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South Carolina to Remove Confederate Flag from Capitol Grounds; New Al Qaeda Chief Calls for Attacks on U.S.; Interview with Congressman Ed Royce. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired July 10, 2015 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[09:00:21] ANA CABRERA, CNN ANCHOR: Right now the eyes of the world are on Columbia, South Carolina. At this hour a history-making moment. The Confederate flag that has flown on these grounds of the state capitol there more than half a century is coming down.

Good morning and thank you for joining us on this Friday. I'm Ana Cabrera in for Carol Costello. Today is a huge day. In just minutes the ceremony to lower the Confederate flag from capitol grounds for the final time will get underway. Now the landmark decision comes after weeks of explosive debate following the church massacre in Charleston that killed nine people. And just yesterday Governor Nikki Haley signed the law to remove the flag where she used a set of pens, including nine for each of the victims.

Here's what we expect to happen. Lawmakers will make their way down capital steps and head to the flag pole. At around 10:00 Eastern Time this flag will be taken down by the head of the Department of Public Safety. And he will then transfer it to the state's Confederate Relic Room and Military Museum.

Now all this as the NAACP announces its plans to drop a 15-year economic boycott against South Carolina.

Let's begin our coverage with CNN's Don Lemon. He is on the ground in Columbia, South Carolina, where that ceremony is about to take place.

Good morning, Don.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to you, Ana and to our viewers. Where were you on Friday, July 10th, 2015? Watching CNN's coverage of the flag coming down in South Carolina, a flag of hate for many in this country that represents hate? To some they say it represents southern pride, but to others it represents hate.

I'm standing here in front of the statehouse, on the statehouse grounds. The flag right behind me. People are starting to gather here. There are people in front of me that you can't see. There are children who are here with their families. They are in picnic chairs, they're in lawn chairs. They're standing here right in front of the statehouse. And they're about to block off the street here in front of the statehouse in just moments.

And there are hundreds of people who are standing on the statehouse grounds right near the Confederate flag -- or the battle flag as they call it here in South Carolina and in the south. And as a son of the south, I want to introduce another son of the south, Bakari Sellers. He's a CNN contributor and also a former state representative here in South Carolina.

What a day.

BAKARI SELLERS (D), FORMER SOUTH CAROLINA STATE REPRESENTATIVE: It's an amazing day. Like I told you earlier, I never thought that I'd be standing here before you, with Don Lemon in front of the world on this joyous day of history. I spoke to my father this morning and we just had a deep sigh. We shed a tear. That flag went up when he was 16 years old, still in high school, (INAUDIBLE) his high school, about an hour away.

And the struggles and the sacrifices that so many heroes and sheroes made in this country so that I could stand here before you today, that movement continues, that journey continues, and this is a civil rights victory for us all.

LEMON: All eyes will be on, of course, South Carolina and this flag, but also Nikki Haley. Really making -- in my estimation making the right decision. That this flag should come down. Nikki Haley being on the right side of history. She has faced a lot of opposition here.

SELLERS: Well, there are only two pages in the history books. There's a right side and a wrong side. And Governor Haley is a friend of mine. We're both from Bamberg County, we're both from a very, very small county here in the state. We grew up where the schools weren't -- the facility weren't the best but people had great hearts.

LEMON: Yes.

SELLERS: And she made a decision that may not win her cool points with her Republican base, but she made a decision that's in the best interest of the state of South Carolina and move it forward so I have to applaud her courage.

LEMON: But not every Republican. There are Republicans who feel that this flag should come down.

SELLERS: Well, there are. You know, what you saw was bipartisan support in both chambers. There were only three people to vote against it in the Senate. There were about 20 in the House. I think we were an example for the rest of the world. I mean, Democrats and Republicans came together, big city, small city, black and white, it didn't matter. We literally came together for this one thing. And my challenge, and what I'd tell you is, if we can do this together, imagine what we can do next.

