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Statue of Liberty Evacuated; Baltimore Protests; Baltimore Mayor Speaks. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired April 24, 2015 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[14:00:03] ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Let's go. Here we are on this Friday. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thank you so much for being with me.

As Wolf had been reporting, we are following this breaking news here out of New York, out of Liberty Island. The Statue of Liberty has just been evacuated. There are massive, massive lines. Here are some photos from Twitter and social media that we've been culling through here at CNN. And you can see all these people packed in, trying to get out of there on these ferries. It's hundreds of people. If you've been, especially on a beautiful spring day like this, you know it's packed full of - full of visitors. And now the bomb squad is moving in.

Let's go to my colleague, Deborah Feyerick, she's our CNN national correspondent sort of working this one for us right now.

And, Deborah, what's going on?

DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, what we can tell you, it's been about two hours since someone phoned in a bomb threat to the U.S. Park Police. They received that call about 11:30 this morning. We are being told now that all visitors, all spectators, all civilians effectively, have been evacuated from the island. We're monitoring some of the ferries that are in New York Harbor. Some of them turning around now. They were perhaps waiting for the outcome, to see how the situation resolved itself.

We are learning that the NYPD is there. A bomb squad on scene, along with members of the fire department, the New York City Fire Department. They are just protectively, just in case. They're trying to figure out what the suspicious package is all about. Apparently the person who called in said that it was in a visitor's locker. And when the U.S. Park Police came with their bomb-sniffing dogs, one of the dogs did react positively.

Now, these are not foolproof. Sometimes dogs do get sort of a false positive. But, clearly, they're taking no precautions. They are investigating to see exactly what it is. And clearly, Brooke, what raises this to an exceptionally higher level is the fact that an actual call came in, according to law enforcement sources, to the U.S. Park Police. So they are taking this very seriously.

But right now we can tell you that the statue of Liberty, the island there, has been evacuated. We are not being told of any disruption to Ellis Island.

BALDWIN: Just next door.

FEYERICK: These ferries, as you know, usually do both of the - both of those. But right now it's really the Statue of Liberty that they're concentrating on, Brooke.

BALDWIN: OK. Let's stay in close contact because I know you have your sources with New York Fire and with the bomb squad there, with the police. We'll stay in touch with you and see what develops from Liberty Island there and the Statue of Liberty.

But let's move on and talk about Baltimore, because critics say the mayor there is not doing enough. But the mayor, Stephanie Rawlings- Blake, says she's doing all she can to find out what happened to Freddie Gray, the 25-year-old man who died in police custody. Her news conference with community leaders is supposed to begin at any moment. And when it does, we'll take that live.

Now look at this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CROWD: Hands up. Don't shoot. Hands up. Don't shoot. Hands up. Don't shoot. Hands up. Don't shoot.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: We are hours away from a fifth consecutive night of these protests in the wake of Freddie Gray's death. In fact, I was just in Baltimore yesterday and a lot of city officials I spoke with were anticipating Saturday's gathering being the largest yet.

Monday he will be laid to rest, but before that happens, the family attorney says a private autopsy will be conducted at the funeral home. They are trying to figure out how Gray suffered a severe spinal injury after his arrest on April 12th. The lack of answers has driven a number of community leaders to say this today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REV. ALVIN GWYNN, PRESIDENT, INTERDENOMINATIONAL MINISTERIAL ALLIANCE: As a result of the many shortfalls of this police department and the lack of viable leadership capabilities, we, the Ministers Alliance, are demanding that Police Commissioner Anthony Batts tender his resignation immediately.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: My next guest knows a lot about life in Baltimore. Felicia "Snoop" Pearson grew up there. She also played an assassin on the Baltimore-based HBO drama "The Wire." It's a role for which author Stephen King actually called her, and I'm quoting him now, "perhaps the most terrifying villain to ever appear in a TV series."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) FELICIA PEARSON, ACTRESS, "THE WIRE": What up, (INAUDIBLE)?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE, ACTOR, "THE WIRE": I don't know. You tell me. I mean everybody locked up, right? I mean, damn (ph).

PEARSON: Yes, because of that (EXPLETIVE DELETED) I'm going to need you for some serious business tomorrow, man.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Anyone I know?

