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NYPD and Mayor Bill de Blasio; NYC Mayor's Remarks at Police Athletic League Lunch

Aired December 22, 2014 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


REV. CALVIN BUTTS, PASTOR, ABYSSINIAN BAPTIST CHURCH: Mr. Lynch may not have it correctly because he's a union leader and he's pushing a very aggressive agenda. But at the same time, you can't ignore him because many of those officers are listening to him. And he seems to have more of their spirit than the mayor does.

(CROSSTALK)

BLITZER: Hold on a second. The mayor is standing. Now he's sitting down again.

(LAUGHER)

We assume this is going to begin very soon.

You know what? Let's take a quick break. We'll resume our coverage. Hopefully, we'll hear from the mayor when we come back. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Welcome back. The Mayor Bill de Blasio is going to be speaking about the relationship between the police and the community. He's got his own issue right now. A lot of the police officers in New York City, the more than 30,000 police officers in New York City, they are very upset at the mayor for some of the comments he's made in recent weeks and the anger has surfaced over the past 48 hours with the brutal shooting of two police officers in Brooklyn, Rafael Ramos and Wenjian Liu, brutally shot down by Ismaaiyl Brinsley who came into New York from Baltimore, simply took out a handgun and these two police officers were in their car and he shot them both dead, shot them in the head. The mayor is at least, by some of these police officers, being at least partially blamed for some of the statements he made, statements that were seen as critical of the New York City police department. There's a new poll, by the way, as we await the mayor that came out, we asked the question, does the U.S. criminal justice system treat whites and blacks equally? Yes, 50 percent of whites said yes. 42 percent of whites said no. There's a very, very different answer from nonwhites, only 21 percent said yes. 69 percent said "no." We're awaiting the mayor.

Calvin Butts, Reverend Calvin Butts, a community leader, a pastor of Abyssinian Baptist Church in New York, he's still with us.

Let me get your quick reaction to that poll, Reverend. 50 percent of whites think the U.S. criminal justice system treats blacks and whites equally. What do you think about that?

BUTTS: Well, I think it's about right. Those of us who are not white know statistically that we are treated unfairly by the criminal justice system here in this nation. Most of the drugs are not purchased by black people. Most of the drugs in this country are not sold by black people but yet black people are the ones mostly incarcerated because of the sale of drugs. Crime rates. If you look at the crime rates in most cities, most of the crime is not perpetrated by people of African descent, though it would seem that that is the case. But yet most of the people incarcerated for crime are people of African descent. It's unfair and I think that book by Michelle Alexander points this out very well. I would encourage everyone to read it because the prison system is now akin to what slavery was many, many years ago. So I agree with you.

BLITZER: Yeah. Let me move on as we await the Mayor Bill de Blasio getting ready to address this group, this Police Athletic League luncheon, on this very sensitive subject of his own personal relationship which is not so good with so many of the cops in New York right now.

Let's bring in CNN political commentator, Paul Begala, joining us from Arlington, Virginia; our CNN political commentator, the former speaker of the House, Newt Gingrich.

What do you think the mayor needs to say right now, Newt?

NEWT GINGRICH, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR & FORMER SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: Well, I think he needs to say that, you know, whatever past statements he wants to work with the police, he wants to reinforces the police and he wants to make clear that the kind of assassinations that we saw this weekend are totally, utterly completely unacceptable. But he has to take some responsibility for the rhetoric and language and the attitude which has so alienated the New York City police department. It's a huge department, as you pointed out, Wolf, and they are deeply alienated from the mayor, more than any I can remember in history.

BLITZER: Paul Begala, does he need to formally express regret for his comments, his actions? Does he need to apologize to the NYPD?

