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CNN NEWSROOM

California Firefighters Desperately Trying to Gain Ground on a Dangerous Wildfire; New Richmond Police Officer Praised for Incredible Restraint in Potentially Life-Threatening Situation; Boat Full of Libyan Migrants Capsized in Mediterranean Near Coast of Malta; President Obama Met with Crown Prince of Abu Dhabi; Remembering Oklahoma City Bombing; Royal Baby Watch in Full Swing; Aired 3-4p ET

Aired April 19, 2015 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[15:00:23] FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Happening right now in the NEWSROOM.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get your hands up. Get your hands up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: A suspect charging but an officer holds his ground and does not pull the trigger.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I want to be absolutely sure before I used deadly force.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: The entire scene caught on a body camera. How one with the split second decision help saved another man's life and perhaps even his own.

And California residents forced to flee their homes as wildfire rage across hundreds of acres east of L.A.

Plus, the royal birth plan, a brother or a sister for little Prince George arriving any day now. How royals are tackling the birth of baby number two of Kate and William a differently this time around.

NEWSROOM starts now.

All right, hello again. And thanks so much for joining me. I'm Fredericka Whitfield. We begin with dramatic video that could have been the latest to show its deadly police shooting, but in this case the officer being threaten did not pull the trigger.

You can see the Ohio police officer repeatedly being charge at by a double murder suspect who keep yelling shoot me, yet even as the officer back pedals, and at one point fall backwards, New Richmond officer Jesse Kidder refuses to fire a shot. The officer's body camera captured the entire confrontation.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get your hands up. Get your hands up. Get your hands up right now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Shoot me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stop. Stop right there. I don't want to shoot you, man. I don't want to shoot you. That's enough. Don't do it man. I'll shoot you. I'll shoot you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do what you want. No you won't.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get back. Get your hand out of your pocket.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Shoot me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get your hands out of your pocket now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Shoot me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm not going to do it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Shoot me. Shoot me. Shoot me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stop it right now. Back up. Back the (bleep) up. Get down on the ground.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Subject is running. Subject is running.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Keep your hands out. Keep your hands out. You're going to get shot, you understand that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, sir.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: Joining us now is CNN's Polo Sandoval.

So this officer is being phrased in many circles for his incredible restrained or potentially life-threatening situation. What is the explanation to why he handled it this way?

POLO SANDOVAL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Fred. Well, as he really, just wasn't sure if this guy was armed or not. So at this point, what we know now is that he held back on using deadly force. And the reality is it only would have taken one shot for the story to take a terrible turn and we likely would be having a very different conversation right now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JESSE KIDDER, NEW RICHMOND POLICE OFFICER: I wanted to be absolutely sure before I used deadly force. SANDOVAL (voice-over): New Richmond, Ohio, police officer Jesse

Kidder knows this confrontation could have taken a deadly turn. The man seen running towards him is a suspect in a double murder, according to CNN affiliate, WLWT. Kidder tells the affiliate the man was trying to commit suicide by cop.

KIDDER: He just kept repeating, "shoot me." At one point, you know, he said "shoot me or I'll shoot you."

SANDOVAL: Despite the man's refusal to comply and with tensions running high, Kidder doesn't pull the trigger.

KIDDER: Put his hand in his pocket there. So my eyes are watching that hand right now and nothing else.

Stop! Stop right there. I don't want to shoot you, man. I don't want to shoot you.

SANDOVAL: Kidder back pedals and eventually loses his footing. But he keeps his cool and his sights on the suspect. Backup arrives just in time.

KIDDER: Get down on the ground.

Law enforcement officers across the nation have split-second decisions that mean life or death.

SANDOVAL: The decision to shoot or not shoot doesn't come easy according to experts. Officers often have to make that decision under pressure.

THOMAS FUENTES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: You are gambling as a police officer that if he pull as pistol out of his pocket, you can shoot him and stop him before he has time to get a shot off and kill you. And that might be a tenth of a second.

