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LEGAL VIEW WITH ASHLEIGH BANFIELD

Democratic Debate Previewed; Police Acted in 'Reasonable Manner' in Cleveland Boy's Slaying; Democratic Candidates' Winning Odds Examined. Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired October 12, 2015 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[12:30:14] DONNA BRAZILE, CNN POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: Well, absolutely. I mean, but look, he has to be careful because he's also authored some tough on some crime laws.

And Bernie Sanders could argue that, you know, we don't need to put more people behind bars, especially nonviolent offenders.

So again we're going to have a -- what I call a clash of ideas. These are ideas that will make America stronger, more healthier and of course, more prosperous in the future, that's the kind of debate we need to have not just in the country. But the party will offer that tomorrow.

PAULA BROWN, CNN: And Hilary do you -- go ahead.

HILARY ROSEN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I was going to say gun is a big issue. And, you know, with all the recent shootings in the last couple of years, this, you know, there was a woeful lack of attention that the Republicans have put on how to deal with the gun crisis in this country.

I think we're going to hear all the candidates talk about this pro- actively. My guess is we're going to hear Bernie Sanders go farther than he's ever gone before in terms of supporting gun control. But clearly candidates who have been there for a long time, Martin O'Malley or Hillary Clinton, they're going to have an advantage on that debate.

BRAZILE: But you know, I got to say this. We're going to hear candidates talk about the middle class, the working poor. We'll going to hear candidates talk about voting rights, equal rights, inclusion.

So this is a different kind of debate, not the kind of what I call the vitriol. And taking a shot at somebody's looks or even to me (ph) and women that's not what we all gone in Democratic Party, we're a party of opportunity and inclusion.

And what you're going to hear is the ideas to make the country stronger and better in the future.

BROWN: We'll see how it plays out tomorrow night, Donna Brazile, Hilary Rosen, thank you both so much.

So which candidate will stand out tomorrow night? For more on the other candidates visit cnnpolitics.com and remember to watch the first Democratic presidential debate right here on CNN tomorrow night at 8:30 eastern.

Up next, a peek at what you won't see at tomorrow night's debate. How do we choose the questions? What goes on behind the scenes? A fascinating look behind the scenes.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:36:43] BROWN: And you are looking at live pictures from Las Vegas, final preparations underway, less than 32 hours before the first Democratic presidential debate. It's happening right here on CNN. And you can also watch anywhere for free on your tablets and smart phones with CNNgo. So be sure to check that out if you're not able to watch it on T.V.

Now I know what you're thinking. What exactly are the rules as the five main contenders share a stage for the first time?

Each candidate will get one minute to answer a question from our panel, 30 seconds to follow up or respond if a rival candidate mentions his or her name.

Lights, not buzzers will signal candidates that their time is running out and they may have to give extra time at the moderator's discretion.

And now, here's some fun stuff, the things you do not see during the commercial breaks and how the moderators handle the impromptu comments. Check it out.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR, ANDERSON COOPER 360: That the level of intensity on that stage always is, I don't know if it comes through necessarily all the time I walk through the television when you're watching at home. But there's really nothing like it.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR, THE SITUATION ROOM: You also have a producer in your ear telling you to move on, do something else. So it's a -- it gets a little complicated, it gets a little intense.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: We're in there and we're looking at them in person. It's a whole different experience. The candidates try so hard to catch your eye.

COOPER: So they're constantly looking at you and trying to signal to you that they want in.

BASH: And make you feel bad for not going to them.

COOPER: Sometimes they can get in but sometimes you have to move along.

BASH: The other thing people don't get to see is what happens in the commercial breaks, which I thought was really cool.

For the most parts, the candidates will go and they also check with their aides but there also were a few moments that I witnessed with the candidates and their spouses and their families kind of getting a gut check.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I remember most from a national perspective is what Newt Gingrich tried to, you know, take my head off.

NEWT GINGRICH: And I am appalled that you would begin a presidential debate with a topic like this.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: After the Newt thing, during the first break he came up to me and said you're doing a great job. And I said that's funny, you just called me reprehensible on national television because, that's just part of the game. He patted on the back and after the debate he brought Calista over, and he goes this is John, didn't John do a good job?

COOPER: There's always that you never see on television, you never see the candidates love ones coming up during the commercial breaks telling you they're not giving their candidate enough time, you know, the wife of a candidate, the child of a candidate and that happens.

Blitzer hadn't warned me about that sort of thing, once you done it and, you know, you gotten through it, you want to do it again.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: To see how the candidates and the moderators do tomorrow night when the first democratic presidential debate take place, watch it here on CNN at 8:30 eastern time.

And now to another story we're following. Remember the young boy with the pellet gunshot and killed by police in the Cleveland Park?

Well the grand jury has yet to decide on charges but an expert ruling concludes the police acted in a "reasonable manner."

[12:39:45] We're going to discuss after this break stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: What happens in Vegas, could change the course of the Democratic race for president less than 32 hours from now.

Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders, Martin O'Malley, Lincoln Chafee and Jim Webb will share a stage for the first of six democratic debates sponsored by CNN and Facebook.

