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@THISHOUR WITH BERMAN AND MICHAELA

Cease-Fire Reached in Ukraine; Joan Rivers Has Died; American Computer Whiz Could be Helping ISIS; Obama to Speak from NATO Summit

Aired September 5, 2014 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN CO-ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm John Berman.

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN CO-ANCHOR: And I'm Michaela Pereira. @THISHOUR, we do begin with breaking news. What could be a major breakthrough for peace between Ukraine's government and pro-Russian separatists. A cease-fire between the two sides is going into effect right now.

Officials from Kiev and rebel leaders signed an agreement earlier today.

BERMAN: Ukraine's president Petro Poroshenko spoke about the cease- fire just a short time ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PETRO POROSHENKO, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT: This cease-fire is based on the agreement which was reached during my phone conversation with Russian President Putin, and that's why I think that this is very important, that the stability, the fact that this cease-fire should lasting long is now the -- our common responsibility.

I can assure you that from Ukrainian side we really do our best to keep peace and stability.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Peace and stability, so badly desired in that region.

This map from the Ukraine National Security and Defense Council gives you an idea of where the heaviest fighting is and where forces could be laying down their weapons @THIS HOUR.

It's been such a confusing week right now, obviously, because we got word there might be a cease-fire, and the Russians said no, no, no, we can't enter into a cease-fire because we're not actually fighting.

PEREIRA: We're not actually in the fighting.

BERMAN: Except they have troops there that they don't admit to having there. PEREIRA: And then add to that, we've heard that there's fighting in

parts of Ukraine today on the day that the cease-fire was set to go into effect.

We want to bring in our Matthew Chance who is in Moscow. Good to have you with us. Let us know what you are hearing about this cease-fire.

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It's quite incredible, isn't it, after so much fighting and blood shed, the more than 2,600 people killed in recent months in those clashes between Ukrainian forces and separatists in the east of the country, pro- Russian separatists, this deal now has been done.

It comes on the back of the NATO summit we've been seeing in Wales, where it become absolutely clear that NATO, even though it would protect its allies, was not going to go to bat essentially for Ukraine, which of course is not a NATO ally.

It really left President Petro Poroshenko, the Ukrainian president, with no option but to sue for peace. There was a phone call between him and his Russian counterpart, Vladimir Putin, on Wednesday. Vladimir Putin proposed a framework for a cease-fire, and it's that framework that appears to have formed the basis of this cease-fire agreement.

Now, central to that, not just as the end of hostilities but a withdrawal of Ukrainian forces, away from population centers, this was a term that Vladimir Putin was quite insistent on it -- withdraw away from cities so they could no longer be barraged by multiple rocket launchers or artillery.

Now what that means, in effect, if that's carried out, would mean that the pro-Russian rebels when the Ukrainians withdraw would be left with vast swaths of territory under their control, and of course that means under the control of the Kremlin.

It's the Kremlin that arms them allegedly, and it's the Kremlin that supports them. And so in a way that kind of achieves what Vladimir Putin had wanted all along, which is to dismember Ukraine and to prevent it, effectively, from joining those Western alliances such as NATO.

BERMAN: Matthew, the cease-fire was set to go into effect three minutes ago so still too early for us to know whether it is taking hold.

PEREIRA: Has the message been received?

BERMAN: Has the message been received or not?

But how about the pro-Russian rebels, the separatists? It seems like the terms of this deal might be favorable to them. Have they indicated they will abide by the letter?

CHANCE: Yeah, there's no doubt the terms of this deal are going to be favorable to them. This is Vladimir Putin's initiative, and he supports those rebels. And, so, yes, they are going to be left, as I said, with vast areas of territory, including major cities like Luhansk and Donetsk, which are effectively under their control and are autonomous.

Now, of course, that gives the Kremlin a great degree of control inside Ukraine. There has been a statement already from the separatists. They're a bit kind of fractured, so it's difficult to get them to speak with a single voice.

But there has been word from the separatists that just because there's a cease-fire, it doesn't mean they have given up all their aspirations for independence from Ukraine, and so that poses a very ominous sign for the future as well.

