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Firefight Along Syria-Turkey Border; U.K. Approves Airstrikes on ISIS in Iraq; British Parliament Worry About Escalation; Mixed Signals on Attacks in US; Defense Department Briefs on ISIS Threat

Aired September 26, 2014 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, I'm Brianna Keilar reporting from Washington. Wolf Blitzer has the day off.

And you are looking, right now, at some live pictures from the Pentagon. We are waiting, right now, for defense secretary, Chuck Hagel, and Joint Chiefs' chairman, General Martin Dempsey, to speak to reporters. This will be the first time that we have heard from them since the U.S. launched air strikes in Syria. And as soon as they come to the microphones, we will take you there live.

But first, let's get some amazing video from an area along the Syria- Turkey border. This is really, you know, unbelievable pictures that we have been seeing today, the battle here between Syrian Kurdish forces and ISIS fighters. Here is part of what our crew saw.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PHIL BLACK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: ISIS has been making progress, a few more miles each day. Now, just take a look up at that ridge line there. What you are seeing is tracer fire moving into that ridge line that is currently occupied by ISIS forces. And around me, the Kurdish crowd is cheering. Take a listen.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: That was our Phil Black narrating the firefight as it happened just a short time ago. And he joins me live now. Phil, these pictures that we are watching right now. They were taken at dusk really, there along the Syria-Turkey border. Night has fallen. Has the fighting stopped?

BLACK: It appears to have largely stopped, Brianna, yes. We're still hearing the occasional burst of small arms fire. The odd blasts and tracer fire through the night sky. But for the most part, yes, it does appear to have stopped. One of the last things that we saw, as dusk was falling, it appeared to be that group of ISIS fighters dropping away from that ridgeline that they were trying to hold there. So, it would appear, for the moment, that, yes, the fighting, as intense as it was earlier in the day, has ebbed away.

And it was pretty intense earlier. What we saw was a continual exchange of small arms fire and heavy or indirect fire, mortar rounds, we believe, between those ISIS fighters at the top of a ridgeline and some Kurdish Syrian fighters on the -- on an opposing ridgeline. Now, ISIS has been trying to move through this territory for about a week or so. It has been making progress doing so. Those local Kurdish fighters have been slowing them down but not able to stop them. ISIS, at this point, has been making progress and that is what has triggered a very large humanitarian catastrophe along this border with Turkey. We have seen this week some 200,000, it is estimated, Syrian refugees flee their homes as ISIS advances crossing into Turkey. And that has been continuing. There was an initial influx of some 140,000 or so then thousands more every day. And it is continuing because that ISIS advance is continuing.

And we've been talking to people, those refugees as they cross the border, and they have been telling terrible, tragic stories about their loss and about what they have witnessed, about what they have seen ISIS do to their villages, their homes and their families. People have talked about loved ones being killed in crossfire, being executed and being wiped out by artillery fire as well.

So, what we are witnessing in this region and what we saw with our own eyes in a very extraordinary way this afternoon was ISIS advancing through this northern Syrian territory which, up until now, it has not controlled but it is clearly trying hard to do so -- Brianna.

KEILAR: How concerned, Phil, is Turkey that ISIS fighters are so close there along the border and is the Turkish military doing anything to get involved here?

BLACK: The Turkish military is not getting directly involved in this fight yet, no. No doubt Turkey is concerned. Turkey has been concerned about ISIS for some time as it has been concerned, very concerned, about the ongoing Syrian civil conflict which has been tearing this country apart. And it is because of that conflict that Turkey has some 1.5 million Syrian refugees on its territory. It is an incredible burden.

And that is Turkey's number one concern in dealing with the ongoing Syrian crisis. It is concerned about ISIS. It has not yet joined and may not join, we don't know, this international coalition that is taking the fight directly to ISIS, itself. But the Turkish government tells us that it is concerned about ISIS, but its primary concern is the ongoing humanitarian catastrophe. And it believes that it has been left to shoulder that burden largely to itself, and that western, very wealthy western countries are not doing enough to assist. That is the view of the Turkish government -- Brianna.

KEILAR: All right, Phil Black. Very important point of view to share with us. Thank you so much for your report.

And I want to bring in, now, CNN Military Analyst Lieutenant Colonel Rick Francona. This is some pretty amazing video, this fire fight, that we're seeing here. What's your initial reaction to what we're seeing and if we're learning anything new?

