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New Ebola Guidelines from CDC; Poll: Americans Confident in Ebola Response; Army Personnel Quarantined after West Africa Trip
Aired October 28, 2014 - 07:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
POPPY HARLOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Under the new guidelines, the CDC outlines four main risk levels: high risk for those with direct exposure to infected fluids of an Ebola patient; some risk for those living with or within three feet of a patient without wearing protective gear.
The third is a low but nonzero risk, meaning anyone traveling from a country with widespread Ebola. The fourth category includes people with no identified risk but could have had exposure to a person with Ebola before the person was showing symptoms or who traveled to West Africa more than 21 days ago.
The CDC believes the changes will better determine when individuals should be routed to care.
Health officials are holding a 5-year-old boy for additional testing after an initial test for Ebola came back negative. He is being monitored at Manhattan's Bellevue Hospital in New York City, where New York doctor Craig Spencer, who contracted the virus in Guinea, is being treated.
MAYOR BILL DE BLASIO, NEW YORK CITY: We did the cautious thing and brought the child in under the full protocol.
HARLOW: Meanwhile, ICU patients at Bellevue have been transferred to NYU Langone Medical Center. According to Bellevue, there were not enough nurses on staff to handle both ICU patients and treat Ebola.
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HARLOW: And Chris, let's talk about some of these poll numbers that came in last night in the most recent CNN/ORC poll that I find interesting. Fifty-four percent of people who responded, and they said they think the federal government has done a good job of treating Ebola patients and preventing the spread.
Seven in ten Americans responded saying they think the U.S. government will be able to prevent an epidemic here in the United States.
As for that 5-year-old little boy, yes, he tested negative last night for Ebola. Why are they keeping him here? The health department says it's because they need further negative tests to confirm that he is indeed clear. No idea yet when he's going to be released here from Bellevue. Good news, though, his mother at least is here with him. Because you
can imagine what it's like for a little 5-year-old boy to be in isolation.
CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Right. And that's the concern, Poppy. That's why we need you to stay on that, because he's just five years old. It's not like some adult who understands what's going on.
HARLOW: Yes.
CUOMO: And I'm sure the parents are starting to get a little concerned, as well. So we'll make sure that we know when that kid actually gets home. Poppy, thank you for the reporting. And bringing up these poll numbers is big. It's a big headline for us.
Let's bring in the senior White House correspondent, Michelle Kosinski.
We were just going through those poll numbers. You understand them better. A big number for me is, 80 percent plus of people think there's going to be another case. It just won't be someone that they know or even where they live. So that's an interesting insight. But also some take-away for government here, Michelle.
MICHELLE KOSINSKI, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes. When you look at those numbers, they really do make sense.
What's been extraordinary is what we've seen happen. And we've seen federal guidelines develop. Then change as problems have arisen but seeming at times to be a step behind the criticism.
Now we see states come forward and say, "Well, that's not enough for us. We're going to do our own thing." The Pentagon saying, "Yes, not enough for us. We're going to take it a step further."
Finally, now we see the CDC expand its guidelines for returning healthcare workers. But again, seeming a bit behind.
Yesterday we saw the White House refuse to criticize what New York and New Jersey have done with their quarantines. Refuse to say whether or not they thought it was a bad idea. They wouldn't say what the Pentagon has done, whether they agreed with that or not. And they wouldn't answer the question as to whether the president spoke directly with either governors Christie or Cuomo. They just wouldn't answer the question.
What they did do was repeatedly state that any procedures need to be based in science. And they said the fact that New Jersey released the nurse from quarantine was a result of conversations with the CDC and proof that the government's coordination with states is successful -- Alisyn.
ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Michelle Kosinski, thanks so much for that update.
Joining us now to talk about all of this, including the new guidelines, Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases at the National Institutes of Health. And Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN chief medical correspondent. Gentlemen, thanks so much for being here.
Dr. Fauci, let's start with these new guidelines. I'll put up on the screen, there are four new guidelines, and I'll fill in the blanks of what these mean. High risk now means exposure to the blood or body fluids of someone with Ebola. Some risk means close contact in households or healthcare facilities with a person with Ebola while the person was symptomatic. Low risk means having been in a country where there's widespread Ebola outbreak, but not having any known exposures. And no risk -- this is interesting -- contact with a person with Ebola before the person developed symptoms.
