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Piece of Airplane Could Be from MH370; Trump Lashes Out at Female Lawyer; Poll: Trump Maintains Strong Lead Over GOP Rivals. Aired 6-6:30a ET

Aired July 30, 2015 - 06:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

[05:58:14] ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: We do want to welcome the viewers in the United States and around the world. This is NEW DAY. We begin with the very significant developments in the search for missing Malaysia Airlines Flight 370. Investigators find a piece of debris found along the coast of Reunion Island -- that's near Madagascar -- a, quote, "major lead."

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: The Malaysian government, in fact, has dispatched a team to the site to investigate. The question is, could this be the break searchers have been hoping for?

We have this story covered only the way CNN can. We begin our global coverage with CNN's Robyn Kriel, who is live on Reunion Island. Quite a voyage to get you there, Robyn?

ROBYN KRIEL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Michaela, and it would be a voyage for the various investigating teams who are due to jet in from Malaysia, Australia. Of course, coordinating the effort is the French here on Reunion Island. It is a French island with roughly 800,000 people on it. A group of people found this piece of debris and reported it to police.

Let's take a look at how -- just how that unfolded.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KRIEL (voice-over): A possible crucial clue and a major lead in the 17-month-old mystery of missing Malaysia Airlines Flight MH-370.

WARREN TRUSS, AUSTRALIAN DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER: This is obviously a very significant development. It's the first real evidence that there's a possibility that a part of the aircraft may have been found.

KRIEL: A piece of debris, possibly part of a wing of what appears to be a Boeing 777, the same model as a missing commercial airliner, discovered washed up on a western Indian Ocean beach on the island of Reunion, near Madagascar.

French and Malaysian authorities dispatched teams to Reunion Island to investigate the debris, which washed up more than 2,300 miles from the current search zone off the Australian coast in the southern Indian Ocean.

A group of people happened upon the wreckage during a beach cleanup.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)

GRAPHIC: I told myself, 'it's debris,' and we walked closer to see better.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)

GRAPHIC: What did you see?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)

GRAPHIC: I saw a wing.

KRIEL: The debris, bearing the marking BB-670, which could help in the identification process.

DAVID SOUCIE, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: If it is indeed part of a 777, then we're pretty clear that it would be then also part of MH- 370.

KRIEL: Flight MH-370 vanished without a trace in March of last year with 239 souls on board shortly after takeoff from Kuala Lumpur en route to Beijing.

The Malaysian government ultimately declaring the missing plane an accident. Everyone on board presumed dead.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KRIEL: And just to give you an idea, Michaela, of what some of these poor families are feeling, we've spoken to some of them. They're not ready to fly out here to Reunion just yet. They say that they've had their hopes dashed so many times. But one family member says that if this does turn out to be the piece of MH-370, then they will finally have closure, some tangible piece of evidence that their loved ones are, indeed, presumed dead -- Michaela.

BERMAN: I'll take it, Robyn. Robyn Kriel, all the way for us on Reunion Island. Great to have you now there.

The discovery of debris comes after more than 16 months of nonstop search efforts for the missing airliner, the search largely focused along the arc over here of western Australia. So how could debris wash from here thousands of miles away all the way here to Reunion Island?

CNN's Andrew Stevens joins us now, live from Kuala Lumpur in Malaysia on this exhaustive search and all the efforts since the plane vanished 500 days ago -- Andrew.

ANDREW STEVENS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, exhaustive is the word. It has been an extraordinary trip for the searchers and for the countries involved. And now, 15, 16 months on, we're finally, perhaps, getting to a point where we can actually say that the plane did crash, because there have been so many theories surrounding this plane.

Let's cart the minds back to March of last year when Flight 370 disappeared off radar. Initially, searchers were looking in the South China Sea; they were looking in the Sea of Vietnam. They were looking around Indonesia.

And as the plane didn't give up any secrets at all and falsely -- followed falsely with no real conclusions as to where this -- where this plane had gone, more and more experts started looking at the mathematics, looking at the possibilities, looking at where it could have gone. And eventually using those satellites, as you remember, those handshakes of satellites between the plane and the handshake.

They find -- the experts finally narrowed it down to an area going down towards the Southern Indian Ocean. This is a massive area of basically unknown sea and unknown seabed.

So that search, it went from 4.6 million square kilometers at one stage, enormous, down to currently it's 120,000 kilometers, John. The search at one stage, there were something like 21 planes, 19 ships, eight countries searching for it. We've now got just two or three ships down there in the deep Southern Indian Ocean looking. They've covered about half of that 120,000 kilometers.

