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Martin O'Malley Speaks Out; Police Van Carrying Freddie Gray Made Second Stop; Dramatic Rescue as Nepal Victim Stops Breathing. Aired 6:30-7a ET
Aired May 1, 2015 - 06:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[06:32:13] CHRIS COUMO, CNN ANCHOR: All right. So, here's where we are in the process.
The police did their preliminary investigation, gave the findings to the Maryland prosecutors. And now, they have to decide whether criminal charges are warranted or not in the death of Freddie Gray.
Baltimore police revealed something that is now fueling a lot of questions. The van carrying Gray made a previously unknown stop while transporting him. What does that mean? That means that somebody didn't tell the police when they were supposed to but they found out anyway.
Now, one target of the frustration in terms of leadership is Martin O'Malley. He's mayor, former governor, mayor of Baltimore and could be a presidential candidate.
CNN anchor Jake Tapper spoke with O'Malley about everything that's going on here and his responsibility.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: When you ran for mayor as a city councilman and when you were mayor, you were tough on crime. You instituted some assertive police practices. And I don't need to tell you that you've been criticized for that especially in recent days and weeks for being too aggressive, for alienating the population from the police force.
Do you shoulder any of the blame here? Are you responsible at all?
MARTIN O'MALLEY (D), FORMER BALTIMORE MAYOR: Well, we're all responsible. I was responsible when I decided to run for mayor in 1999. And I told people all across our city, vote for me, and together we will not only improve the policing of our streets, we'll improve the policing of our police, we'll expand drug treatment and we'll save a lot of young lives by intervening earlier.
And these are the things we did every day and went onto achieve a record reduction in violent crime. And there are probably now a thousand mostly young, poor, African-American men who did not die violent deaths in our city who would have if we had continued at the trajectory and level of violent crime we had before.
TAPPER: Was that trade-off worth it? Because there are people, as you know, African-Americans who say that that policing whether it's the NAACP, ACLU who sued you for arresting individuals, your administration, for arresting individuals without probable cause. Are we seeing the flip side?
O'MALLEY: Well, look, let's acknowledge this. I don't think there is a trade-off. In fact, we never use the term aggressive policing. We were very clear with police officers. We wanted them to be assertive when necessary, proactive and restoring, you know, to the good people in every neighborhood their streets from open air drug dealing. But we also worked every single day on policing our police.
TAPPER: When your police were assertive, there was one year 2005 when there was something like 100,000 arrests in the city of 600,000 people. That seems like a lot of arrests.
O'MALLEY: Yes. And a lot of them were of the same people again and again and again. We also put mechanisms in place so that we would be -- so that we could spare as many people as we could from having a blemish on their record if it indeed were just a one-time event.
[06:35:11] We also reduced violent crime. Look, every mayor I think tries to get the balance right.
I never once in my years as mayor ever had a single leader of the community, black or white, ever say to me, Mr. Mayor, I want less police presence in my neighborhood. In fact, we had a waiting list of neighbors that said we want you to close down the open air drug markets in our neighborhoods and we wanted you to do it last month.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CUOMO: So you just heard from O'Malley himself. He says what he did made things a lot better. Then why are so many out here saying things are as bad or worse than they've ever been? The question is, did the type of policing that's going on in this community before, during and after he left office, is that something that's contributing to the frustrations here with this community?
Yes, says Professor D. Watkins. He grew up here. And frequently writes about his run-ins with city police when he was young, including a new op-ed published in "New York Times" that you should read.
We're also joined by "Baltimore Sun" reporter Justin Fenton who's covering this situation.
Thanks to both of you gentlemen.
Let's start with the news. OK, that the van made an extra stop. It was undisclosed. What does that mean to you that it was undisclosed?
JUSTIN FENTON, BALTIMORE SUN: It's potentially significant, but we don't know. You have to question why we didn't know about it. And yet we don't know why police threw that out there yesterday. It could be as simple as the van driver stopped to get a coke and didn't tell anybody.
So, it's a big question about what exactly that represents.
CUOMO: One reason that they might want it out there is what does it show, Professor? It shows that the cops dealt with a little bit of deception, right? Someone didn't tell them something but they ferreted it out anyway.
What's the message -- we can police our own, we can investigate our own -- do you buy it?
D. WATKINS, PROFESSOR: Right now, the trust for the Baltimore City Police Department is at an all-time low and I don't think this is helping. I think they need to be more transparent with the investigation. And these new facts are just making people uneasy.
CUOMO: Do you think anything the police can do in investigating themselves would pass your smell test? Or do you believe it's just a flawed mechanism that you have to have independent review?