This seems a little confusing, Dr. Fauci. Will these really be helpful?
DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, INSTITUTE FOR ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES, NIH: Well, they will really be helpful, because what they're doing is that they're matching the degree of a particular risk of exposure of a person with the kind of monitoring that will be done and the kind of restriction that would be put on that person.
So it actually is based on science of what we know how the virus is spread. And in the caution of being safe, it matches the level with judgment as to the type of monitoring and the type of restrictions.
So instead of putting everybody in the same bucket and being overly restrictive or putting people in a less-restrictive bucket and having a bucket and having a person, possibilities get out and do actually transmission if they were symptomatic, it really does a science-based matching of risk with the kind of monitoring and the kind of restriction. And for that reason, I think it's really much, much clearer than what we've seen in the past.
CAMEROTA: OK, that's good to hear. Because at first blush, it seems a little bit like the terror alert letter [SIC] -- levels of orange or yellow or red. Where it's done sort of for the public, to make the public think that things are happening and make them feel better. But there may not be an actual accomplishment. But you disagree.
FAUCI: I disagree, because it's based on the science. It's based on what we know and how it's -- how it's transmitted. And we know about the kinds of risks that are involved.
And in this case, it isn't just all or none. It's a good matching based on science of the level of risk, with the kind of monitoring, and the kind of monitoring with the kind of restriction. And if you look at that chart, and look at someone, be it a healthcare worker who is someone who's been in the country, but not a healthcare worker. They fit into one of those categories. And the -- the framework in which they're put is really based on scientific evidence as well as experience.
CAMEROTA: OK. So Sanjay, do you think that this will really help healthcare workers? DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: I think it could
help healthcare workers sort of have a better idea of how to categorize people.
But you know, I was reading through this list pretty closely last night. And I think it's still going to rely a lot on people's judgment to determine when someone is truly high-risk versus some risk, for example. So I don't think it's going to be absolutely clear cut. And some people -- the same person may be categorized high risk by one healthcare team and some risk by another. So I think that's going to require a little bit of finessing.
But you know, I'm curious. If I could ask Dr. Fauci a question, as well. I was thinking about this last night a bit, Dr. Fauci. But the idea that people don't start transmitting the virus until they're sick. It seems like people fundamentally understand that. And also, that once they're symptomatic, they're more likely to transmit the virus.
But the scenario people seem to be concerned about is, like, with regard to Dr. Spencer. He could have been feeling fine. Out and about, getting his temperature checked twice a day. But at some point when he was out and about on the subway, for example, could he have started to get very sick, possibly vomited and put people at risk because of that? That seems to be the question about whether someone should be quarantined or not. How quickly can they develop symptoms and put others at risk?
FAUCI: Right. Well, if you look at the clinical course, Sanjay, of someone who has Ebola, and you take a look at the onset of the early type of flu-like syndrome, the fever; and then you start talking about the diarrhea and the vomiting. And when the viral load gets high, when you have the possibility of contact with a person, it isn't waking up in the morning, feeling great, going out and then all of a sudden your viral load goes off the ceiling. It just doesn't work that way.
You have, when you start getting a viral load that is enough to be able to be transmitted, you're feeling very, very poorly. And when someone wakes up, even if they feel a little bit achy, they may ultimately turn out to be infected. But unless you have direct contact with the bodily fluid of a sick person, and we know that from the transmissions to the healthcare workers.
Take a look at the family members of Duncan, in the house in Dallas with him. They were not infected. The ones who have gotten infected in this country were the brave two nurses who were directly taking care of Duncan. That's a case study that tells a lot.
CAMEROTA: Yes. Sanjay, does that answer your question?
GUPTA: Yes, it does answer the question. It is worth pointing out, Dr. Fauci, as you know, that Mr. Sawyer, who was a gentleman who got on a plane from Liberia, flew to Nigeria. He was able to get on the plane just fine, but by the time he got -- landed in Nigeria, he essentially collapsed in the airport. So I just bring that up to say it does seem the symptoms can come on pretty quickly. Right, Dr. Fauci.
FAUCI: Unless you're denying symptoms and unless you're sick and somehow you get through. And I think with the restrictions now, Sanjay, that I know you're familiar with. When you're talking about someone coming over from those countries, you have symptom evaluation and temperature when you get on, which was called the exit screening. And then you have the entry screening. So I mean, it would be really difficult under those circumstances, I believe, for Sawyer to have done what he did.