LEMON: Yes. And it's going to be a short ceremony. I mean, it's not going to be very long. She's not expected to make any sort of remarks. She made her remarks yesterday where she said that a whole lot of people, generations of people will be looking at South Carolina differently, more positively in the years to come.

Bakari Sellers will be here with me as we continue on with the ceremony. Expect it to start at 10:00 a.m.

Lawmakers, I should tell you, Ana, who want to participate will come down about 9:45, about 15 minutes before. That's Eastern Time. And gather on the steps, come down those steps, if they want to participate in this. But again, a short ceremony, but it is expected to be moving nonetheless.

CABRERA: And it looks like a lot of people out there from the public who want to see this historic moment firsthand.

Don Lemon, Bakari Sellers, thanks to both of you. We'll check back in with you at the bottom of the hour.

[09:05:01] And while today is historic for South Carolina, it's also a somber day as we remember the tragic event that brought us to this point. It was after that brutal church shooting that many started calling for the flag to come down. Now earlier today Governor Nikki Haley said today is a tribute to those victims. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. NIKKI HALEY (R), SOUTH CAROLINA: The statehouse is -- that's an area that belongs to everyone and no one should ever drive by the statehouse and feel pain. No one should ever drive by the statehouse and feel like they don't belong. And so I think this is a hopeful day for South Carolina. I think it's a day that we can all say that we have come together as a state. I think you can look at the way South Carolina responded to this tragedy and I think we can all say that hopefully the Emanuel Nine are looking down and feeling proud today.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CABRERA: Let's talk more about this historic moment with CNN political commentator Van Jones joining us from San Diego this morning.

Thanks so much, Van, for joining us. I know this is a huge moment, not just for South Carolina, but really for the entire nation. And you have fought for civil rights for a long time yourself. What's going through your mind right now?

VAN JONES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, it's an emotional moment, I think, for a lot of people. I grew up in the south. I'm a ninth generation American. Ninth generation. I'm the first person in my family that was born with all my rights recognized and respected. I was born in '68. I think people don't understand how recent this segregationist past is. My parents were born under segregation, they were married under segregation. I have cousins that were born on segregation.

So this flag -- I understand as a southerner why people feel that our region is not respected. Why people want to have regional pride. There's a sense that people on the coast and from the north look down on us. That is true. We need to have regional pride. But this flag can no longer be that symbol. It has become increasingly associated with more and more hateful elements. It's become increasingly associated even overseas, in Europe where they're not allowed to fly the swastika. They now fly that so-called Confederate battle flag.

And it's not just an issue of race. What about patriotism? This is a flag of rebellion, of treason against the United States of America. This is about dividing the United States. And so there's really no reason to give a flag like that such a prominent place. Of course you don't take it from the history books. Of course you put it in a museum. Of course we recognize -- as a private citizen you want to fry it, that's fine.

But why should a state building fly the flag of rebels and traitors and people who stood for both slavery and unfortunately increasingly racial hatred? And so for me, as a southerner, but as an American, it's time for us to put that flag in the museum where it belongs.

CABRERA: What's so interesting is this really could just be the beginning of a huge movement. We'll have to wait and see. But other states like Georgia and Mississippi they have elements of the Confederate flag in their state flags, not just a flag that's flying on state ground, but it is part of really what represents their state. So what do you think should happen in those other places?

JONES: you know, this is an important conversation. I think it's actually symbolic and it's actually almost appropriate that you do have this interweaving of this really, really horrible past. You know, most Americans don't look at this part of our past because it's just so painful. And you say, jeez, I wish we could just move on. Why do we even have to talk about this? But then you look at the state flags of states of our union and the history is right there in your face. We have to deal with this. I think it is important to revisit this.

Now listen, when you start pulling on symbols, you also start invoking -- you start hitting on substance. And so I think it's important that we -- if we're going to move these flags, change these flag, do it in a respectful way. But it's time we have the conversation.