PAUL BEGALA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Wolf, there's a lot of pain. I'm not sure which comment you're referring to but there clearly is an enormous amount of pain there. He should say all of the things that Newt just suggested. It's good advice. I'm much more troubled not by what he says but what he doesn't do. I heard Calvin Butts say that the mayor had refused to meet with him. Well, that's just wrong. He needs to listen more. Yes, he needs to say the right things but he needs to listen more. At the same time, this was a horrific, vicious murder and I think it's much more befitting of ISIS than any American to murder Officer Liu, Officer Ramos that way. And we cannot live in a society where that happens. Nor should we live in a society where we're not free to criticize authority figures without worrying that we'll be blamed for what some deranged subject does. I do think we need to assign more culpability to the murder, not to any statement that the mayor or anybody else said. BLITZER: Let me ask Chris Smith, because you've been covering this

story for "New York" magazine, Chris. What statement did the mayor make that so angered the New York Police Benevolent Society, that angered so many cops in New York in the aftermath of the Eric Garner death?

CHRIS SMITH, CONTRIBUTING EDITOR, NEW YORK MAGAZINE: Well, a couple of things. The mayor has supported the police both materially and verbally in the ways that Newt just asked him to do. He has disavowed violence and disruption in the city. He's been criticized, in particular, by some of the police unions for his speech in a Staten Island church after the grand jury decision in which he talked about his bi-racial son, Dante, needing to be careful, wary in his potential encounters with police officers. In that poll you showed, Reverend Butts, really gets to the heart of the matter here. The police for all their good work? Driving down crime over the past decade or longer, now many of them feel that they are being blamed. They are the ones being held responsible by a lot of people and partly they attribute this to the mayor for racism in this country and that's a painful and complicated thing. Has there been police misbehavior? Sure. But they feel like they are being the ones, in many instances, pinned the blame here, being made guilty for the racism and the larger problems that exist.

BLITZER: We have some video of the mayor earlier today going over to the homes of the two police officers who were gunned down. I'll show you some of that video the two police officers, Rafael Ramos, Wenjian Liu. There's the mayor and police commissioner, Bill Bratton, going inside the home. I'm sure once the mayor starts speaking in a little while, he's going to be talking about what he said to the families and how he's dealing with this crisis in New York. And here are the mayors emerging. This is video that just came in courtesy of our affiliate, WABC, in New York City. This was earlier, the mayor and police Commissioner Bill Bratton were there and paid their respects to the families of these two police officers.

Let's take a quick break. We'll resume our special coverage. We'll hear from the mayor when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: All right. We're standing by. The mayor of New York is now being introduced by the former D.A., district attorney, in New York. We're going to hear what the mayor has to say.

Tensions are obviously very, very high right now between the mayor and NYPD. The mayor has a lot of work to do, in fact. We saw the virtually unprecedented picture of the mayor of New York going to the hospital Saturday night to pay his respects to the two police officers who were gunned down and you saw two columns of police officers simply turning their backs on the mayor of New York, refusing to look at him, refusing to look at him in the eye. They simply turned around, refused to look at the mayor. So the mayor knows he's got work to do. Earlier, he met with the families of Rafael Ramos and Wenjian Liu, the two police officers who were gunned down. Tom Fuentes, as we await the mayor, here's the concern in New York

City and it's demonstrated. Police officers are new rules now. They are not going out by themselves. They are being joined by others. They are afraid, and for good reason given the social media out there, that there could be copycats and other officers could be in danger.

TOM FUENTES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Wolf, there are already people on social media desiring to be a copycat. They've been running down threats since Saturday afternoon when the murders happened, and then all day yesterday day and continuing today. In their minds, it's not idle threats. There are people who want to come out and do what happened in this case, and they are concerned about that.

BLITZER: Reverend Calvin Butts, you're a pastor of the Abyssinian Baptist Church, and you're a community leader in New York. People have relied on your wisdom for many years. A lot of us were really outraged when we heard some of the protesters, though most of the protesters were peaceful, organized, they did what they had a right to do, but you heard those chants from some and it's very disturbing when you heard them say what do you want, dead cops, when do you want it, now. They kept repeating that over and over again. That's so awful to hear that and I wanted to get your thoughts.