CAMEROTA: Yes. Gentlemen, I want to tell you we have some breaking news just in the middle of your segment. And that is that Emory University has just come out and announced that Amber Vinson, the nurse who was infected with Ebola, is now Ebola-free, and she is being released. So that's great news. We will hear from her in a press conference, we're told, later this morning.
So Sanjay, that was -- that was a fairly -- that was successful and a fairly short run. It feels as though we were just talking, you know, within the past ten days of whether or not she would be able to be OK. And now she is.
GUPTA: Yes. You know, look, we've been talking about some things that I think have made people somewhat fearful over the last few weeks. But then you hear the stories of nurse Nina Pham, now nurse Amber Vinson. Eight of the nine patients that have been treated now here in the United States have all been released or Ebola-free. And sounds like they're doing well. So you know, that's some good news.
Obviously, it's a small group of people, relatively speaking. But the track record seems to be very good here in the United States.
CAMEROTA: It sure does. We have had real success stories here in the U.S. Dr. Anthony Fauci, Sanjay Gupta, thanks so much for being on with us, and we will look forward to that press conference from Amber Vinson.
Let's go over to Michaela for some more top stories.
MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Thanks so much, Alisyn. Let's take a look at those headlines.
As you mentioned, new details are emerging now about how the Washington high school shooting unfolded. The county sheriff says Jaylen Fryberg sent text messages to lure his victims to sit at the same lunch table in the cafeteria. We're also learning that Fryberg sent a picture of himself with a gun to his ex-girlfriend not long before the attack. It's unclear if he's holding the same weapon in that photo used in the rampage.
The soldier gunned down in last week's rampage in Ottawa will be laid to rest today. Corporal Nathan Cirillo was standing guard at the National War Memorial in Canada's capital when he was shot by Michael Zehaf-Bibeau. Secretary of State John Kerry will attend the funeral on behalf of the United States today. After the service, a procession will pass through the streets of Ottawa with military units paying final respects.
Prosecutors are set to appeal the verdict and sentence in the Oscar Pistorius case. They say the judge misinterpreted a complex standard defining intent. That proved to be a central aspect of the case. As a result, prosecutors say Pistorius should not have been convicted on the lesser charge of culpable homicide.
Quite an unusual rescue at a home on Long Island. John Bacchi is credited with saving a 79-year-old man who accidentally drove right into his swimming pool -- swimming pool. Police say Joseph DiDonato accidentally hit the gas pedal instead of the brakes, sending his SUV through Bacchi's back yard fence. Bacchi jumped into the pool, smashed the driver's side window and was able to pull DiDonato out to safety.
CAMEROTA: Oh, my gosh.
PEREIRA: Thank goodness he was home. Thank goodness he was there and saw it all happen.
CAMEROTA: I want to have a neighbor like that.
CUOMO: Italian.
CAMEROTA: Bacchi.
PEREIRA: I'm very pleased that everybody was OK.
CUOMO: Not easy to do, by the way. How do you break a window?
PEREIRA: No, in fact that's what they talk about when -- the difficulty.
CUOMO: Safety glass and it's pressure...
CAMEROTA: How did he break the window? We need to find out.
CUOMO: It was very cool that he took that risk going in there himself. And I can't believe the guy was OK.
PEREIRA: That's great.
CUOMO: Pools can be repaired. People, not so much.
PEREIRA: They sure can.
CAMEROTA: Thanks, Michaela.
PEREIRA: You're welcome.
CAMEROTA: All right. Close to a dozen soldiers fighting a new fight, this one against Ebola. They've been quarantined in Italy after a trip to West Africa. So we'll have a live report from the Pentagon to learn more about what's going on with them.
CUOMO: And it may not be a surprise, but it's probably true. This year's elections probably going to be all about anger and fear. You've got Ebola. You've got ISIS. You've got perceived leadership failures, so I guess you'll be voting a lot of people out there year -- right? Probably not. Why not? John King will have more of the ORC/CNN poll and what will happen in "Inside Politics."
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CAMEROTA: Nearly a dozen U.S. Army personnel have been quarantined in Italy after delivering Ebola aid in West Africa. Military officials say the group is in, quote, "controlled monitoring" after spending a month setting up assistance in Liberia. So far there is no indication that anyone on the team has symptoms of Ebola. So why are they isolated?