CABRERA: All right. Van Jones, good to see you this morning. We will be coming back to speak with you as we continue our coverage of the flag's removal. We also are following other news this morning.

Still to come, al Qaeda's new leader now calling for terror attacks on the U.S., making a public call for this. Why experts are taking the threat seriously.

[09:09:20]

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CABRERA: New terror threats against America by one of the most dangerous branches of al Qaeda. The new leader of the group's branch in the Arabian Peninsula or AQAP has released a message calling for attacks on the U.S. Now he is the group's former military chief and he moved into this lead role after an airstrike in June that killed AQAP's former leader.

We get more now from chief national security correspondent Jim Sciutto joining us in Washington.

Jim, just how serious of a threat is this?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: It's real. It's serious. You know, the current focus, and we hear this a lot, has been on ISIS and that is very real as well. But there's a difference here. While ISIS is most likely to be able to carry out an attack on the U.S. homeland because radicalizing lone wolves here via the Internet, it's just easy and it's hard to track. But those tend to be less ambitious plots.

AQAP is different. This is a group that has tremendous capability. Their bomb maker is famous around the world, for instance, for shrinking bombs, making them very easily concealed in electronics, getting on airplanes. That kind of thing. So when I speak to counterterrorism officials they say that while the chances of a lone wolf attack are the highest, they really worry about AQAP because that's the kind of attack that would be more ambitious, more spectacular and as a result more deadly.

CABRERA: And now this new leader who has all that military background apparently, does it mean that the terrorist group's strategy might be changing against the U.S. in some way?

SCIUTTO: Not changing, but I think reiterating that threat. That the U.S. is in their -- is in their targets. And I think some of this, Ana, as well is a bit of competition because ISIS has soaked up a lot of oxygen as it were in the Jihadi world.

[09:15:06] It is the hot terror group. It attracts not just foreign fighters but it's also attracting some AQAP fighters. We've seen that in Yemen where some fighters fleeing or leaving rather ISIS to -- or AQAP to join ISIS. And, you know, these groups thrive on relevance and in being in people's attention. And they do that by carrying out attacks.

So, I think here you have this new leader after the other was killed in the U.S. drone strike last month, saying, hey, we're still here, we're still a threat, join us, attack America. You know, that's their message and it is somewhat competitive with ISIS.

CABRERA: All right. Thanks. Jim Sciutto, joining us from Washington.

And still to come, with nuclear negotiations with Iran expected to go well into the weekend, how close are we to a deal? The chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Committee, Ed Royce, weighs in.

And we're just moments away from history. The Confederate flag coming down from in front of the South Carolina capital. We will bring that to you live.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:20:16] CABRERA: Talks on Iran's nuclear program will now probably go through the weekend, blowing through a third deadline. This is the word from Iran's foreign minister who you see there on the balcony in Vienna. And when reporters asked him if they would still be there on Monday, he yelled back, "I hope not".

Now, Secretary of State John Kerry also talking about their negotiations this morning and I want to read you his tweet. He says, "Working diligently to see if an agreement is possible."

Let's talk more about this. Joining me now to talk about the Iran's nuclear negotiations right now -- this is Ed Royce. He is congressman and chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Committee.

Thank you so much for being with us, Congressman.

REP. ED ROYCE (R), CALIFORNIA: Thank you, Ana.

CABRERA: So, as we mentioned, the deadline has been extended twice now. Some might argue this is a sign the administration is standing firm on its pledge not to accept a bad deal.

Do you see this additional delay as a good or bad sign?

ROYCE: Well, the key point here is not the delay. The key point is holding to the position that we're able to inspect those military bases and really have international inspectors have the ability to go anywhere any time. And that's one of the big differences of opinion with the ayatollah saying no. No access to where they've done the testing in the past. This is a big point of contention.

And the other big point is that the Iranians are demanding the lifting of all sanctions up front while simultaneously now rearming Hezbollah and Hamas with new missiles. And this has created a bit of consternation as well.