SANDOVAL: A second that could last a lifetime.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

[15:04:57] SANDOVAL: And Officer Kidder went on to say that his military background likely helped him to manage the situation, Fred, you see, he actually served as a marine during two tours in Iraq, even the recipient of the Purple Heart. As in case, you are wondering that body camera he was wearing, that's not standard issue for his department, his family actually bought it for him recently to serve as, really, an extra pair of eyes as he work to street. At this point, Fred, I can tell you, if it weren't for the camera, we would not have this heart-stopping images right now.

WHITFIELD: All right, Polo Sandoval, thank you so much.

Earlier I discussed this officer's actions with former FBI agent Jonathan Gilliam who is also a former Navy SEAL. And Gilliam is in that camp of people who is not necessarily applauding decisions made by this officer. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JONATHAN GILLIAM, FORMER NAVY SEAL: Statistics say that within 21 feet that individual can charge you before you draw a weapon. This officer had his weapon out. But when he fell down, he didn't know what the guy had in his hand at that point.

And here is that most important part of this whole thing, Fred, is that if you look around in the video, there are houses everywhere. This officer's job is not just to protect his life, but to make sure that that threat does not pose imminent danger on the public around him. And at that point, he did. And the officer, at the point where he started to back up and the guy who put his hand back in his pocket, he should have, in my view, shot the suspect. Because remember, you are eliminating the threat. That is the biggest thing here.

This individual is alive because this officer showed great restraint, but he went, in my opinion, he went too far. His training did not tell him to do that. And you know, the department is really backing him up because the video and because the guy, you know, actually did not get shot. But I think it's the wrong point to make. I think that the public should start realizing that there is a point when officers can no longer retreat. That's the big point here.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: That was former Navy Seal, former FBI agent Jonathan Gilliam.

All right, now to a developing story out of southern California. Firefighters there are desperately trying to gain ground on a dangerous wildfire as the state faces one of its most severe droughts on record. The fire is burning near a residential area, near the town of Corona, east of Los Angeles.

Joining me right now on the phone is Mike Mueller, fire captain for the California department of forestry and fire protection.

So Captain, explain to me what is happening right now.

MIKE MUELLER, FIRE CAPTAIN, CALIFORNIA DEPARTMENT OF FORESTRY AND FIRE PROTECTION (via phone): Well, we just got our latest numbers in. And right now, the fire has increased to 980 acres, 25 percent containment. These are 100-year-old fuel beds. So firefighters still have a lot of work ahead of them, but we can say all the evacuation orders have been lifted and we've got the residents back to their homes.

WHITFIELD: So how many residents are impacted if not everyone has been or if the evacuation orders have not been lifted everywhere. How many people still in potential danger?

MUELLER: As of 6:00 a.m. in California, we lifted all evacuations, so all residents we know. Right now, we have no current evacuations.

WHITFIELD: I see. OK. Now, what about structures? What kind of damage has taken place?

MUELLER: Well, we have no structures that were damaged or destroyed, and we have no injuries reported at this time. But we still have a difficult fire fight on our hands due to the access and the type of fuel it's burning in.

WHITFIELD: OK. What are the obstacles you can speak of?

MUELLER: Well, what is happening is this actually in a dam river basin (INAUDIBLE). And so, our engine companies can't necessarily drive up right to the fires. So a lot of our firefighters are having to hike in to fight the fires. So it makes it very difficult and time consuming.

WHITFIELD: All right. What about assistance from other firefighters in other localities? Are you at that point?

MUELLER: Yes, absolutely. We've got agencies throughout southern California that are assisting in this battle on this blaze.

WHITFIELD: All right, Captain Mike Mueller, thank you so much and all the best in your continued firefighting efforts there.

All right, now to the east coast, the Boston marathon tomorrow. And it is happening just as the convicted bomber prepares to be sentenced.

Our Alexander Field is live for us in Boston -- Alexandra.

