Return to Transcripts main page

WOLF

Curfew Appears to Bring Calm in Baltimore; Reporter: Baltimore Riots Were Just a Matter of Time; Powerful Message from Saints' Benjamin Watson; Hillary Clinton, Others Sound Off on Race, Justice in America. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired April 29, 2015 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:38:49] WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Cooler heads seem to be prevailing in Baltimore. These were the scenes from Monday, buildings on fire, protesters confronting police, businesses being looted. On Tuesday, a tense calm filled the streets as a curfew took effect.

I want to bring in my next guest, Marq Claxton, retired New York City police detective and director of the Black Law Enforcement Alliance.

Marq, thanks very much for joining us.

I assume you believe that 10:00 p.m. to 5:00 a.m. curfew was a good idea?

MARQ CLAXTON, DIRECTOR, BLACK LAW ENFORCEMENT ALLIANCE & RETIRED NEW YORK CITY POLICE DETECTIVE: Good idea and it was effective. Given if you juxtapose what occurred the night before last and last night, there was a huge difference and thankfully there wasn't an overzealous response on the part of the police itself as we witnessed in previous interactions like in Ferguson. There was really a controlled and tempered response and minor amount of violators to the curfew.

BLITZER: Should they -- do you believe they should keep that curfew in effect into next week?

CLAXTON: I think at this point, it's important to maintain that curfew. I'll tell you, specifically because there's some confusion out in the community and across the nation as a matter of fact, I think many people are expecting some details or chronology about events surrounding Mr. Gray's death to come out on Friday. However, the mayor made it clear that there will be no major announcement or chronology given to the public or family, merely there will be passing on the results of their report, the police report, to the state attorney's office. So I think there will be on Friday, tomorrow, some level of frustration, anger, disappointment because many people are waiting for this may 1st deadline to come to finally get some idea about what contributed or caused Mr. Gray's death.

[13:35:442] BLITZER: And if they don't get that, because the expectations are they'll at least get some more information on what led to Freddie Gray's death. If they don't get it what should police, National Guard personnel, what should they be bracing for? CLAXTON: Well, you have to prepare for the unexpected and expected or

the probable or the possible. It's such a tenuous situation and things are changing on a dime. You never know what will cause an extended burst of emotion or some immediate response. Even from, you know, peaceful, law-abiding protesters, you know, when you have a group of people who congregate in one particular area and have some impact on the flow of traffic or commercialism in that particular area, it's necessary to have a police response so you want to be over prepared as opposed to under prepared as they were on Friday -- I mean on the first day of disorder, when the young people let out of school, they were a bit caught off guard. You don't want that to occur again. You would rather be over prepared for events.

BLITZER: Marq Claxton, thanks very much for joining us.

CLAXTON: Thank you, Wolf.

BLITZER: Thank you.

Still to come, the events in Baltimore may have shocked much of the nation, but we'll talk with one reporter who says it was just a matter of time. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:40:41] BLITZER: Welcome back to our viewers in the United States and around the world.

Our next guest says it was only a matter of time before Baltimore "exploded." His words. Michael Fletcher is a reporter for "The Washington Post," and lived in Baltimore more than 30 years. And he writes this. Let me read it to you: "Baltimore is not Ferguson and its primary problems are not racial. Mayor, city council president, police chief, top prosecutor and many other city leaders are black, as is half of Baltimore as the 3000-person police force, yet the gaping disparity separating the have and have-nots in Baltimore are as large as they are anywhere."

Michael Fletcher is joining us live from Baltimore.

Michael, thanks very much. Thanks for writing that excellent article in "The Washington Post." Explain your analysis, why there's "two Baltimores," for all practical purposes, your words.

MICHAEL FLETCHER, REPORTER, THE WASHINGTON POST: You see, Wolf, this across the country. You have a city like any other city where you have a working and middle class but also in Baltimore a huge poor population, in many ways is disconnected from the life of the city. And their connection to the city really is through the police force, the police going there to keep order. Look at some of the social indicators in those communities, drug abuse is rampant, Baltimore as a city is considered to be the number one heroin using city in America according to the federal government. You look at schools in Winchester, the neighborhood where Freddie Gray grew up, half -- almost half of high school students miss more than 20s days of school a year. 20 percent of the middle school students do. The census track that encompasses Winchester has the highest number of Maryland state prison inmates in the state. So you look at that and you sort of have this kind of dichotomy that exists. Baltimore, which in many ways is a beautiful city, within that you have this kind of rolling kind of -- all these social problems.