PEARSON: Big Walter.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Big Nose Big Walter?

PEARSON: No, Skinny Big Walter. The Walter you (INAUDIBLE) in front of the (INAUDIBLE) all the time.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).

PEARSON: (INAUDIBLE). So it was what it is. You got a problem with that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We straight.

PEARSON: No need to bring your iron. I got a clean knife for you to shave numbers. I'll pick you up tomorrow night. You heard?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah, yeah.

PEARSON: All right.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[14:05:10] BALDWIN: Felicia Pearson also penned a memoir entitled "Grace after Midnight." She talks about being the child of drug addicted parents, growing up in an east Baltimore foster home and going to prison at just 14 years of age for second degree murder. And she joins me now from New York.

Felicia, thank you so much for coming on.

FELICIA "SNOOP" PEARSON, FORMER ACTRESS, HBO'S "THE WIRE": Thanks for having me.

BALDWIN: I know, you know, you're incredibly vocal over your hometown, over what's happened there with Freddie Gray. You say this death really hits home for you. Tell me how.

PEARSON: Yes. First of all, I knew Freddie Gray, you know, and he was a - a wonderful person. He liked to laugh, you know, crack jokes, you know, things like that. That's why it hit close to home.

BALDWIN: How did you know him?

PEARSON: Just neighborhoods, just being outside. Baltimore is really small, you know everybody, know everybody. BALDWIN: And so when you hear that in that moment, according to

police, they saw him, they locked eyes, it's a high-crime neighborhood, they see it in their eyes as a constitutional stop. He ran, unprovoked, in the other direction. What do you make of all those details knowing police as you do?

PEARSON: They - they - they corrupted, man. I'm not going to say all of them, but 90 percent of them is corrupted. You know they are - they know - they know people in the neighborhood or whatever. They know who's doing what and what's going on in the neighborhood. And it's just - it's just sad. How can you just lock somebody up and next thing you know his spinal cord is fractured or - you know what I mean, it's just broken, period. Like it just don't make no sense.

BALDWIN: The family would agree with you. I don't know if you've been in touch with the family at all, but we've talked to the attorney multiple times and there are a lot of unanswered questions for sure.

I want to go back to your story, though. You know, you were convicted for murder at 14 years of age. How, Felicia, did you get wrapped up in that - that life so young?

PEARSON: Because I was adopted. Me, personally, myself, it has to do with me because I didn't think nobody cares - cared about me, like my real biological mother or father. You know, how can y'all leave me with another family and not come back to get me? So, in my mind, I just already had it like, you know, I don't care nothing about the world. And, for me to get locked up at 14 for a murder charge, you know, I was - I was young. You know, like, I was young. I was - I was just retarded, for real, you know?

BALDWIN: How did you go from that life at such a young age to being this actress we know you as in this incredibly successful TV series?

PEARSON: Through Michael K. Williams. He - I met him in a nightclub. It was called Club One in Baltimore. And "The Wire" was on - ready to begin season three. And he just took me on set to meet the writers and producers. And they loved me. They just wrote me in. They never had a part for me, they just wrote me in. That's why my name stayed the same, Felicia Snoop Pearson.

BALDWIN: So you were blessed in a sense -

PEARSON: Yes.

BALDWIN: But there are a lot of people who are not and, you know -

PEARSON: So blessed.

BALDWIN: Going back to your story and that of Freddie Gray, who you say you know, and a number of people in these Baltimore neighborhoods, you know, one of the big themes of these conversations has been why - why are - why are these young men, in most cases, running from police? You know, that's when the situation escalates. And we've heard from Freddie Gray's family's lawyer saying, well, he should have run faster. That was the only mistake, you know, he made that night. How would your 25-year-old self, knowing Baltimore as you do, how - what would you have done?

PEARSON: I probably would have took off too. But - because there's no win with them. You know, they - like I was reading and looking on CNN or whatever and they was -

BALDWIN: But doesn't that make the situation worse, Felicia?

PEARSON: I mean - yes, but not all the time because if you stand there, they - they going to say you did anything or whatever they want to say. They going - whatever - whatever they say, whatever the police say, y'all is going to believe it, you know, so they - because they have the badge. So if he ran, it probably was a reason why. I mean they probably was already - the police probably was already in - angry - an angry force already. So, I mean, we don't know why he ran. But me, if - it all depends on how the situation - how it occurred.