What we know at this stage is that where that has debris surfaced is consistent with the currents and where it could have floated from. So the Australian authorities, Alisyn, are saying at the moment that that -- it doesn't bring us any closer to where or pinpointing where the wreckage may be. But it is does -- it is consistent with where the search area is now. Any debris from that search area could well, after six to eight months, end up around Reunion Island. It is still pretty much a needle in the haystack, though the haystack does get smaller and smaller, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Andrew, fascinating developments this morning. Thanks for all of that.

It has been an agonizing week for the families of the 239 people on board that missing airliner. After more than 16 months, many are treating this news with caution. CNN's Will Ripley is live in Beijing. That's where Flight 370 was headed before it vanished. He has that part of the story -- Will.

WILL RIPLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Alisyn, family members here tell us this brings them right back to March of last year when we saw them in such anguish, such pain and such uncertainty. That uncertainty still continues right now, because they still simply don't know where their loved ones are.

The families at this point only have each other for support. The information center has been closed. The hotline shut down. They don't have any official information. They're only getting it from the media. I want to read you a statement we got from some of the Chinese families here, saying, quote, "No matter where the debris is found, we care more about the whereabouts of our family members. Whether or not the debris of MH-370 is found, all parties should not stop or give up their previously pledged search effort."

And Jacquita Gonzales, the wife of Patrick Gomez, the in-flight supervisor of MH-370, he said, quote, "I'm torn. If it's confirmed to have come from 370, there will be some closure for us, but I am still hoping it's not the plane. That Patrick is still alive."

[06:05:10] And Alisyn, that is what is so heartbreaking that, more than 17 months later, there are still many family members here who believe that this plane somehow landed and that their loved ones are still alive.

CAMEROTA: Well, perhaps the news today will give them some measure of information or closure. Will, thank you so much for that.

So joining us on the phone now is Martin Dolan. He is the chief commissioner of the Australian Transport Safety Board. His agency has been leading this search for MH-370 for the past, at least year.

Commissioner Dolan, thanks so much for being here. Can you tell us how much certainty you have today that a piece of MH-370 has been found?

MARTIN DOLAN, CHIEF COMMISSIONER, AUSTRALIAN TRANSPORT SAFETY BOARD (via phone): We remain cautious at this stage, Alisyn, because we have not been able to confirm the full details of what this piece of debris is or whether it is associated with Flight MH-370.

CAMEROTA: How long do you think it will take to definitively determine if this is a piece of that airliner?

DOLAN: The French authorities are working with the Malaysian authorities and us to do this as quickly as possible. And we are hoping that something can be done in the next 24 to 48 hours. It depends on how much information can quickly be extracted from this piece of debris.

CAMEROTA: If it is, in fact, a piece of a 777, does that mean it is MH-370?

DOLAN: If it is confirmed to be a piece of a 777, yes. Our view is that there is no other known source for a piece of that size and significance.

CAMEROTA: Commissioner, for the better part of the past year, you have been leading a search that has been 2,300 miles away from where this piece of debris was found. Can you just share with us your thoughts when you heard that this debris was found off the coast of Madagascar?

DOLAN: Well, we have done -- our thoughts were certainly that it is possible associated with the Asian aircraft. And that's something that, as we say, has to be confirmed. Because we have done a considerable amount of modeling of how floating debris would drift in the Indian Ocean. And over the length of time, six to eight months we're talking about, the drift goes a considerable distance. And our modeling said that there was certainly a possibility that, by this time, floating debris would have reached as far east as this.

CAMEROTA: But yet were you convinced that it was still the right place to be searching off the west coast of Australia where you were?

DOLAN: Our search zone is based very much on very close and the expert analysis for metal (ph) like that associated with the aircraft. The so-called arcs (ph) of the aircraft will be found quite close to the seven-pack (ph), so we have a high degree of confidence in our search area; a high degree of confidence in the officials and the people and equipment we use to search the area.

CAMEROTA: But Commissioner, this meaning that if this is a piece of debris, you still have found off of the coast of Madagascar, but you still have a high confidence in your search area 2,300 miles away?

DOLAN: Correct. Because our modeling says that a drift of a piece of wreckage that far west is entirely consistent with the location of our search area.

CAMEROTA: So even if this is determined today to, in fact, be MH-370, you won't move your operations over to Madagascar?