ALEXANDRA FIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Fredricka. No doubt it is bound to be an emotional day here in the city of Boston. The very next day the penalty phase of that trial begins and soon jurors will be determining whether or not to spare the Boston bomber's life.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:12:43] WHITFIELD: All right, final security and race preparations are under way right now for tomorrow's historic Boston marathon. This year's race bears special significance since it comes against the back drop of the sentencing phase for convicted Boston bomber Dzhokhar Tsarnaev.

CNN's Alexandra Field joins us now from Boston with more on this.

So first, you know, you've got this high security. And then, of course, you also have the sentencing phase that begins the day after the race. What's to be expected?

FIELD: You know, it's weighing so heavily on the minds of people here in the city. The penalty phase of the trial will start on Tuesday. You'll hear from witnesses called from both sides. And then jurors will determine whether or not to spare Tsarnaev's life.

(INAUDIBLE) will happens tomorrow. There will be no court in session. The penalty phase will resume after the marathon. That would be Tuesday. But already the people who are involved in those attacks out here on this street just two years ago, they are offering their voices. They have incredibly powerful sentiments to share, Fredricka.

Earlier this week, we heard from Bill Richard, the father of Martin Richard, the 8-year-old boy who was killed in the attack. Here is what he wrote in an op-ed. He says this. "We know the government has its reasons for seeking the death penalty, but the continued pursuit of that punishment could bring years of appeals and prolong reliving the most painful day of our lives."

Bill Richard goes on to say to ask for a life sentence for Tsarnaev with no possibility of release and no chance of appeal, Fredricka. The victims of those attacks, they have different feelings on this. A lot of people will be closely following the next phase of that trial when it resumes after the marathon.

WHITFIELD: And then, Alexandra, there are some restrictions for the jurors as it pertains to that race. What are they?

FIELD: That's right. After the verdict, after the Dzhokhar Tsarnaev was found guilty on all 30 counts, and before they started the penalty phase, the judge actually asked the jurors to come in on an off day. He brought them into the courtroom to talk to them about the events surrounding the anniversary, which was April 15th and the marathon Patriots Day tomorrow. And he told them they are by no means allowed to participate in any events related to either be in anniversary or the marathon. They can't watch it. They cannot attend any gathering where it will be watch. They can't see it on TV. They can't turn out here.

This is a big day for the city. It is a huge celebration. It is an annual tradition. It brings out so many people from, not just this city, but really all over the country. The jurors are being told that because of the profound importance of this case, they cannot expose themselves to hearing more information and hearing other people's thoughts. They really need to keep their minds, just focused on what they hear in court. So they will not be participating in these events, Fred.

[15:15:18] WHITFIELD: All right, Alexander Field, thanks so much from Boston.

The Oklahoma federal building bombing was 20 years ago today. We'll take you to an emotional remembrance ceremony at the site of that attack next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:19:14] WHITFIELD: All right, the federal government had been growing pot for years for research purposes on a piece of land in Mississippi. But now, because of the growing use of medical marijuana, things are really blooming.

CNN's Dr. Sanjay Gupta checks out farm in "Weed 3."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DOCTOR SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Oxford, Mississippi, the middle of the campus of Ole Miss. This was our first visit here two years ago, spring 2013.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I can't remember the last time we actually grew more than an acre.

GUPTA: Since the 1970s this field has been the only place in the United States where scientists could get marijuana to dispense and research. The reason, to control the quality and distribution all what it from the soil to the study.

[15:20:04] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is the place where the marijuana has gone for federal research and there is nothing in the fields.

GUPTA: And there hasn't been for six years you say.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That is correct. The last time we grew was 2007.

GUPTA: Mahmoud (INAUDIBLE) is the farm's director.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are not growing because there is not much demand or the material.

GUPTA: Why isn't there more demand? This is something that a lot --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No research protocols. No research proposals. No requirement for the material.

GUPTA: That was then. This is now. Nearly two years later, there is acre upon acre of marijuana. Ever wonder what a revolution looks like?

