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LEGAL VIEW WITH ASHLEIGH BANFIELD

A Look at Doctors Who Treat Ebola Outbreaks; Can Families of MH-17 Sue Putin and Russia?; Gaza Hospital Hit; Israel and Hamas Fighting; Second American Infected with Ebola

Aired July 28, 2014 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: In fact, only a handful of doctors are willing to risk their own lives to treat the sick.

CNN's Sanjay Gupta found some of them. Three months ago, he went to the front lines of the Ebola outbreak in Guinea to show us how brutal this disease is.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: You're about to go inside an isolation ward in Guinea. There's a reason you may not have seen images like this before.

These patients are fighting one of the deadliest diseases in the world, Ebola. It has disarmed their immune system, shut up their blood's ability, and invaded the organs in their body. Up to nine out of 10 patients will die.

But this horror is isolated in Conakry, Guinea. We found traffic to still be busy here. Markets are full. Children, lots of children, still smiling.

You see, as scary as Ebola, it's not particularly contagious. It doesn't disperse easily through the air and it doesn't live long on surfaces either, and people don't typically spread it until they're sick, really sick.

And if that is the case the patients are not up walking around on the busy streets, they are down in bed in hospitals or worse. Even the dead are highly contagious.

DR. PIERRE ROLLIN, CENTERS FOR DISEASE CONTROL: The story unfortunately always the same.

GUPTA: Dr. Pierre Rollin from CDC has helped traced Ebola outbreaks for more than 30 years.

ROLLIN: The risk is not the people doing with Ebola patients. It's the people doing with regular patients not thinking of Ebola.

GUPTA: You see, it only takes a small amount of the virus anywhere on your skin to cause an infection. And as I learned, no precaution is too small for the doctors who care for these patients.

So nothing gets in.

TIM JAGATIC, DOCTORS WITHOUT BORDERS: Nothing gets out.

GUPTA: Nothing gets out.

Tim Jagatic is one of the Doctors Without Borders. He's from Canada. He comes into these settings for weeks at a time. He is not married. He has no children. That would be a job liability, he tells me.

Multiple pairs of gloves and masks. The head is completely covered. A multi-layer of gown, boots, and then an apron. It's positively suffocating in the 100-degree weather.

JAGATIC: And these are the final pairs.

GUPTA: Preparing to treat a patient with Ebola is like preparing to land on the moon. But you're their only visitor, the only person helping them survive. They do this so people outside these wards, the people on the streets will never know what it is like to be inside.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN, reporting.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: And thank you, Dr. Gupta, for bringing us that story.

And we're not done with Ebola just yet. Coming up, I'll interview a former disease detective for the CDC about what Ebola does to the body. It's painful, gruesome, and there is no cure, as we heard from Dr. Gupta there.

Another story, families of the people on board Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 are devastated, confused and angry, rightfully so.

So can they take action and sue the president of Russia? The LEGAL VIEW, up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: For the second time in two days, heavy fighting in eastern Ukraine is keeping investigators away from the site where Malaysia Flight 15 was shot down a week and a half ago.

Ukraine's military is pushing into territory held by pro-Russian separatists and now, according to the separatists has claimed part of the crash site itself. That has not been confirmed.

And apart from the obvious urgency of recovering human remains, the U.N. high commissioner for human rights today said it is vital to gather evidence of what may amount to a war crime.

For its part, the U.S. State Department is offering what it calls proof that Russia is not only arming the separatists; it's firing artillery from Russia into Ukraine. Russia says it wants a, quote, "impartial investigation." And as the bodies return and families say farewell, the lawsuits could

be coming. Malaysia Airlines might not be the only target of a potential lawsuit. Lawyers are considering the option of suing President Putin and Russia.

In a statement from the London firm of McCue & Partners, a spokesman says, "Our team has traveled to Ukraine and is liaising and working with partners in Ukraine and the United States on potential legal actions that can be brought against those responsible, directly and/or indirectly, for the downing of Malaysian Airways Flight MH-17."

So let's discuss this. CNN legal analyst Mel Robbins and CNN aviation analyst attorney Arthur Rosenberg joining me now from our New York newsroom. Great to have you both with us.

Mel, I'm going to start with you. If you would, tell us how realistic do you think it is for a lawsuit, a class action lawsuit, to be brought against Russia and President Putin, and in what jurisdiction would it be filed?

MEL ROBBINS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, it's going to be filed in the United States, and not only is it realistic, Pam, it's actually got precedent.

You remember the bombing of Pan Am Flight 103 over Scotland that killed 298 folks. There was a class action lawsuit that was successfully brought against the government of Libya. And with political pressure, even though Libya never claimed responsibility for that bombing, they got a $500 million settlement out of that lawsuit.