[14:10:03] But this is - all we want to know is how did he get his spinal cord broke, you know? Like, that don't make sense. They say some about a pocket knife that wasn't - not illegal. You know you have your legal sizes that you can carry around. You know, all right, it's a pocket knife. Why - why is - why is his spinal cord broke? Why - why - why - why - why this happen?

BALDWIN: That's what they're - that's what they're trying to figure out and people are calling for all these investigations. I talked to a reverend with the SCLC yesterday. They're conducting their own investigation because they don't trust police there in Baltimore.

PEARSON: Right.

BALDWIN: Here's the deal. And you said this yourself, that not all cops are bad. I was talking to a city councilman there yesterday, Carl Stokes, and he was -

PEARSON: You've got - you've got 100 percent cops, 90 percent is not right and 10 percent, they're not going to say nothing because they - they - they - they like a big, you know, gang theirself you might as well say because they got to - they got to respect their shield, you know, so -

BALDWIN: So I'm - I'm with you, I'm with you in that you have some bad cops. And I think a lot of people wouldn't disagree with that. And so that needs to change.

PEARSON: Yes, it does.

BALDWIN: But my final question would be, what about attitudes within these communities toward cops? Does that not need to change as well, the trust?

PEARSON: But if our attitude change, the cops' attitudes has to change.

BALDWIN: Yes.

PEARSON: We can't just - we can't just change on our own, you know, like it - if the cop come and say something to me and I'm talking nicely and they just go ahead and start disrespecting me, what I'm going to do? I'm going to start disrespecting them because I'm a human being. You have to give me respect. I'm giving you respect. So, you know, like everybody has to respect everybody. But it can - it just can't happen like my community just getting no respect. You know, they have to respect us too. Like we don't - like they supposed to protect and serve. You know, like my nephew, he's really scared. He is really scared, you know, just to go outside and play, you know? Are the police going to beat me? He don't know really what's going on, but he see what's going - he hears little things or whatever, but it's just crazy, man. It's just crazy. Like I just - I just -

BALDWIN: I hear a lot about the fear.

PEARSON: Yes.

BALDWIN: I hear a lot about the fear. Felicia Pearson, thank you so much.

PEARSON: Yes.

BALDWIN: I just - I want to go to Baltimore. We're actually hearing from the mayor, Stephanie Rawlings-Blake. Thank you for that conversation. And here she is. Let's take a listen.

All right, as we're waiting, looks like they're flipping through some papers, it should start any minute now. You know, there's been a lot of criticism against both the mayor here in the city of Baltimore and also the police commissioner. But specifically toward the mayor, that she hasn't done enough. I think the phraseology from this councilmember I talked to yesterday is that she's been too calm, right? So since then she has said no crying and screaming on my end would really get any answers any quicker for Freddie Gray's family. So we'll - we want to watch and see if she has anything more to say about the investigation and also to that criticism here. Stephanie Rawlings- Blake in the city of Baltimore. Let's go.

(CROSS TALK)

MAYOR STEPHANIE RAWLINGS-BLAKE (D), BALTIMORE: All right. Good afternoon and thank you all for joining us today.

Before I even begin with this press conference, I want to again offer my sincere condolences to all of Mr. Gray's family, to his friends. I am very keenly aware of the - their pain during this difficult time. And I know that many in our community continue to pray for them.

I want to thank the members of our community for their commitment to peaceful and respectful protests during this process. Our community is very clear, they demand answers, and so do I. I still want to know why the policies and the procedures for transport were not followed. I still want to know why none of the officers called for immediate medical assistance despite Mr. Gray's apparent pleas.

The one thing we all know is that because of this incident, a mother has to bury her child. And she doesn't even know exactly how or why this tragedy occurs. Only that this occurred while her child was in our custody, in police custody. And this is unacceptable.

[14:15:10] As mayor, as a parent, as someone who's lost family members to violence, I know that this is absolutely unacceptable and I want answers. Commissioner Batts has assured me that the Baltimore Police Department is moving as quickly as possible with a responsible investigation. And we will determine exactly how this death occurred. If necessary, we will hold the appropriate parties responsible.

