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CNN NEWSROOM

Charles Barkley Comments on Ferguson; ISIS Leader's Wife Detained in Lebanon; The Deadly High of Synthetic Drugs; Kenya's Nat'l Police Chief, Interior Minister Resign

Aired December 2, 2014 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: It's a line drawn in the sand over border policy. A GOP grilling right now on Capitol Hill as Homeland Security Secretary Jeh Johnson defends President Obama's executive action on immigration. In prepared remarks, Johnson calls the policy to shield up to 5 million undocumented immigration from deportation "common sense," but Homeland Security Committee Chair Michael McCaul vows to fight the president's action, calling it unconstitutional and a threat to democracy. We'll continue to monitor this hearing for you.

Let's get back to Ferguson now, shall we. Many police officers across the country say they're being unfairly maligned for doing a difficult job. This morning they have a brand new champion, Charles Barkley. In an interview with a Philadelphia sports radio station, Barkley pulls no punches, calls the looters in Ferguson "scumbags" and says if it were not for police, some black neighborhoods would be like the wild, wild west.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHARLES BARKLEY, FORMER NBA PLAYER (voice-over): I'm not saying who's right or wrong. I'm just hearing the true story that came out of the grand jury investigation. I know I'm black, but I'm going to try to always be honest and fair. We have to be really careful with the cop, man, because if it wasn't for the cops, we'd be living in the wild, wild west in our neighborhoods. I think we can't pick out certain incidents that don't go our way and act like the cops are all bad. I hate when we do that, because, think about it, if you know how bad some of these neighborhoods would be if it wasn't for the cops -- listen, and, first of all, it's always great to play Monday morning quarterback. Like, he shot him a lot like -- well, if you've got a gun and you fighting with somebody, you're not going to shoot them once, you're going to pull the trigger "x" amount of times.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: There you have it. With me now to talk about this, Crystal Wright from conservativeblackchick.com and CNN commentator L.Z. Granderson.

Good morning to both of you.

CRYSTAL WRIGHT, EDITOR BLOGGER, CONSERVATIVEBLACKCHICK.COM: Good morning, Carol.

L.Z. GRANDERSON, CNN COMMENTATOR: Good morning, Carol.

COSTELLO: Good morning.

So, L.Z., is Charles Barkley right? Are we maligning all police officers for the actions of a few?

GRANDERSON: No. And I don't see the evidence in which anyone has actually has said that. Nothing -- anything close to that. You know the sound that we didn't include with the Charles Barkley interview was repeatedly he says that, one, he hasn't really been paying attention and that he hasn't read any of the grand jury information. And so he is going by hearsay, just like many people are going by hearsay. But I will tell you, I haven't heard -- I haven't heard a single person of credibility say all police officers are bad.

COSTELLO: Crystal, what do you think?

WRIGHT: Well, Charles Barkley did read articles about the grand jury's deliberations, so I disagree with L.Z. on that. But I think Charles Barkley hits the nail on the head.

GRANDERSON: He said he didn't.

WRIGHT: Well, you want to let me finish or are you going to talk over me? OK. So --

GRANDERSON: Go ahead. Go ahead.

WRIGHT: Charles Barkley hit the nail on the head and I'm glad he can say it because he's a strong man, he has security behind him. He is exactly right, Carol. Right here, where the CNN bureau is in D.C., a couple of blocks away, really bad neighborhoods, black neighborhoods here in Washington, D.C., where even black people don't even want to go. And the reality is, in inner city black neighborhoods across the country, black people are destroying their own communities, black people are killing each other in their own communities and we don't need to look any further than like Charles Barkley said what happened in Ferguson. It is disgusting, it's a shame that you had 60 businesses, predominantly black-owned, that were either burned to the ground or destroyed to the point that they cannot reopen for months. And who do you think loses in that situation? The black people in Ferguson who worked at those businesses.