I mean, of course, this is a deal that's been reached in Minsk, the Belarusian capital. It's merely a cease-fire deal. There are issues that have to be resolved in the longer term, what place these areas will have in a united Ukraine or whether they will even stay in Ukraine, and so obviously, the rebels will have their say in that as well.

BERMAN: Still, there'll be issues that need to be resolved, the very issues for which they've been fighting over the last several months.

PEREIRA: A step in the right direction.

BERMAN: A step in the right direction. It would be a good thing if the fighting has in fact stopped. Four minutes ago that cease-fire went into effect, so we'll have to wait and see how that goes.

Matthew Chance in Moscow for us, thank you so much.

And this cease-fire -- at least the planned cease-fire -- is happening as the NATO summit is winding down in Wales. The Russian aggression in Ukraine was a major reason that allied nations and the U.S. had gathered there. That was one of the key discussion points on the agenda for this meeting.

PEREIRA: Another key discussion point obviously has been about a way to stop ISIS's barbaric advances in Iraq and Syria and how exactly to deal with its threat to the West.

President Obama is going to speak @THIS HOUR just before he leaves that summit in Wales. We'll bring that to you live.

BERMAN: It could be a very interesting news conference, a lot of questions for the president there.

While the president is focused on foreign policy, the administration dealing with a fairly disappointing jobs report that was released this morning. A hundred and forty two thousand jobs were added last month. It's always good to add them instead of subtracting.

But economists surveyed by CNN had expected a gain of about 226,000 jobs.

PEREIRA: It's a big difference.

BERMAN: There have been six straight months of gains of more than 200,000. The unemployment rate did dip slightly to 6.1 percent, down from 6.2 percent in July.

PEREIRA: Meanwhile @ THIS HOUR, the world is mourning the death of comedian Joan Rivers. Her self-deprecating humor and celebrity barbs drew fans for something like 50 years, from her work in the early days on "The Tonight Show" to a new generation of fans with her show on E!, "Fashion Police."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOAN RIVERS, COMEDIAN: At 21, my mother said only a doctor for you. When I was 22, she said all right, a lawyer, a CPA. Twenty-four, she said, we'll grab a dentist. Twenty-six, she said anything.

She got me well this morning. I came in. I can't do the show, and he said coffee enemas, and I can never go back to Starbucks, but the point is I had -- I came over to do show, and I'm also here for charity because at this age you like to give back because you are closer to God, you know.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: There are serious questions this morning about why Joan Rivers died and how it happened.

The 81-year-old went into an outpatient surgery clinic for a minor procedure on her vocal cords, then she went into cardiac arrest.

Joining us to talk about this and her career, Alexandra Field and Tom O'Neil, editor of GoldDerby.com, who worked the red carpet with Joan Rivers.

Alexandra, we want to start with you first. And the question a lot of people are asking, you got in what should be a routine throat procedure and then this happens.

ALEXANDRA FIELD, CNN CORRESPODENT: Sure. A devastating loss, it's been called an unexpected death because of that, what you just pointed out. And that means that an investigation has to be happen there. These questions need to be answered.

And what we're seeing now in the aftermath of her death is two investigations. You've got the medical examiner here in New York who is looking into the cause and manner of Joan Rivers' death. He will determine exactly what happened to her.

But you've also got the state's Department of Health looking at the facility where this procedure was performed, Yorkville Endoscopy Center. And they've got to make sure that this facility was operating just the way that it should have been.

So they have sent investigators to that center now, and they are going to be looking at the procedures that were in place there. They are looking at documents, medical records. They will be talking to staff members. They'll be talking to physicians.

We know that the facility was inspected just before it opened, which was only in 2013. There had been no violations to this point --

PEREIRA: So no red flags.

FIELD: -- according to the health department.

No, no red flags, but it's been in operation for a short period, and they really want to see what was happening there. They've got to look and make sure that the state's regulations were all being complied with, and they need to see if there are any deficiencies at the time that Joan Rivers was brought in there.

PEREIRA: And, look, we know that those are answers that need to be found.

Clearly, the funeral is planned for Sunday, but this will be happening sort of simultaneously as those plains are being made.

Alexandra, thank you so much for that. We really appreciate it.

We want to bring in Tom O'Neil, a friend of mine from Los Angeles, who I haven't spoken to in some time.

