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Dzhokhar Tsarnaev Guilty on All Accounts; Protests Erupted Over Deadly Shooting in South Carolina; Ferguson Elects Two African- Americans to City Council. Aired 3:30-4p ET

Aired April 8, 2015 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[15:30:01] KAREN BRASSARD, BOSTON BOMBING SURVIVOR: The younger brother was going to school. He didn't have the capability or the location to build bombs and do all of that. But I think he was all in with the brother. I don't think that -- I don't think that he was driven to that by any means.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Thank you, guys.

(CROSSTALK)

BRASSARD: It's important for me to be here, out here with you all.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In the trial --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: During the trial.

BRASSARD: For me -- for me personally I needed to go through the entire process. It's just the way that my healing can complete.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why?

BRASSARD: Because I feel like I needed to experience it from beginning to end. Something happened to me, and I need to go through it from beginning to end to get my brain to just understand the whole process.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you, guys.

BRASSARD: Thank you, guys.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you very much.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: All right. That is Karen Brassard, she is from New Hampshire. And she, her husband, and her daughter were at the marathon. Their first visit to the marathon to watch their friend's sister run. She was injured, her daughter was injured, her husband was injured most severely. He actually had a severed artery in his leg. And he basically only survived because two runners in the marathon took off their jerseys and tourniqueted his leg to help him survive.

That is just one of the stories coming out of this. And we are waiting to see if other survivors and other victims' family members will take to the microphone there in Boston where we have learned that Dzhokhar Tsarnaev is guilty on all counts, all 30 counts, in the Boston marathon bombing.

I want to get back to another story that we've been following out of South Carolina. The killing of an apparently unarmed black man by a police officer there who is now in prison facing murder charges. He has been fired. We learned that from the mayor as well.

And joining me to talk more about this now from North Charleston, we have CNN's Jason Carroll.

Jason, I know that you just spoke -- actually we don't have Jason Carroll but we are going to talk to him right after a quick break. He has just spoken with the family of that man there in the green shirt, Walter Scott, the 50-year-old who was killed. Stay tuned for that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:36:39] KEILAR: Just before the break, we showed you a disturbing video in its entirety of the shooting of an unarmed black man in North Charleston, South Carolina, by a white police officer. This is something -- this video shows the whole thing on tape. And this is something that has sparked rallies there in that community.

There was a press conference today with the mayor and the police chief that was disrupted by people who are so upset, who want answers, as this investigation goes on.

Joining me now from North Charleston, South Carolina, we have CNN's Jason Carroll.

And, Jason, the victim in this case who is in this video lying on the ground, Walter Scott, a 50-year-old man who was unarmed, then shot by Officer Slager who you see there, walking. You just spoke with his family. What did they say to you?

JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. And let's point out also shot in the back, Brianna.

KEILAR: That's right.

CARROLL: As you can imagine, the family is just heartbroken. I mean, they -- they tell me there just are no words to describe what it's like for them to see that video and to watch it over and over again. And for them, it's just heartbreaking.

Also earlier today, Brianna, the mayor and the police chief met with the family as well. They went out to the house, spoke with them, talked with them. The mayor and police chief also held a press conference, as you say, a little earlier this afternoon at one point announcing that Officer Michael Slager had been fired. They also announced that the police here will now be -- all be wearing body cameras going forward. They received funding for that.

That was the only time they got support during that press conference. After that, it really went south from there, especially when the police chief was questioned about the officer's taser. As you know, according to the police's account, the officer basically said that Walter Scott struggled with him over that taser. But the video seems to show him dropping an object near his body. And he was asked about that, the police chief, during the press conference. Listen to how he tried to respond.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHIEF EDDIE DRIGGERS, NORTH CHARLESTON, SOUTH CAROLINA POLICE: In the end of it, what I saw was a -- I believe to be a police officer removing the shirt of the individual and performing some type of life saving -- but I'm not sure what took place there.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But you don't know if CPR was performed?

DRIGGERS: I do not know. I -- I was told live saving -- that they tried to save his life.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CARROLL: So unclear whether or not he -- the officers used CPR. Unclear about this taser that was -- that may have been dropped near Walter Scott's body. These are points that will be reviewed during this investigation.

We should also tell you that after speaking to the family, they tell us that when they looked at that video Brianna and watched it over and over again, they said it never gets any better for them. What they're trying to remember is a brother, a man who was also a father. He was also a son. I spoke to his brother a little earlier.