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: All right. Dr. Sanjay Gupta, with me now in the NEWSROOM.

So Sanjay, I did stories on that farm in the late '90s. They didn't let me in, they let you in, however. But what is different know because at the time, it was the best-kept secret in terms of, you know, federal research. And then it seemed to lose popularity. And now, there was resurgence, why?

GUPTA: There was nothing being grown there a few years ago, Fred. I don't know what it was like back in the 1990s. They just basically said, look, we are not doing marijuana research here. And this was just two or three years ago.

What has changed now is in the last year alone, they increased production, as you just saw 30-fold. I mean, this isn't just incremental steps. They increase their production 30 times. And they are saying that they anticipate the scientific revolution. We are going to study this for patients with cancer, to epilepsy, the Alzheimer's, the MS, the pain. They anticipate all these research studies happening here, the things that haven't been studied in decades in this country. And they want the marijuana ready to do it.

WHITFIELD: So that marijuana at that farm being grown is for research purposes. But will it also find its way into certain dispensaries for medicinal purposes?

GUPTA: You know, that particular marijuana is going to be for scientists who want to study it. And as part of that studying, dispense it to participants in the studies. It's not really going to be available for mass use right now. This is research grade marijuana. That is what they are trying to grow there. If those studies pan out and some of those studies now started, you are going to see the first ever veterans PTSD in marijuana study underway in our documentary. If they fan out, then we take the same strains and make them available al at dispensaries and even at VA hospitals so that doctors can prescribe them (INAUDIBLE).

WHITFIELD: You write on CNN.com your strong thoughts about this medical marijuana revolution. What are the potential pitfalls if this nation does embrace more of a medicinal use of marijuana? Because as you mentioned, sometimes with good comes bad. There might be some hoe abuse the privilege for medicinal purposes. How does anyone in the medical community or otherwise control that?

GUPTA: It's challenging to control. And I think you would probably not be being honest if you said this is not going to be something that's people will abuse, that people will feign illness. It already started happening. I mean, it is, in times, comical. Some are what you are seeing in certain places around the country already.

I think you get to try to control as much as possible while recognizing that it will never completely go away. It's true with other medications, as well. Painkillers, for example, some of the most heavily abused medications in our country.

But I think the flip side of that is that there are people out there that get really legitimate medical benefit from this. When they get legitimate medical benefit when nothing else they tried worked. How do you provide the care people deserve while balancing with the idea there will be people who abuse the system? That abuse will occur, you want to curb that as much as possible, but don't deny people therapy that can help them.

WHITFIELD: All right, to see more of Dr. Sanjay Gupta's special investigation into medicinal marijuana, "Weed 3" airs tonight on CNN 9:00 eastern. And then at 10:00 p.m., the premiere of CNN's new series "high profits."

And we are back in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:27:33] WHITFIELD: All right. Hello again, everyone. Thanks for joining me. I'm Fredericka Whitfield.

An effort is under way to save as many as 700 Libyan migrants after their boat capsized in the Mediterranean sea near the coast of Malta. So far the Italian coast guard has only saved 28 of them. Migrants were fleeing terror groups like ISIS who are invading their war-torn homelands.

Our Phil Black joins me from London.

So, how are they going about it? This is a colossal effort. And is it mostly at nightfall?

PHIL BLACK, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. It doesn't look good at this stage, Fredricka. As you said, the numbers of people found, very low so far. It is from survivors aboard the vessel we believe there could have been as many as 700 people onboard this relatively small boat trying to cross the Mediterranean to seek asylum and better life, a safer life in Europe.

It is believed to have capsized when a merchant vessel dispatched to assist the boat approached. It's thought that many of those people of this sort kind of vessel moved to one side. It simply couldn't continue to stay upright under those conditions, capsized. If that many people were onboard the boat, it is now on the bottom because very little has been found. It's likely that most of those people on the boat are still there. That is certainly what's happened in the past. Most of the victims with these overcrowded vessels are found on the boat on the bottom of the sea itself.