So what the president and everybody and Eric Holder, you can have all the task forces until the cows come home. I really wish we would start being honest about what's going on in black communities across the country. Thank God for Charles Barkley

COSTELLO: And Charles Barkley pulls no punches, L.Z. He called those looters scumbags. He called them not real black people.

GRANDERSON: Well, I mean, when my first piece that I wrote for CNN regarding the, you know, what was going on in Ferguson, I compared the looters to the KKK. So I think there are a lot of black people who are very upset with the looters and the rioters. And they should not be grouped in together with the protesters who have legitimate concerns.

And I will say that much of what Crystal Wright said, I agree with, and I have written about over the years. I'm only taking issue with this notion that Charles Barkley is speaking from a place of authority with all of the information and thus can explain why the people in Ferguson are upset.

WRIGHT: Well, but --

GRANDERSON: The people in Ferguson are upset -- allow me to finish. The people in Ferguson are upset for a multitude of reasons in which Charles Barkley has said repeatedly in that interview he didn't follow up. I'll tell you something most people don't know, that the police officer who is the spokesperson for the St. Louis Police, who came out against those five men in the football field for having their hands up, he's been fired for lying in police reports and then he was hired again in a small town in Missouri as the police chief after he was fired for lying in police reports.

WRIGHT: Yes.

GRANDERSON: And so when you really start digging deep into what's going on in the Ferguson area, and perhaps in the state of Missouri when it comes to minorities and police officers, you can see why there's a distrust. And that, to me, is what these protesters are about, the distrust between minority communities and the police force. Not all police force, but some.

COSTELLO: And I think -- and I think, Crystal, when you talk about black on black crime, which is a problem, everybody knows that's a problem, but it's really diverting the issue at hand. It's a distrust between the community and police, and that has to be fixed.

WRIGHT: Right. Well, yes, I disagree with you. I disagree with you that it's diverting the conversation. What it is, is, the -- I would argue the media at large, not -- you know, all news outlets want to avoid that uncomfortable, ugly discussion about black on black crime. I will agree with you, Carol, trust goes both ways. Black people need to trust the police that are policing their neighborhoods and keeping their neighborhoods safe and I think trust is a two-way street.

And we aren't talking about what happened that night that Michael Brown -- the bad choices Michael Brown made that led to his tragic death. I will go back to what Charles Barkley said about policing, and I think that in this whole narrative, police have gotten a bad rap. I know -- I live in the nation's capital. And when I call the police, they're responsive and I thank God for them every day. They put their lives at risk.

And, finally, Charles Barkley has just as much credibility, if not more, to talk about this issue than somebody like Reverend Al Sharpton. He always wins at the end of the day and the black people are left to pick up the pieces. And I do -- I think L.Z. and I do have common ground on a lot of these topics and we disagree on some things, but, you know, I think there's an ugly part of the black community that nobody wants to talk about, and I hope maybe the president's task force can get to that, but I'm not confident it will. I mean Reverend Al Sharpton shouldn't be anywhere near a task force.

COSTELLO: Well, I'd have to agree with that. Crystal Wright --

GRANDERSON: Carol, if I could just -- if I could just quickly add --

COSTELLO: OK.

GRANDERSON: If I could just quickly add, you know, there's this conversation of black on black crime and if you look at the FBI statistics, what you also find is that 80 percent of white people who suffer crimes suffer from white people. So there's not black on black crime like this unique sort of, you know, unicorn. The fact of the matter is, crime happens where people are congregated. And so whether it's black on black, white on white, it's a reflection of segregation in our country and not just something unique with black people.

WRIGHT: Yes, well, I don't --

COSTELLO: That's right, crime happens where people live.

WRIGHT: Yes. Yes.

GRANDERSON: Exactly.

COSTELLO: And it's true, more than 80 percent of murders among white people are committed by white people.