LT. COL. RICK FRANCONA, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Well, it's -- it follows what we've been watching for the past couple of weeks. We know that the ISIS has wanted to take that whole Turkish border area, and they've been pushing the Kurds closer to the Turkish border. And as what we're seeing, this humanitarian crisis, that's erupting in Turkey, and it appears that ISIS is allowing the Kurds to take refuge in Turkey. It's not -- they're not trying to stop them. And I was talking to Phil earlier about this, and it seems that they're more interested in seizing the terrain and holding that terrain than they are with the Kurds that are actually living there. So, if the Kurds want to leave, they're going to let them.

As far as the fighting goes, this is -- this is really dramatic footage. But you can see where the -- that ISIS actually is better gunned than they have more people. So, eventually, the ISIS is going to push them back. You know, and, as they said, 100 meters a day, a mile a day. And so, we're watching the Kurds being pushed into this -- right up against the border. So, this would be a great opportunity for air power to get involved, but we've got no one on the ground to do the forward air control which is a key part of this.

KEILAR: So, -- and that's what I was going to ask you, so this is an area where, for instance, U.S. or other Arab nations who are allied with the U.S., at this point, it's sort of ripe, really, for them to intervene with air power. But, what, they're sort of flying blind in a way.

FRANCONA: Well, they won't because the chance of hitting friendly forces or --

KEILAR: Yes.

FRANCONA: -- causing civilian casualties would far outweigh the benefit. Everybody wants to bring air power in but remember how far away the bases are from which we're operating. It would take a long time to get there. And without anybody on the ground to control this, it just wouldn't happen.

KEILAR: And you can see how closely, certainly the crowd there of largely, we believe, Syrian Kurds, just watching and cheering as ISIS fighters took on some fire there.

Right now, Lieutenant Colonel, we're awaiting this Pentagon briefing. We'll be hearing from defense secretary. We'll be hearing from the Joint Chiefs' chairman. This is the first time that we will be hearing from them since these air strikes began. What are you expecting they'll say?

FRANCONA: Well, I'm hoping to hear an update on the status of the air campaign. What are -- what is their assessment of how it's going? Are we achieving the objectives? Are we being effective? How are the allies doing? And what can we expect in the future? I know that we've just heard that the Dutch and the Belgians are going to be participating. There was this vote in the British parliament. So, we can expect to see more assets being brought into the area. How are they going to integrate those into the force?

KEILAR: Yes, big, big news coming out of Britain with the vote to join the fight. Lieutenant Colonel Rick Francona, thank you so much. Stand by. We're actually going to be coming back to you a little later in the hour.

It is, though, official, as you heard the lieutenant colonel say. Less than an hour ago, the United Kingdom voted to take military action. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Order.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The ayes to the right, 524. The nos to the left, 43.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Now, this means that Britain will join the air campaign against ISIS militants in Iraq. Prime Minister David Cameron convening this special session of parliament earlier today, and he told lawmakers why he thinks there should be military action.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID CAMERON, PRIME MINISTER, GREAT BRITAIN: Let me make some progress on why I believe military action is necessary before taking further interventions. Frankly, without it, I don't believe there is a realistic prospect of degrading and defeating ISIL. And should be frank, there already is a military conflict taking place. ISIL have taken territory. They're butchering people in Iraq.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: The opposition also backed air strikes in Iraq. Here's part of what Labour Party leader, Ed Milliband, had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ED MILLIBAND, LEADER, BRITISH LABOUR PARTY: I rise to support the government motion concerning military action against ISIL in Iraq. And it is right that the prime minister has brought this issue to the house and that he has committed that he will bring future decisions to the house, too. Let us to be clear, Mr. Speaker, at the outset, what is the proposition today? It is about air strikes against ISIL in Iraq. It is not about ground troops from the United Kingdom nor about U.K. military action elsewhere. It is a mission specifically aimed at ISIL.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: But the British parliament is not unanimous. Many British lawmakers are worried about this war escalating.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE GALLOWAY, RESPECT PARTY MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT, GREAT BRITAIN: If there's a consensus in here that we're going to soon be bombing Syria, the words don't mention boots on the ground. But there's a consensus here that there will be boots on the ground. The only question -- the only question being, whose boots are they?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Let's bring in CNN International Anchor and Correspondent Hala Gorani. She's joining us from London. And you're listening there, Hala. You can hear in the British parliament, there is this concern because there's a vote here to authorize force in Iraq, not Syria. And there is concern that there will be, essentially, mission creep, right?

HALA GORANI, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Right, there is some concern. However, if you look at the vote breakdown, we're looking at an overwhelming yes in favor of this military intervention in Iraq with the yeses at 524, the nos at 43. But you're right, there was some dissent. And some of the members of parliament in the House of Commons, here behind me, voicing some concern that, essentially, this is open-ended and this could be opening the door to involvement in Syria. And a very long-term military involvement for the U.K. in that part of the world.

