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Two Prisoners Break Out of Maximum Security Prison in New York; President Attends G-7 Summit; ISIS Driven Out of Iraqi City; Chaotic Scene Raises Questions About Excessive Force. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired June 8, 2015 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[08:00:00] POLO SANDOVAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: -- this maximum security prison are going about their lives, but as for authorities at this hour, we know that they are scrambling to answer two key questions. Where are these guys? And how were they able to pull off this prison escape?

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MAJOR CHARLES GUESS, NEW YORK STATE POLICE, TROOP B COMMANDER: We're leave nothing stone unturned. They could be literally anywhere.

SANDOVAL: Two convicted murderers escaping this maximum security prison for the first time in its 170-year history has hundreds of law enforcement officers scouring upstate New York this morning.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: These are dangerous people.

SANDOVAL: The massive manhunt is on for 35 year-old David Sweat who was sentenced to life for no parole for a 2002 killing of a sheriff deputy, and 49-year-old Richard Matt who was spending 25 to life for beating a man to death and dismembering him in 1997.

GOV. ANDREW CUOMO, (D) NEW YORK: When you look how it was done, it was extraordinary.

SANDOVAL: New York's governor Andrew Cuomo taking a tour of their elaborate and almost unbelievable escape route discovered around 5:30 Saturday morning. After stuffing makeshift dummies into their beds so the guards thought they were sleeping, the inmates somehow obtained power tools to cut this hole in the back of their cell. Cutting through solid steel, they exited onto a cat walk. From the cat walk they had to shimmy down into a tunnel below. Once there, they had to breakthrough a 24-inch brick wall, then cut through a 24-inch steel vertical pipe, which they then shimmed into continuing for a significant distance until cutting another hole, making their way into the city sewer.

Then when they reached a manhole they had to cut through a steel lock and chain, finally disappearing into the neighborhood about a block away from the prison, but not before leaving this racially offensive drawing for prison officials on a post-it reading "Have a nice day."

LISA VAN SUSTEREN, FORENSIC PSYCHIATRIST: It's clear that they had help. There's no way. Power tools don't just materialize inside prison cells. This has been being planned for a long time.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANDOVAL: Back live here on the rainy streets of Kenmore, New York, we know that authorities have received several leads, at least 150 leads to be exact. That is from investigators. However, Governor Cuomo adding that really none of them have been strong enough to lead authorities in any specific direction, Chris. So at this point the reality here is that there is very real concern that these two individuals may have even left the country with the Canadian border about 25 to 30 miles from here, Chris.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Polo, the reporting is great. They have to be scrambling right now. So let's discuss exactly what they're dealing with. Thank you, Polo.

Richard Matt, that's one guy, David Sweat, we'll keep showing their pictures just in case, because they are bad men. They are convicted killers. They are on the loose. They broke out of a super max prison with an obvious plan. So the question is, what else do they have planned? And as you heard, they could be at the border, across the border in Canada. It's very close there. So how did this happen and what do you do now? We have Jonathan Gilliam. He's a former FBI special agent, U.S. Air Marshal, and Navy Seal. That's some combination of talents. You're exactly the man for the job. So let's start at the beginning.

JONATHAN GILLIAM, FORMER U.S. AIR MARSHAL: OK.

CUOMO: They say this is the only time that anyone broke out of this super max. It's the only super max they have in New York state. How does this size up in terms of these guys knew what they were doing, in your experience?

GILLIAM: I know a lot of people that work for the prison system, and there are as professional as you can get. I do think, though, that this appears to me there had to be some type of inside help. Definitely, and this is what worries me, it looks, from my perspective, as though they may have had some outside help.

And why that really worries me is if I took your job away from CNN and I took all your money away from you, where are you probably going to go? Probably back to the last place that you came from, which is home or somebody that you were dating or married to. But if you have inside help, that makes it even harder to track, because now you have support. And once support is secreted into this whole situation, the sky is the limit where they go.

CUOMO: And the reason that you're taking us down the road is a combination of factors. One, sophistication of tools, right, which though wouldn't have anyway, and they're probably battery because they're not getting a cord, so they needed a way to charge them. They knew how to use the tools. Those are clean cuts, and they probably weren't learning that in shop. Then they also knew how to do it and not get detected in the cell. And they knew how to follow what I understand to be a labyrinth of steam pipes that could just as easily keep you going in circles all night as getting you out, and then they vanished.

