking ISIS territory away from -- out of their hands, containing ISIS territory. That includes airstrikes and more ground troops, which we don't need to call Special Operations. We can call them direct ground troops. But the point of the speech was singular. It was to reassure the American public that the strategy we're currently pursuing is working and can work. And so for the president to take that opportunity to instead defend the current policy as working when his own intelligence advisers have contradicted that and to point fingers back on the American people with whom he disagrees politically and personally seemed a total waste of time and a highly offensive exercise in a moment where there were a lot of eyeballs on him and it was a huge platform that he was using in very unique special circumstances to do one thing, reassure the American public. I don't think he did that.

BERMAN: Pointing fingers, I assume, S.E., when you're saying pointing fingers you were talking about the president saying that Muslims should not be discriminated against.

CUPP: Yes. It looks like he was talking to folks like Donald Trump who talked about having a database. Stuff I disagree with. I don't want that either. But the point of the speech, again -- and to the governor's point, this is important to talk about not discriminating against Muslim Americans and rhetoric against them. But it wasn't the point of last night's speech. That message comes out of the White House on a daily basis. That comes out of Democrat's mouths on a daily basis. Last night should have not talked about gun control on Muslim databases. It should have talked about here's what we're doing on ISIS and here's why it's going to work. The vast majority of his speech was talking about people like me and Donald Trump and his own intelligence advisers who disagree with him.

BERMAN: I would never say you're like Donald Trump.

But, Governor, do you want to respond?

GRANHOLM: I do, a couple things. First of all, the majority of the speech was saying we're accelerating and here's our four-point strategy to do that to let people know action is being taken. Second, to say that the point of restricting terrorists or people who are on the watch list from having guns is irrelevant, I think, is crazy. Of course, it's relevant. Of course, we want to make sure terrorists don't have guns. It's one measure we can do.

But I would also say the Republicans have not said much different at all from what the president is already doing expect for boots on the ground. And then Ted Cruz this weekend saying we're going to carpet-bomb them into oblivion. We're going to see -- I don't know if sand blows, but we're going to see. What does that mean? He wants to start some sort of nuclear war? What does that even mean? That's the kind of rhetoric that the president --

(CROSSTALK)

CUPP: Governor, I agree with you that some of these solutions are not efficient. They are not possible. Some are not even constitutional. However, when you have attacks in Paris and San Bernardino, Chattanooga, Donald Trump is reaffirmed on a daily basis unfortunately. The president's language, the president's actions have clearly not been tough enough to satisfy even Democratic voters on this issue. Now we have a majority in this country for the first time that thinks we should have boots on the ground in Syria.

(CROSSTALK)

CUPP: So whatever the president is doing or saying, it is not working and it's opening up areas for people like Donald Trump and Ted Cruz to fill that void.

GRANHOLM: OK, and if you look at CNN's poll from last week, unless some of the Republicans step up, Donald Trump is going to be your nominee. That poll made it clear he's winning in every category, every demographic category. So the Republicans have to step up and say this is not who we are as a nation. This is not the kind of rhetoric that will help us. By the way, that kind of rhetoric will only encourage ISIS and recruits and our adversaries and it's dangerous to America.

BERMAN: Jennifer Granholm, S.E. Cupp --

(CROSSTALK)

CUPP: I totally agree Republicans need to do that. The president does not.

BERMAN: An agreement here. We'll leave the show on an agreement.

(LAUGHTER)

S.E. Cupp, Jennifer Granholm, thank you both for being with us. Thanks so much.

GRANHOLM: You bet.

BERMAN: That is all for me. The news continues, right now.

[14:00:10] Top of the hour. I'm Poppy Harlow, in for my friend, Brooke Baldwin today.