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Interview with Donald Trump Biographer; Would Pope Be Well Received by U.S. Government as Negotiator; Donations Increase for Carson after Muslim Remarks. Aired 2:30-3p ET

Aired September 23, 2015 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[14:30:00] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Michael, a pleasure to have you here.

MICHAEL D'ANTONIO, AUTHOR: Thanks for inviting me.

BALDWIN: We've both been listening to him. Here's my number one question. You met with him five different times over the course of, off-and-on, 2014, where he promised he was going to run for president. You almost didn't believe him.

D'ANTONIO: The first time I met him, he said, I'm going to run. They're all asking me to run.

BALDWIN: The man we were watching in South Carolina, the man on Twitter in the middle of the night, at the debate, is this the real Donald Trump or is he acting like the man he thinks he wants us to be?

D'ANTONIO: I think by now it's the real Donald Trump. This is a guy who spent 40 years building this persona he started in 1975 promoting himself as something. Kind of a combination of Archie Bunker and "The Great Gatsby." Think of those two put together, a wise guy from queens who wants to be elegant and maybe a little menacing. So that's captivated us. Over time, I think it's become who he really is. You know, he'll get quieter in private and forgive the expression let his hair down a little bit, but not a lot. He's very on message, very focused.

BALDWIN: But he doesn't like to talk about the past. Only what's happening right now and looking ahead.

D'ANTONIO: Right. Donald doesn't want to think about the past.

BALDWIN: Why?

D'ANTONIO: Because he's afraid of what he'll realize.

BALDWIN: What is that supposed to mean?

D'ANTONIO: That he's hurt somebody, he'll regret something. He's a no regrets guy. He doubles down instead of retreating.

BALDWIN: What was his behavior like when you were speaking with him those different times? D'ANTONIO: He got bored if the questions were too much about the past

or about something detailed. I think this might be why he doesn't get into national affairs in a direct, detailed way. He likes big picture.

BALDWIN: It's big picture, blanket statements.

D'ANTONIO: Right. I'm the smartest guy around. I'm really smart. I'm really, really rich. Vote for me.

BALDWIN: I'm curious about, Michael, his relationship with his children. Being at the debate, I was in the room. It wasn't 100 degrees. Yes, it was warm. I was standing off camera and I saw Ivanka, his daughter, sitting front and center. Any moment they had in commercial, she would come and greet her father. What is -- you said at the Trump business he's a floor above and they would speak about him looking upward to the heavens.

D'ANTONIO: Expect Donald to be up on a cloud as they talk about him. They are devoted to him. Ivanka is a brilliant young woman. I think he trusts her completely. I think she is devoted to him and completely loyal. If you dealt with Trump folks, they are loyal. They are on message. He's the one in charge and they're going to support him.

BALDWIN: Just quickly, in the book, interesting tidbit, Trump thought he would be dead by 40?

D'ANTONIO: He told someone that back in the '70s.

BALDWIN: Why?

D'ANTONIO: You know, I think he had kind of a dramatic sense of himself. He told me that his mother was very dramatic, riveted on the queen when her coronation took place, could hold a room with her jokes. So I think he kind of has this dramatic sense of himself. You know, young people say, I'm going to die young because I live life to the fullest. It was probably a throw-away like that.

BALDWIN: Little did you know when he said he would run for president you would end up writing a biography of a man front and center.

D'ANTONIO: He said he would run over and over and over again and he did. When he told me, I thought, OK Donald, let's see. Then, lo and behold, he declared.

BALDWIN: You're book is "Never Enough: Donald Trump and the Pursuit of Success."

Michael D'Antonio, thanks for coming by.

D'ANTONIO: Thank you.

BALDWIN: I appreciate it.

And make sure you remember here coming up in just a couple of weeks we mentioned that Republican presidential debate recently in just three weeks CNN and Facebook will host the first Democratic presidential debate, Tuesday, October 13th, in Las Vegas.

Coming up next, as we await Pope Francis getting ready to meet more crowds in our nation's capital here, we will talk about his many roles, including the role of top negotiator. What role is most important? My next guest says the Vatican is the ultimate insider. Do not miss that conversation.

You're watching special breaking coverage here on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:38:42] BALDWIN: You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

During Pope Francis' speech this morning he said he was ready to listen to, quote, "the hopes and dreams of the American people," the words of a negotiator. But how well would he be received by those in charge here in the United States?

My next guest is coming straight from the White House. He is Massimo Faggioli, the director of the Institute for Catholicism and Citizenship, and a professor of theology at the University of St. Thomas in St. Paul, Minnesota.

Massimo, welcome.

MASSIMO FAGGIOLI, DIRECTOR, INSTITUTE FOR CATHOLICISM AND CITIZENSHIP & PROFESSOR OF THEOLOGY, UNIVERSITY OF ST. THOMAS, ST. PAUL: Thank you. Thanks very much

BALDWIN: I know you say the pope's visit comes at a unique time because of what's happening, this great debate within the Catholic Church. More complex you say than the visits of John Paul II or Pope Benedict. Can you explain what you mean by that?

