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CNN NEWSROOM

Ex-Cop Darren Wilson Talks; Exotic Animal Shipping; Jindal talks Sanctuary Cities; Investigators Meeting in France to Analyze Plane Debris; Five Years Since the Miraculous Rescue of Trapped Chilean Miners. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired August 4, 2015 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[09:30:00] CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Quote, "it's a pre-gang culture where you're just running in the streets, not worried about working in the morning, just worried about your immediate gratification. It's the same younger culture that is everywhere in the inner cities."

And, Joseph, I'd actually like to get your reaction to that quote.

JOSEPH GIACALONE, FMR. NYPD DETECTIVE SERGEANT: Well, I mean, if they were trying to paint them as empathetic to the whole situation, I think they really did a terrible job. I mean he's really referring to the fact that the people in Ferguson aren't going to work and they don't have anything to do and, I mean, you can make so manty assumptions based on that. I really question the fact that, you know, why -- the timing of this article, why he even bothered doing it. It's -- I mean it's -- it was such a firestorm, you would think that he would be the last person on earth that would want to actually bring any of this ever back up.

COSTELLO: Well, here's why he might have granted that interview because the reporter also asked him if the Ferguson Police Department offered him his job back, would he take it. Quote, "I asked Wilson what he would do if the Ferguson police force offered him his job back. He seemed startled. 'I would, um, I would not allow him.' Barb said." Barb's his wife. "I would want to do it for a day,' Darren said, finally," he said, "to show people that he was not 'defeated.'"

Marc.

MARC LAMONT HILL, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: He's making this about him. It should be about Michael Brown, who lay dead on the ground unattended for hours as if he belonged to nobody. It should be about a community that has been plagued by structural racism and police misconduct according to the Justice Department report that he didn't even read for decades. It should be about that.

I -- I am sensitive to the loss of life here. I'm also sensitive to Darren Wilson. But at the end of the day, this can't be about whether Darren Wilson was defeated or not. It has to be about whether or not we can get justice in the land. Justice or else has to be the way we think about this, otherwise we're all in a bad position.

COSTELLO: All right, Marc Lamont Hill and Joseph Giacalone, thanks to both of you. I appreciate it.

GIACALONE: Thanks for having me.

COSTELLO: And good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.

Effective immediately, Delta and American Airlines are banning the shipment of big game trophies as freight. The ban comes after protests like this around the world sparked by the recent slaughter of an African lion named Cecil at the hands of the -- of an American dentist. Christine Romans joining me now to tell us more about this ban.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Good morning.

And we're talking about trophies. Trophies are the heads and pelts of these animals. And, Carol, hunters talk about the big five game, and these big five game have been banned by two of these airlines and other airlines also have policies in place where they will not ship them.

What are these? These are lions. These are leopards. You can see them on your screen. These are the big five game that hunters pay a lot of money for the right to go and legally try to kill. Delta and American will no longer allow those to be shipped back on their planes, in the belly of their planes. Experts saying that lion trophies are the most prized here. Lion trophies, some I think 600 African lions each year are legally killed. The majority of those are shipped back to the United States, Carol.

COSTELLO: So it doesn't matter if they were legally killed or not, Delta and American, no.

ROMANS: It doesn't matter if it's legal. They don't want to be in the business. We know that the Human Society has been pushed them and saying that other international airlines who already don't do this praising them. The Humane Society saying you don't want to be the getaway driver for the pillage of, you know, African wildlife. That's sort of the way that they put it, which is an interesting -- interesting use of imagery. But we know that Delta is the biggest, you know, direct connection from the United States to South Africa. We're the gateway for a lot of people to go on these safaris and on these hunting trips. So Delta had been under a lot of pressure. Delta's not saying specifically it's because of this Cecil case, but Delta saying very clearly, we will not ship any lion, leopard, elephant, rhinoceros, buffalo trophies worldwide as freight.

COSTELLO: All right, Christine Romans, many thanks. I appreciate it.

ROMANS: You're welcome.

COSTELLO: Still to come in the NEWSROOM, Republican Presidential Candidate Bobby Jindal says lock up mayors of sanctuary cities for the illegal acts of undocumented immigrants. My next guest, the mayor of Somerville, Massachusetts, says, bring it on, Bobby.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:38:25] COSTELLO: Presidential Candidate Bobby Jindal may be lagging in the polls but this morning he's firmly in the spotlight for new comments on illegal immigration. Specifically that so-called sanctuary cities that don't enforce immigration laws, Jindal says if undocumented immigrants break the law, then that city's mayor should also face arrest as a partner in crime.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Should a mayor of a sanctuary city who ignores federal law be arrested?

GOV. BOBBY JINDAL (R-LA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Absolutely. I would hold them as an accomplice, make them criminally culpable. I'd also make them civilly liable so that families -- victim's families could sue.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Jindal's big idea did not sit well with Somerville, Massachusetts, Mayor Joseph Curtatone, who likened Louisiana's governor to some less than flattering characters on TV.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR JOE CURTATONE, SOMERVILLE, MASSACHUSETTS: Sheriff Bobby Jindal, more like Deputy Barney Fife, has not arrested me yet. I love listening to Jindal, because I swear if you didn't know who he was, you would think it was Gomer Pyle on the phone, it's fantastic.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Whoa!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Whoa!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: All right, with me now, Mayor Joseph Curtatone.