GILLIAM: You see, the combination of all those things is very worrisome for me because that spells help. I just don't think -- listen, could they have gotten tools somehow from the inside to cut through a wall.

CUOMO: They were doing construction in the prison.

GILLIAM: Sure. Could they have gotten that? Could they have gotten into a pipe somehow? Possibly. But when you put the combination of all the things coming together and how perfectly they worked, it just spells to me help. And I would be taking a close not only at the guard but at who is doing that construction, because we found with certain organized crime groups, you know, they're really good at going -- they want to rob a bank, and doing some construction in the building next and actually come in through the wall or down from the ceiling. So this looks to me like they could have possibilities of a construction crew actually being involved.

[08:05:08] CUOMO: And they're definitely scrambling. We had the governor on earlier, obviously, my brother. And this is what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. ANDREW CUOMO, (D) NEW YORK: It was really unbelievable. If it wasn't -- it was a movie plot you would say it was overdone. There's no doubt in my opinion that they needed equipment that they wouldn't have had, and they had to have the assistance of someone.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: And how did they even cut through the wall in the cell without being heard?

GILLIAM: That's the other thing. There are certain tools there that have been left there, but I would really suggest that law enforcement is looking to see if other tools were used. Was there a plasma cutter? Was there something that may have been snuck in that they could use?

The thing is we can talk about how they got out all day long. And I think that's where investigation is going to have to go. I think one thing is important that you can reach is the public right now. You know, if you have family members that live there, I would call them and see if they're home, because if these guys got in and, heaven forbid, murdered somebody and took their car, you're not going to for a long time until you communicate with these people. I think it is important for the public to reach out as law enforcement moves forward.

The good thing is it's a wooded area. If they didn't have help and they get stuck in there, maybe they'll be there and we'll able to track them. But again, I just think they probably had outside help.

CUOMO: If they planned this much to get out of prison it seems common sense they would have planned to do something once they did get out. One man who didn't alert the authorities at the time later said "I think I saw the two guys," and he did match description with them in his backyard, which would show a little bit of an unsophisticated level of the plan. But the types of men, one of these guys killed his boss, chopped him up afterwards. And the other guy killed a cop. So these are the worst of the worst.

GILLIAM: That is where I'm looking. You're looking at people who dismember or somebody who kills a cop, that's basically as bad as it gets right there. And so, you know, I don't know if they split up. I think it would be better for the public if they did. It would be better for them if they actually stayed together, because I come from a team environment and I think they would go further. But probably most likely if they have support I would say they're probably going to split up at some point in time.

CUOMO: Now, let's say that this is the timing that they know so far is accurate. They were there for bed check at 5:30 or so that night, Friday night, gone the next morning. This period without hearing from them, what does it indicate to you?

GILLIAM: Again, they knew when to leave.

CUOMO: I'm saying for them to make it this long already. Usually you catch these guys pretty fast.

GILLIAM: And here, again, I keep going back to the same point. If they have help, that period of time is just going to -- it's going to lengthen their ability to get whenever the support group gave them the ability to go. If they're on their own, they have to go private, because in order to support themselves, if they don't have help, they don't have money. They are going to commit crimes to keep it going. If they have support it is less crime and it's easier to hide.

So that eight-hour period is really not going to be as big deal if they have help. But it could set the parameters of how far they would go if they did not have help, because that's where you start looking. Has there been carjackings, has there been robberies, has there been clothes stolen off of a clothesline? Even the stuff you see from the movies, that's the way the individuals work if they're on the run alone.

CUOMO: We've not seen anything like this in a long time. Mr. Gilliam, thank you very much. Appreciate it. Alisyn?

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: OK, Chris, President Obama and world leaders wrapping up the G-7 summit talking terrorism and what can be done to stop groups like ISIS. Iraq's prime minister has met with the president and other G-7 leaders. He's seeking more help to turn back the surging ISIS fighters. CNN senior White House correspondent Jim Acosta joins us now from Austria. What a great backdrop. Tell us what is going on there.

JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely. It's pretty spectacular here, but they don't have time for distractions at this G-7 summit, Alisyn. And President Obama's most critical meeting of the day is with the leader who isn't part of the G-7, Iraqi Prime Minister Haider al Abadi. He wrapped up some face-to-face chats with some of the world's most powerful leaders earlier this morning. Abadi is here, as you said, in the Alps to seek more military assistance for the battle against ISIS.

And I'm told by administration officials don't expect any big announcements on the front. But the president has a diplomatic goal in mind for the meeting with Abadi, and that is to ease some of the tensions with the prime minister after the defense secretary of the United States, Ash Carter, told CNN he questioned the Iraqi's will to fight. Administration officials know that comment deeply upset the Iraqis.

But there's more than Iraq on the agenda here. The president hopes to leave this G-7 summit with the G-7 leaders showing unity when it comes to maintaining sanctions on Russia for its actions in Ukraine. He's lined up support from the summit's host, German Chancellor Angela Merkel, the British prime minister, David Cameron, and the French president Francois Hollande.

But just to get back to the Iraqi prime minister, guys, you need to take a look at some video we got earlier this morning from the G-7 summit. It really highlights just how delicate the optics can be of the gatherings.

[08:10:05] In this video you can see the president can see the president deeply engrossed in a conversation with one of the other leaders gathered here. And you see the Iraqi prime minister Haider al Abadi sitting behind him in the hopes of having a quick conversation with the president. And President Obama doesn't even really recognize Haider al Abadi is there. It's sort of an awkward moment. We should point out, though, they did shake hands earlier today and they will have that more formal bilateral meeting on the sidelines of the summit within the next hour. And the president will talk about that in a news conference later on this morning. Michaela?

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: Yes, and the media will have a field day with the image, of course. It's very interesting to see that, Jim.

ACOSTA: I think so.

PEREIRA: Thanks so much for that.

ISIS meanwhile forced to flee Baiji in Iraq after the U.S. helps Iraqi forces reclaim that key refinery town. The terrorists fleeing for Mosul while still under attack by air. CNN's Jomana Karadsheh is live in Amman, Jordan, with the latest for us. Jomana?

JOMANA KARADSHEH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Michaela, according to Iraqi officials, both from the military and also the Shia militias who have been the main fighting force on the ground, on Sunday they announced that they have managed regain the control of most the city of Baiji. They say that they have taken control of the city center, the main government complex there, and the mosque. And according to officials, they say this happened with the support

of U.S. and coalition air strikes that we have seen taking part for months in that Baiji area. They say that what remains are pockets of resistance and that they have managed to push back ISIS fighters north wards toward Mosul, and now they have clearing operations left.

But all eyes now are on the Baiji refinery. It is not clear what the situation is there. It has been an intense battle for that key piece of infrastructure, and in recent weeks we saw ISIS gain control of the majority of that complex after it had changed hands several times over the past year.

And, of course, this is of great strategic importance for ISIS as well as symbolically important for the group. We have seen them dedicate a lot of resources and fighters to maintain control of Iraq's largest oil refinery, although it hasn't been functioning for months. While Iraqis are describing this as a victory, lots of challenges remain, including their ability to hold grounds they have regained. Chris?

CUOMO: Oil matters, strategy matters here. What matters most is the people who live there are finally going hopefully get some humanitarian relief, because ISIS kills more Muslims in that city than they've been killing certainly of the people trying to take them out.

All right, we also want to tell you that 1,200 refugees were rescued this weekend in the Mediterranean by the British Royal Navy. Now, this is just the latest of 6,000 migrants who have been saved while fleeing the violence in Libya. And that's this weekend alone. Thousands more are still waiting for help. We have CNN senior correspondent Nic Robertson, and he's live in Italy with the latest. Nic?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Chris. This is right where the HMS Lulworth is going to dock. On board we're told there are Syrians, Egyptians, there are Libyans, people from Mali in North Africa, Nigeria, people even from as far away as Pakistan, 10 pregnant women, a lot of children are on board.

Preparations are just getting underway. If we just take a look around here you can see the Red Cross here. They are going to be the ones, if you will, who get to help these migrants. First of all when they get off the boat, they come off, the Red Cross will give them medical checks. After the Red Cross have done that they'll hand them over to the immigration authorities here, and then they'll go to emigration centers.