This all puts great pressure upon the European Union to act because this is not an isolated incident. These boats are constantly making crossings across the Mediterranean from North Africa. Tens of thousands who made the journey already this year. Some 900 before today's incident lost their lives during so. These are terrible figures, very high given the space and time, certainly compare to last year. And it's not even at the peak season yet. That comes during the warmer summer months, Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: But the numbers are high enough to provoke even the Pope to weigh in on this crisis. What did he say specifically?

BLACK: Well, he is asking international community to do more and do something quickly to ensure it's not repeated. He wasn't specific. But human rights groups have been very specific in what they want. They want the European Union to do more to help people at sea. A large scale ongoing search and rescue operation. That's what used to be in place until November last year. But then the EU round that back, replaced it with a much smaller operation because there is a dominant idea within the European Union at the moment. And that is if you make it safe for these people to cross, it makes it more attractive. And so, therefore, more people will do so. But at the time that that change was made, human rights groups warned more people would lose their lives. That is certainly what we've seen today, Fredricka.

[15:30:13] WHITFIELD: All right, thanks so much, Phillip Black. Appreciate that from London.

All right, President Obama will be discussing the Iran nuclear deal this week when he meets with the crown prince of Abu Dhabi. Mohammed bin Zayed is also the head of the United Arab Emirates armed forces. The UAE, along with several other Arab countries have expressed concerns over the nuclear deal with Iran.

Sunlen Serfaty is at the White House for use today.

So there seems to be some particular concern over dropping sanctions against Iran. What is the worry here?

SUNLEN SERFATY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Fred. And the issue over sanctions is one of the biggest areas of contention as the framework comes together. There's concern about how fast the sanctions would be lifted and how they would be put back in place if Iran violates the term of the agreements.

Now, one of the biggest reasons why there is so much worry and concern is because there's two duly narratives that is coming out. Iran is saying that sanctions will be lifted immediately once this deal is signed. And the U.S., they are saying quite the opposite saying that they would be gradually phased out over time as Iran complies with the terms of this agreement.

But it is interesting though, President Obama, he has been recently downplaying the differences over this timeline of sanctions. He is really playing up instead and emphasizing the snapback provisions that would be in place. How those provisions would be put back into place when and potentially if Iran violates terms of the deal.

Now, Republican senator Bob Corker, he says this morning on CNN's "STATE OF THE UNION" that he believes the U.S. has already given too much up in these negotiations. And he says absolutely sanctions must be lifted gradually. Trust, clearly, is going to continue to be an issue, Fred.

WHITFIELD: And in the next round of nuclear talks with Iran, will continue this week. What is expected there?

SERFATY: That's right. Negotiators will get back to the drawing board. They'll head to Vienna on Tuesday. Now, this will be a median on political level. So lower level secretary Kerry, for example, is not going over. But they have major key details to really hammer out, not to mention sanctions that we just talked about, but also inspections of military facilities as they work towards potentially getting a final deal, the deadline June 30th -- Fred.

WHITFIELD: All right, Sunlen Serfaty, thanks so much at the White House. Appreciate it.

SERFATY: Thanks.

WHITFIELD: All right, remembering the Oklahoma City bombing exactly 20 years ago today. We'll take a look at the person who knew about the plot and could have helped save it and stop it before it happened. It might surprise you he is now a free man. That story next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:36:19] WHITFIELD: All right, today marks 20 years since the Oklahoma city bombing that took 168 lives, including 19 children when anti-government militants Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols detonated a truck bomb outside the Alfred P. Murrah federal building. President Clinton today marked the solemn anniversary at the memorial

that now stands at the site of that bombing.

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYING)

WHITFIELD: And even 20 years later, it is still difficult to make sense of a part of the story you might not be aware of, that a man who could have stopped the bombing is a free man today.

CNN's Gary Tuchman reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's an amazing site. It is six-storey building. And one half of the building is sheared away.