And I know, speaking of friends, you had a chance to work alongside Miss Joan Rivers so much. We've heard from people time to time again, Tom, about how generous she was, how supportive she was of other people.

Not everybody always appreciated her sense of humor, though.

TOM O'NEIL, GOLDDERBY.COM: Well, that's what I think the big story and headline is here, Michaela, because while Joan Rivers was such a pioneer in so many ways -- professionally, she was the first woman to have a daytime talk show, the first woman to have a late-night talk show -- she was also a kind of enduring pioneer of an old kind of humor that people don't get today.

It was all Borsht Belt. It was called Catskills, and the purpose of it was to go for the joke to the most extreme you could, and, so, many people she was so cruel, how could she do that?

But Joan did it to herself. One of most outrageous jokes she ever told was the following. She usually began her nightclub act with, "So my husband killed himself, get over it. It was all my fault." She says, "We were making love one night and I took the bag off my head." You think, what did she just say?

PEREIRA: My goodness.

BERMAN: Yeah, I mean, she really spared nobody, including herself, to be sure.

It's funny. She had even written about her death in her book, and it really is -- it's a really nice little clip, and I want to read it to you.

She said, "I don't want some rabbi rambling on. I want Meryl Streep crying in five different accents." That of course her favorite line. She says, " I want to look gorgeous, better dead than I do alive. I want to be buried in a Valentino gown, and I want Harry Winston to make me a toe tag."

I mean, really, truly, Tom, nothing off-limits?

O'NEIL: Nothing off-limits. And that's what made her a mystery to many people.

Remember the Elizabeth Taylor fat jokes, and people would say, how can she do that to a legend like Elizabeth Taylor. Joan would get up there and say, "Oh, Elizabeth Taylor's so fat she's the only person who stands in front of a microwave screaming, 'Hurry!' She's the only person who puts mayonnaise on an aspirin."

And she would just, you know, be so outrageous. You think, how could she do this? But that was Joan and that's what made her a great talent.

PEREIRA: And she lived to make people laugh. She has said that time and time again.

If the Twitter remembrances from celebrities around the world are any indication, that funeral on Sunday in New York could be a who's who of comedy. I really tell you that. We don't know what the plans are at this point, obviously.

But, Tom O'Neil, thank you so much for joining us and recalling a little bit of our friend and a great comedian legend, Joan Rivers.

BERMAN: I hope Meryl Streep does go and cries, cries in five accents.

PEREIRA: You love that line.

BERMAN: She worked so hard, Joan Rivers. She wrote thousands and thousands of jokes, which is work. It is work. She worked furiously at her craft.

PEREIRA: A funny man knows.

All right, we're going to take a short break here.

Ahead, is this man from Massachusetts behind some of the horrific social media messages used by ISIS to recruit new members? He is one of the FBI's Most Wanted suspected terrorists. We have his story straight ahead.

BERMAN: Plus, as we mentioned, we're waiting to hear from President Obama. He is set to speak at 11:30 Eastern before wrapping up his NATO visit, expected to answer questions, and there are a lot of questions for the president.

We'll bring you that live when it happens. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: An American computer whiz could be a critical contributor to those savage messages and images coming from ISIS. His name is Ahmad Abousamra. U.S. intelligence officials suspect that he is behind the terror groups social media campaign.

PEREIRA: Our Deborah Feyerick is here with more. OK, so we know he's raised in Massachusetts. What more do we know about him? How did he find his way to be on the FBI's most suspected terrorists list?

DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: What we do know is that intelligence sources say that Ahmad Abousamra is exactly the kind of person that ISIS would look to recruit to head up social media efforts. He is fluent in English and Arabic, he grew up in Boston, he graduated in 2006 with a degree in computer science from the University of Massachusetts, and that was after spend several years at Northeastern University.

Now it appears that Abousamra was focused on jihad for than a decade. This isn't just something that happened over night. He traveled to Yemen in 2004 for terror training. Then went on to Iraq and fight and kill U.S. troops. That's according to the FBI. He spent about six months over seas, cam back to the U.S., was questioned by members of the FBI's joint terrorism task force. And then he fled, he simple disappeared. That's why there's such a high priority by the Boston office of the FBI to try to find this guy.