DOLAN: No, because if it's confirmed to be from MH-370. We know that the wreckage could easily have drifted over a period of time we have to that search area. And all the information we have and analysis we have says the search area is where this aircraft will be found.

CAMEROTA: Last, Commissioner, what will you be doing today?

DOLAN: What I'll be doing today is waiting until I can get confirmation on the nature of this piece of debris. And I will be continuing to work with my team and the crews out on the water to search that area and will continue to search that area until we find the missing aircraft.

CAMEROTA: And you believe that that confirmation will come within the next 24 to 48 hours?

DOLAN: I'm hoping so, yes.

CAMEROTA: Commissioner Dolan, we know you have a busy day. Thanks so much for taking time for NEW DAY. It's great to get your updates.

We want to get analysis now, because we are joined by Mary Schiavo and David Gallo. Mary, of course, is a CNN transportation analyst and a former inspector general of the Department of Transportation. David is a special -- sorry, director of special projects at Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution. He led the effort to find remains of Air France Flight 447.

[06:10:09] Nice to see both of you this morning. Such an important day. Mary, tell us what your thoughts were when you heard that this piece of debris was found off the coast of Madagascar.

MARY SCHIAVO, CNN TRANSPORTATION ANALYST: Well, my initial thoughts were there were two of the missing -- missing Malaysian plane, but there was also another crash in the area back in 2009, but that was an Airbus.

So from the hearing of that piece of plane being found, I thought, well, at this point, it's kind of a 50/50 chance. And with the news yesterday that Boeing said it was consistent with the 777, that definitely was highly significant, because the 777 was such a unique airplane that, when it was first certified to fly back in 1995. It was completely redesigned from previous planes, and it was computer-designed. So that would be a unique part in the 777, being a unique plane. And there were only four crashes. So I was fairly -- fairly confident it might be that.

CAMEROTA: David, can you explain the location where this piece of debris was found and how peculiar or expected that is?

DAVID GALLO, DIRECTOR OF SPECIAL PROJECTS, WOODS HOLE OCEANOGRAPHIC INSTITUTION: Hi, Alisyn. It's very expected for something floating in the southernmost part of the Indian Ocean, especially off the west coast of Australia far enough out. Everything there circulates in a counterclockwise manner. And the distance is not that great, when you think that it's been in the water for 500 days.

So with the winds and the -- and the currents that are pushing it, it would have made it -- it could have made it there easily.

The question is, where exactly did it come from? And how much can it tell us about where "X" marks the spot where Malaysian Air 370 -- if it, in fact, is -- and I'm still reserving judgment -- if it is, in fact, a piece of MH-370. Where did it hit the -- impact the water?

CAMEROTA: If it does turn out to be from a 777, then are you still reserving judgment?

GALLO: No. Then OK. Then I think we have confirmation that it met its end in the Indian Ocean. But I understand the family's anguish completely, because it's been 500 days and worse, it's been 500 nights of not knowing where their loved ones are. And there have been so many stops and starts and reversals of opinions that I can't blame them for really having some question about whether this is real or not.

CAMEROTA: Absolutely. I mean, it's just the worst not knowing. It's such a mystery for them. And they have never been able to have any resolution whatsoever.

GALLO: And I'm hoping, you know, it's going to be -- it's going to be a long time still, if this is a piece of MH-370, a long time still before anyone actually finds the main body of the wreckage.

CAMEROTA: Mary, can you tell us about this piece and what this piece tells you about why this plane might have gone down? SCHIAVO: Well, it does give us some clues. It certainly doesn't

give us the clues that the families and everyone else wants and investigators always want as to what started the chain of events. Why did the plane end up in the water?

But it's a pretty large piece from other actions I've worked on. For example, if you remember the Germanwings crash and how small the pieces were there.

In this case, a couple things could have happened. The wing could have detached and then later, this flaperon piece, which is towards the wing closest to the body of the plane. And that detached later.

But this is a pretty big piece. And we can probably tell that the plane did not fall from, say, 35,000 feet straight into the water. Not a diving crash into the water, because the pieces would be much smaller. You wouldn't expect to find a piece this big.

And then also that it looks -- it appears that it was torn from its attach point or from its hinges. And that would suggest there were stresses put on that piece. And this piece is used to extend the wing area and give an aircraft more lift or to turn the plane so the plane could have been turning, or it could have been in a configuration trying to get more lift for whatever reason. Landing, you always put it down.