GARY TUCHMAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): One week after the Oklahoma City bombing and after Timothy McVeigh's arrest, McVeigh's friend Michael Fortier talked to CNN in his hometown of Kingman, Arizona.

MICHAEL FORTIER, MCVEIGH'S FRIEND: I did not believe that Tim blew up any building in Oklahoma. There is nothing for me to look back on and say, yes, that might have been -- I should have seen it back then. There was nothing like that.

TUCHMAN: Every one of those words, a complete lie. Michael McGuire would soon become Fortier's attorney. They first met shortly after that CNN interview.

MICHAEL MCGUIRE, MICHAEL FORTIER'S ATTORNEY: I'll never forget what he said next. Mr. McGuire, I know all about the whole plan to blow up the building.

TUCHMAN: Timothy McVeigh executed in 2001. Accomplice Terry Nichols in prison for life. Michael Fortier neither of those things. In fact, it's a secret where he is. How is that possible?

That a man who admitted to not only knowing about the plan, but admitting casing the Murrah federal building site with McVeigh. He knew how the bomb was built and where the explosive material was purchased. How is it he is not now in prison? It is to say at the least controversial and complicated. His lawyer illustrated these charts back in 1995 as Fortier told him what he knew.

MCGUIRE: This diagram is the actual diagram Tim drew out on a piece of paper what he called a shape charge.

TUCHMAN: These are the barrels of explosives?

MCGUIRE: This is how they would be set inside the truck.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We've seen a number of small children being carried bleeding heavily from the safe.

TUCHMAN: The bombing remains the heaviest home grown attack in U.S. history, 168 people killed including 19 children. Today the site of the Murrah building is a memorial and museum. Michael Fortier could have taken the information he learned from McVeigh and told authorities and stop the bombing plot in its tracks, but he chose not to do so. And 168 people were murdered.

So what is he doing today? Michael Fortier is a free man. Fortier claimed he didn't think McVeigh would carry out the bombing plan. He agreed to a plea bargain testifying against McVeigh and Nichols. He served about ten-and-a-half years in prison and was released almost a decade ago. Fortier now has a new identity and new hometown because he's in the federal witness protection program. Fortier still occasionally calls his lawyer.

Can you tell us where he is living, what his name is?

MCGUIRE: No.

TUCHMAN: He is still married?

MCGUIRE: Yes.

TUCHMAN: To the same woman?

MCGUIRE: Yes.

TUCHMAN: And he has children?

MCGUIRE: Yes.

TUCHMAN: How many children does he have?

MCGUIRE: Two.

TUCHMAN: And does he live a normal life?

MCGUIRE: No. He'll never be able to live a normal life.

TUCHMAN: I mean, in the witness protection program you're given a new identity. I mean, presumably his neighbors don't know anything about his background, correct?

MCGUIRE: I probably can't comment on that.

[15:40:03] TUCHMAN: But when you say he's not living a normal life, what do you mean because of the traumas of the past or things that happened in the present?

MCGUIRE: The traumas of the past and the risk to him.

TUCHMAN: Brothers Aaron and Elijah Coverdale were two of the children killed in the Murrah building's day care center. Their grandmother is Jeanie Coverdale.

JEANNIE COVERDALE, VICTIMS' GRANDMOTHER: It makes me angry to know he is enjoying life and all those people are dead and we are still suffering. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I had broken ribs, punctured lung and looked

like I was beaten with a baseball bat.

TUCHMAN: Priscilla (INAUDIBLE) was in the Murrah building trapped under the rubble for hours. She, too, is deep anger towards Fortier, but thinks his testimony is important.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, his life is going on, but I feel like in the end, he'll have to face judgment. That's my faith.

Fortier was dishonest and self-righteous when he talked us to.

FORTIER: Judge not for you shall be judged.

TUCHMAN: And 20 years later -- does he feel guilt 168 people are dead and could have stopped it if he said something, yet he is living this semi normal life with his family and children in freedom?

MCGUIRE: I think carrying guilt is an understatement.