We are told by a law enforcement official that they are looking into whether he's the one putting up all these videos, all these tweets on the social media sites. Including Facebook, including this online magazine, also twitter. Twitter recently simply shut down the group's account, and one of key connections is that one of the friends that he's accused of trying to go over to Yemen to get this training with was actually translating information for al Qaeda in Iraq, their media wing, and that ultimately became ISIS.

So there's that really hardcore connection of Abousamra being link to somebody else who was essentially doing something very similar. To be clear, authorities will not confirm whether in fact this is his role or whether in fact he is with ISIS, but he has been on the run for five years and the FBI has made it a top priority, especially now, to try to catch him.

BERMAN: They are concerned and they are on the case. That's abundantly clear.

FEYERICK: No question.

BERMAN: Thanks so much.

PEREIRA: Thanks so much for that. Well, we know that ISIS wants to establish a caliphate, but instead of doing it quietly, the terror group appears that it wants to show the world, to witness and see its brutality.

BERMAN: When you see these videos, it almost does seem like ISIS is trying to goad the west to try and come and get them.

I want to bring in Martin Chulov for The Guardian. Martin, What about that? Is ISIS trying to provoke the United States and west into action? And if so, why would that be their motive?

MARTIN CHULOV, MIDDLE EAST CORRESPONDENT, THE GUARDIAN: There are two schools of thoughts on that. Within the organization and outside, there's a lot of debate in recent days as to whether these videos, these horrific beheading videos, are indeed an attempt by the ISIS leadership to bring the U.S. into what would amount to a holy war, a war against the infidels. A preordained war, in the eyes of the leader Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, with the crusaders. He truly does believes, in many ways, that what he's doing is acting out preordained prophecy's, in terms of fighting a prescribed enemy, one that's been around for 1500 years. He sees this as his moment in history according to many of his followers. Some others within the ISIS organization are saying if Baghdadi truly did want to do that, to bring in the Americans quickly, he will kill all hostages straight away. Not just one or two in a drip feed such as that. So there's a lot of discussion right as we speak.

PEREIRA: So follow that last train of thought then, if he would have just killed them all quickly then that would be the reasoning and his ultimate goal there?

CHULOV: Well, Islamic scriptures are pretty specific about several parts of Syria. They feature very prominently in Islamic scripture and in teaching. There's a town in northern Syria called Debek (ph), there is a prophecy or Hadith in Islamic teachings, which is that this - A town called Debek (ph) would be a scene of a pre-apocalyptic showdown between the Persians and the Sunnis. Shortly after that, there would be a big showdown, an apocalyptic showdown with the Christians.

Now Debek (ph) is only 30 miles form the Turkish border. A lot of the ISIS jihadists that are flooding into Syria are doing so with this scripture in mind. They are taking up residence in Debek (ph) they are using this as a lightening - A Clarion call I should say, for what they are doing and many of them truly do believe that this prophecy is inching forward towards quickly.

BERMAN: Quickly, is it just Baghdadi who is running this? Is he doing it alone? What's the hierarchy right now in ISIS? Because U.S. officials say that some ISIS officials have been hit. How does it work?

CHULOV: It's a very strict hierarchy, very disciplined. Abu Bakr al- Baghdadi is definitely the overall leader. The caliph as he calls himself. He does however have a military council which do have a lot of responsibility. They are very prescriptive in terms of the battles that they engage, in terms of their strategy. There is about an eight-man ruling military council. They are responsible for all of the strategic decisions. They push toward Erbil, the push into Baghdad and now they reinforced emphasis on Syria.

PEREIRA: Well, it is concerning. I'm really glad we had a chance to talk to you about it. I'm hoping that, Martin, you can come back and talk to us again another time.

Martin Chulov, Middle East correspondent for The Guardian. Thanks so much for joining us and have a great weekend.

BERMAN: You want to stay with CNN. President Obama is set to speak any moment. He's wrapping up his trip in Newport, Wales, where he met with NATO members. He is expected to answer questions about Ukraine, Russia, and ISIS. We're going to bring that to you live after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST, "THE SITUATION ROOM": Hello, I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington and this is a special live coverage that we're focusing in right now. We want to welcome in our viewers in the United States and around the world.

