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CNN NEWSROOM

Worries More Americans Will Join Terrorists; Russia Moves Troops into Ukraine; ISIS Demanded Scientist Release Before Foley Death; Tony Stewart Talks about Accident on Track.

Aired August 29, 2014 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Just past the bottom of the hour. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

The death of another American killed fighting for ISIS is raising concern about how many more Americans could be out there and what is driving them to join the fight to become terrorists. That's what the family of one Minnesota man, Abrachman Mohammad (ph), is trying to figure out. The family says he was killed over the weekend in Syria fighting alongside ISIS

So just this week, I talked to Chris Dickey, foreign editor of "The Daily Beast." He talked about the would-be terrorists or terrorists in general. He said essentially they're a bunch of young men, full of testosterone and they want fame. He explained the traits they share in common. Here he was.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRIS DICKEY, FOREIGN EDITOR, THE DAILY BEAST: TNT. Testosterone. Almost all young guys. Some of these guys may be older. Narrative. That's very important. They may not be oppressed or grown up oppressed but passionately identify with some oppressed people, maybe their own, maybe somebody else's. Finally, theater. They want to project themselves on the world stage.

BALDWIN: They want the fame.

DICKEY: They want this fame. They want to carry out spectacular acts, whether 9/11 or the beheading of an American journalist.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Let's take this a little bit more, the psychology of these potential terrorists with Tony Lemieux, an investigator for Study of Terrorism and Responses to Terrorism.

Tony, welcome.

ANTHONY LEMIEUX, INVESTIGATOR, STUDY OF TERRORISM & RESPONSE: Thanks for having me.

BALDWIN: First, do you agree with what he said, the TNT, testosterone narrative and theater?

LEMIEUX: On some level there's some accuracy. It is important to recognize plenty of women get involved as well. I think that misses part of the story, and of course there's a lot more to it as well. There's a desire to fit in, to belong, to do something important and have meaning. So there are issues of identity and perceived grievance. Those are all factors he alluded to that are in play here.

BALDWIN: I understand young men or young women growing up, maybe lose a parent, maybe something horrendous happens in their lives that they want this acceptance, you know, but to up and go overseas and join this terrorist organization, connect the dots for me. I mean, how do you get there?

LEMIEUX: That's the million dollar question, and it really is a difficult one because there are lots of different potential pathways for people. Part of it is identifying with a group that's particularly grieved or perplexed. What should I do, can I sit on the sidelines and watch this happen. There are certain spaces and vulnerabilities we need to be concerned with. My own area of interest in this is what kind of materials are available. What kind of --

BALDWIN: Propaganda, right?

LEMIEUX: That's a really important piece of it because it interacts with those windows of vulnerability.

BALDWIN: Let's compare ISIS propaganda to al Qaeda and the Arabian Peninsula. Why would it be more alluring to join ISIS now?

LEMIEUX: I think the propaganda is one piece of it, but also the content of that. What ISIS is doing is saying we have a place, we have this physical territory that we have succeeded in battle, in combat. It is not an idea only. It has a much more tangible real sort of quality to it in some ways, so there's an appeal there.

What I think is interesting, in my own studies of propaganda of al Qaeda and Arabian Peninsula put out in the forms of magazines, there was more of a do it yourself that was characteristic of some of their work. One of the things we're seeing, some of the stuff we are seeing with ISIS propaganda is it is more motivational, not necessarily concerned with giving you the skills to do something wherever you are. It is more about, here is where the action is and here is what needs to be done, come be a part of it, look at how we're winning. That's a big piece of this throughout.

BALDWIN: Winning. If you consider killing people, beheading American journalists as playing on the winning team, that's part of the malleability of the young minds.

Tony Lemieux, thanks so much.

LEMIEUX: Thanks for having me.

BALDWIN: Try to understand it. Let's turn the situation back to the Ukraine, the U.S., and NATO. Now

into CNN, Great Britain saying more Russian troops crossed into Ukraine. More sanctions could be on the table. What about military action? We will talk to retired Army Lieutenant General Mark Hertling about strategy moving ahead and how to stop them next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Got a new development. This just into CNN. A British government source telling us that Russia has moved between 4,000 and 5,000 troops in formed units into eastern Ukraine. So that's new, 4,000 to 5,000. Also, Britain believes Russia has 20,000 troops on the Russian side of the border, and more may be on the way. NATO says these images right here show Russian tanks and artillery units that were already there, moving around eastern Ukraine.