BLITZER: Why do so many people in Baltimore distrust police? We've pointed out -- you pointed out in your article a black police commissioner, half of the 3,000 members of the police department are African-American, so why is there so much distrust and why did it explode that violence explode on Monday?

FLETCHER: I think it has to do with the role the police play in a part of the city that I argue is disconnected from the rest of the city. When the cops come in there, they're doing drug sweeps, they're, you know, arresting everyone in sight, and many people argue that's what they need to do because you have open-air drug markets, high level of violence, so you kind of more of an occupied kind of feel. The police -- people talk about community policing in Baltimore and past commissioners have tried to implement that, but when it comes to the communities, the cops come in with a heavy hand and that breeds resentment. It's, basically, too much interaction with the police.

BLITZER: I recommend your article to our viewers out there. They can go to your "Washington Post" website to read it.

Michael Fletcher, a long-time reporter for "The Washington Post," thanks very much for joining us.

FLETCHER: My pleasure, Wolf.

BLITZER: Thank you.

Just ahead, what will it take to fix the problems in Baltimore and elsewhere around the country as well? We'll speak with an NFL player, whose Facebook post on the issue has taken the Internet by storm. Benjamin right there, he has powerful words to share with our viewers, we'll be right back. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:47:46] BLITZER: The unrest in Baltimore prompted a Facebook post by the New Orleans Saints player, Benjamin Watson, which has garnered thousands of likes and shares. He says with so many of today's problems, we talk about fixing broken systems, but he goes on to say this, he says, "without a change of heart these attempts will fail us." He says, "What can we do? What can we say? Systems are broken. Systems, because people are broken and systems are fixed without hearts being changed the result will be a legalistic attempt that will lack long-term results."

Benjamin Watson is joining us from New Orleans.

Benjamin, thanks very much for joining us.

You also wrote a post a lot of us remember when Ferguson happened, which prompted a huge response on social media. You talk about fixing these problems we face by changing hearts. How does society do that? BENJAMIN WATSON, NEW ORLEANS SAINTS PLAYER: Well, thank you, Wolf,

for having me.

When I'm watching the things that have happened in this country, really I try to put myself in the space of those who are in many times lashing out. There's tremendous pain in this country, and I really think that we're at a turning point where if we don't address some of these issues, America is going to cease to exist how we know it. Everybody has remedies an we talk about changing this and that, but I believe that the heart of man is what makes us do these things and without a relationship with god, without his heart being changed, simply just putting band-aids on bullet wounds and without having a new heart we change things but the people feel the same. Police officers that are abusing people, people rioting, still have crime happening, but god wants to give us a chance to love our fellow man and that only happens through a relationship with Jesus Christ.

BLITZER: You also write that Baltimore, you see smoke, but you say, "We must address the fire." Explain what you mean by that.

WATSON: First of all, we need to recognize the fact that people are upset because of things that have happened over generations and this isn't just a flippant reaction. These things have been brewing. There have been injustices that have happened in the neighborhoods. I think part of moving forward is being able to recognize and acknowledge that, yes, there are certain times when people have been treated wrongly because of the color of their skin. Once you can address that, that gives that person. Another thing I would address is the family. The family is the structure that god gave us to teach young men, young women how to act when they get in public. It teaches them how to obey. It teaches them responsibility. It teaches them all those things. When you're looking at the break down of the family -- and I'm not just talking about the black community. In general in America, there's a fatherlessness issue that we have. And I think when we see kids, black or white, lashing out, a lot of it has to do with the identity and being taught those things at home and having the father in the home.

[13:50:00] BLITZER: That's well said, indeed.

Benjamin, you're a professional athlete. Think about this for a moment. The Baltimore Orioles are about to play the Chicago White Sox in Baltimore in a stadium that seats 46,000 fans. There will be zero fans because of security concerns. They're going to play the game. We'll be able to watch it on television. Can you imagine an NFL game -- hopefully it'll never happen -- that you would play a game and there would be no fans cheering? Just talk a little bit as a professional athlete about this amazing scene we're about to see in Baltimore.