I just want you to listen to what he had to say about it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANTHONY SCOTT, BROTHER OF SHOOTING VICTIM: When I saw it, I'm like, we have to have that. That's -- we have to have that. It shows everything. It shows the truth which I knew that the story which they were telling wasn't the truth. But when I saw the video, I said, we have to have that video.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[15:40:14] CARROLL: Well, Slager remains in custody. As you know, Brianna, his lawyer dropped him shortly after that video surfaced. It's unclear at this point who is representing him. This community at this point just trying to come together and heal. And this family, Brianna, still trying to make sense of it all -- Brianna.

KEILAR: They certainly are. Jason Carroll, thank you so much.

Meantime, protesters wearing T-shirts with the "Black Lives Matter" slogan rallied and marched in North Charleston. And then later some of the protesters interrupted that news conference as the police chief and the mayor spoke about the incident.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: All lives matter. All lives matter.

(APPLAUSE)

UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: Black lives matter. Black lives matter. Black lives matter. Black lives matter. Black lives matter. Black lives matter. Black lives matter.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: And we want to talk now to Black Lives Matter organizer Muhiyidin D'Baha. He's joining me now.

So, Mr. D'Baha, you were at the city hall today. There were other protesters there. We saw you in the video. You interjected some of the comments -- some of those that we heard from people in the audience during that conference with the mayor and the police chief there.

Tell us about your response to what you heard today and just also how this case has been handled so far.

MUHIYIDIN D'BAHA, BLACK LIVES MATTER ORGANIZER: Yes. Definitely. What would have happened if that video wasn't shown? What was the narrative that was being portrayed? That's what we're reacting to. The lies and the individuals that were part of that lie because there's so much harassment. And this upwelling right now is -- it's been coming for a very long time. And this is a moment and opportunity when Walter Scott passed away.

And if we had the truth in our hands, which we did, we didn't have the capacity to actually let the media and let the truth actually be known from the police department. We had no citizens review board, we had no ability to do that. And that's really what we're here to ask for, a citizens review board.

KEILAR: OK. So you want a citizens review board. Let's talk about that in just a moment. I want to ask you about something that I heard people today at this press conference saying. We heard the mayor and the police chief and they were saying look, we've turned this over to an independent group which is called SLED which is a South Carolina, like a state level group that is going to oversee this investigation now.

I heard someone in the audience say you all work together. There's obviously a lot of suspicion even at this point about there being -- about this investigation. Can you speak to that?

D'BAHA: Yes, of course. Where does the line stop? If there's contradictions in the story from the get-go, if you look at the -- just the initial incident report, there's information on there that was bad information. And so the SLED is working with bad information. At the same time, do we draw the line there? How do we know that SLED

doesn't receive information and turn a blind eye? Right now the whole system is in question because we have no means of accountability from the grassroots and from the community side.

KEILAR: OK. So talk about that. You want a citizens review board. What do you want them to do? What can they achieve?

D'BAHA: And so we can actually change the training, the recruitment, the policy. We can actually be able to have accountability systems that come from the grassroots. So an officer, a badge number that is abusing community members can get out right away. And the community can do that kind of work. That kind of work needs to be responded to fast.

We don't need a drawn-out investigation so there can be intimidation or administrative duties. We need the capacity to have a responsive system. And so a citizens review board is simply just a mechanism for the community's voice to be heard right away.

KEILAR: And what do you expect to happen? We've seen rallies already. Are we going to see more of this, and for how long? And what kind of support are you building there? And do you think this is going to spread far beyond South Carolina?

D'BAHA: Yes, definitely. What would have happened if it -- if there was no video released? That's the question we all need to be asking. Because we don't have the capacity as a community to say we know something different happened. But we don't have the evidence, we don't have the pull. And so one of the things that we're generating on the ground is actually being able to have communities come together, share stories of some of their testimony, of what's been happening and start to identify badge numbers right now. So we can have action done right now.

[15:45:07] If everybody is sympathetic to what's going on, then please support us in clearing out more bad apples, if we want to say bad apples. Bur really rectifying the whole situation by making sure it doesn't happen again. And a citizens review board is in fact what will do that.

KEILAR: All right. Well, we certainly understand your frustration with this situation now, as this video coming out and the story changing so drastically.