We're waiting for President Obama to address reporters. Indeed, the NATO summit, the entire world at the close of what has been called one of the most important NATO summit in decades. Topping the agenda a pair of issues dominating world affairs, Russia's incursion into eastern Ukraine and the ISIS threat in Iraq and Syria. We expect the President to begin speaking in just a few minutes. I want to welcome once again our viewers United States and around the world.

As we anticipate President Obama's remarks, we're covering all the angles as only CNN can. Our reporters are in Wales, in the Ukrainian capital of Kiev, at the Pentagon, along with our panel of experts, former presidential adviser David Gergen, Rice University historian Doug Brinkley and Nile Gardiner with the Heritage foundation.

Let's begin with CNN's White House correspondent Michelle Kosinski, she is standing by. Set the scene for us, Michelle, with the very latest.

MICHELLE KOSINSKI, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: So much has happened today on both of those counts. First on Russia, NATO put out its declaration. A lengthy document outlining it's stance on those issues. But this is also changing in light of events. We didn't see an additional round of sanctions announced today. It seems like they were waiting to see what would happen on the ground between the Ukraine and the rebels there.

They have arrived at a cease-fire but we don't know yet if that's going to play out. There's a lot of skepticism from leaders here about what the outcome of that would be in real terms. But within the declarations, NATO denounced, condemned in the strongest terms it said, what its called Russia's escalating and illegal military intervention in Ukraine. Demanded that Russia pull its troops out, stop funding the rebels. Similar to what we have seen before. Again, they are not calling it an invasion.

Also on ISIS, they have taken steps to condemn the group, express outrage and now we see this coalition forming really in a concrete sense. Coalition building has been talked about, especially by the U.S. and the U.K. over the past few days, but now we see it coming together at least in a preliminary sense. Ten countries talking about this, expanding their military within the format of NATO, and that was a big part of the NATO declaration as well. This increasing military readiness, a rapid response force that would be expanded and ready within two days to respond to threats, so really on all of these counts, we're seeing action by NATO today, and we should hear more from the President.

BLITZER: We will be hearing momentarily from the President. I assume he will open with a statement that will answer reporters questions. Our live coverage, of course, will continue.

I want to go to Nic Robertson, he join is us also at the summit. He is in Newport, Wales. Nick, tell us what you expect the President to say specifically about the ISIS threat in Iraq and Syria.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think we're going to hear him talk about what has been agreed and the way forward. You know, those ten nations we talk about, Australia, Denmark, Italy, France, Germany, Portugal, Turkey, Britain, among them, are all very important nations, with a lot to contribute. And what has been discussed here at NATO is what those nations can contribute and how they can contribute, and the idea is that there's a focus on isolating and destroying ISIS. How do they do it?

What's agreed upon what far? Well, we know there's an agreement to stop ISIS fighters, foreign fighters getting into Iraq and Syria. That is going to be done by sharing information, sharing intelligence among those nations, and other nations, to stop those fighters getting in. Cutting their finances. Targeting their ideology, humanitarian assistance, and importantly supporting the governments on the ground that are fighting ISIS already, Wolf

BLITZER: All right, Nic, I want you to stand by as well. Once again, we're awaiting the President of the United States wrapping up the NATO summit in Wales. The President will open with a statement and then answer reporters questions.

David Gergen is a former adviser to Presidents Nixon, Ford, Reagan and Clinton. He is joining us, he is our CNN senior political analyst.

David, as we await the President, he's putting together this international coalition. It sort of reminds me of the coalition of the willing going into the war against Saddam Hussein in 2003. Is this a real coalition based on what you've heard so far, or sort of like a token presence from these other countries?

DAVID GERGEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: I think it's a real coalition in the sense of commitment. What each one contributes is going to be, I think, open to question.

But we are coming to the conclusion now of what many believe is the most important NATO summit in decades, because it is an attempt now to do something what's called out of area, Wolf, as you know, to go beyond the NATO borders themselves and try to deal with ISIS through this kind of coalition -- and a coalition that will expand to include Middle Eastern countries such as Saudi Arabia, Jordan, and the Emirates.