And so I think that you will see a lawsuit brought on behalf of the victims here in the United States. This law firm has done it multiple times before with great success.

Now, that doesn't mean that they'll be successful. I mean, they don't even have a secure crash site yet, but they could bring the lawsuit and with political pressure and negotiation perhaps get a settlement.

BROWN: And on that note, Arthur, what kind of damages could or will the family seek from Russia, especially considering the circumstances and the fact that Russia and pro-Russian rebels are denying any involvement with bringing the plane down?

ARTHUR ROSENBERG, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: Yes, first off, the objective would be for these families to be able to secure all compensatory potentially even punitive damages.

We actually have to go back a little bit, something that Mel said. First off, for -- I think these terrorist cases are going to be excellent cases for a variety of reasons, but the most important thing coming out of the chute is to establish whether this is an act of terrorism within the definition of certain federal statutes in the United States.

Once it's established as an act of terrorism, you have the Alien Tort Claims Act, the Antiterrorist Act, the Foreign Sovereignty Immunities Act. There's a whole panoply of statutes which are intended to cut off the heads of these terrorist organizations and get them where it hurts, in the pocketbook.

But that being said, we were involved in Pan Am 103, and the big difference between that case and what looks like will be this case potentially against Russia and Putin is that Libya and Gadhafi were claimed by the State Department to be, quote, "state sponsors of terror."

Russia does not have that label and Putin does not have that label. Therefore, in my judgment, the best course of action would be an indirect case against Russia through the pro-Russian separatists, declaring them as terrorists, finding out where assets are potentially of Putin and maybe other Russian leaders, being able to attach and seize them.

And then in a terrorist case against the pro-Russian separatists in the United States, which they don't have to appear, use the seized assets to satisfy the compensatory and punitive judgments against the terrorists.

One final note, the Gadhafi case against Libya was settled for billions of dollars and it was a political solution to a judicial problem which I predict will be revisited in this case.

ROBBINS: I think Arthur's exactly right.

BROWN: Go ahead, Mel.

ROBBINS: I think Arthur's exactly right. That is an example where the lawsuit served two purposes. It was not only to make sure that the victims were compensated but it was used as a political tool to achieve some goals with Libya at the time. I think you're going to see a very public lawsuit in this case being used for the same purpose.

By the way, they still have claims, these families do, against Malaysian Air, under the Montreal Convention. You also may see something happening with the Hague.

This is a story that is going to just grow and grow and grow.

BROWN: Yeah, this is certainly just the beginning.

Thank you so much, Mel Robbins and Arthur Rosenberg. We appreciate.

And back now to our breaking news, a hospital in Gaza, the center of new violence today, we'll have more on that, up ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: Bloodshed at the Gaza hospital and a refugee camp today and Israel and Hamas are blaming each other. A Hamas-run TV network is airing this video right here, what Hamas claims is the aftermath of an Israeli drone strike on a Palestinian hospital. But Israel blames failed rockets launched by Hamas for the attack. And in a separate attack, 10 people died at a refugee camp in Gaza. Here's how the casualties stand right now. More than 1,000

Palestinians are dead, 2,600 are injured, and it's not clear how many Hamas militants have been killed. And on the Israeli side, 43 soldiers have been killed along with three civilians. CNN's Ian Lee joins me live from Gaza city.

Ian, if you would, tell us more about this attack on the hospital.

IAN LEE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Pam, I'll get to that in a second.

I just want to kind of make you aware, there's a lot of heavy fighting now to the south of us. This has really picked up in about the last hour or two, to really sense the attack on the hospital. We're seeing a lot of increase in the fighting in the Gaza Strip.

Now, when we came -- talked about the hospital, you're right, both sides are blaming each other. Hamas is saying that this was a drone strike that struck the hospital and the refugee camp. Israel is saying that this was a failed rocket. Now, Hamas has come out and said -- against the Israeli accusations saying that they have evidence of the Israeli rockets that struck the hospital and they say that this is just a maneuver by the Israelis to cover up the truth. We have a team on the ground. They're investigating what actually happened. We're also expecting an independent body to eventually go there and figure out what ultimately happened.

Shifa hospital is the largest hospital in Gaza. This is an incident that is similar, if you may remember, to Beit Hanoun, where a U.N.-run school was hit there. Well, investigators tried to go to that school, but that is on the front line. Shifa hospital is far from the front line. Investigators are likely to get there to really pick apart and see what actually happened.

What we do know, though, is 10 children were killed in the attack. That's according to the ministry of health. And over 40 people were injured. Now, we don't know exactly what happened, but it does look -- this was an explosion, this was an area where a lot of people were hanging out, Shifa hospital. It was a lot of people taking shelter there during the fighting. Also in this camp, these are areas that are far away from the front line. So when an explosion happens in these areas, we do see a lot of casualties, Pam.