Mr. D'Baha, thank you so much for being with us. Appreciate it.

And after this, we are going to be looking at this video. It's very disturbing. But it tells such an important story about what really happened. It's a very different story as we've been talking about than what was out there before there was this video evidence of this.

We are going to dissect this. We will be looking at this step by step to try to figure out exactly what happened. Stay tuned.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [15:50:09]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No justice.

UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: No peace.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No justice.

UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: No peace.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No justice.

UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: No peace.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: And that was the scene in North Charleston, South Carolina, today as the mayor and the police chief tried to hold a press conference. A lot of people very upset because a police officer has been fired after being charged with murder.

This is all on video that was shot by a bystander that shows a white police officer firing eight times at an unarmed black man as he runs away. Four of the bullets struck 50-year-old Walter Scott in the back. The video shows him falling to the ground there and dying.

And with me now to talk about it, we have criminal defense attorney Brian Claypool, we have CNN's Don Lemon and we have CNN legal analyst, Sunny Hostin.

How different, Sunny, would this be if there was no video?

SUNNY HOSTIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, clearly it would be different because when the narrative first came out from the officer, he said he shot in self-defense. He was able to retain an attorney and that attorney dropped his representation the minute he saw the video.

And I think that is why when you look at recommendations for police reform, especially in the context of deadly force and the use of justifiable force, one of the top line recommendations is always body cameras. I have been a proponent for body cameras on police officers ever since I was a federal prosecutor because the bottom line is, Brianna, it not only protects potential victims. It protects police officers. It can support their version of events.

This time, it did not support his version of events, but I've got to say, I think, we really do have to commend the North Charleston Police Department as well as the mayor, because I don't think I have ever seen a police officer involved shooting be handled so swiftly.

We are talking about an April 4th shooting. This officer was charged with murder April 7th, three days later. He was also fired and he's also being held without bond. He faces up to 30 years in prison, up to life and also possibly the death penalty. I don't think we would have seen any of this without the video.

(CROSSTALK)

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: And that's how the process works.

KEILAR: Yes. But --

LEMON: And it should work that quickly. The video is a story. There would be no story without the video because this happens all the time, all over the country, and again, we always preface that by saying most police officers are good. But there are bad police officers who do terrible things like this officer appears to be doing in this videotape or in this tape, all the time. And it just so happens that this one was caught on videotape. And that's why we are sitting here talking about it now.

KEILAR: It's not just that. When you look at the police report and what appears to be claims not just by that officer but by other officers that CPR was performed, that they delivered first aid to Scott, you look at the video and, you know, what do you think, Brian, when you see that it appears that didn't even happen or if it did, it was some time before they attempted any life-saving measures, and there's no indication on this rather lengthy video that we see them even doing that.

BRIAN CLAYPOOL, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Brooke, I think this goes to an issue of training, too. And I think an investigation of this officer is not enough. He's been charged with murder. But I think what you're finding here, you also have complaints here of possible racism as far as pulling over African-Americans for minor violations.

I think we need a bigger investigation into whether there's a pattern and culture happening within the North Charleston Police Department much like the investigation that was done in Ferguson after the Michael Brown shooting. I think this is a deeper problem.

KEILAR: OK. Do you think -- do you think there is a deeper problem here?

LEMON: I --

KEILAR: When you hear Sunny saying, look, they dealt with it very swiftly. Within three days he's charged with murder.

LEMON: Yes. I think there's a deeper problem. And the brother spoke, I spoke to the family last night. The brother said there is a deeper problem. There are people there in North Charleston who say it is a deeper problem. And it's not just there. It's all over the country. There is a deeper problem and this again is bringing it to light. And this is not -- it's not -- yes, race is a factor but it's not just about race. This is about police -- people who are in positions of power who are abusing power. This is about abuse of power.

KEILAR: One of the things that we heard today in this press conference as people so upset disrupted this press conference and they were talking about how you work with them, that would be, they were saying to the North Charleston Police, who were saying, hey, we have handed this over to basically an independent investigation unit, the South Carolina Law Enforcement Division, SLED as they call it. People yelled but you work together. There is this sense that law enforcement is unfair and they're in cahoots.

HOSTIN: Well, yes, I think in this instance perhaps that's unfair. Because what you do want to happen when you have an officer-involved shooting, quite frankly, you want to have an independent unit investigate. That is one of the recommendations that was made for the Michael Brown shooting, that was one of the investigations that was made in New York.