Of course, the concern is the massive influx this week and this huge wave, the biggest this year so far in a two-day period. And what we're seeing and what aid agencies here, the Italian coast guard is telling us here is that so far this year close to 100,000 migrants have tried to get across the Mediterranean Sea here. Hundreds have died, and this is a significant increase here. By this time last year, it was only about 50,000 so far. So the concern here, you've got the British Navy, you've got the Italian, Spanish, Swedish, Irish, German navies all working the big issue here right now. Alisyn? CAMEROTA: Absolutely, for all those desperate people. Nic, thanks so much for that background.

Well, a chemical fire in Pennsylvania now under control, but still no word what caused the explosion that started the blaze. This happened in West Elizabeth, that's about 30 minutes south of Pittsburgh. Surrounding communities placed on a brief lock down because of fears that that air was contaminated. Officials say no one was hurt.

PEREIRA: A dip in the ocean in Cocoa Beach, Florida, nearly turned deadly for a 10-year-old boy. A bull shark bit him as he waded into waist-deep water with his mom. Lifeguards carried the boy to shore and provided emergency care for severe bite wounds to his calf. They wrapped it tightly, as you can see. He was airlifted to a trauma center in Orlando because of the severity of those bites.

[08:15:03] The victim's condition has not been released. Apparently he handled it bravely. There was emergency help there right away, likely saved him from being much worst.

CUOMO: Bull sharks are the worst.

CAMEROTA: They are?

PEREIRA: They're aggressive.

CUOMO: They can be in salt or fresh water. They go in the rivers. And they are incredibly aggressive.

CAMEROTA: Gosh, that's terrible.

CUOMO: Are you one of those you won't go in the water because you believe they're to get us, or are you want of those live and let live?

PEREIRA: I give them -- I give them space, obviously. I get a little wigged out even just snorkeling. I'm not sure what is going to be down there. But no, go in the water.

CUOMO: You trust them?

CAMEROTA: I go in but I worry the whole time I'm in there.

CUOMO: I have a great white shark that follows me on Twitter.

CAMEROTA: Is that right?

CUOMO: Catherine the shark.

CAMEROTA: Yes?

CUOMO: And I think she's baiting me for a meeting.

CAMEROTA: Baiting you?

CUOMO: She keeps saying, I don't want to eat you. You're not a turtle. I don't believe it. PEREIRA: He's not tasty.

CUOMO: I don't believe it.

You know, I don't trust something that can't blink. My mother told me that. If they can't blink, don't trust them.

CAMEROTA: You've given us a lot to marinate.

CUOMO: I have a lot of cousins with teeth like that. So, that's not what gets me. It's them not blinking.

PEREIRA: Who is this guy today?

CUOMO: All right. We're going to take a break.

A Texas cop is off the street right now because of this. OK. This is a pool party they came to break up, you know, the kids were in a community pool. That's 14-year-old girl he's throwing on the floor there. He would pull his weapon on these two. Is there any way to defend the actions? We'll give you the details ahead and you decide.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:20:07] CAMEROTA: Well, you're about to see a Texas police officer this weekend responding to teenagers allegedly using a pool without permission. You'll see the officer throw one girl to the ground and draw his weapon on others.

Take a look at this. Here is the moment. He's throwing a girl to the ground. When her friends come to help, that's when he pulls a gun on them.

So, here to discuss whether this is yet another case of excessive force is CNN law enforcement officer Cedric Alexander. He's also president of the National Association of Black Law Enforcement Executives. And Paul Callan, CNN legal analyst and criminal defense attorney.

Gentlemen, thanks so much for being here.

Cedric, I want to start with you.

Obviously, one video clip never tells the entire story of an event. However, do you see from your watching of this video clip any justification for this officer to have his gun drawn and to be forcing kids -- these teenagers to the ground?

CEDRIC ALEXANDER, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, let me put it very simply, Alisyn. I think it is important to note that this one particular officer's action. You just see one officer running around, the way he is, his cursing, his swearing, his conduct is totally unbecoming of a police officer under those type of circumstances. I think we'll agree with that.