CNN's Barbara Starr is live at the Pentagon with more. What's the thinking, Barbara?
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Alisyn. That number I want to tell you right off the bat is about to grow. Thirty additional Army personnel in the air right now, having left West Africa today, headed for Italy. They, too, will go into closed monitoring.
This was ordered by the chief of the U.S. Army. He says out of an abundance of caution.
Now, the person you saw a minute ago on the video, that is Major General Darryl Williams. He headed up this initial operation for 30 days. He and his team were all over Liberia in rural areas, in the cities. They moved around a good deal, seeing the situation and working on this aid.
So he may be in a position, he and his team, where there may be some reasonable discussion by the Army. They want to protect them. They want to make sure they're OK. No symptoms so far. Nobody sick. But they're going to be in this close monitoring.
The question now on the table at the Pentagon is are you going to do this for all troops that are there? There are 900 right now. It could grow to 4,000. Many of them will simply work on construction projects, depart Liberia, they will not be in any position where they will come into contact, reasonably, with anyone who is sick.
So the question now for the Pentagon, for the joint chiefs and especially for Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel, are you going to have a mandatory quarantine, essentially, for all troops that go on this mission in West Africa? That's a decision that will be made in the coming days by Hagel himself -- Chris.
CUOMO: Barbara, thank you so much for the reporting.
And it's interesting the words that Barbara used there. This is monitoring. Why has quarantine become a dirty word? What's going on here?
Let's continue this discussion with retired Lieutenant Colonel James Reese. He's a CNN global affairs analyst and former Delta Force commander. And Joyce Raezer. She's the executive director of the National Military Family Association. Thank you both for being here.
Now, you heard what I just said, right? What's going on here, Lieutenant Colonel, when it comes to quarantines? This is the military making its own decision to do this for its own people out of an abundance of caution, right?
LT. COL. JAMES REESE (RET.), CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: Yes, sir. You know, Chris, you know this. I mean, the military is a microcosm in our society. You know, General Williams, all the generals, all the commanders out there, they have a plethora of staff. They have their own infectious disease doctors. They have their own doctors to advise them. These guys are making very good decisions based off the science, which we hear about all week.
CUOMO: Sure.
REESE: And, two, what they've been doing in Liberia right now.
CUOMO: So you know, Colonel, on the one hand we have the White House, the government on one side saying, you know, "Let's not be so fast with this quarantine. Science doesn't suggest it."
And you have the military on the other side, which is, you know, functionally an aspect of the government, and they're taking this step.
And now all this talk about quarantine, Joyce, we seem to be missing the big point. Are we doing everything we can to keep our men and women safe in harm's way? You know, we're obsessed with quarantine. Do you feel that we're doing enough on the ground in Liberia, specifically, to keep our men and women safe?
JOYCE RAEZER, NATIONAL MILITARY FAMILY ASSOCIATION: Well, that's certainly the question military families are asking.
CUOMO: Sure.
RAEZER: How are you keeping my service member safe? They are seeing this mission unfold. They are seeing precautions being added. They're seeing training being changed. They see that this was a quick deployment decision. Quick rapid mission. And so that we're all -- everybody in the country, including their leaders, are learning about Ebola and how to best protect people as they go along.
But military families are also asking, "And how are you going to insure that my service member doesn't bring the disease back here to our home, to our children, to our family, to our kids' schools?"
And so what they want to see is some consistent guidance on what will be safe, but they're also dealing with questions from their communities. What's going to happen in my kids' school when my service member comes back, for example?
CUOMO: That's something that's being ignored here. You know, there was this quick push-back from the White House, Colonel. I'll direct it to you, about how you have to respect these people. They're doing heroic work, and you know what? That can't be said enough. Whether it's the -- our fighting men and women who are going into harm's way, to help out with Ebola treatment or anywhere else we send them in the world. They're certainly doing the Lord's work. There's no question about that.
But if the quarantine is only seen as a stigma, what about the stigma when there is no quarantine? CNN/ORC poll, Colonel, says 78 percent say quarantine those with symptoms like a fever. But let in other people into the U.S. Do you think that this is reactionary and punitive? Or do you think it's common sense?