FAGGIOLI: Yeah. In church history, there is a 50-year history of the visits of the popes to the United States. But the previous ones up to the visit of Pope Benedict in 2008, they happened in a church that was quiet or where dissent was marginal in some places. The special thing for Pope Francis is he has opened the debate on many issues like gays or contraception, marriage and family that we ignore they were there, and it happens that these issues are extremely important for the identity of the Catholic church in the West. In this sense, Pope Francis is bringing the center of the bishops to America and he is trying to involve the U.S. bishops in the center.

[14:40:16] BALDWIN: You mentioned some social issues, but I want to ask you about the role of negotiator for this pope. You know, he helped broker renewed relations with Cuba, reports that asked to intervene in Iran. How successful has he been so far serving as this intermediary?

FAGGIOLI: So far, he has been successful. I mean, the Vatican can be the ultimate soft power in terms of global diplomacy. What's new about Pope Francis is that in the first two years and a half of his pontification he has received difficulty from American bishops. And it's more difficult for popes to build bridges internally to the church. So to his own brother bishops that are so far the most visible group that is not sure that they are getting this pope right. So that's why these three -- it's about building bridges between himself and America, but especially between himself and the leaders of the Catholic Church in this country.

BALDWIN: Exactly right. And he knows that and he'll be speaking at live prayer service to a number of those bishops today.

For now, Professor Massimo Faggioli, thank you very much for joining me.

FAGGIOLI: Thank you.

BALDWIN: And very shortly we're all watching. Aren't we all glued to these pictures? I've been all day long. The pope will be riding through these crowds in Washington, D.C., in that popemobile. So stay tuned for the pictures.

Plus, Ben Carson says the money is pouring in after his controversial remarks about Muslims not becoming president.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:46:26] BALDWIN: Ever since Ben Carson said he would not support any Muslim for president, the criticisms against him have really been pouring in, but reportedly so have the campaign donations. That is what Dr. Carson told FOX News today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. BEN CARSON, (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE & RETIRED NEUROSURGEON: The money's been coming in so fast it's hard to even keep up with it. I remember the day of the last debate, within 24 hours, we had raised a million dollars. And it's coming in at least at that rate, if not quite a bit faster.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: CNN won't be able to verify this with the Federal Election Commission until after the quarter ends at the end of the month.

But since he first made that initial comment Sunday, Carson has shifted his position saying he would support a Muslim for the White House as long as that candidate denounced Sharia Law.

Joining me now, retired colonel, Shareda Hosein. She served in the military for 35 years. She is a Muslim chaplain who volunteers at the Islamic Society of Boston and has served as a chaplain at Tufts University. And she first gained attention for attempting to be the first female Muslim chaplain in the U.S. military.

Shareda, welcome to you and thank you for all that you've done with the U.S. military.

COL. SHAREDA HOSEIN, RETIRED MUSLIM CHAPLIN, U.S. ARMY: You're welcome. Thank you for having me on the show.

BALDWIN: Let's just begin and get right to it with Dr. Carson's comments. I know you have said his language is dangerous, divisive, and it makes you more fearful for Muslims than right after 9/11. Tell me why.

HOSEIN: I'm more fearful because it seems like a lot more Americans have been incited to almost do vigilante justice. So when I walk around with my hijab, I'm very noticeable as a Muslim, as well as other women. And I'm just -- with candidates saying things like Muslims shouldn't be president of the United States or we're a -- or we want to inundate, take over by Sharia, these are fearful rhetoric that I think is causing the backlash on the end. That's why I'm very afraid of that.

BALDWIN: You bring up Sharia Law. There are so many misconceptions when it comes to Islam. Can you just explain Sharia Law?

HOSEIN: Well, that is -- yes, Sharia Law is -- the way I practice it is my personal religious beliefs, how I regulate my life and my daily prayer, in my giving of charity and my kindness to others. It is also similar to the Canon Law that the Catholics follow or what Jewish people follow. But at the end of the day it doesn't consume my life that I want to make it the governing law of the country that I live in. I am very content living in the United States under the Constitution, and for me the Constitution affords me my freedom of religion, which is most important for me as well as other Muslims. So the Sharia Law I think is almost like a scare tactic that some of the politicians are using to gain votes. Dr. Carson, he in many ways follows his canon law as a Christian following his beliefs in reading the Bible, but he --

(CROSSTALK)

[14:50:00] BALDWIN: Forgive me, because there are misconceptions of that. And I think it's important to hear you explain it. Though still, there are 38 percent of Americans, Shareda, polled in June said they would not support a Muslim candidate for president. You heard me mention a million dollars, according to Dr. Carson, pouring into his campaign since he said what he did. Final question, what would you say to that slice of America?

HOSEIN: I would say I have been in the military for 35 years defending the Constitution of the United States. I am a lawful, loyal citizen as a female Muslim. I am able to practice my faith and defend my country all in the same breath. And so I say the best thing is for each one of you out there to go find Muslims and get to know Muslims because the moment you understand Muslims, you'll realize that Islam isn't a threat to you. It is similar to your own faith practices if you have one. And if not, it is very congruent with obeying the Constitution of the United States, human rights, just personal ethics.