BUTTS: I'm outraged by those comments, Wolf. I think they are dangerous, divisive and they put many of our police officers at risk. All of our police officers at risk. We cannot tolerate that rhetoric. And we must be very careful to separate a few provocateurs and not led the bad behavior of some tank the whole police department in New York. Many of our members are members of the New York City Police Department. They are hard-working men and women and they deserve encouragement and protection and they should be very, very, very careful because we do know that there are copycats out here and we do know that these men and women's lives are at risk. So we have to decry that rhetoric whenever we hear it, we have to stand up against it but we know it's out there and, in this country, we have to make sure that we have the kind of leadership that will not be swayed by those who seek only to make political hate or progress their own particular agenda.

BLITZER: Pastor, Reverend Calvin Butts, stand by. Bobby Morgenthau has just introduced Mayor de Blasio. Looks like he's getting a nice little standing ovation there. We're going to hear what the mayor has to say right now.

BILL DE BLASIO, (D), MAYOR OF NEW YORK CITY: While the D.A. returns to his seat, I want to start by thanking all of you for supporting our police, for supporting our children. Those two missions go hand in hand. It's expressed most powerfully by the work of the Police Athletic League. That work couldn't happen in neighborhoods all over the city if it weren't for all of you. I want to thank you for doing the right thing by our city by helping us come together and move forward.

And I have to say, Bob, I love that story you just told. I love that you kept that quarter for that young girl. You're an honest to good man and it epitomizes a life that you have given in service for this city, for the rule of law, for the healing of people, the service to your nation in World War II. I can't think of a man who epitomizes public service and all that we hope to build together more than Bob. Let's thank him again.

(APPLAUSE)

DE BLASIO: I want to talk about this organization and some of the people that are here but I have to first talk about what's going through our hearts right now, what we're all feeling but no one is feeling it more than two families today. Commissioner Bratton and I just came from visiting the family of Officer Ramos and then the family of Officer Liu. And we began that journey with them a few nights ago in a hospital when they experienced the worst possible moment any family could with no warning their loved one was gone. Their father, their husband, their son, their brother, just one moment and then they were gone. And Commissioner Bratton has gone on this mission many times to console families. It's newer in my life but it's one of the most difficult elements of the jobs we do, is to try and help these families that have suffered so wrongly to try and help them in that moment and to let them know we'll be with them every it's something the NYPD believes in. These families are now our family. And we will stand by them. They're suffering. They're suffering an unspeakable pain right now. It's impressive when somehow people can put on a brave face but in the conversations we had, you can tell there's a lot of fear what the future will hold. And we let them know that we would be there for them, that people such as good people in this room would be there for them, and we would never forget them and never forget the sacrifice of Officer Ramos and Officer Liu, who stood for all that is good in this society.

And we have to understand the attack on them was an attack on all of us. It was an attack on our democracy. It was an attack on our values and attack on every single New Yorker and we have to see it as such. There's a lot of pain, and it's so hard to make sense of it. One deeply troubled violent individual could do this to these good families. And I think it's a time for everyone to take stock that there are things that unite us and things we told dear as New Yorkers and as Americans. We all see the prism of the world through our own families. It's time for people to take stock of this moment.

Our first obligation is to respect these families in mourning. Our first obligation is to stand by them in every way we can, and I call upon everyone to focus on these families and these next days which so painfully are also a time that we usually think of as one of the high points of the year. A moment of celebration. A moment of faith. In these days, we still have to find that goodness. I think it's important that regardless of people's viewpoints, that everyone recognize it's a time to step back and just focus on these families. I think it's a time for everyone to put aside political debates, put aside protests and put aside all of those things we'll talk about in due time, but in coming days, two families prepare for funerals. Two families try to think about how to piece their lives back together. That should be our only concern.