LEMON: Yes.

[15:55:07] HOSTIN: It's been made over and over and over again. And so to suggest somehow that that isn't the right thing to do is incorrect. What is the wrong thing to do is to have prosecutors investigate along with local police officers, investigate their own. I can tell you from being a former prosecutor that you work day in and day out with these agents, with the FBI, with police officers, and then to suggest that you should be the person to prosecute them and investigate them is just ludicrous.

(CROSSTALK)

HOSTIN: I wouldn't want to investigate you, Don Lemon.

LEMON: Not the only agency that investigates itself. Right? Yes.

HOSTIN: Exactly. And so I think this is the right thing to do. And it's interesting because we're seeing -- it's sad but interesting, we're seeing so many of these cases but there is a playbook now, isn't there? We are seeing swift action, we are seeing the recommendation for body cameras, we're seeing the recommendation for civilian complaint review boards.

KEILAR: Yes.

HOSTIN: And this is where we need to be.

CLAYPOOL: Right.

KEILAR: We really need those body cameras.

And guys, sorry to interrupt. Just stay with me for a second because we're going to talk about another story right now.

This anger over what is going on right now in South Carolina with the white police officer facing a murder charge in the fatal shooting of a black man, it echoes of course what happened last summer in the St. Louis suburb of Ferguson, Missouri. You can't really talk about what happened in South Carolina without talking about Ferguson and the outrage over it. That's where a white police officer shot and killed a black teenager, Michael Brown. He was not charged and now there is something that may ease racial tensions there.

Ferguson electing two more African-Americans to its city council. Half of the six-person council now comprised of black members. This is a closer representation of the city's diversity, not exactly it, where you have -- pardon me, 70 percent of the residents are black.

And joining me now to talk about this, one of those newly elected officials joining me now, Wesley Bell. He is a professor and a local magistrate and now he's one of two new African-Americans elected to the Ferguson City Council.

I want to congratulate you on your win and before we talk about Ferguson, I want to ask you about South Carolina. Certainly you have seen this video out of North Charleston. Give us your reaction to that.

WESLEY BELL, ELECTED TO WARD 3, FERGUSON CITY COUNCIL: I was sickened. I actually saw the video this morning. I had first read the accounts and that was heartbreaking enough. And then to actually see it, you know, because it was, like I said, it was just sickening.

KEILAR: And was there anything about it that really just sort of fed into some of the frustration that you'd already seen in your own community?

BELL: You know, I'm going to -- I don't want to condemn all officers for the actions of a few. What I saw on that video, that appeared to just be murder. You know, if there's aggravating circumstances, obviously the law takes those into consideration, particularly with the use -- when using -- with the use of force, but what I saw on the video, that was not justified by any stretch of the imagination.

KEILAR: Yes. And you -- maybe you don't compare Ferguson and South Carolina as being apples to apples in this. I want to talk to you about last night's election. Ferguson has really been plagued by some poor turnout in the past but you had double the usual voter turnout last night.

What does it mean to you that you had more people deciding to participate, keeping in mind I will say the turnout was still not overwhelming, but there were definitely more people who were saying I'm going to participate at the ballot box. What did that mean to you and also the fact that now the city council is more representative of the makeup of Ferguson?

BELL: Well, first, don't try to bring us down. That was a great turnout and I'm not going to let you ruin it.

KEILAR: OK. All right. It was double. No, I will -- I mean, when you double your turnout, that's pretty good. That is good, I will say.

BELL: Yes. No, more -- we more than doubled the turnout. That's the largest turnout in our ward in the history of Ward Three. And what makes us most proud, and I say us because I have a great team around me, Miranda Wilson, Dan Peters and many others. But what's great about it is that our entire campaign was focused around community outreach and bringing people together.

So it just validated -- it validated all the things that we believe, that we -- our core values, so that's what makes us most proud.

KEILAR: I certainly see your point there. I didn't mean to bring you down. I hear you there. I just want to ask you one final question just because --

BELL: That's OK.

KEILAR: You know, you didn't compare -- actually, sorry, Wesley Bell, I got to let you go. Thanks so much for being with us. We are out of time. We really appreciate you being with us.

And that does it for me. "THE LEAD" with Jake Tapper starts right now.