BALDWIN: Lieutenant Colonel Shareda Hosein, thank you so much for your service to this country and thank you for joining me today.

HOSEIN: You're welcome. Thank you. BALDWIN: Next, the show, "Somebody's Got to Do It." He's back for a

new season. Coming up next, Mike Rowe joins me with some very extra special guests.

We are also live in Washington today, of course, as the pope prepares to perform his first mass ever on U.S. soil.

Our special coverage continues right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:55:58] BALDWIN: Here we go. If there is one thing -- there is one thing we are learning about Mike Rowe other than he will try any job, apparently, anywhere anytime on his hit CNN series, "Somebody's Got to Do It." It's this, his antics with his parents are as entertaining as his series.

I want you to look at a behind-the-scenes at a promo Mike was making with his mom, Peggy. Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE ROWE, CNN HOST, SOMEBODY'S GOT TO DO IT: What, mom?

PEGGY ROWE, MOTHER OF MIKE ROWE: It's happening again.

ROWE: What's happening? I said, what's happening? What the hell is happening? Why won't you talk to me? We don't talk anymore.

PEGGY ROWE: Sorry. You told me this season was going to be different.

(LAUGHER)

I got all confused with all those ropes.

ROWE: I know. I'm very convincing. Here we go.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Aren't the bloopers the best?

ROWE: The bloopers are better than the actual promo.

BALDWIN: Here are the stars of the show, in my opinion, in their very first live TV appearance with me. I have John and Peggy Rowe and, yeah, their son, Mike.

Anyway, you two, so lovely to meet you. Thank you for popping by my office earlier. And I've heard a bit about you.

Let's begin with the fact that here you are, you came in from Maryland. And you already had your big celebrity encounter this morning.

PEGGY ROWE: Oh, yeah. BALDWIN: Tell me about that.

We're not talking about you, by the way.

PEGGY ROWE, We had breakfast.

BALDWIN: With?

PEGGY ROWE, Bruce Willis and Martin Scorsese.

ROWE: Well, at least we were in the same room.

BALDWIN: When we say breakfast with, Peggy --

PEGGY ROWE, Well, we were at different tables, but we saw them.

BALDWIN: There we go. Martin Scorsese, who by the way, directed our favorite film you've seen a ton of times, "The Last Waltz."

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Anyway, back to your parents, can you give me some dirt on your son?

ROWE: Why am I even here?

BALDWIN: So we can make him blush.

ROWE: Why am I even here? Oh, my god.

BALDWIN: Come on, dad.

JOHN ROWE, FATHER OF MIKE ROWE: I probably could, but I don't know if it's ready for prime-time.

ROWE: We're not in prime-time.

BALDWIN: We're in the middle of the day, like five people are watching.

(LAUGHTER)

ROWE: You can say whatever you want.

JOHN ROWE: This is very prime for us. Yes, I can think of something that was an embarrassment.

(LAUGHTER)

BALDWIN: Let's go.

JOHN ROWE: When Mike was in, I believe, the eighth or ninth grade, there was a smoke bomb released in the hall of his junior high school.

ROWE: Yes? JOHN ROWE: I came home from work, and mom here said, Mike's upstairs,

you need to go talk to him. So I went up and I said, what's happening? So he told me that he had violated a school rule. Today, he would have been arrested probably for trying to blow up the school.

ROWE: This is the story he's going with. It's unbelievable.

BALDWIN: This is the story, a smoke bomb?

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Now look at the life, the career this man has made for himself.

JOHN ROWE: But I have to defend my son. I think he had just cause for doing it.

BALDWIN: All right.

JOHN ROWE: I think he had just cause for doing it.

ROWE: Finally.

JOHN ROWE: Just cause for doing it.

(CROSSTALK)

ROWE: Pushing back against the man. I was raging against the machine. I was young.

BALDWIN: And what's changed since then?

ROWE: Not much.

(CROSSTALK)

ROWE: Very little.

BALDWIN: Let's ask you a question, since this is about you after all. So how about this new season of "Somebody's Got to Do It."

ROWE: It's the best season. I don't want to overstate it. It's jam- packed, action-packed, it also satisfies curiosity in a totally non- pretentious way. You can ask my mom. She can confirm it.

(CROSSTALK)

PEGGY ROWE, Can't he talk?

BALDWIN: He can talk. I mean, if we bloopers in the quiz show.

ROWE: Oh, my goodness. I had no idea your brain was so enormous, until I stood next to it.

(CROSSTALK)

PEGGY ROWE: The quiz show was fun.

BALDWIN: That was fun, right?

PEGGY ROWE: We really enjoyed it.

ROWE: Did you watch it?

PEGGY ROWE, I did watch it.

BALDWIN: You know we didn't --

(CROSSTALK)

PEGGY ROWE: You came in second.

ROWE: Well, we were in the top three.

BALDWIN: We did come in second. Get it out there.

All right --

(CROSSTALK)

PEGGY ROWE: And I loved your attitude.

(LAUGHTER)

BALDWIN: Thank you.