Welcome, Mr. Mayor. Thank you for being here.

MAYOR JOSEPH CURTATONE, SOMERVILLE, MASSACHUSETTS: Good morning, Carol.

COSTELLO: We invited Bobby Jindal as well, but so far we haven't heard back.

So here you are. Thank you for being here.

Did you really call him jindog (ph)? Is that what you said?

CURTATONE: No, I think that's just my unique Boston accent, Carol.

COSTELLO: Well, you did call him Gomer Pyle and Barney Fife. Why?

CURTATONE: I did. You know, and it's easy to make such comments because, you know, Governor Jindal's comments and assertions are so absurd. So when I woke up and I heard them, it just -- it just blew my mind.

[09:40:06] COSTELLO: You also said, bring it on. If -- if -- if Bobby Jindal want to arrest mayors like yourself, bring it on. Can you expound on that?

CURTATONE: Yes, you know -- well, it's not just bring it on his purported actions and what he threatened he would do if he were president, but bring on the conversation and debate because this issue is much more complex about who -- much more than who declares themselves a sanctuary city. We need, Carol, in this country, serious leadership. Leadership that is smart and that is compassionate and that is serious about solving problems, not just making Washington work, but helping our cities work. And I'm a mayor trying to represent everyone in my community, whether they're documented or undocumented, not matter where they came from, to solve problems on public health, public safety and grow a healthy community for everyone to live in. And we need a president that understands that he or she will represent every city, including Somerville. But, you know, just don't try to make Washington work and don't just try to throw out assertions to ignite the mob. Let's have serious conversations. Bring it on. And let's see -- and let's -- let's have the American people weigh in because I think you're a lot smarter than Bobby Jindal thinks.

COSTELLO: So -- so -- so, mayor, in your mind, what is bobby Jindal trying to do?

CURTATONE: Well, I think you've alluded to it, Carol. I mean he is lagging in the polls, although maybe yesterday's comments by him have brought him from 1.4 percent to 1.5. You know, I understand it's politics. It's political season. And there's dozens of people that appears running on each side of the aisle for president. But what I believe the American people want to see -- and whether you vote Republican or Democrat or independent -- is strong, committed, serious, smart, compassionate leadership. We need leadership. Leadership that wants to take on major problems in this country, such as immigration reform.

COSTELLO: But --

CURTATONE: Let's have a serious conversation. Bring that conversation on.

COSTELLO: But --

CURTATONE: And let's not just throw out words that ignite the mob and attack and declare war on 11 million -- more than 11 million undocumented people. That's not the -- that's not leadership.

COSTELLO: But what happened in San Francisco, you know, with Katie Steinle, she was killed by an undocumented immigrant who should have been shipped out of the country long ago. Some say, including Bobby Jindal, that he was protected by city leaders. Why shouldn't that mayor be held accountable for that, for not turning that undocumented immigrant over to federal authorities when they asked? CURTATONE: OK. So, the case in San Francisco was absolutely tragic. A

heinous crime was committed and an innocent person lost her life. And that conversation should be had. The questions need to be asked. The city of San Francisco and its mayor have publicly stated they were wrong and made a mistake.

But the problem is much more complex than one terrible incident. Sanctuary cities have been in existence now for almost 30 years. And let's understand why they came into existence and why communities like Somerville also decided to go away from the secure -- secured communities program because we're trying to break down walls, Carol. We're trying to create connections to everyone in our community to make our community safer. And to make our communities safer, we need to engage everyone.

My city speaks 52 languages. A third of my population wasn't even born in the United States. And to make Somerville a great place to live, work, play and raise a family, I need to engage with everyone. I need to earn their trust.

Our public enforcement -- public safety official have stated the same thing, that we've had numerous cases where people, when they've even been victims themselves, have refused to come forward because of fear of being determined to be undocumented status or -- and being, as a consequence, being deported. It's much more complex than one terrible act. And this is where we need leadership. And Bobby Jindal is much smarter than that and that's what's disappointing here. People like him and Donald Trump, they didn't come to position of leadership and power and success by being dumb. But to state incredible, you know, inflammatory statements they made about Mexico not sending their best, or that sanctuary cities and those who declare themselves sanctuary cities are harboring murderers and rapists and burglars, that just ignites the mob. And the people of this country know that's not the case. They know a lot more that the problem is much more complex and we need leadership in Washington to solve the problem. Help me, as a local official, grow my community. Help us all to grow a better country.

COSTELLO: Mayor Joseph Curtatone, thank you so much for being with me this morning. I appreciate it.

CURTATONE: Thank you, Carol.

COSTELLO: Thank you.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, experts from across the globe meeting right now in France. Is this a piece of the wing from MH-370? We'll talk about that next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:54:10] COSTELLO: Investigators meeting today before they begin analyzing this piece of debris possibly from that missing Malaysia Airlines flight. There has been around the clock anticipation for this meeting since the wreckage washed up last week, many hoping this will shed light on what happened to the flight that vanished off the radar nearly 17 months ago.