I recognize there's frustration over this investigation, but I want to be clear, there is a process, and we have to respect that process. In order to just - to have justice and not just seek justice, the investigation has to follow procedures. It needs to - the investigation and the police and the others who are looking into this have to be able to follow up on leads, and they have to be as thorough as possible. Again, in order for us to have justice, and not just seek justice, we have to protect this process.

Commissioner Batts has pledged to leave no stone unturned until - and no - excuse me, no stone unturned during this investigation with the goal of turning over all of the information to our state's attorney a week from today. I appreciate the outside independent investigations and reviews that will be a part of this process, and we will cooperate with all of them. The outside review from the Department of Justice is welcomed and should provide confidence to everyone that this investigation will be comprehensive, independent, thorough, and fair.

Throw this process, it's absolutely vital that we remain one community. Over the past week, I've met with community leaders and spoken with families to talk about exactly this. And just a few minutes ago, I'm so incredibly blessed to have had the opportunity to meet with faith leaders from across Baltimore to discuss how we can work together to build community as the Baltimore Police Department moves forward with their investigation.

We have strong communities here. We have a strong faith community here. And we have a strong tradition of being able to protest and still be respectable and strong in our communities. So far, I'm encouraged, I said, about how peaceful the demonstrations have been, and I want to thank the police department for working so hard to protect the protesters' right to be heard and working with them to facilitate peaceful demonstrations as we move forward.

I will continue to encourage residents who wish to voice their frustrations, I encourage them to do so. I also encourage them to be peaceful. I appreciate the sentiment. That same sentiment was echoed by the faith leaders that we had a chance to speak to today.

I know that this weekend, whether you're Jewish, AME, Baptist, Catholic, or any denomination across the board, I know that if you - if you show up on Saturday or Sunday for service - that's my plug for you - if you show up, I'm sure that you will hear a message asking for continued peace.

I will not deny that here in Baltimore we have had a very long and complicated history on issues such as these. But it's important to remember that we have an equally long history of peaceful and legal protests. We are the home of Thurgood Marshall. We're the home of one of the first sit-ins of the civil rights movement. We have a responsibility to preserve that legacy. And I know that we're up to the task.

Now I'd like to turn things over to a few of those who were in the meeting this afternoon to go into some more details. First, I would like to hear from Reverend Dr. Frank Reed, Bethel AME Church.

BALDWIN: All right, we're going to pull away from this and have a greater discussion about what's going on in the city of Baltimore. But I think the one piece of news that came out of that is that the mayor was saying that they will be, the city and really actually the police department, will be turning over the results from - or details of that investigation on to the state's attorney's office. So that will be happening one week from today she said.

With me now from Baltimore, I have city councilman Brandon Scott. And also with me, Atlanta civil rights activist Reverend Markel Hutchins.

So, gentlemen, thank you both so much for joining me.

[14:20:00] REV. MARKEL HUTCHINS, CIVIL & HUMAN RIGHTS ACTIVIST: Good to be with you.

BRANDON SCOTT, BALTIMORE CITY COUNCIL: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Brandon, let me just begin with you, since we just heard from the mayor. And I know I have specifics for you beyond that. But just can you - I don't know if you were able to hear what Mayor Stephanie Rawlings-Blake just said. I know it's kind of loud where you are. Can you hear me, sir?

SCOTT: Yes, I can hear you just fine.

BALDWIN: OK. Good. How - their - you know, the mayor has been criticized for being too calm in handling this. How do you think she's handling it?

SCOTT: Well, I think that, in a time like this, our leaders have to be calm. We have to be focused (ph). We have to express upon folks what the processes are. We have to also understand - we have to understand the frustrations of people, but we have to let folks know that we have to follow the rules of the law. The laws are the laws. Yes, people in our city should be angry. Yes, they should be upset. But the laws are laws.

There has been effort in this - in this state led by many folks, including our mayor, to change some of the laws, the reasons why information cannot be shared. And what we have to do as citizens, if we are upset with the process, then we have to advocate and change that process, and that process cannot be changed by any individual in the city of Baltimore. That power lies in our general assembly in Annapolis. And folks from our city have to convince folks from outside of our city this this issue is important to them. And that's very important to get across to folks because these rules - I think even the police know some of those folks - those rules have to change. So we have to - we have to do that, but we have to do that calmly and we also have to do that with the benefit and help of others outside of our city.