You'll see it live online and on T.V. at 8:30 P.M. eastern and 5:30 pacific tomorrow.

Meanwhile, Republican front-runner Donald Trump spoke earlier this morning in New Hampshire at the No Labels convention, a group pushing for bipartisanship and more civility in politics. Listen to Trump's answer to a question about his support for women and women's health.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't think that you're a friend to women. How -- what it...

[12:45:02] DONALD TRUMP (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I knew I shouldn't have picked her. I knew I shouldn't have picked her.

All right, so let me give you that answer right now.

I respect women incredibly. I have given women more opportunity than I would say virtually anybody in the construction industry. I have a daughter named Ivanka and a wife named Miliana. Who constantly watch me to talk about women's health issues because they know how I feel about it and they know how I feel about women. I respect women. I love women. I cherish women.

BROWN: This is new polls show Trump's dominance over his Republican rivals.

And in Georgia Justin Ross Harris, remember him, a father accused of intentionally leaving his 22-month-old son in a hot car last year is in court right now for some pretrial motion hearings. Harris is charged with murdering his son. He has pleaded not guilty. Prosecutors say Harris was sexting with a 17-year-old girl and several women while his son was dying. Harris wants to keep those texts from being admitted as evidence in the trial. We'll let you know when the judge rules on that defense motion.

Iranian state TV reports a verdict has been issued on the espionage trial of journalist Jason Rezaian. "The Washington Post" reporter has been languishing in a Tehran prison since last July, for 447 days to be precise. The details of his conviction still remain a mystery. The post had denied all claims against Rezaian and says the moverepresent represents "An outrageous injustice." His attorney has 20 days to appeal his sentence. Next hour, Ali Rezaian, Jason Rezaian's brother will talk with CNN live. So be sure to stick around for that.

And in California, Governor Jerry Brown has just signed a bill that in 2017 will outlaw the use of redskins as a team name or mascot in public schools. It makes the California the first sate to ban the red skin moniker , the same logo use by the NFL Washington Redskin and Florida State University Seminoles.

You might have heard about this already, two experts concluding that the police shooting death of 12-year-old Tamir Rice in Cleveland was reasonable. They believed the 12-year-old boy posed a serious threat to an officer in training. That officer was responding to a 911 call that claimed Rice had a gun, which he did but it was a pellet gun. Democratic presidential candidates Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders both met with activists from the Black Lives Matter organization last week. And they both support the movement and Rice's family. Clinton tweeting today, sending support to Tamir Rice his loved ones, too many black families are mourning the loss of a child. We need to change that reality. The people for Bernie Sanders posted a video on Facebook back in July.

The candidate saying that he is the one to make that change happen. So I have some questions for my colleague, HLN Legal Analyst Joey Jackson.

Joey, I just read your op-ed. So these experts put together this report which was commissioned by the prosecutor's office. But in your op-ed what you say is sort of missing from these reports is the fact that perhaps protocol could have been violated because we see in that video the police pull right up to where Tamir Rice was standig and then opened fire. Tell me what else you think about that.

JOEY JACKSON, HLN LEGAL ANALYST: Sure, Pam. Good afternoon to you. You know, first we have to keep in mind that they're expert reports. And experts can come to various conclusions. And it's certainly in this profession not uncommon or unusual to have experts pitted against each other. So the mere fact that you have two experts who're very well qualified, who're in the business, who know the business, who know the constitutional standards in the law, the mere fact that opined that it was justified doesn't mean anything to the ultimate issue as to whether it really was, because clearly you can get other suspects who could say something as completely different.

The other thing to keep in mind is that how these reports will ultimately factor into the case will be however the prosecutor wants them to. The grand jury, which consists of 15 members, is a foreperson four team. They'll ultimately make the call and they don't have to be unanimous and agreeing n what to do. And the standard is not guilt or innocence. Remember a grand jury is not really giving a conclusion on whether the officer is guilty. They're merely saying is there reasonable cause to believe that there's enough to move forward to have a trial here. How Prosecutor McGinty uses these reports and whether he scratches the surface and points to the deficiencies of the reports, because there are deficiencies here will go a long way in concluding how the case ultimately ends up.

BROWN: What do you see the deficiencies are? I mean, you know, we just talk about the fact perhaps they didn't tough enough on protocol being violated. What else Joey?

JACKSON: And that's the issue. What happens is, that the constitutional standard. Now we have to be mindful, officers have a very difficult job. They have a right to go home to their families at the end of the day. They shouldn't be put in peril. But the constitutional standard is, what would a reasonable officer in Timothy Loehmann's position.

[12:45:03] Well, can you reach that conclusion if you don't end the report assess what the protocols and policies are of the Cleveland police department in responding to similar instances.

I certainly in reading the report how can you have reach that conclusion if you don't end the report assess what the protocols and policies are of the Cleveland police department in responding to similar instances.