WATSON: Well, I guess the good thing about baseball is they have, I don't know, 180-something games. One game without fans isn't as big a deal as playing a football game without fans when we only have 16 of them. But this just points to the severity of the issues in Baltimore. Really, the severity of the issues that we're facing in America where we have a professional sports team not able to play and fans not able to come to the game because of issues going on in this city. I am encouraged, however, because I know people in Baltimore, I know pastors in Baltimore. I've seen people on the streets holding hands, praying in Baltimore. My hope is that through this whole thing, the body of Christ will come together and be the example, be the example of what it means to love your neighbor, be the example of what it means to demonstrate these things. Show the world that hearts can truly be changed, not just through policies, but through the love of Christ.

BLITZER: Benjamin Watson plays for the New Orleans Saints. Thanks very much for joining us.

WATSON: Thank you, Wolf.

BLITZER: Still ahead, the crisis in Baltimore also hits the campaign trail here in the United States. Hillary Clinton just the latest candidate to sound off on the topic of race and justice in America. What she just said, what some other White House contenders have to say. That's coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:55:54] BLITZER: Let's get back to our coverage on the situation in Baltimore as the city cleans up. Contenders for the White House in 2016 are weighing in on the shocking scenes of violence playing out from hour to hour. Not even an hour's drive from Washington, we're talking about Baltimore, which is only about 40 miles away from the nation's capital.

The latest contender to speak out, Hillary Clinton said her heartbreaks for the families of young men like Freddie Gray, said investigators in Baltimore are disrespecting the community -- disrupters are setting back the cause of justice. That's what they're saying, the instigators in Baltimore, I should say. She also took the opportunity to call for immediate change with police across the country. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, FORMER SECRETARY OF STATE & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We should make sure every police department in the country has body cameras to record braxs between officers on patrol and suspects. That will improve transparency and accountability. It will help protect good people on both sides of the lens.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Let's bring in Nia Malika-Henderson, our senior political reporter.

The first time she's done a major sort of policy speech since announcing, right?

NIA MALIKA-HENDERSON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER: That's right. I think just in terms of presentation, it was well delivered. In terms of the message there, some things I think we've heard before, not necessarily from her, but certainly from President Obama, body cameras. I think the theme she was trying to get across is this idea of balance, restoring balance back into the criminal justice system, ending the era of mass incarceration. It's something I think people were waiting to hear from her because there were questions about how she would approach this, given that her husband, that many people think, was sort of the father of mass incarceration.

BLITZER: Because he was sort of --

MALIKA-HENDERSON: Because he was very tough on crime, right.

BLITZER: Whole subject of race and justice in America. She tackled that head on today.

MALIKA-HENDERSON: Yeah, exactly. She did. Again, I think people wanted to hear this from her. It was a good speech. It was a perfectly timed speech because we're in the middle of this national conversation about this. I think we'll end up hearing more from her.

BLITZER: The former governor of Maryland, Martin O'Malley, he canceled a trip to Europe to be on hand. There was an incident where he was a little heckled.

MALIKA-HENDERSON: That's right. People remember what it was like to be citizens in Baltimore under Martin O'Malley. He had a policy of zero tolerance, which meant, if you were young and black, you were often subject to searches and seizures. He was very harsh in terms of meting out punishment, even for small crimes.

BLITZER: Let me get your thoughts on Republican contenders. Rand Paul, he says, "There are so many things we can talk about, the break down of the family structure, the lack of fathers, the lack of sort of a moral code in our society. This isn't just a racial thing." Then he quipped, "I came through the train on Baltimore last night. I'm glad the train didn't stop." That's Rand Paul.

Then there was Dr. Ben Carson, retired neurosurgeon from Johns Hopkins University. He says, "If you have an unpleasant experience with a plumber, do you go out and declare a war on all plumbers, doctors, teachers? Of course not. It doesn't make sense either."

MALIKA-HENDERSON: I think Rand Paul got a little blow back. They were concerns people, African-Americans, took his comments about not stopping in Baltimore, they found those to be insensitive. He understands that. He wishes he would have framed it much differently.

But I think over the next weeks and months, this is something that keeps coming up, these criminal justice issues. Rand Paul has been out front in talking about them. We'll see what the others offer as well.

[13:59:45] BLITZER: Certainly going to be an issue in the campaign, I assume.

Thanks very much.

Nia Malika-Henderson doing her reporting for us.

That's it for me. Thanks very much for watching. I'll be back 5:00 p.m. Eastern in "The Situation Room."

For our international viewers, "Amanpour" is next.

For our viewers in the U.S., Brooke Baldwin is in Baltimore. She picks up CNN's special coverage of the state of emergency there.