And that in and of itself has a bad optic to it, and it certainly does not set the stage in terms of trying to create an environment in which this can be resolved. It did not help in that situation.

CAMEROTA: He really is not, Cedric. But beyond cursing and swearing, he draws his gun!

ALEXANDER: Right.

CAMEROTA: I mean, why would he do that?

ALEXANDER: Well, I don't know what was on his mind in regards to why he drew his weapon. He immediately reholstered. What made him draw his weapon at that time? I don't see any threat where I am. But, of course, he was there in the moment in time. He's going to have to make some justification for that while they're doing the justification that his department is having.

CAMEROTA: Paul, kids allegedly using a pool without permission. That's a pretty universal summer experience.

PAUL CALLAN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Sadly reminiscent for all of us, of people who made the mistake of lending the house to the senior in high school who can be trusted and you can come and kids jumping out the window. There's a party going on.

CAMEROTA: Right, sure. I think all of us have had that experience.

CALLAN: That's right.

CAMEROTA: But why are police officers even chasing kids? Why not just let the kids scatter?

CALLAN: Well, let me give you the back story because I watched the tape maybe five or six times yesterday and there's more to the story. This cop acted inappropriately in chasing these kids without knowing that any of them was a suspect. Remember, this was -- this is a private gated community, apparently there have been complaints that people were trespassing on the pool and there were fights going on.

The police then arrive on the scene. But, of course, they are confronted with a large crowd of kids. They don't know who is supposed to be there and who is not. He elects to chase all the kids down and angrily subdue them. Not knowing whether they were the bad guys or girls or not.

The final thing that you were talking about, the unholstering of the gun, the cop's actions were totally inappropriate up until that moment. But he's effecting the arrest of the girl in the bikini. Probably he shouldn't be arresting her, but he is.

CAMEROTA: Right.

CALLAN: But he is. He is surround by eight civilians. I count them. One kid comes around and looks like he's approaching him and going to jump the officer.

CAMEROTA: No. Not jump the officer. He's defending his friend, when they see the girl thrown to the ground. CALLAN: It doesn't matter.

CAMEROTA: It's just I think it is a natural reaction.

CALLAN: This is a cop. Of course, it's a natural reaction. From the cop's standpoint he's looking at the big kid, who he thinks is about to jump him. He unholsters his weapon and the kid backs off. The cop then reholsters his weapon and continues to subdue.

That -- of all the things he did, that's probably the one thing that most police officers would say was within training and procedure. The rest, the wild chasing people around for no reason, that set off this whole escapade, that was wrong.

CAMEROTA: Cedric, this police officer has been placed on administrative leave, but of course, that's temporary. What should happen to him?

ALEXANDER: Well, that's going to be depending upon his department and the policies they have in place.

CAMEROTA: What would you do to him?

ALEXANDER: Well, I don't know what I would do at this point, because in all fairness, you must have a complete investigation.

Here let me say this, Alisyn, a lot of things went wrong here. If you look at the total picture of it, there is certainly this one particular officer did is in question. I think by the end of the day, at some point, there's going to be some discipline if not termination as it relates to him. That's going to be for his department to determine.

But here is a question I raise as well, too. Any time that you have that many young people at a pool party or whatever, the question I raise, also, is where was the adult supervision?

[08:25:08] Because no adult showed up to the scene to step in, talk to police officers, and say, hey, I'm responsible for these kids and so forth and so on.

So, I think there's a lot of lessons in here this need to be taught to all of us. These are young teenage kids out having fun during the summer. But we all, too, have some responsibility for our behavior. There should have been some adult supervision there inside the complex. Obviously, one of those kids -- some of the kids live there who may have invited some friends over and got out of control.

CAMEROTA: Yes, we'll try to find out more information about what the predicate was for all of this partying.

Cedric Alexander, Paul Callan, thanks so much for your input.

CALLAN: Thank you.

ALEXANDER: Thank you for having me. CAMEROTA: What's your take on this? You can tweet us using

#NewDayCNN, or post your comments on Facebook.com/NewDay. We like to read those.

CUOMO: How about that amazing Triple Crown win this weekend for American Pharoah? Right? He walked the field. He left no doubts. We have legendary sports caster Dave Johnson, he's going to put in perspective what history we just beheld. Stay with us.

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