WATKINS: From my experience, I would say, no. I think it's a flawed mechanism. I think we need an outside source to investigate them.
CUOMO: And that's something that we've been hearing about, right? Is there any reason to believe that that will happen here?
FENTON: There's no reason to believe that will happen here. And I think it's an interesting point. The police lately and recent years have really tried to increase their transparency. They've appointed these blue ribbon panels, they've put out these reports.
But the reports don't come back with the findings that the community expects. The community believes the police are overaggressive, they believe unjust force was used. And the reports typically don't come back with that finding.
CUOMO: But is that a function of perception versus reality or do you think that it's a whitewash?
FENTON: It's tough to say.
CUOMO: It's tough for you to say, but I'm sure you have an opinion about it, right? It could be that the word is police aren't nice to us. But the reality is, you're a high crime area, you're not that nice when the police come up on you and that combination is going to create friction, friction creates altercations, altercation creates force and then you get your statistical outcomes.
What's your analysis?
WATKINS: You put it in a nutshell. A lot of times these politicians and police officers only deal with stats. But we're talking about people.
You know, we say, well, you know, 37 percent less people have been cracked in the head with clubs, but still a lot of people getting hit in the head. No one should be hit in the head.
So, a lot of things that go on in these black so-called high crime areas is not what's going on in different parts of the city. So, you know, people are frustrated. They just want more transparency. They just want justice like everyone else.
CUOMO: Potential leak out of the medical examiner's office. I say we take a step away from it because the medical examiner's pushing back hard saying we don't do preliminary findings. We only do final findings. So, this leak from our office doesn't make any sense.
Anyway knowing that it might have been a bolt that sizes up with the injury, that only tells you what and not how. How is what's going to matter for the prosecution.
So, let's jump to what nobody wants to talk about, young people. You've heard this all the time, professor, as have you. It's new to those of us covering this specific case. They'll say, yes, Freddie Gray bothers me, but it's because of why Freddie Gray existed as a dynamic that he was in the drug game because of his education and he was on that corner and he ran because cops aren't nice to you and he had to be on that corner because we can't get jobs. And people hear that and they go, deal with your life just like I did.
What do you make of that scenario, D.? People are ignoring it but everyone on these streets are talking about it.
WATKINS: I think it's very, very easy for a person who don't understand that reality to be disconnected. I think that's the problem we have with humanity in general. You know, I should be able to understand what life is like for you, and you should be able to understand what life is like as me and we can all be equal.
CUOMO: Being naive --
WATKINS: No one wants to sell drugs, no one wants to be a criminal, and, you know, no one wants to be a bad guy.
[06:40:03] These are huge systemic issues need to be addressed on multiple levels not just with the police department.
CUOMO: And you said the very easily, but the acceptance is not that easy. People say, no, you don't have to sell drugs, you don't have to run from the cops, you don't have to push a cop when they say get up against the wall.
What does that perspective miss?
WATKINS: It misses the fact that if Freddie Gray was a white kid in Roman Park, he would be alive right now. It misses the fact that, you know, Freddie Gray was guilty before he even had his day in court. He suffered his fate. If Freddie Gray was in a more affluent part of Baltimore and maybe had a different background, he would be alive.
CUOMO: The leaks are going to continue. You have been doing a great job at the paper of ferreting what you should put weight on and when. We're going to look to you for guidance on that.
And, Professor, thank you for helping us share the experience as an academic but one who lived the reality.
Appreciate it from both of you.
All right. We're going to have more on the breaking developments that are here in Baltimore ahead.
But first, there was this girl in Nepal, many like her, near death until Dr. Sanjay Gupta comes to the rescue. You're going to have to see it for yourself. It was caught on video, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: You hear us talk about CNN heroes all the time. Well, I think we have one in our midst.
I want to tell you a story about a young victim in the earthquake was rescued in Nepal, put onto a plane. Her health began to deteriorate rapidly. Minutes into the flight, she stops breathing. No medical supplies are anywhere within reach.
[06:45:00] That's when CNN chief medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta jumps into action to save her life. Watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Sometimes it takes a village to reach a village, and right now they are trying to save a village.
Just east of Kathmandu, Sindhupalchok is the hardest hit district in Nepal. More devastation and more deaths here than anywhere else. They need everything. Anything.
(on camera): So, we're seeing how some of this relief works. First of all, Indian helicopter -- getting a lot of assistance from other countries. Noodles, instant noodles, one of the biggest relief items providing an instant source of calories. And finally these are the tarps. This is so badly needed because of the weather conditions where we're going.