You have to put this in -- this is the 11th war for the United Kingdom since 1991 with, of course, the two main ones, Iraq and Afghanistan, that have met a lot of opposition in this country. There was no appetite, just a few months ago, for any kind of military intervention.

But, Brianna, with ISIS's advance in Iraq and also those terrible videos of the beheading of American journalists and one British aid worker, you are feeling public opinion shift in this country in support of military intervention to do something, anything against ISIS. Even though long term, and it has been said by every military expert I've spoken to, you will need a ground component. The U.K. and the United States have both said no troop -- no boots on the ground. But, at some point, this military operation is going to have to morph into something different and that is what some opponents of these -- this effort, right now, are voicing concern about.

But right now, a decisive political victory for the prime minister. Here, he made sure that this motion was very precise, that it was only Iraq, not Syria, no boots on the ground, and it was passed overwhelmingly.

KEILAR: And what a difference a year makes, right, Hala? It was about this time, last year, where Prime Minister Cameron brought the British parliament back from vacation to have another vote taking strikes in Syria really to debate that. And it did not go -- it did -- it went completely the opposite way.

GORANI: Right. It was, in fact, a terrible political embarrassment for him because he recalled parliament. This was after the Syrian regime. We're not talking about is here. But the Syrian government was accused of having, essentially, used chemical weapons against its own people. There was talk even in the United States of intervening militarily. And the prime minister here asked parliament to authorize military intervention. That went exactly in the opposite direction. They said no. And that was very embarrassing for him. So, this time around, he pretty much made sure this motion had all the support it could get. In fact, the three main parties in parliament all aligned behind this movement.

But it's going to -- we'll see because the prime minister, himself, is acknowledging that this will take years. We'll see how much appetite is left after this mission sort of, kind of, carries over into the coming weeks and months and how effective it is in combatting ISIS -- Brianna.

KEILAR: Yes, certainly a consensus there in the U.K., as well in the U.S., that ISIS is a much bigger threat to western interests than Bashar Al Assad is. Hala Gorani for us in London. Thank you so much.

And up next, we will be going to the Pentagon where we're expecting to hear details on the U.S. mission in Iraq and Syria. Defense secretary, Chuck Hagel and Joint Chiefs' chairman, General Martin Dempsey, will be taking questions, and we'll take you there live.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: We are keeping an eye on the Pentagon as we speak. You can see we're waiting here for any moment we're expecting to hear from Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel, as well as Joint Chiefs Chairman General Martin Dempsey. And this will be the first time that we've heard from them since these air strikes were launched in Syria earlier this week. So a big briefing and we'll bring that to you live as soon as it begins.

After getting blindsided by a warning from Iraq's new prime minister, U.S. officials are trying to reassure Americans that subway systems are safe. Haider al-Abadi told reporters yesterday that his country had discovered an ISIS plot to attack transit systems in the U.S. and Paris, but U.S. intelligence officials say no such threat exists. Today, Iraq's president says he cannot confirm the report. Fuad Masum spoke before the Council on Foreign Relations.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FUAD MASUM, IRAQ PRESIDENT (through translator): Personally, I don't have any information about this. I have not heard or seen exactly what he said. it could be that it's an expectation to -- of (INAUDIBLE) - of this to happen by sleeper cells and they retaliate for what (ph). They could resort to such thing. But as detailed, accurate information, I have not seen any information like this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: So that's talking about ISIS. But the FBI still has concerns about Khorasan. This is an al Qaeda offshoot in Syria. And Director James Comey says he is not confident, that's a quote, that air strikes in Syria disrupted a plot to stage an attack in the U.S. He says the group remains at the top of the list of things that he is worried about.

So, a lot of issues to talk about here. Let's bring in CNN law enforcement analyst Tom Fuentes. And joining us as well, former Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense Peter Brookes. He's also a senior fellow at Heritage Foundation.

So, Tom, I mean, I want to get both of your perspectives on this because there are a lot of crossed signals here. You have the prime minister of Iraq saying one thing, that there is this threat from ISIS, which generally we haven't even conceived of to be threatening the U.S. homeland certainly imminently. Are these just signals getting crossed? What's going on here?

TOM FUENTES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, the only cross here is the Iraqi prime minister not knowing what he's talking about because nobody in Iraq has heard of this, no one at the U.S. embassy, which is staffed fully with FBI, CIA, the ambassador, the deputy chiefs of mission, defense attaches. They were told nothing. No one in the U.S. or in the western countries, our allies, have heard a thing, including the FBI and the CIA and the entire security infrastructure of the U.S. So why he said it, we have no clue. And he more or less retracted it later. So it's really -

KEILAR: Yes.

