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Nine Killed in Missouri; Potential Criminal Activity at IRS; CNN Hero; DHS Spending to Expire Today; "Finding Jesus" Premiers Sunday on CNN

Aired February 27, 2015 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: And we are just getting breaking news into our newsroom here at CNN. This morning in Missouri, nine people have been killed at four separate locations in Tyrone. That's about 130 miles southwest of St. Louis. "The Houston Herald" is citing the county sheriff who says there may be even more crime scenes. There is no word on what is motivating this onslaught or who is behind it. We do understand that in Tyrone, Missouri, however, the school district has asked officials to arrive early today for counseling services. Not to suggest this is a school shooting, but somehow in Tyrone authorities are telling people that there will be counseling services available.

So we are just getting information into our newsroom. We will go to our affiliate there as soon as they have a news conference and we will bring you more developments as soon as we have them.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Right. Information is coming in. The sheriff there saying it could be four, even five different crime scenes that involve the nine deaths reported so far. We don't know about others or injuries. Neighbors have been calling in reports that very early in the morning, like 3:45 local time, officers were on scene asking for injured inside the home. It gives a sense of the very randomness going on with this event, as if they were moving along with it.

Another neighbor said that they, too, had been told to stay indoors. We do know the state police have set up a mobile command center in the area. As we get the information, we will bring it to you. Please stay with us for that.

We do have another big development to tell you about this morning in the IRS investigation, looking into those mysterious e-mails and how they disappeared belonging to former official Lois Lerner. CNN's Chris Frates is developing that story for us from the Washington bureau.

Chris, what do we know now?

CHRIS FRATES, CNN INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Chris.

We now know that the watchdog investigating the missing e-mails is looking into the possibility of criminal activity. The news broke late last night when the deputy inspector general testified before a congressional committee. He didn't elaborate on who might have broken the law or how and he reminded lawmakers that the investigation is ongoing and he cautioned them against jumping to any conclusions.

But the news that there's a potential criminal activity is very important. Remember, Lois Lerner was the IRS official at the center of a huge scandal accused of targeting conservative groups trying to get non-profit status. When Congress began investigating the scandal, they asked for Lerner's e-mails but the IRS said some of the e-mails had been lost and they weren't recoverable. Well, last year the inspector general was able to find a lot of those lost e-mails. And last night we learned that officials had found even more computer backups that might have additional e-mails on them.

When I talked to House Oversight Committee Chairman Jason Chaffetz, after the hearing, Chris, he told me, quote, "the IRS had as a lot of explain to do."

CUOMO: Well, I'll tell you, Chris, you know, you're an investigative reporter, but you don't have to be one to say that when they say there's potential criminal activity and those e-mails went missing, you're going to have a problem there going forward. Please stay on it for us. We know you will.

Christine.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN ANCHOR: All right, today's CNN hero recognizes a 12-year-old hero who saw a problem, thought of a solution and didn't wait to grow up to act. Lily Born noticed that her grandfather was having trouble drinking from a cup. His hands shaking because he had Parkinson's disease. So she invented something to make his life, and the lives of so many others, a little better.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LILY BORN: My grandfather has Parkinson's disease that causes him to shake. He spilled all the time. So I decided to make the Kangaroo Cup.

I came up with the idea when I was around eight or nine years old. I wanted to put legs on the cup because I figured that it wouldn't be as likely to spill.

I have a design team and they really do help me so much.

Color-wise?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

BORN: Blue?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Lily has sold about 11,000 cups total. Many of her classmates and teachers don't even know what she's doing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because I want to be like the next big thing. BORN: I really do keep the Kangaroo Cup talk to a minimum.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I remember reading about it online (ph).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Now the word is getting around school. Like, wait, Lily? She did what? She invented this cup? Oh, my gosh.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That is so cool!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hi, Lily. How you doing?

BORN: Good.

My cup has changed my grandfather's life because that's the only cup he uses now. One day I want to give money from the Kangaroo Cup to Parkinson's Research and hopefully they'll find a cure.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: here's to ya.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CUOMO: What a beautiful gesture for her to do. We wish her a lot of success with that. Kids, they just see a path, they see no challenge, no obstacle, just solution. Beautiful, beautiful thing for her and her grandpa and a lot of other people.

All right, let's take a break here. When we come back, let's put the clock up. It matters. Homeland Security funding on the line as this deadline crepes up. Tonight, the Republicans could save it or could cause harm to their party if they don't get a deal done. We're going to have Michael Smerconish on this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAMEROTA: Well, funding for the Department of Homeland Security could expire at midnight tonight. We are 15 plus hours away from that unless Congress passes a bill today that will extend the agency's budget just for three weeks. The bigger concern could be a possible shutdown that would allow terror group like ISIS -- could allow them to gain an advantage without a solution here.