(voice-over): One of the challenges, we are told, this team has no idea what they'll find when they arrive. We quickly see what that means. The propellers never even stop as we drop off aid supplies.
And suddenly, an 18-year-old mother is thrust through the aircraft door atop a stretcher made out of straw.
We only know her name -- Sabina. We see her husband and one and a half month old baby. As I examine her, I quickly realize she has no movement and no sensation in her legs. Sabina is paraplegic.
Then things get worse. Minutes into our flight now, Sabina stops breathing. We can no longer detect a pulse either in her wrist or her neck.
I check her pupils and try desperately to rouse her as we blast over countryside.
There are no IV fluids on this helicopter. No defibrillator. Not even a first aid kit. And this young woman is going into cardiac arrest. It is aggressive, but I just delivered a cardiac thump -- a quick, strong hit to the chest, in a last-ditch effort to get her heart back into action.
Whether it worked or not, I can't say for sure. But she came back, and for a moment everything calms down. I slowly try and rehydrate her the old fashioned way.
We touch down once more at a makeshift hospital high in the mountains and we realize, as dramatic as that was, it is a scene that is playing out every day, maybe every hour, in the skies above Nepal.
(on camera): You get an idea of just how challenging these missions are. Look at the very small space this helicopter had to land on top of this hill. Hardly any room to spare. They're taking off these badly needed supplies as quickly as they can, because there's a woman on that helicopter who nearly went into cardiac arrest. They got to get her back as quickly as possible.
(voice-over): Here come the patients, one by one. I'm handed a precious little baby to fly back whose mother is too weak to hold her. Sabina's IV bag now tied to the ceiling, using a disposal facemask. Anything to just make it work.
Just a single moment to celebrate the lives on this chopper. We touch down again and, this time, there are stretchers, medicines, fluids, and prayers.
Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN, Nepal.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PEREIRA: We're told Sabina's recovering in the hospital. Our Sanjay Gupta doing what he knows best, how to safe lives. Really incredible. Thank you for that, Sanjay.
Meanwhile, back here in America, growing crisis. People losing trust in the police officers who serve them. How can faith be restored? Can protests and violence like we witnessed in Baltimore happen where you live? We'll take a look.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[06:52:33] PEREIRA: The death of Freddie Gray is sadly only the latest case of a young black man dying under questionable circumstances in confrontations with police. Two days ago on this program Maryland Congressman Elijah Cummings said, quote, "Baltimore can happen anywhere."
So the question becomes, what needs to happen to keep that from being the norm?
Joining us now is Karen Freeman-Wilson. She is the mayor of Gary, Indiana. She's also the chair of U.S. Conference of Mayors, which recently released a report in improving police practices nationwide.
Mayor Freeman-Wilson, really a pleasure to have you here.
KAREN FREEMAN-WILSON, CHAIRWOMAN, U.S. CONFERENCE OF MAYORS: It's great to be here. Thank you.
PEREIRA: Interesting conversations I'm sure that were had. Tell us what you learned that could apply to what's going on right now in Baltimore.
FREEMAN-WILSON: Well, in chairing the Conference of Mayor's task force on police community policing or police community relations, we really looked at a number of things. We looked at communications when there is a crises, but we also pulled back to look at recruitment, to look at discipline, to look at those things involving officers during the normal course of time, like training.
PEREIRA: It is a first step these meetings.
FREEMAN-WILSON: Yes.
PEREIRA: But how do we ensure -- you and I have all been to meetings in our own offices where we have all sorts of high-minded ideas, but when it gets down to getting the job done, there's a disconnect.
FREEMAN-WILSON: But we made recommendations that will lead to training. And not just training of police officers, but also that would lead to solutions in communities. And as you hear people talk about the frustration that they feel disenfranchised, that they are concerned about education, jobs.
PEREIRA: Poverty, sure.
FREEMAN-WILSON: Those recommendations also addressed those issues.
PEREIRA: It's all part and parcel.
Interesting, during Ferguson I remember we had a commentator on our air talking about how he felt that it was too little too late, to have people come into the community after something had happened instead of being there before. Is that a conversation about the relationship that needs to happen between not just local officials and law enforcement, law enforcement and the public?
FREEMAN-WILSON: So much of the conversation is about trust. Trust emanates from relationships. So you have to have that pre- existing relationship. But if it doesn't exist, then you work on building it.
PEREIRA: Sure.
FREEMAN-WILSON: You don't say it's too little too late. You build it for the next time. Because there will unfortunately be a next time.