BALDWIN: All right. Councilman, let me follow up with you and, reverend, I'm coming to you in just a minute. But first, I want to talk to you about the Donte (ph) Johnson case because in 2005 the family of Donte Johnson -

SCOTT: Yes.

BALDWIN: Has accused an officer of purposefully giving him quote/unquote "a rough ride." His spine was broken. He died two weeks later. Johnson wasn't strapped in, in these prisoner transport vehicles and - similar to what we saw Freddie Gray taken into. He wasn't in a seat belt. This is according to the attorney for the officer suspended over Gray's arrest. You want that to change, right? You're calling for hearings.

SCOTT: Yes.

BALDWIN: Can you tell me what kind of answers you're getting, first and foremost, from Baltimore Police over that?

SCOTT: Well, we heard a few months ago that they were going to be getting new vans and stuff like that, update the safety in those vans. They (INAUDIBLE) before me and the code (ph) safety committee. They say that they have begun that process. But I want to take that a step further. Have them have a hearing specifically about the vans. Are we getting new vans? How safe are our vans? Have we looked at putting cameras in our vans? And those kind of questions to see what the policies are, have they changed policy, have they done audits? We want to get into the details of the devils - the devils in the details in these kind of things we see. What they have done from the Johnson case that's actually an individual who was from the neighborhood that I grew up in when I was in college until now with this unfortunate Freddie Gray case.

BALDWIN: Reverend, to you. You are a man of God. You are an activist. And you also decided to take a little time to go through this police training program. Can you just first explain to me why you wanted to do that?

HUTCHINS: Well, I think, in this environment, where there's such a strain in the relationship between law enforcement and communities of color, it is essential for those of us who advocate police accountability and police responsibility to at least have some basic knowledge of what police officers face every day. Because I think without that, we are inable (ph) really to adequately assess whether or not some of these scenarios and situations that are unfolding across the country are justified or not. I think we have to -

BALDWIN: What did you learn?

HUTCHINS: Well, I learned certainly that, in the heat of that moment, police officers are having to make very difficult decisions. But I want to draw one major distinction. In the scenarios that I went through, they were real, they were live, they were very, very highly intense, but they involved people that had weapons that were drawn against me. I think one of the frustrations we see in America today is a large - in large part because it is unarmed African-American men who are being killed by police. And I think that's what we have to really contend with in America today.

BALDWIN: Reverend Markel Hutchins, thank you, sir. And Brandon Scott for me in Baltimore this afternoon, I appreciate you very much to both of you.

And just a quick note. During an earlier interview, my guest used some offensive language off the top of the show and I just wanted to apologize to you for that.

Next, just in, breaking word, the Tulsa deputy who pulled that gun instead of a Taser got special treatment and his training violated rules. New information there.

Also ahead, inside the terror plot to bomb the Vatican. What's security like there? Is the holy site secure?

And, an amazing interview. One of the oldest Holocaust survivors will join us today to talk about this trial that's underway in Auschwitz. The trial of a former Nazi guard. His own words, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:28:53] BALDWIN: Well, he's had his post since 2009 as the United States attorney general. Eric Holder is about to say thank you and good-bye. Let's listen.

ERIC HOLDER, OUTGOING ATTORNEY GENERAL: A couple of business items. Now, my portrait hangs on the fifth floor of the Justice Department. And something that has not been mentioned, but that I really kind of pressed Simi Nots (ph), who is the author of - the author - the artist of the portrait, my kids' names are hidden in the - in the portrait. And if you look on the button of my jacket and on the wings of the eagle, you'll find the three of them. And that's the lore (ph) I want to have come out about this portrait, find the names of the Holder children, OK?

The other thing. Lee Loft (ph) just asked me to check to make sure that you all know that you're on annual leave. But in my final act as attorney general, screw it.

[14:29:54] This has been a great six years. Being at the Justice Department has - I say the last six years, but the reality is I've been at this department since 1976, you know, off and - off and on.