REESE: Well, Chris, I do. I think it's common sense. I mean, we go back to the science, you know. And then you've got to take a look at the situation. If we try to make everything black and white, it's not going to work.
So, you know, to me, you've got military commanders like I said. They've got great advisers with them. Give me, if I'm the commander, give me the intent and let me make a decision.
You know, General Williams and the guys from Italy. This is another key point that went over. You know, they jumped over their quickly, do a site survey, assess the situation. So those 60 to 70 soldiers that were over there might have been, because they were all over the country like Barbara discussed, might have been -- had a higher chance, based on the guidelines we see this morning -- of being more in contact.
But here's the other thing. Those soldiers have returned to Italy. Not back to the U.S. base where there's a domestic issue. You know, and the Italians get a vote in this also, based on the status of force -- forces agreement that we have with the Italians.
CUOMO: And Joyce, don't you think this comes down to how it's done? That poor nurse from Maine, you know, she comes back from Africa. She gets put in a plastic bag, basically, in the hospital. Those are very harsh conditions for 21 days. But don't you think this is something that can be done in a way that gives dignity to the person who's going through it, makes sure that they're OK and cures all these kinds of fears that surround this situation?
RAEZER: Well, I think that's what military families would hope. Is that the military is providing a place where the service member can be monitored and quarantined. Where there's no danger of passing an illness on to a family member. But where there's still communication, where there's still support for both that service member and the family.
And they're looking for the consistency. Because we have people deploying for multiple services, from many installations; and so they're looking for what's going to be the standard that's going to be used across the military.
CUOMO: The willingness is always there for our fighting men and women. It's just about us doing our part to protect them.
Thank you very much to both of you for weighing in on this issue. I'm sure we'll be talking about it again -- Alisyn.
CAMEROTA: All right, Chris. As you know, election day is a week away. Candidates are pulling out all the stops and airing some ads that, well, you just won't believe. John King has all of that "Inside Politics."
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PEREIRA: All right. Take a look at your headlines. Breaking news just in minutes ago to CNN. Amber Vinson, the second nurse who contracted Ebola at Texas Presbyterian Hospital in Dallas, is virus free and will be released from Emory University Hospital in Atlanta. We expect to hear from her at a news conference later today.
The other nurse who got sick, Nina Pham, was released from the National Institutes of Health last week.
Kurdish Peshmerga foreign fighters will be entering the besieged Syrian city of Kobani today or tomorrow to help battle ISIS. A Peshmerga general tells CNN soldiers have been ready for a few days but encountered some logistical problems. This comes as ISIS releases a new video showing British hostage John Cantlie, depicting him reporting from Kobani in the video. Cantlie says the all-out battle for Kobani is over; it's now under ISIS control, despite reports to the contrary from western media.
Slowly but surely, lava from Hawaii's erupting Kilauea volcano moving closer and closer to homes on the big island, by some estimates at the rate of 8 to 11 yards an hour. Officials say the lava flow is now within 70 yards of the nearest home in the village of Pahoa, which would spell disaster for that community. Many village residents have fled. There are reports of some of those homes being looted.
And I have to show you this, a beautiful Halloween treat from a Colorado step-father to his step-son. Check it out. Jake Gregory will go trick-or-treating in a custom -- this isn't the picture. This was last year. That was the year before. But this is his new one: an Army tank. Where is it? Here it comes. There it is. Thanks to step-dad Andy, who made the epic costume. It even boasts a cannon that smokes.
Jake lives with cerebral palsy and epilepsy. But his step-dad decided that should not stop his son from having fun. It's the third year that his step-dad has outfitted his wheelchair as a costume. We just think it's the coolest thing, and you had to see it. Well done, Dad.
CUOMO: Great dad.
CAMEROTA: That's awesome.
PEREIRA: Creative, too.
CAMEROTA: Thank you. CUOMO: A beautiful way to show that young man, that little boy that he is not his limitations.
PEREIRA: Exactly.
CUOMO: Gorgeous. Gorgeous.
How about, speaking of limitations, politics? "Inside Politics" on NEW DAY with John King. Help us make some sense of the situation, my friend.
JOHN KING, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hats off to that dad. My little Spider-Man is getting ready for Halloween, as well.
Yes, let's make sense of politics. Good luck with that.
One week from today, election day. Folks, I'm getting excited. Let's go "Inside Politics" this morning.