Just a couple hours ago, the White House slammed Russia's continuous denials of interference.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOSH EARNEST, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: As the Russian military has fired on Ukrainian military positions, as the Russian military has put boots on the ground in Ukraine, we have regularly marshaled evidence to show what's happened. Despite protests by the Russian government that for some reason would have us believe otherwise, those denials are completely without credibility and we have been pretty candid about that I think.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Listening to the president speaking yesterday afternoon, he stopped short of calling what Russia is doing an invasion. Instead, President Obama labeled these moves as an "incursion." The president basically ruling out any U.S. military action.

So let's talk military with our CNN military analyst, Lieutenant General Mark Hertling.

General, let's begin with the news just in from Britain saying 4,000 to 5,000. That's up a couple thousand troops inside, Russian troops inside Ukraine, and knowing 20,000 or so amassed on the border of Russia, reading into that militarily, how does that strike you?

LT. GEN. MARK HERTLING, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: That tells me there's a couple of divisions on the border, that's critical, when you talk about 4 to 5,000, the size of that element is probably a reinforced regimen or tank regimen with artillery. That's pretty significant. You can call it incursion or invasion, what it ISIS is basically going into sovereign territory of Ukraine and trying to create chaos.

BALDWIN: Can I just -- on semantics, incursion, invasion, what's the difference?

HERTLING: The invasion piece is a Russian attempt to bring their political will against another country. An incursion is where they used their force to basically influence another country. And it is semantics, Brooke. I call it an invasion. It meets the pure definition of invasion.

BALDWIN: I want to you listen to something. I had a guest on the show yesterday, Ben Judah, wrote a book on Vladimir Putin. He was talking to me, he said that Putin has struck fear in the hearts and minds of Russians and that Ukraine, he taught them through propaganda and what not is evil. But now my guest said Putin is stuck. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Why can't he just stop, Ben, why can't he stop? Heaven forbid Vladimir Putin would say I am wrong and stop what he began in Ukraine. But what's wrong with that?

BEN JUDAH, AUTHOR: Because Nazi Ukraine, as Putin framed it, for the Russian people was starting to win, and it looked like Putin's rebels were going to lose consequent and Luhansk. Now Vladimir Putin can't lose those two cities to Nazi party, can he? That's why he has to react. He is trapped by his propaganda.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Then, General, he went on to say that Putin finds himself stuck. Even at the cost of full collapse of relations with the West, even with a full scale war. Do you agree?

HERTLING: Here is what I would say, Brooke. This is something Mr. Putin cannot afford. He cannot afford to lose. He was being beat in the two provinces where he was attempting to cause chaos against the Ukrainian military. Now he is trying to create another front against the Ukrainian military and maybe create a bridge. He cannot go back to his people and say I lost against an inferior force.

BALDWIN: Lose what? Do we even really know what he is trying to win? We can guess.

HERTLING: He is trying to influence the Europeans. And it won't stop with Ukraine. This will continue on into other areas, the Baltic nations, Georgia, Moldavia, where Russia already acted in several ways. This is where he was trying to counter the influence of the West. And he can't afford to lose in Ukraine.

BALDWIN: OK. How do you stop it?

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: The president is talking about possible additional sanctions.

General, can you hear me?

Oh. We lost him. Darn it. I hate when that happens. General Mark Hertling, thanks for that.

We will talk to him next hour about something else.

Up next, she's known by many as Lady al Qaeda and sits in a U.S. prison. ISIS wants her freed. And her sister and family speak out exclusively to us on CNN.

And NASCAR driver, Tony Stewart, racing this weekend and talking for the first time about the accident on a track just a couple of weeks ago that killed another driver. Hear what Tony Stewart had to say just this accident.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Before ISIS killed James Foley, they demanded the release of a Pakistani neuroscientist, Aafia Siddiqui, who sits in a Texas federal prison. Some call her Lady al Qaeda. A woman on the FBI's most-wanted list.