TUCHMAN: Gary Tuchman, CNN, Oklahoma City.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: And next, police using reserve officers. Some will work for no money at all. We will take a closer look at possible dangers of using these officers.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:46:47] WHITFIELD: All right, what role do reserve deputies with the law enforcement agencies? That is a question being raised after a reserve deputy in Oklahoma killed a man after admitting he had mistaken his gun for a taser?

CNN's Atika Shubert looks at how research deputies are usually trained around the country.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ATIKA SHUBERT, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The video clearly shows mistakes made by 73-year-old reserve deputy Robert Bates. As the suspect is wrestled to the ground, Bate fires a gunshot, immediately apologizes and drops the weapon. Bates told police he thought he was firing a taser, but why was he there to begin with? Should sheriffs rely on volunteers in such dangerous operations?

RICHARD MACK, FORMER SHERIFF: I used them. And I wouldn't mind being a reserve deputy.

SHUBERT: Former sheriff Richard Mack says his reserves were trained like any full-time officers. The only differs, they weren't paid.

MACK: A lot of them work for free. There is not a police agency or sheriff's office who doesn't need that kind of help. With budgets the way they are these days and manpower being down, reservists are wonderful.

SHUBERT: There are thousands of reserved sheriffs deputies and more volunteer police. Duties and training vary from state to state. But a 2013 survey of reserve officers by the national sheriffs association show 45 percent had law enforcement powers of arrest on or off duty. 90 percent were armed. The overwhelming majority do vehicle and crowd patrol duties, although more than one-third also participated in dangerous operations such as the drug and gun bust Robert Bates was on. Perhaps most worrying, 43 percent said they spent less time on training than full-time officers.

That's not the case for Evan Wagoner, a reserve deputy in L.A. in his free time he does exactly what a full-time officer does for virtually no pay.

EVAN WAGONER, RESERVE DEPUTY IN L.A.: When you put on that badge, you know, you are taking the same risks as anybody else. And so, you have to have the same training. And you know, that badge is a burden. It's not a prize. I think you do have some reserves who have donated to departments and their heart's in it for the wrong reasons. And I think that is a huge problem. But I think by and large, most reserves in this country are doing the law's work and doing it well.

SHUBERT: Training is a concern and so are Robert Bates' frequent donations of equipment and funding of the Tulsa County sheriff's office.

MACK: The reason that the reservist program weren't is because they are real, certified, legitimate, bona fide peace officers. And if they are just paying their way into the department by making donations and then put a uniform and gun on their hip, no.

SHUBERT: The Tulsa, Oklahoma, shooting put reserves under scrutiny, but it won't change the fact police and sheriffs nationwide have come to rely on them to hold the thin blue line.

Atika Shubert, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: And checking your top stories.

French customs officers have seized more than two tops of cocaine from a sailboat, one very that is Whalen and two nationals were Spanish arrested in the raid off the coast of martin sneak in the Caribbean. The value of the sized cocaine is estimated at more than $105 million.

And a police officer in New Jersey is being call adhere row today after pulling a woman from a car on fire. You see what happened on the officer's dash camera there. The officer had to cut her seatbelt and then you see them eventually pulling the woman out of the car just minutes before it explodes. The woman was charged with DUI.

And this isn't black Friday, it is Lily Pulitzer fans rushing into target stores today, ling up, as you saw there, for the rollout of the limited edition designer collection, everything from lily's dresses to shoes, housewares, sold out in four minutes at this Target in Smyrna, Georgia. And it wasn't any easier for Lily fans online either.

Customers ran into problems on the Target Web site. The company says it had to take down the site temporarily to slow down the traffic. And it apologized for the inconvenience. Yes, of course, very happy about the popularity.

And we have fires out west and a major storm system affecting over 80 million people from Texas to the southeast. Heavy rains hit Texas. Dallas had tornado warnings and floodwaters hit the Houston area. There were also tornado warnings in parts of the south today.