CAMEROTA: But I mean, the fact, David, that it is such a big piece, what does that tell us about what happened?

GALLO: Well, I think, you know, the -- it's in the hands now of the French equivalent of the NTSB, the BEA, and the Australian Transportation Safety Board.

And the BEA is excellent. And they will get every bit of evidence and every clue that they can out of that piece. So they might be able to tell if it was more a belly landing on the water or some sort of a plunge. Mary's right: I mean, having the contact points for that attachment to the plane, they'll be able to look at the strings inside those areas and the deformations and be able to say something, which is much the case in Air France 447. The pieces that were found floating had a little bit to say about how the plane actually hit the water.

CAMEROTA: Mary, we just spoke to the commissioner who is leading the search of the Australian equivalent of the NTSB. And they've been 2,300 miles away has been their search area. And he said he's still confident that that is the right search area. What do you think?

[06:15:11] SCHIAVO: Well, I think, given the piece, you know, where it was found, you know, if I was doing it, I would want to expand a few hypotheses and go back and look at the initial theories of if the plane made that initial turn in the last primary tracings and secondary radar, as well, from that plane, where precisely was it headed? And I would also want to enlist the aid of persons in Madagascar,

in addition to Reunion, and look for other pieces on the beaches in that area. If they can find just a few more pieces, that might help them triangulate better and get a better fix on some of the currents and where it came from.

So I guess at this point it would open my mind a little further to perhaps look at other theories and expand the area. But the most important parts they need right now are the black boxes. And those are still under, you know, thousands of feet of ocean.

CAMEROTA: Absolutely. It sounds as though the next 24 to 48 hours will be critical.

Mary, David, thanks so much for all of your expertise. Obviously, we'll have much more coverage of this throughout the course of NEW DAY and the morning.

Let's get over to John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Thanks, Alisyn.

And there is also new news concerning the crash of another Malaysian flight. MH-17 went down in Eastern Ukraine last July, killing all 298 people on board. Russia using its veto to block a U.N. resolution that would establish an international tribunal to prosecute those responsible. Russia has denied any involvement in shooting down that airliner, though there is speculation that Russian- backed separatists in the area were behind it.

PEREIRA: We will return to our breaking coverage of the possible MH-370 debris. But first, Donald Trump making his first overseas trip and cementing his standing at the Republican frontrunner. A new -- brand-new Quinnipiac University national poll showing that he is way ahead in the Republican presidential pack right now.

In the meantime, Mr. Trump also responding to the lawyer that we interviewed right here on NEW DAY, who says Mr. Trump called her disgusting during a deposition. Chief congressional correspondent Dana Bash sat down with Trump for his take on this and many other things. Quite a discussion you had.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Quite a discussion on a wide range of topics. Let's start there. He was watching your interview, Alisyn, and tweeted afterwards some things that he thought about it, as you can imagine, not all positive.

And he continued that conversation with me at the Trump Tower.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BASH: She said that you got up, shook your finger, screamed, "You're disgusting, you're disgusting," and ran out.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: OK. I watched that, and I thought it was disgraceful. She's a terrible attorney. She lost her case to me. In fact, I won legal fees. The judge awarded legal fees, which is pretty rare when you get that. But we beat her soundly. She's got a terrible reputation, in my opinion. She's got just a terrible reputation. Other lawyers have called me up to say how bad she is.

Bottom line, I would be her end. What happened is, in the middle of everything, it wasn't breast-feed. You used the word "breast- feed." It was breast pump. She wanted to pump in front of me during a deposition.

BASH: The way she described it was that she wanted to take a break so she could take the pump out.

TRUMP: Not true. In fact, my lawyer, who was there, he said, "I've never seen anything like it." She wanted to breast pump in front of me. And I may have said that's disgusting. I may have said something else. I thought it was terrible.

She's a horrible person, knows nothing about me. I see her, she's now the great expert on Donald Trump.

BASH: I guess the question isn't so much, you know, that she's an expert, but she does have an experience, which she clearly doesn't think was very...

TRUMP: Excuse me she lost. And that's what the country needs. The country needs somebody that's going to win. We always lose. We lose on trade. We lose to China, Japan, Mexico. We lose to everybody. Wouldn't it be nice if we could finally win something? I beat her so badly. She's a vicious, horrible person.

BASH: Because you're not a politician, you know, we don't have your voting record to go on. We don't have -- you know, we have your experience as a businessman, and part of your experience are legal issues.

TRUMP: Well, let me explain that. Let me explain.