Saima Moshin is in France where that meeting is taking place. Tell us more.

SAIMA MOSHIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Carol, yes, they have confirmed of course it is a flaperon from a 777, yet to say whether it is from MH- 370. And this is where that crucial work will take place now.

On Monday at the Paris prosecutor's office, Malaysian authorities met with French aviation authorities and talked about how they want to move forward. And the Malaysian Transport Ministry and the Civil Aviation Authority released a statement saying that they've agreed how they're going to move forward, what examinations they're going to do.

[09:05:05] And crucially, Carol, agreed to conduct examinations both under international aviation legislation but also under judicial legislation, and that is because there's also a manslaughter case here in France that's been launched by the families of the four nationals on MH-370. Now -- and that is why there's going to be a judicial investigation and an air crash investigation going on simultaneously.

Those are the parameters they've decided. CNN has also learned that the United States' NTSB and Boeing and Malaysian authorities, the Malaysian investigation in charge, will be meeting here in Toulouse at some point today. We haven't been give an time. And that's because they're remaining so tight-lipped, Carol. It's a very sensitive investigation, as you can imagine.

COSTELLO: Yes, I can. Saima Moshin, thank you so much, reporting live for us this morning.

Checking some other top stories for you at 50 minutes past. Tthe death penalty still on the table for Colorado movie theater shooter James Holmes. Jurors rejected a plea for leniency Monday, moving the trial into the third and final phase, which will include victims and family impact statements along with sentencing. 12 people were killed, 70 injured, in that shooting three years ago.

Now, this heart-pounding rescue caught on video in northern California. A sheriff's deputy pulls a man out of a car and off train tracks moments before a train comes barreling through and smashes into his car. The driver was stuck on the tracks, but the deputy saw him in trouble, pulled him to safety with barely a second to spare. Wow.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, remember the unbelievable rescue, 33 Chilean miners waiting underground for more than two months? See how they're doing five years later. Next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:56:03] COSTELLO: It's been five years -- 33 Chilean miners trapped more than a half mile underground when their mine collapsed around them. For nearly ten weeks, the world watched, waited, and prayed. In a new CNN Special Report premiering tonight, "A MINER MIRACLE: FIVE YEARS AFTER THE CHILEAN RESCUE", CNN's Rosa Flores looks back at the dangerous operation that brought those men back to the surface one by one.

Rosa joins me now to talk more about this. This was an incredible story.

ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It was. I think we all remember when these men were being brought up one by one. And one of the amazing things about this documentary is that we're going to be able to share with you details that you didn't know. Even if you think you know the story, there's certain things, Carol, that you just didn't know about, because these men invited us into their homes. They shared their stories with us of how they were trapped underneath, how they didn't have food, and a couple other things. I'm not going to tell you everything so you can watch. But then there's this one day that they are found, and this is what it was like. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LAURENCE GOLBORNE, FORMER MINING MINISTER: Around 6:00 a.m. I receive a phone call.

FLORES (voice-over): From the drillers who believe they finally busted through to the mine.

GOLBORNE: I got up here without shower, without anything. I went nearly to the site.

FLORES (on-camera): So the miners down there started screaming saying we were found? Nos encontraro?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The plan is that somebody will take a big piece of steel and start whacking the drill bit and, sure enough, the drill operator is hearing this kind of echoing coming up.

FLORES (voice-over): Rescuers take several hours to pull up the bit.

GOLBORNE: The hammer came out with a cross painted in red, and I said to one of the them, it's painted. They said, yes, that wasn't there. Are you sure? Yes, Minister, I'm sure that there wasn't anything. And then in the hammer there was tied a plastic bag with a message inside.

FLORES: It's a note from one miner to his wife. Then workers notice something else.

GOLBORNE: And we start digging, and we took the paper and open and I see the message.

FLORES: A message that triggers an impossible rescue.

(on camera): Did you ever think, darn, this is not going to happen?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Every minute of every day.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FLORES (on camera): Geez. You're going to feel through this Special Report, Carol, because I think we really are going to take you through the highs and lows of the emotion that these people went through, both underground and aboveground.

COSTELLO: What about lasting effects?

FLORES: Oh, these poor miners. A lot of them are having a lot of trouble -- psychologically, financially, they're not doing very well. They're being pulled back into those dark areas that they lived and experienced, and you're going to learn in this SPECIAL REPORT how they're coping today, what they're doing to make sure that they're OK and that their families are OK.

COSTELLO: What about mine safety in general in Chile because that was a big problem, right?

FLORES: You know, and it improved. It did improve. There's a lot of concentration on safety now, but, of course, it's too late for these men. They've already been trapped. They've already gone through all of those experiences. And so for them, you know, it's a moot point at this point.

COSTELLO: Oh, I can't wait to watch. Rosa Flores, thanks so much for stopping by. I appreciate it.

[10:00:00] The CNN Special Report, "A MINER MIRACLE: FIVE YEARS AFTER THE CHILEAN RESCUE" airs tonight, 9:00 p.m. Eastern, right here on CNN.

The next hour of CNN NEWSROOM starts now.