FUENTES: It was a thing he shouldn't have said. And having said it, he tried to undo it, but no one's been able to put the genie back in the bottle.

KEILAR: So - so what is it? Because some people have said this may have been raw intel that he was getting from ISIS fighters captured in Iraq, but it might have just been essentially untrue.

PETER BROOKES, FMR. DEPUTY ASST. SECY. OF DEFENSE: Well, Brianna, we certainly hope it wasn't politically motivated. You know, obviously, the Iraqis would like us to see ISIS as a greater danger than they perhaps are. I do think they are a danger that --

KEILAR: Meaning that he may have come to the U.S. -

BROOKES: Yes, sure.

KEILAR: To try to scare Americans and that's what you're --

BROOKES: And get us to put more resources to what's going on in his fight against ISIS in Iraq. I mean that's a possibility. I don't want to say that's what he was doing, but we certainly can't rule that out. We don't know what was really in his heart and his mind when he said that.

FUENTES: Not - not to mention what ISIS soldiers have been captured by the Iraqi military? We have seen the Iraqi military in action or inaction.

KEILAR: It's sort of the reverse right now, right?

FUENTES: Exactly. Exactly.

KEILAR: We've seen Iraqi soldiers overrun by ISIS fighters, 300 captured.

FUENTES: Exactly.

BROOKES: And we should be worried about perhaps of Iraq -the quality of Iraqi intelligence. That's another thing we have to be concerned about when they do give us additional information.

KEILAR: Or the Iraqi prime minister saying this, right? This is the guy -

FUENTES: That's a - that's a problem.

KEILAR: Who is supposed to be in charge of a political solutions in Iraq.

BROOKES: Right.

KEILAR: What does that tell you about what kind of partner he is? Do you take anything away from that?

BROOKES: I -- it could undermine our confidence in him. Hopefully it won't and hopefully he'll have learned something from this. Of course, we did have to run it to ground. We have to take anything like this seriously.

KEILAR: Yes. So let's talk about the air strikes in Syria. So the U.S. took on ISIS in Syria with these air strikes with Arab allies. Separately, the U.S. going alone took on Khorasan, which is an al Qaeda off shoot, with air strikes. We're hearing, again, mixed signals here. James Comey, the FBI director, is saying one thing, that he's not confident that we've really sort of hurt Khorasan, or I should say that the U.S. has hurt Khorasan. And then you have other Obama administration officials who are saying they have more confidence. What do we make of this?

FUENTES: Well, I think there you have the military saying, in their battle-damage assessment, that they hit what they were aiming at.

KEILAR: Yes.

FUENTES: And you have the director of the FBI, James Comey, saying, but was that Khorasan? We don't know. We know the bombs landed on the building and the facilities that they aimed for, but was the intelligence correct that they were there at the time of the bombing or had they left earlier or maybe were never there? So that's the difference. There's no reason to be confident.

And this isn't - you know, referring to them as an al Qaeda off shoot doesn't do them justice. This is the al Qaeda all-star team. This is like somebody that has a New York Yankee uniform like Derek Jeter go to the all-star game and the uniform says American league. That doesn't mean he's an off shoot of baseball. He's an all-star. He's one of their top guys. So they've sent their best players from Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Yemen to Syria. This is a serious group.

BROOKES: You know, Brianna, sometimes you don't know what you don't know, especially --

KEILAR: There are no eyes on the ground. That's the issue, right?

FUENTES: Exactly.

BROOKES: And it's sometimes it's like a jigsaw puzzle and you don't have all the pieces. You don't know exactly what you're putting together. So they're probably being cautious here. It's a threat. We know al Qaeda, instead of focus on Syria, what's going on in Syria, they're focusing on the United States but using Syria. And that brings us to the problem of having these ungoverned lawless spaces where terrorists can set up camp and plan and operate against the United States and western Europe.

KEILAR: Is that how you would describe Khorasan as al Qaeda all-stars?

BROOKES: It's core al Qaeda, al Qaeda core, however you want to do it. These are the folks - the head of this group was with Osama bin Laden around the time of 9/11. He was a young man, an up and comer and he's considered -- he's still around. So is al Qaeda on the run? Maybe they're on the run to Syria and other places where they can plan, train, and operate.

KEILAR: All right, thank you so much. Tom Fuentes, Peter Brookes, really appreciate you both being here.

And coming up, we are waiting, as we have been telling you, it should be starting any moment now, to hear from Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel and Joint Chiefs Chairman General Martin Dempsey. As soon as this starts, we will bring it to you live.