Let's bring in Michael Smerconish. He's a CNN political commentator and host of CNN's "Smerconish."

Michael, great to see you.

MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Thank you.

CAMEROTA: So it just feels like this is the new normal. This is what Congress does. They push -- because they can't make a decision, they push everything to the brink. We're sort of used to that now.

SMERCONISH: I think that's true. I also think it's political malpractice. I mean take a look at the front page of any newspaper in the country or listen to the items that you've been discussing. It's all about jihad johnny. It's about the pillaging of Assyrian Christians in Syria today. It's about the Brooklyn three. It's about a potential threat on the Mall of America. And what is the GOP targeting? Funding for the Department of Homeland Security? They must be crazy.

CUOMO: They say, hold on, we're not targeting anything. The president took extra constitutional actions. He is putting it on DHS because that's who will have to enact his orders. He did this, not us.

SMERCONISH: So I would say to them, target commerce. Target some other department. Target education. But at this juncture in time, to be jeopardizing the funding for the Department of Homeland Security, it's not going to play well in the country. That's my point politically.

ROMANS: There's also the big irony that, in fact, parts of the immigration system are actually run by fees and a judge has already stopped the president's order already, so it's really political and symbolic what they're trying to do.

SMERCONISH: You've got to get pretty far into the weeds, I think, to understand what the geo perspective is. I think there will be a more superficial interpretation which says, we really need the Department of Homeland Security, particularly at this moment, and the Republicans are standing in the way of its funding.

CAMEROTA: But is this really threatening our national security or will essential workers continue to show up? And once they figure all this out, even the nonessential workers will get back pay?

SMERCONISH: I think that's probably the reality. I think it's a battle for perception. I would hate to think that they haven't planned for this contingency. I suspect today there will be a vote, it will be saved. If not, within the next three weeks it will be resolved. But how embarrassing, you know, to tinker with national security in the name of partisanship, which is what I think this is all about.

CUOMO: Right. Hey, then, look, it makes it even worse in a way if you're targeting it but only doing it with non-essential employees. But then you have Jeh Johnson coming over who says it's not non- essential, we need all of them. I don't have enough as it is. Don't mess with us right now because we don't ever know which element of us will make us effective.

ROMANS: It's embarrassing to give an IOU to workers in this country. The biggest, richest country in the world, we're give -- we're going to give middle class workers an IOU and say, we'll pay you later. That's just -- it's crazy.

SMERCONISH: Agreed, especially those with an important task.

ROMANS: Right.

CAMEROTA: Let's talk about what's happening next week in Congress.

SMERCONISH: Sure.

CAMEROTA: Benjamin Netanyahu's visit. Now 30 Democrats say that they're going to be boycotting his address to Congress. Do you think that he should be coming? Should Democrats be boycotting? Where are you with this?

SMERCONISH: Where I am on this position is that I think it sets a dangerous precedent. I think many --

CUOMO: The boycotting or the Bebe coming?

SMERCONISH: No, Bebe coming in the midst of an election two weeks out and using, I think, our Congress as a forum to make a political statement. That's my view. And I would encourage people who look at this as a referendum on Obama not to do so. I think there's a tendency to -- if you're for Obama, then you side one way, and if you're against Obama you side another. Instead, imagine that it's President Rand Paul and that Speaker Pelosi has decided to invite a foreign head of state to speak to the Congress without consulting the White House. I don't like that precedent because on matters of foreign policy I think it's important to speak with one voice, and that's now what they're doing in this instance.

CUOMO: I have to think about that.

CAMEROTA: I know. I see your contemplative face.

CUOMO: That's a strong point. The other side is, of course, that they say, first of all, we can invite anybody we want and there's a huge issue at stake here with what's going on in Iran and as fellow supporters of Israel, which is a very strong poll, bipartisan one, this is bad policy. The president's on the wrong side of it and we want to give this voice.

SMERCONISH: Yes, I'm unsettled. I was unsettled when Eric Cantor came into his leadership position several years ago, had a meeting at the Regency Hotel as it was reported with Prime Minister Netanyahu and gave him the assurance, don't worry, we have your back. I really didn't like that. And this reminds me of it because they're saying, we have your back against whom, essentially? Against the commander in chief, the president of the United States? I'm all for supporting and defending Israel, but you've got to put American interests first. And if you're contravening the commander in chief, I think it's a bad precedent.

CAMEROTA: I know you both wanted to talk about this new public policy polling that you've both had interesting tidbits in. Do you want to start?