And if you want to help people affected by the severe weather, head to our Web site at CNN.com/impact.

All right, the countdown to 40 weeks is on. And we are talking about the royal baby count, the watch of the calendar. Next with, we hear about prince and -- Prince William and Kate's plan for the birth of their second child.

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[15:55:37] WHITFIELD: OK. That royal baby watch is in full swing as the duke and duchess of Cambridge get ready for their second child. They are due at the end of this month but know at this point, it could be any day now.

Prince William and Kate haven't revealed the exact due date and we are starting to learn a little bit about the birth plan from "People" magazine, as the couple will not hire a second nanny. Kate will take nine months off her, you know, public engagements and all that and Prince William, he started a new job as an air ambulance pilot which means he will be closer to home.

So let's talk more about what is planned as baby number two is about to arrive, royal commentator Victoria Arbiter joining us now.

So Victoria, what do we know about, say, like the announcement or when she goes into labor or when she delivers? How much will the public know and will it be similar or very different from how things rolled out for Prince George?

VICTORIA ARBITER, ROYAL COMMENTATOR: Well, actually, it has already been very different, simply from the fact that the press has not been allowed to congregate outside the hospital in the same fashion that they did for Prince George.

Last time around, July 1st hit and the first camera people showed up and then the media sort of got panicky and everybody showed up. Need long wait that became known as the great Kate wait. This time around, the hospital said we are not standing for that because, of course, it is an operating hospital. It is a private wing. People paid a lot of money to be in that hospital.

So, we have been told that once Kate is admitted, that's when the first members of the media are allowed to start showing up. Their places have been allocated already. And then, really, it depends on how things unfold. Last time, Kate was estimated to be in labor around ten hours. She and William allowed themselves a couple of hours privately with Prince George before the announcement was made. So, really, once she has been admitted to the hospital, it could be a long waiting game.

WHITFIELD: Interesting. OK. So the public or, you know, press will be informed when she's admitted. Now, what about the whole announcement? We saw last time that all three of them, you know, came out for that official first photograph. And it wasn't that long after the birth. How might it be similar or different?

ARBITER: Really, it depends on what kind of birth Kate has. Hopefully, everything will go according to plan and able to have a natural birth as she did with Prince George. Generally, royals like to get out of hospital as quickly as possible because they are aware when they are in there, there is a lot of chaos that comes with a royal patient. There's security, there is all the media outside. So, if everything goes according to plan, we can expect to see Kate leave the hospital the next day in the same way that she did with George.

In terms of the announcement, it was a shame that old tradition sort of seemed not quite possible last time around. And again, it comes down to the fact that there were so many people waiting, so, yes, the traditional eves will be placed in the four corners of Buckingham palace, but it's going out on twitter beforehand and social media accounts that the royal family operates because they know there's no way to keep anything private anymore it will hit twitter, obviously, that will just be beamed around the world in a nanosecond and see the easel outside.

WHITFIELD: But is it true before the twitter potential moment that in a very, you know, pragmatic kind of traditional way, the message will be hand delivered to the royal family and there won't be the use of telephone or cell phone or, you know, anybody's Iphone, et cetera? Is that true that they will go that route, happened delivering a message?

ARBITER: No, they are not going to hand deliver to the queen, they will put a phone call into the queen, she will probably be the first to find out, Prince Charles and of course, Kate's parents. So they are going to know before anybody else knows and then it becomes a matter of controlling the media and the public interest.

WHITFIELD: All right. Well, good luck then. They are the prettiest people, aren't they? I mean, you can't get enough of just those still imams and the video images. There's never a bad picture of any of them.

ARBITER: No, there isn't. And of course, everyone is hoping that George will be at the hospital. That they said they are going to decide at the time, but we will see.

WHITFIELD: That's going to be a sweet photo.

All right, thanks so much. Good to see you, Victoria Arbiter. Appreciate it.

ARBITER: Thank you.

WHITFIELD: We have much more straight ahead in the NEWSROOM and it all starts right now.