And then also ahead, there are pressing issues at the United Nations. One of the key ones this week is Iran's nuclear program. There is a deadline that's drawing closer and diplomats are pressing ahead with their - and actually, you know what, we're going to cut out of this. We're going to go straight to the Pentagon for this press conference we've been waiting for with Secretary Hagel and the chairman of the Joint Chiefs. Here we go.

CHUCK HAGEL, US SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Good afternoon.

As you all know, this has been an important week in our campaign against ISIL. So, let me make a few comments about that campaign and what's been going on the last week, and then General Dempsey will make some comments, and then we'll take the questions.

As I said, this week has been an important week for the U.S. and our coalition forces as we began airstrikes in Syria. Along with France, we've conducted over 200 airstrikes in Iraq against ISIL and in support of Iraqi forces. With our Arab partners, we've conducted 43 airstrikes in Syria.

Combined with our ongoing efforts in Iraq, these strikes will continue to deny ISIL freedom of movement and challenge its ability to plan, direct, and sustain its operations.

We also took action in Syria against the network of Al Qaida veterans known as the Khorasan group. We are still assessing the operational impact of these strikes. This was a critical operation. Members of this group were actively plotting attacks against the United States and our friends' allies.

In Syria there has been no coordination, nor will there be with the Assad regime. Nothing has changed about our position that has shifted our approach to Assad and his regime because this regime, President Assad, has lost all legitimacy to govern.

As we continue our operation from the air, I also want to emphasize that no one is under any illusions -- under any illusions -- that airstrikes alone will destroy ISIL. They are one element of our broader comprehensive campaign against ISIL, a campaign that has diplomatic, economic, intelligence and other military components, working with coalition partners and a new government in Iraq.

This week we move forward on each of these fronts. In New York, the president chaired a U.N. Security Council meeting focused on stopping the flow of fighters into and out of the region.

With the Treasury Department in the lead, the United States and our coalition partners are also intensifying efforts to cut off ISIL's financing and we continue to support the new Iraqi government and its program of reform and reconciliation, because that is the only long- term solution to the sectarian tensions that enabled ISIL's rise in Iraq.

On Wednesday President Obama met with Prime Minister Abadi. The president affirmed America's support for him, his new government and the Iraqi people. Yesterday Secretary Kerry met with members of the Gulf Cooperation Council and the president and vice president spoke with Turkish President Erdogan to strengthen our coalition's cooperation against ISIL.

Senior military officials continue to coordinate with our coalition partners. The other dimensions of our military strategy are also seeing progress. Now that we have the support of Congress, we are moving forward with our plan to train and equip the moderate Syrian opposition.

We have begun detailed military planning for this mission. And assessment teams have arrived in Saudi Arabia.

In Iraq, ISIL strongholds continued to pose a major challenge. But our support for Iraqi and Kurdish forces is enabling many Iraqi units to go on the offensive. Coalition forces will continue to maintain pressure on ISIL fighters throughout Iraq.

As the president emphasized on Wednesday in his speech at the United Nations, this broad diplomatic, economic and military campaign is being underwritten by a broad multinational coalition of more than 40 nations, including five regional partners. And this coalition continues to expand.

Over the last two days, the governments of Belgium, Denmark and the Netherlands have announced their intention to participate in coalition airstrikes in Iraq. A few minutes ago, before coming down here, I spoke with Britain's defense minister, Michael Fallon (ph). He called me as he left the chambers of the Parliament to inform me that the British Parliament had just voted 524-43 to join the air campaign in Iraq with the United States and our coalition partners.

A broad coalition has been and will continue to be a cornerstone of our strategy against ISIL and we appreciate all the contributions and commitments of our friends and allies as we continue to work closely with them and coordinate their participation and efforts.

Sustaining our broad diplomatic, economic and military campaign will require a long-term commitment from the United States and all of our partners and allies. This will not be an easy or brief effort. We are at the beginning, not the end.

We are at the beginning, not the end of our effort to degrade and destroy ISIL. I know that Americans have confidence in the skill and professionalism of our men and women in uniform and our exceptional military leadership.

When I had the opportunity to visit CENTCOM last week with President Obama in Tampa, we made a point of expressing our deep appreciation to General Austin and his CENTCOM team for their hard work, their planning. And this hard work and planning and commitment to this country is keeping America secure.

I'm proud of him. The president's proud of him. We're all proud of him. We're proud of these men and women who do so much for our country, and the men and women downrange who are carrying out this mission every day with courage and dedication and resolve.

Thank you.

Marty?