WRIGHT: Well, but white people don't have -- well, white people aren't having their neighborhoods destroyed all over the country. Look at Detroit. Look at D.C. You can -- you can go everywhere. It's not -- white people don't have their neighborhoods vandalized. I mean it's just not true. We can agree but disagree.

COSTELLO: Well, some do but certainly not as many. OK, Crystal Wright --

GRANDERSON: Actually, white people do actually have their neighborhoods vandalized.

COSTELLO: I've got to go. They do, some of them.

WRIGHT: Thanks, Carol.

COSTELLO: Crystal Wright, L.Z. Granderson, thanks to both of you. I'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: A possible break in the war on ISIS. Sources tell CNN that the wife and son of Abu Bakr Al Baghdadi, the ruthless leader of the Islamic terror group ISIS, have been detained. Details on this developing story are still murky but here is what's clear. This is the first time anyone has gotten a hold of someone so closely connected to Al Baghdadi.

CNN's Nic Robertson is tracking the story for us from London. Nic, tell us more.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENRIO INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hey Carol. What we know from our sources in the region is that Baghdadi's wife was arrested. She is one -- the one who has been arrested is one of two wives that Baghdadi is believed to have.

A source also tells us that this was a planned operation, that it had been in the works for some time, that they were waiting for this event to happen, this arrest to happen, in fact, that this particular wife of Baghdadi who was arrested is somebody who is very active in the ISIS organization, who is very powerful within the organization, obviously very well connected through our husband. But what we're being told is she was such a significant player; that is why she was targeted for arrest.

Now, we don't have details of what's been learned. Media outlets in Lebanon where she's being held are reporting that she was arrested as long as a week ago, arrested with one of her children. We've also been told we're not aware of what she is actually offering up to the Lebanese, who are undoubtedly questioning her very thoroughly and very closely. But because we do understand that this was something that was planned, that involved intelligence agencies, there is likely going to be a lot more scrutiny than just the Lebanese right now on her of what she can tell authorities. Carol?

COSTELLO: Is there any indication she might have been fleeing from Al Baghdadi?

ROBERTSON: From sources that I've talked to, that sounds unlikely. It sounds unlikely because she is believed to be a significant player and figure within -- and an important figure -- within her own right within the ISIS organization. So, at the moment, it would seem that she was, you know, working for and continuing to work for that organization rather than trying to flee her husband. And it appears that whatever she was doing on that day when she tried to cross the border and was picked up using false papers, she was effectively being tracked already and they were just -- authorities were just waiting for that opportunity to see her and grab her. Carol?

COSTELLO: Interesting. All right, Nic Robertson, thanks so much. I'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: There is a new and deadly threat to our teenagers. It's a drug you may never have heard of but it's marketed to your kids as harmless and it's anything but.

CNN's senior investigative correspondent Drew Griffin has a special documentary tonight. It's called "DEADLY HIGH". Hi, Drew.

DREW GRIFFIN, CNN SENIOR INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT: How are you doing, Carol?

You know, this is the story that the parents of two dead children really wanted us to tell, because they had no idea what happened to their children. These new drugs are called synthetics, chemically produced designer drugs. They're designed, Carol, to evade the law. That's what the design is.

You can buy them easily online. Very easy to get. Tonight, we look at how these designer drugs tore through a Midwestern city, ruining dozens of lives and families before anybody really knew what they were.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GRIFFIN (voice-over): In the week of June 10, 2012, law enforcement in Grand Forks were dealing with an outbreak of violent overdoses. A mystery drug on the streets had already kill two teenagers.

TIM PURDON, U.S. ATTORNEY, DISTRICT OF NORTH DAKOTA: We've got multiple overdoses, we've two young men who've lost their lives. I mean, what's more serious than that.

GRIFFIN: Tim Purdon was the U.S. attorney for North Dakota.

PURDON: That was unprecedented. I had -- I've been U.S. attorney now for going on four years. This is the only time we've reached out to a school system, to the university, and said, hey, there's this danger on the streets right now that people need to be aware about.