BASH: Can I talk?

TRUMP: So many people are on television that don't know me, and they're like experts on me. You know, when Michael Jackson died, I knew him very well. And everybody was talking about Michael Jackson. They didn't know him. They knew nothing. Some of them never even met him. And I sort of laughed to myself. Here they are. They're talking about Michael Jackson, and they never met him. And that's happening with me.

BASH: But she -- I don't think anybody's saying she's an expert on Donald Trump.

TRUMP: She claims to be.

BASH: She's somebody who is -- who is recounting an experience she had. So my question for you is.

TRUMP: She lost.

BASH: My question for you is, people are looking at that. They're thinking, OK, if he blows up at a lawyer in a deposition...

TRUMP: I didn't blow up. I didn't blow up.

BASH: ... negotiating, what would he do -- what would you do you if Vladimir Putin challenged you?

[06:20:04] TRUMP: Excuse me. Believe me, he'd be -- I'd do very well with him. I get along with people. I didn't blow up at a deposition. I don't blow up. I'm a person who...

BASH: So that didn't happen? She's wrong, that didn't happen?

TRUMP: She made it up. She made it up.

BASH: One other thing I want to ask you that was in "The New York Times" this morning.

They went through some of your depositions. Quoted you under oath saying, "I'm no different from a politician running for office. You always want to put the best foot forward," saying that you exaggerate.

TRUMP: Well, I do want to put the best. You can call it exaggeration. Of course I want to put the best foot forward. I'm not going to say, "Oh, gee, everything is terrible." I'm a very optimistic person. I'm optimistic for the country. Of course I want to put the best foot forward.

BASH: Do you exaggerate?

TRUMP: Everybody exaggerates. I mean, I guess I do a little bit. I want to say good things.

OK. So I have space, let's say it's for rent. Somebody walks in. Am I supposed to say, "Oh, this space is no good. Don't take it, it's terrible?" Or am I supposed to say, "This is beautiful space. Don't you love it? Isn't it wonderful? Look at the view."

BASH: Will you exaggerate in the White House?

TRUMP: I will -- the word -- I don't think the word "exaggerate" is a good word. I want to put a positive spin on things. I want to put a positive spin on the United States if I'm president, because we have a country that's not respected. We're very down. The United States is very down. We don't have good news anymore. We don't have victories anymore.

So I would certainly want to promote the United States as a great place. People are laughing at us all over the world. They think we're stupid. And we are. I mean, we're being led by stupid people. We're being led by people that don't have a clue. They're incompetent. BASH: One other question about that quote. You said, "I'm no

different from a politician running for office." Have you considered yourself a politician? Because you're out there saying that you're not.

TRUMP: I became a politician a few months ago when I decided -- I never did this...

BASH: This is several years ago.

TRUMP: Yes. But politicians running for office try and put a positive spin on it. I mean, I think that's OK. I mean, what are they going to do, put a negative spin? I think they try and put a positive spin. A politician is a person that, generally speaking, should be uplifting.

BASH: Are you a politician now?

TRUMP: Well, now I'm a politician, but I'm not acting like a politician, because I tell the truth.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BERMAN: He exaggerates. "I exaggerate. That's what I do."

PEREIRA: He doesn't say that.

BASH: That happens in all your interviews with politicians. They say, "I exaggerate, so what?" Yes.

CAMEROTA: There's nothing in his interview that you just did that's happened with normal politicians.

BASH: And guess what is also happening right now? He's in Scotland at his golf course, because they're hosting the women's golf tournament. So he's off the campaign trail for a couple of days doing that. Again, not something that anybody else who I've covered running for president does.

CAMEROTA: Just for the record, she says that -- by the way, Elizabeth Beck is the woman to whom he was referring, she says she did not want to breast pump in front of Donald Trump. She had a room specially designated.

PEREIRA: No woman wants to breast pump in front of...

CAMEROTA: It was time to go there and she made that clear. So there's a...

PEREIRA: We're going to have more from this interview, Dana. Thank you so much for that. We're going to talk more about what he had to say, break it down.

Also the new poll, we're going to break down. What do the numbers mean for next week's GOP debate? Who is going to end up on stage? And also, we're going to have much more on our continuing

coverage in search for Malaysian Airlines Flight 370.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:25:37] BERMAN: All right. You hear the political music there, but we are following breaking news this morning. The discovery of a possible piece of debris, plane debris on an island in the Indian Ocean, Reunion Island off the coast of Madagascar. Officials investigating whether it belongs to missing Malaysia Flight 370. Is it connected?