CABRERA: I know, yesterday you issued the statement that reads in part, "We don't know the details of the final agreement, but we do know its essence, permanent sanctions from the U.S. in return for temporary constraints on Iran's nuclear program. How is that a good deal?"

Well, supporters may argue it's better than nothing. Does it have to be all or nothing? What do you think?

ROYCE: Well, no. But, remember, this was originally supposed to be multiple decades, 20-plus years. So, the Iranians, of course, want it to only be ten years.

Congress sent a letter signed by 367 members. The majority of the Democrats, almost all of the Republicans in the House, that's 84 percent of the House saying, let's have this be a 20-year, you know, time period or more. Let's make certain that the inspectors can go anywhere any time. Let's not lift all the sanctions up front so we've got leverage in the deal and let's get the questions of the international inspectors answered on the test work, bomb work that was already done.

So, that's the position of the Congress has taken in this. CABRERA: So, at this point now that we've passed the Thursday

deadline if Congress were to have 30 days to review a potential deal. Now, you'll have 60 days if there is a deal made at all.

What exactly will you be looking for? Is there a deal that you would consider satisfactory, understanding there may have to be some compromises?

ROYCE: Yes, there is. But we don't want to make the same mistake we made with the 1994 North Korea framework agreement where we did not have the ability for inspectors to go anywhere any time and talk to the scientists on the North Korean side, because the result of that was that North Korea got the bomb.

Also, in Congress, we're a little more aware that we're dealing with people like Zarif here who in the past laid the wreath at the grave site of the terrorists who bombed our embassy and killed those marines in Saudi Arabia, at the Kobar Towers, and in Lebanon, that carried out those attacks.

And so, as a consequence of -- you know, the full understanding of what we're dealing with here, we want to make certain we have verification in this agreement.

CABRERA: The director of the Arms Control Association disagrees with you, saying it's unnecessary and really unrealistic to go anywhere anytime, and that Iran has some legitimate concerns about having some privacy for its own military secrets. What's your response to that?

ROYCE: Well, remember, the problem is that Iran did their testing at military sites, deep into a mountain. And so, if we do not have the ability to go onto the very military sites like Parchin, where they did the testing and where we now know there's a thousand pages of documents which the IAEA does have that shows the testing that they did do, if we can't follow up on, that then they could cheat on the agreement in the same way the North Koreans cheated on the agreement.

So, in that situation, the agreement would be worth no more than what it's written on.

[09:25:01] And that's -- that's why it's so important we have this ability to go into these sites for the international inspectors, from our perspectives.

CABRERA: Secretary Kerry has said they will walk away at some point if there's not some kind of compromise, if there's not progress being made. When is it time to walk away and then what?

ROYCE: I think we should try to get an agreement, but we should be clear-eyed.

For example, today is Quds in Iran, and so, out on the streets in Iran, you'll be following this story later today, there are millions of Iranians chanting, "down with America, death to Israel" in celebrating a holiday called by the ayatollah some years ago, calling for the destruction of Israel, calling for, you know, the overthrow, you know, of the United States. And when they say "death to the great Satan, death to the little Satan" as they're saying on the streets, remember this is the official position of a regime that wants ICBMs and we suspect wants nuclear weapons for a reason.

And so, this is why its' important we get an intrusive inspections regime in place where we can actually verify what they are or are not doing in terms of their testing.

CABRERA: I hope a deal does come to fruition. Congressman Ed Royce, thank you so much for your time today. Good luck as we move forward on this important issue.

ROYCE: Thank you.

CABRERA: And still to come, a historic moment. For 54 years, the Confederate flag has flown on the grounds of the South Carolina state capitol. But in just a few minutes, a ceremony will begin to remove this banner, the battle flag from the pole. We'll have live coverage with Don Lemon in South Carolina right after a break. Stay with us.

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