How do we support them? I would ask that any organizations that were planning events or gatherings for politics or protests, that could be for another day. Let's accompany these families on their difficult journey and see them through the funerals. Then debate can begin again. Until that time, it is our obligation to respect them. Let's see this attack not only on all of us citizens, an attack on all police and the family of the NYPD is feeling this deeply. Not just their comrades in arms, two officers in the 84th Precinct, but beyond every member of the NYPD. Every retired member of the NYPD are feeling this so personally and so deeply. Let's respect the family of the NYPD as they go through their mourning and take a moment when you see a police officer to thank them and console them because it is personal for them. Take a moment to console them as you would one of the members of the families of Officer Ramos and Officer Liu.

I want to talk about this organization because I think, in the work you do, is a message to all of us about where we --

BLITZER: There's the mayor of New York City, Mayor de Blasio making a very heartfelt statement expressing his deepest condolences to the families of these two police officers who were so brutally gunned down as they sat in their patrol car in Brooklyn.

I want to get some quick reaction. Reverend Calvin Butts is joining us. He's the pastor of a Baptist church in New York.

What did you think, Reverend?

BUTTS: I thought it was correct to express our concern, love and support for the families of the police officers. But certainly this was not a Barack Obama speech. To say we are to stop protesting really does not touch on the fact that not only are the families of the police officers grieving, the family of Eric Garner is grieving and the protests are a separate matter from this heinous crime that's been committed against these New York City police officers. And moreover, giving leadership to the police, encouraging them, was not something that came across strongly for me. These men and women have been demoralized. What you need to do is begin to assume a position that says, you know, I am your leader. I am telling you I am with you. We fight all kinds of crime in this city but we will not tolerate your blood or anyone's bloodshed on the streets unjustly or criminally. I didn't get that. It seemed to be a brief introduction where he moved over the most important issues of the day and he went onto talk about a great organization. They don't need him to speak. They need to put up their track record and everybody says that's great organization. I wasn't moved by it, Wolf.

BLITZER: PAL is the Police Athletic League. That's the event he was addressing.

Tom Fuentes, what did you think?

FUENTES: I couldn't agree more. His commentary has been so eloquent and exactly correct about what the problem is and what needs to be done to address it. I completely agree with everything he just said.

BLITZER: Is this going to work? You're the contributing editor of "New York" magazine and covering New York for a long time. What the mayor just said, is that going to start a process at least of easing the tensions that have exploded in recent weeks especially in the past 48 hours between New York City police officers and the mayor?

SMITH: I think in the short-term it's going to help lower the tone of the discussion. It's very interesting that this morning Commissioner Bratton connected the shootings to the demonstrations and now the mayor is calling for a pause in protest. This has been one of the hardest things for Bratton and de Blasio to square. Bratton is a believer in broken windows. You take care of the small problems so they don't become bigger problems. Protests have escalated and a week or so ago we had an attack on police officers on the Brooklyn Bridge connecting that to this deranged individual shooting two officers is another step. This is a very difficult, very emotional moment and the mayor is trying to take the air out of the situation. I don't know that the protesters are going to stand down.

BLITZER: Chris Smith of "New York" magazine, thank you for joining us.

Tom Fuentes, our law enforcement analyst, thanks to you as well.

And especially thanks to Reverend Calvin Butts, the pastor of the Abyssinian Baptist Church in New York City, a major community leader.

Thank you for spending so much time with us, Reverend Butts. We really appreciate it.

Let's hope tensions calm down in New York and calm down soon, especially during --

(CROSSTALK)

BLITZER: -- this Christmas season. It's a bad way to go into Christmas.

That's it for me. Thanks very much for watching. I'll be back at 5:00 p.m. eastern in "The Situation Room."

For our international viewers, "Amanpour" is next.

For our in North American viewers, "Newsroom" with Brooke Baldwin starts after a quick break.

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