Before we get to that, first, a brand-new poll out this morning that shows Donald Trump not just in front but kind of pretty far in front of the rest of the pack, at 20 percent. This is a Quinnipiac poll, a respected unit. Governor Scott Walker of Wisconsin behind him at 13 percent. Jeb Bush back at 10.

CAMEROTA: All right. Let's talk about all this. Back with us is CNN's chief congressional correspondent, Dana Bash. And CNN's digital politics correspondent Chris Moody. Great to have both of you.

Let's start with that Quinnipiac poll, because once again we see Donald Trump out front, as we did in the Monmouth poll, by a wide margin. He is two times where Jeb Bush is and ahead of Scott Walker, his closest opponent. What do you think, Dana?

BASH: Look, it's amazing. And I think if we didn't have polls in the first states where they're actually going to the polls to vote, in Iowa and New Hampshire, that are similar to this, you would say, you know what? That's a popularity contest. Of course, he's the guy from "The Apprentice." Everybody knows him. That's what it's about, because it's a national poll.

But it's not, because he is doing well in the early states also. Look, I think it's terrifying for Jeb Bush because for him, spending all of the past six months raising $100 million for his super PAC is like chump change compared to what Donald Trump can do when he writes a check.

BERMAN: And part of Jeb's appeal, the Bush people don't want to admit it, is he wants to be the prohibitive frontrunner. He wants to be the establishment guy out in front. I think they were expected to be out in front.

Chris Moody, let me bring you in here. This is going to be a tough poll for you, because he's much closer to the pack right now than he is to Donald Trump.

CHRIS MOODY, CNN DIGITAL POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: At first glance, the poll looks great for Donald Trump. He's at about 20 percent among Republican voters, which you dive into the numbers, and it doesn't look so good in the long-term for him.

Yes, he's at 20 percent. But also, 30 percent of Republicans polled said they would never vote for Donald Trump. Further, if you put Donald Trump against Hillary Clinton, he loses. If you put Donald Trump against Joe Biden, he loses. And against Bernie Sanders, Donald Trump loses. While the other folks in the poll, like Jeb Bush or Scott Walker, come much closer.

So if you are a Republican looking at this poll, you are really -- or you're a Republican looking to win the general, you're really hoping Donald Trump does not win that primary, because he doesn't -- according to this poll, doesn't really have much of a chance against any of the Democratic contenders.

CAMEROTA: That's an important perspective, Chris. Thanks.

Let's pull up the -- what you are talking about in terms of putting Trump against Hillary Clinton. Here are the numbers in this latest Quinnipiac poll. Hillary Clinton gets 48 percent of the vote. Donald Trump gets 36 percent.

BERMAN: And contrast, by the way, that with Clinton and Bush. I mean, Jeb Bush right now leading Hillary Clinton, 42 to 41.

BASH: That's right. I mean, look, there's a reason why every Democrat who comes on TV is cheering Donald Trump. Because of those numbers. They know that the best news in the world has been -- for them has been Donald Trump doing well.

But I think Chris also makes a point that, according to this poll, not just this poll but other polls, Trump does appear to have a ceiling. I mean, because you have -- it's such a splintered field, I mean, 20 percent is so out front because you have 16 people who you are polling. When you go down the road with fewer people, people start to -- candidates start to drop out, 20 percent is not going to look that good. And if he can't crack -- if there are 30 percent of the people saying they are never going to -- they'll never vote for him, it's not going to be so easy.

CAMEROTA: Chris, let's look at the debate, which is one week from now. And let's look at the poll of polls, because this will tell us who is likely going to be in the debate. And the top nine slots seem to be a lock because obviously, they've crunched all of the latest polls together to see who's leading. So on the top tier, you see the nine people who will be...

BERMAN: The tiny little faces.

CAMEROTA: ... will be in the debate. And then the tenth slot is still up for grabs. And you can see all of the different contenders: Kasich, Perry, Santorum. And then that's what this stage will look like if you look at your screen right now. And the tenth is still a question mark.

What do you think, Chris, for who will be in that slot?

MOODY: Well, no matter what Republican establishment folks do, Donald Trump is going to be on that debate stage, and they're going to have to find a way to deal with him. But I think the more interesting story right now is that tenth

slot.

Also something very interesting. If you look at Chris Christie, he's rounding out the bottom, barely hanging on. He was...