CUOMO: Well, Michael's the guest. Who do you like?

SMERCONISH: It's -- so it's a Republican poll. It's a poll of GOPers. And they're saying that, you know, many of them agree with the sentiments expressed by Mayor Giuliani a week ago in terms of questioning --

CUOMO: Many, it's like 70 something, right?

SMERCONISH: Seventy some percent who question the president's love for the country. And what I would say is, these are the folks who are gathered at CPAC. You know, these are the folks who control the primary and the caucus process. I don't think they speak for all Americans, but this is what will shape the GOP nomination.

CUOMO: They also have in the poll that over half of those polled among the Republicans say that Christianity should be our national religion, and a very small number disagreed with that notion in a separate question part and it's very interesting. Even though that is a direct contravention of the Constitution and what we're supposed to be about, it shows that as we're fighting religious extremists --

SMERCONISH: Right, let's be like them. Let's establish our own caliphate, even if it is Christianity.

CAMEROTA: But maybe it's a reaction to them. I mean wanting to be about Christianity because they see that it's under threat and imperiled around the world.

SMERCONISH: I like Chris' observation though. This really does contravene the Constitution, the establishment clause, and yet the proponents of this, I'm sure, would be thumping their chests and embracing the Constitution of the United States.

CUOMO: The word "God" is not in the U.S. Constitution and there must be a reason for that.

SMERCONISH: Freedom of religion, freedom from religion. That's what it guarantees.

CAMEROTA: Michael, great to see you.

SMERCONISH: You as well.

CAMEROTA: All right, check out "SMERCONISH" Saturdays at 9:00 a.m. Eastern here on CNN. And you can hear him weekdays on Sirius XM, also at 9:00 a.m. Eastern.

CUOMO: You know, CNN always ready to take you on an amazing journey. This is one. The lifee and death of Jesus, a brand new series you do not want to miss debuting this weekend. We've got a sneak preview for you. It's called "FINDING JESUS" next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CUOMO: CNN big into the ambitious projects and they have another one, "FINDING JESUS", an in depth look finding the artifacts and evidence surrounding Jesus' life and death. In the premier episode, it's his alleged burial cloth. Remember that? The Shroud of Turin going under the microscope.

Let's bring David Gibson and Michael McKinley. They're co-authors of the book "Finding Jesus: Faith, Fact, Forgery" produced in conjunction with the series. Of course, the big question, was there a Jesus?

MICHAEL MCKINLEY, CO-AUTHOR, "FINDING JESUS: FAITH, FACT, FORGERY": Oh, yes, absolutely there was a Jesus. I mean, it's fashionable in some scholarly circles these days to say he might not have existed and was an invention, but I think the one thing that is for sure is that he existed. And our quest was to figure out what he left behind.

CUOMO: Why for sure? Give me the confidence boost because many will disagree.

DAVID GIBSON, REPORTER, RELIGION NEWS SERVICE: Because they know there are contemporary references outside the gospels of historians of the day who talk about this Jesus and about -- mainly about the followers who left behind this church that grew up from nothing. Again, this guy, you know, he was crucified. He was supposed to be the Messiah who was going to become the King of Israel that was going to lead the people. He was crucified as a common criminal and yet this amazing community grew out of this -- you know, we've got this guy who died a death that nobody expected.

CAMEROTA: Right. So one of the things that you explore is the Shroud of Turin?

GIBSON: Yes.

CAMEROTA: So what have you discovered about the Shroud of Turin? What is it?

MCKINLEY: Well, in and of itself it's a burial shroud from the First Century, so based on Jewish burial customs. But what we've really discovered is that the more science you bring to it, the more mysterious it gets.

CUOMO: Mysterious meaning that you don't think it's real? Or you think it is real, and if it is real, is it connected to him in any way?

MCKINLEY: You can't -- the more science you put to it, you can't disprove it. In other words, science hasn't yet said it's a forgery. They've tried.

CAMEROTA: So they've sampled the fibers and they've sampled the material on the fibers.

MCKINLEY: Yes.

CAMEROTA: And what have they found?

MCKINLEY: Well, they did it in the 1980s. And they took a sampling from the edges. Three independent labs checked it out and they said it was from the middle ages. However, the sample they took from the edges had been handled by all kinds of grimy middle-aged hands. And so could be a polluted sample. Subsequently theories have cast doubt on that. The only for sure way would be to take a sample from the middle, which isn't going to happen, so we have to look at other ways.

GIBSON: The other thing is how did that image get on there? Nobody's got -- even if it's only 1,000 years old, how did it get on there? If it was 2,000 years old, is that actually the face, the image of Jesus? Nobody's explained these things adequately. So we really try and delve into those mysteries.