CNN had a chance to speak with Siddiqui's sister, and she tells our Saima Mohsin that her sister is not a terrorist and doesn't want her name associated with any terrorist group.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FOWZIA SIDDIQUI, SISTER OF AAFIA SIDDIQUI: I condemn any kind of violence. I don't care who does it, I condemn it.

SAIMA MOHSIN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Aafia Siddiqui's sister, Fowzia, made the decision to speak to CNN from her home in Karachi, Pakistan, because the family doesn't want terrorists carrying out attacks in Aafia's name.

After the brutal beheading of James Foley, a letter sent to his family reveals how ISIS claimed to have requested Aafia Siddiqui's release. It read, "We offered prisoner exchanges to free the Muslims currently in your detention, like our sister, Dr. Aafia Siddiqui."

Not in our name, says her family.

SIDDIQUI: Any kind of kidnappers, is, whoever wants to claim Aafia, I am Aafia's sister. We are Aafia's family. And we speak on her behalf as well. We want no violence in Aafia's name. Our whole struggle has been one that is dignified, that is peaceful, and that is legal.

MOHSIN: A Pakistani neuroscientist based in the U.S., Aafia went missing in 2003. A year later, she was named on the FBI alert list as an al Qaeda member. In 2008, she reappeared, stopped by Afghan national police, for acting suspiciously outside a government building. She was accused of shooting at two FBI agents and several military personnel, while being held at an Afghan facility and sentenced by a U.S. federal judge to 86 years in prison for attempted murder and other charges.

DEBORAH SCROGGINS, AUTHOR: She is an icon. She is the poster girl for jihad, and in that way she serves as a sort of rallying point.

She's the premier symbol of the Muslim woman in distress.

SIDDIQUI: Aafia should be released, but not for ransom, not in exchange, not for other people that are kidnapped by extremists. No. And if I were to make an appeal to the kidnappers of hostages, I would say the same thing to them. You don't get anything, achieve anything by kidnapping innocent people. Unjust incarceration is wrong.

MOHSIN: The only solution, says the family, is to remove the extremist cause celeb and release Aafia Siddiqui.

Saima Mohsin, CNN.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: Saima, thank you so much.

Coming up on CNN, there's a new report that says a laptop belonging to ISIS was discovered, and in it, information on the bubonic plague, on chemical weapons. The question we're asking, is the terror group capable of carrying out these types of attacks? We will discuss that coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: In today's "Bleacher Report," after sitting out three raises, tony Stewart is returning to the track this weekend. It is significant. This will be his first event since the accident that killed fellow driver, Kevin Ward Jr. Earlier, his car hit him during a dirt track event in up state New York. Stewart, as we now know, will complete at the Atlanta Motor Speedway in the NASCAR Sprint Cup Series this weekend. Today, he spoke publicly for the first time since that deadly accident.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TONY STEWART, NASCAR DRIVER: This has been one of the toughest tragedies I've ever had to deal with, both professionally and personally, and this is something that will definitely affect my life forever. This is a sadness and a pain that I hope no one ever has to experience in their life. That being said, I know that the pain that Kevin Ward's friends and family are experiencing is something I can't possibly imagine. I want Kevin's father, Kevin Sr, and his mother, Pam, and his sisters, Christy, Kayla, Kaitlin, to know every day I am thinking about them and praying for them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: He was cleared to return to all racing activities after Ward's death. NASCAR began requiring drivers not to exit cars stopped on the track unless they face fire in the cockpit or other imminent danger.

Comedian Joan Rivers is in serious condition at a New York hospital. Her daughter, Melissa Rivers, tells "E! News," quote, "My mother would be so touched by the tributes and prayers that we have received from around the world. Her condition remains serious, but she is receiving the best treatment and care possible." She goes on, "We ask that you continue to keep her in your thoughts as we pray for her recovery."

Now, a law enforcement official tells CNN that Rivers stopped breathing during throat surgery yesterday at a New York medical clinic. Rivers apparently suffered cardiac and respiratory arrest and was taken then to the hospital.

And let me show you something. I want to show you a photo of the 81- year-old Joan Rivers. This was Joan Rivers performing just a day before this happened. And here is Joan Rivers at New York's Beachman Theater Thursday night showing no signs of health problems on stage, even joking about her own mortality.

And we continue.