[06:55:02] PEREIRA: So to that next time aspect, we know that this mayor of conferences you meet regularly.
FREEMAN-WILSON: We do.
PEREIRA: But in advance or post something like this, are mayors in contact with one another about the potential? Because we're seeing -- we saw the map Rosa Flores was showing us earlier. The protests and marches of solidarity are popping up across the nation.
FREEMAN-WILSON: We are absolutely in contact even before protests occur. We are in contact to look at best practices, to talk about what are those things that need to happen in communities so that we can prevent these instances. But we also know that there but by the grace of God go we.
PEREIRA: Do you have that kind of come to Jesus conversation with one another?
FREEMAN-WILSON: Oh, absolutely. We understand that Baltimore could happen in Gary, could happen in Los Angeles, could happen in the smallest city because in many of our urban communities there is a level of frustration that has to be addressed.
PEREIRA: What do we do about the deaf ear? There are people who don't want to hear this and don't believe that it's their reality. And sometimes they think, oh, this is just a black issue. That's just bitter people. Why don't they pull themselves up by the boot straps?
Why does this matter that all of us need to be invested in?
FREEMAN-WILSON: You know, Mayor Betsy Hodges from Minneapolis articulated it and she's a white woman and she said all of the citizens in the community need to live without an asterisk. White people need to live without an asterisk as do African-Americans.
And so, it's important that people embrace this as a community wide issue.
PEREIRA: Do you agree with what Congressman Elijah Cummings said, that Baltimore could happen to any of us? Does it feel that imminent to you? Does it feel that urgent to you?
FREEMAN-WILSON: It feels certainly that urgent. And it feels that it could happen to any of us because people in all of our communities, citizens in all of our communities have a sense of hopelessness, have a sense of disenfranchisement, have a sense that they are not being heard. And when people feel that they aren't being heard, they do desperate things.
PEREIRA: And it's important to be heard. Isn't that what we all want ultimately?
FREEMAN-WILSON: We absolutely do. And our job is to really let them be heard.
PEREIRA: Mayor Freeman-Wilson. Pleasure to meet you. Gary, Indiana, is lucky to have you. Thank you for sharing your time with us this morning.
FREEMAN-WILSON: It is my pleasure. Thank you.
PEREIRA: A whole lot of news to get to once again especially on this Friday. Let's get to it.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(CHANTING)
CUOMO: Leaked information exposing an additional stop after arrests.
(CHANTING)
ANTHONY BATTS, BALTIMORE POLICE COMMISSIONER: People are jumping to conclusions. I think it's unfortunate.
STEPHANIE RAWLINGS-BLAKE (D), BALTIMORE, MD: I love this city. And I know we can be better than what we have seen.
O'MALLEY: We're all responsible. America's failing America.
PEREIRA: Protests across the nation.
PROTESTERS: No justice! No peace. We want peace!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The kids, they want to know why their city is burning.
REP. ELIJAH CUMMINGS (D), MARYLAND: What I can do is fight for them. Baltimore can happen anywhere.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CUOMO: Welcome back. You're watching NEW DAY. Michaela is in New York. Alisyn's off.
And here in Baltimore two critical developments that very well could be keys in the death of Freddie Gray. Baltimore police turned over their investigative report to prosecutors a day early, but in it they admit the van carrying Gray previously made an unknown stop while transporting him.
Unknown. They didn't know. They had to figure it out. They didn't learn it from their officers. Why? What does it mean?
Also, a leak supposedly from the medical examiner's office saying that in that van there was a bolt. And that bolt sizes up with the injury to Freddie Gray. What does that mean?
We hear prosecutors could have autopsy proof as early as today.
The outrage here now echoing nationwide. We have all the events overnight. And we'll start with what happened here in Baltimore.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PROTESTERS: All night! All day, we will fight for Freddie Gray!
CUOMO (voice-over): Anger spikes after documents are leaked in the investigation to Freddie Gray's death.
(on camera): It feels a little different tonight.
(voice-over): The passion on the streets of Baltimore overnight spilling onto intersections across the country.
Despite a few tense moments in Philadelphia when protesters try entering a highway, voices rage but protests are mostly peaceful.
(on camera): The police are sitting here and watching this. So it's about a balance.
(voice-over): Officers understanding the outrage in Baltimore saying they'll only interfere if public safety really becomes an issue.
Once again the 10:00 curfew nears.
CUMMINGS: We are getting ready to leave this area.
CUOMO: Once again, Congressman Elijah Cummings on the streets telling, protesters to go home.
(SINGING)