ROMANS: 2,000 years on, why is this all so fascinating? It's still so fascinating. Even people who don't believe in Jesus Christ and the church that grew up behind him, people are fascinated by Jesus, what he looked like, and any kind of tangible evidence around him.

MCKINLEY: Well, I think, you know, when you look back at what he was trying to do, he was a rabbi from the back of (INAUDIBLE). He was going to shake up Judaism a little bit, and ended up founding a global religion that has captured the imagination of the world for 2,000 years. So the central character of that religion is still fascinating to us because we want to understand the man behind the message.

CUOMO: Right. And I think for believers it may be even more compelling because, yes, you believe, but wouldn't it be great to have proof? I know that's not what faith is -- I know, believe me, I know, I know. And I hear a new voice from above telling me the same thing, but the counter evidence, you also have the Sudarium of Oviedo. What is that? And what does that do in terms of throwing a wrench in the mix?

MCKINLEY: Well, actually, the gospel of John tells us two cloths were found in the tomb. One was the burial shroud and one was the kind of face cloth wrapped around the head of Jesus after he had died. Ad the Sudarium is that cloth, and it winds up in Spain. And tests have been done on it that show not only do the blood stains match those on the shroud, but the blood type is the same.

CAMEROTA: Wow. Could that be DNA of Jesus Christ?

CUOMO: What blood type was it?

MCKINLEY: AB.

CUOMO: AB. What blood type are you?

ROMANS: I have no idea. A plus. What are you?

CUOMO: Of course you're A plus. I'm D minus.

(LAUGHTER)

CAMEROTA: He walked into that. But so it's DNA. I mean, DNA, all of the progress we've made in DNA, is it going to crack this code? Is it going to solve this?

GIBSON: No, because the DNA you haven't been able to extract. There are still some doubts about -- even though you've got this blood type match, it's not a slam dunk to make the match. So there are always these -- I don't want to give too much away about the show, but there are always these kinds of doubts that, again, despite our advances in technology and in science, there are always some lingering doubts. Again, even if we prove that this is 2,000 years old and it's the image of a crucified man, is it Jesus?

CAMEROTA: Right. Such good stuff. David Gibson and Michael McKinley, we'll be watching the program.

CUOMO: Yes, we don't usually let people come on here and we ask them a question, they get to answer us a question, they leave with a bloody nose. But this one you do.

All right, thank you very much. You get to uncover more in the premiere episode of "FINDING JESUS". That's this Sunday, 9:00 p.m. Eastern of course on CNN. Here's a lilt bit of it right now. Here's the promo.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: An unprecedented CNN event. He didn't vanish without leaving a trace.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For the first time in history we're able to place these relics.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And grasp something that changed the world.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is really the moment of truth.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is the story of Jesus.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The rock upon which the church was built.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: An icon of scientific obsession.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is extraordinary to find an archaeological piece.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What do we really have here?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why did Judas betray Jesus?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Somebody chose to write this.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The science does matter. Is this the burial shroud of Jesus.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What are the clues he left behind?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Faith, fact, forgery.

"FINDING JESUS" premiers Sunday night at 9:00 on CNN.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CUOMO: Just talking about exactly this here on the couch because it's such a good story, certainly the Good Stuff.

All right, the hero of Reservoir Road. Reservoir Road, nasty hill in Arkansas. The ice storm we just had turned it into everything from a frustration to an icy graveyard for cars. Enter Wayne Shaw. Lived along Reservoir Road for 11 years. Knows the drill. Spent an entire day helping those who don't know the drill.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WAYNE SHAW, SPENT ENTIRE DAY GIVING PEOPLE A LIFT OUT OF SNOW: I've only given rides to three people. Driven four cars up the hill. Gotten three out of the street so they don't get hit by the other cars coming through, and just various assistance to probably another dozen.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: That's right. He knows how bad it is, so he took it upon himself to help people. Threw chains on the truck, got busy all day. And he says it wasn't completely selfless.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHAW: I was raised out in the country, you help your neighbors out, and that night I don't want about 15 cars piled up in my driveway, too, so --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: He didn't want the cars piled up either.

CAMEROTA: We have one more bit of Good Stuff also. We welcome to a new addition to our family. Our audio engineer Shimon Baum and his wife, Rose, had a baby boy, Benjamin Baum. He's 7 lbs 3 oz, everybody is doing great. Congratulations to them.

CUOMO: Congratulations. Get back to work!

A lot of news. Get to the "NEWSROOM" with Carol Costello. Carol, have a great weekend.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR, "NEWSROOM": All right. Thanks, you too.

"NEWSROOM" starts now.