GRIFFIN: As emergency warnings were being issued, investigators were desperately trying to find out just what this drug was and, more importantly, where it came from.

CHRIS MYERS, FIRST ASSISTANT U.S. ATTORNEY, DISTRICT OF NORTH DAKOTA: It took lab analysis to determine the true nature of these substances. When we learned what they were, 2C-I-NDOMe, 2C-C-NBOMe, that was new to us.

GRIFFIN: 2C-I-NDOMe and 2C-C-NBOMe are synthetic designer drug, chemicals designed to imitate the high of the banned drug LSD. These drugs are so potent, a dose the size of a few grains of salt is enough to get high. North Dakota's top federal drug prosecutor had never heard of them, and neither had Christian Bjerk's parents.

DEBRA BJERK, CHRISTIAN BJERK'S MOTHER: I had to go to the Internet and look up information. And I really didn't understand the whole synthetic drug. I didn't know what it was. Didn't know how dangerous they were.

KEITH BJERK, CHRISTIAN BJERK'S FATHER: The message we got after we went on the Internet was that somebody had said it was OK for these drugs to be on the street and they had been tweaked. But that's all we knew.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Synthetic LSD has been blamed for at least --

GRIFFIN: Parents across the country are now learning the painful truth about synthetic designer drugs.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Investigators say he overdosed on a synthetic marijuana --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Otherwise known as K2.

GRIFFIN: With deaths and overdoses reported almost daily.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COSTELLO: So where these these drugs coming from?

GRIFFIN (on camera): That's one of the more scary things about this. These are chemicals being made in laboratories in China by businesses by and large from China that are being sold bulk research chemicals across the United States, the U.K., Europe. This is not your drug cartel stuff slipping stuff across the border, which is why it's been so hard to get a handle on it.

COSTELLO: So parents are probably a little freaked out right now. So what advice would you have for them?

GRIFFIN: Listen, the best advice is to know what's out there, to keep ahead of this, to talk to your kids. I mean, it may sound corny, but you should watch this with your kids tonight, discuss what this stuff is, know the dangers, know the risks, know that no matter what these people tell you about synthetic drugs, they are not safe.

And you're going to hear uniquely from the drug dealer who talked to us exclusively about just how easy this was. Carol, I think you'll be amazed to see what you can do today with a computer and an Internet connection. It's scary but, you know, gain some power through knowledge.

COSTELLO: I'm eager to watch it. Thank you, Drew, I appreciate it.

So tune in tonight, 9:00 p.m. Eastern for CNN's special investigative documentary, "DEADLY HIGH: HOW SYNTHETIC DRUGS ARE KILLING KIDS". You can also go to CNN/deadlyhigh for more information about synthetic drugs.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Kenya's national police chief has now resigned in the wake of a horrific attack by al Qaeda-linked militants that left 36 people dead. CNN's Nima Elbagir is in London with more on this. Good morning.

NIMA ELBAGIR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Morning, Carol. We also just confirmed before I came to air that Kenya's Interior Minister is also standing aside. Many Kenyans feel that finally there is some movement on this protracted security crisis. You remember the Westgate Mall attack in September last year. Well, since then, there has been no censure of any high-ranking officials, and the attacks this morning and last week on holiday-makers going home to spend Christmas with their families, this seems to have been the tipping point.

This attack, absolutely horrifying, Carol. It was the early hours of this morning, Al Shabab attacked, separating the Christians from the Muslims before proceeding to bludgeon some of the workers in this quarry in this remote part of Kenya to death, decapitating others and leaving their bodies to be found. They have since claimed as a message in revenge for Kenya's attacks on Somali territory, but also in some mosques where some extremists are known to radicalize other young men.

The hope is this finally will be Kenya moving, the Kenyan government, moving to take control of the crisis out there. Carol.

COSTELLO: I hope so. Nima Elbagir, thanks so much.

The next hour of CNN NEWSROOM starts now.

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