I certainly in reading hr report would have wanted to know what were those policies that were in place? What are they violated? If so, how? What did they mean? What was the training of the officers? The nature of the train, the kind of training. So before I could conclude whether an officer and Timothy Loehmann position would have done a similar or different thing, I need to know, well, what was he required or expected to do

And I think certainly that's something that's glaring and that's absent. The other thing, Pam, to keep in mind, there's nothing in the reports that address, not whether there was something intentional that occurred here, but was there any negligence, that was there failure to perceive the risk that in coming into a park, you know, at a rate of speed, stopping the car and jumping out, was there carelessness involve in his action or was there a recklessness. That is, do you consciously disregard the risk that in approaching a suspect that why, something could happen? And so I think clearly, negligence and recklessness could have been discussed as well as anything else the prosecutor could put before that grand jury to have them determine was there any criminality here. And ultimately I will be up to a grand jury to decide whether the man and move forward.

BROWN: And of course that will depend on how the grand jury decide on how much the prosecutor presents these findings to the grand jury.

JACKSON: Exactly, that's right.

BROWN: And the question of course will the Rice family attorneys commission their own report to be presented that perhaps such on of the deficiencies you point out.

JACKSON: You know what's a great point to be made here Pam, and that's this. The bottom line, is that the prosecutor really controls the grand jury. You're the judge, the jury, the executionist. So the manner upon what you present the case has a lot to do in terms of the outcome of what they decide. Now also keeping in mind that the victim and the victim attorneys are not allowed to go before the grand jury, and not allowed to make arguments before the grand jury or not allow really to present witnesses. So its going to either A Timothy McGinty to present a clear picture to than grad jury or B for the grand jury upon in their enquiry to ask the right questions about what happened here and how things could have been differently.

So although a report commissioned by the family wouldn't make it in front of the grand jury, the essence of the questions that would come up would certainly be something the grand jury could consider.

BROWN: And just to round it. I just want to make it clear because I think we pointed this out the officers there in the scene didn't know that he was under age, that he was a juvenile and that it was a pellet gun according to the person calling in to 911.

JACKSON: Exactly.

BROWN: Joey Jackson, thank you so much. I really appreciate it. JACKSON: Thank you Pam. My pleasure.

BROWN: And take a look here. We're going to look at a live picture from Las Vegas boulevard of the Wynn Hotel, the location of the first Democratic debate airing right here on CNN tomorrow night.

Up next, we can't legally gamble on elections here in America but what if you could? We talked to the bookie about the possibilities, up next. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:57:15] BROWN: You're looking at live pictures right here from Las Vegas. Where CNN is hosting the Democratic debate tomorrow night. Vegas, of course is known for gambling and gaming but you won't be able to bet on the debate outcome tomorrow night or on Election Day for that matter. CNN's Chris Moody talked with a bookie about the odds.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRIS MOODY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: If you had to put your own hard earned cash down, who do you bet wins the Democratic nomination proposal?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm not betting on Hillary, I could tell you that.

MOODY: Here in Las Vegas, Nevada, you can bet on almost everything. But there's one thing you can't bet on, and that's politics.

Casino gambling on elections is illegal in the United States. Just for fun, Jimmy Vaccaro the book maker of the South Point casino in Las Vegas puts up the odds of the presidential contenders on the hotel sports book board. If Jimmy were making the rules, Americans would be allowed to bet on elections like in other countries where it's legal.

JIMMY VACCARO, ODDSMAKER SOUTH POINT CASINO: We've been saying for the past 30 years what's wrong with this? What's the sense of not being able to do that since we can book just about everything else? And why send a lot of this money offshore or to illegal booking where we could regulate it, and tax it and everybody can make some money doing it properly.

MOODY: Tell me what Election Day would it look like if we could bet on election here in the United States?

VACCARO: It would be the biggest thing we've every brought bigger than Super Bowl. I would make Super Bowl like a high school football game. What are they screaming about?

MOODY: Imagine if this was a presidential debate.

VACCARO: They like this.

MOODY: When this is happened.

VACCARO: This is what you would get. There are a million different things we could offer. And that's biggest thing would be who's going to be next president of the United States. Watch a football game with $50 on it. It makes you watch the damn game completely differently than you would normally.

MOODY: If you had a thousand bucks we're do you put on the Republican to win the nomination. Who would you put your money on?

VACCARO: Donald Trump.

MOODY: Democrats to win the nomination.

VACCARO: Joe Biden.

MOODY: We went around the casino and ask them who they'd put their money on to win the party nominations. These what they said about the Republicans.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jeb Bush.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Marco Rubio.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jeb Bush.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Donald Trump.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Probably Donald Trump.

MOODY: And the Democrats?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If Joe Biden runs he wins.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Joe Biden.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Joe Biden.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Biden.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hillary Clinton.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hillary Clinton.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hillary.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hillary.

MOODY: We don't get too excited. Election gambling won't be here anytime soon. Lawmakers in Nevada rejected a proposal last year but you can still make it interesting. CNN Politics is partnered with pivot a political prediction market that let you have a say what you think is going to happen in politics. Here you pay with points, not money. Go to cnn.com/predict to play. And hey with a little skin in the game...

VACCARO: You would follow politics much closer than you once did.

(END VIDEO CLIP) BROWN: So who would you bet on? Watch the first Democratic presidential debate tomorrow night at 8:30 eastern right here on CNN.

[13:00:02] Thank you so much for watching. "Wolf" starts right now. Have a great day.