BROWN: And what else do we know, Ian, about the refugee camp attack?

LEE: Well, this is a refugee camp that's been around since 1948. There's roughly 100,000 people that live there. And this is where we saw the majority of the fatalities. This is where ambulances were taking them to the hospital. Now, Israel is saying that this was also the result a failed Hamas rocket. Hamas is saying that this was from an Israeli drone strike.

This is also far from the front lines. An independent investigation would be needed to figure out what exactly happened. And this would be an easy place for them to go.

But this has raised tensions here and, like I said in the beginning, a lot of activity now coming from both Gaza militants, as well as the Israelis. We've seen some rockets fired off as well. We've seen quite a few number of air strikes, as well as tracer fire in the distance. Things really seem to be escalating here tonight in Gaza.

BROWN: And we know not long ago, Ian, the IDF sent text messages and phone calls to the civilian population in Gaza urging them to immediately evacuate to central Gaza city. What are you seeing in that regard?

LEE: Well, yes, you're right, there have been a number of text messages sent out. And these are areas that are along the eastern border of Gaza that border along with Israel. They have received similar text messages and leaflets before telling them to evacuate. And I was out in Beit Hanoun, one of the areas that had those text messages, and Shishia (ph), another area, and the residents that are there probably will take this warning seriously because these areas have had neighborhoods that have been completely demolished from air strikes, from artillery. And so if there are any -- if they're going to take any lessons from what they've seen already, it's likely that we'll see a lot of people who are remaining there to move into the center. And I say remaining there because when I went there the last time, it was fairly -- it was very much a ghost town, a lot of these areas. People have already moved away after the heavy bombardment that we've seen in the week prior.

BROWN: And was that more strikes, Ian? I just saw you turn around there. I know you said earlier the situation's escalating where you are.

LEE: Yes. Yes, that's right.

BROWN: Yes. All right, well, Ian Lee -

LEE: That's right, that was a strike. It was just off here to my right, and, yes, it's - it's happening -- there's a lot of firepower around right now.

BROWN: Well, Ian Lee, stay safe, and thank you so much for bringing that reporting to us. We appreciate it.

So the big question, what happens if Israel does destroy Hamas, what happens if there is a power vacuum in the Palestinian community? Let's bring in CNN military analyst Rick Francona to talk about this.

Rick, do you think something worse is waiting in the wings if Hamas is destroyed? That's what we've been hearing from a lot of Israeli officials even.

RICK FRANCONA, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: And a lot of American officials feel the same way. You know, if Hamas goes away, something will take its place. We don't know what that will be. It could be Islamic jihad. It could be a new group. But, you know, power abhors a vacuum. Somebody will step up to maintain the resistance.

There's just so much animosity right now. If you get rid of Hamas, it's not going to solve the problems that are in Gaza. Gaza is just going to be a problem for the Israelis going forward.

But this goes beyond the borders of just Gaza. We're seeing recruitment among all of these jihadi groups just skyrocket in the last three weeks because of this animosity toward Israel. If you want to galvanize public opinion in the Arab world and drive, you know, radical Islamist into a militant organization, this is what happens. And this goes far beyond Israel. This goes - this affects all of us now.

BROWN: Thank you, Colonel Rick Francona, we appreciate it.

This is, of course, an ongoing situation. And CNN's Wolf Blitzer got access to tunnels just this morning. Those tunnels that Hamas has been using to get into Israel. We're going to have more on that for you coming up in just about 10 minutes. You're not going to want to miss this. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: With Ebola, it's not that you die, but how you die. The symptoms start mild. Fever, sore throat, chills, achy, kind of like the flu, which is often what people think they have. But then Ebola will start to break your body down. You'll vomit uncontrollably. You'll bleed from your nose, your mouth, your eyes, ears and elsewhere. You'll be in pain. Your eyes will turn red. Pretty gruesome stuff here. And Ebola isn't done yet. As it goes from bad to worse, your organs will start to fail. Your skin will become yellow with jaundice. You can become delirious. And the bleeding becomes severe. The disease interferes with your body's immune system and it cannot mount a defense and there is no cure. Doctors can only comfort you, give you fluids and pray. Your shot at surviving, 10 percent.

So joining me now to discuss this, Dr. Seema Yasmin, a medical doctor and columnist with "The Dallas Morning News." She also was a disease detective in the Epidemic Intelligence Service at the U.S. Centers for Disease Control.

Doctor, thank you so much for being here with us. Really gruesome just describing what Ebola does to your body. Why is it so difficult to treat?

DR. SEEMA YASMIN, FORMER DISEASE DETECTIVE AT CDC: Well, Pamela, the problem is, is we don't have a specific treatment for Ebola, so the gruesome, painful, horrific death that you mentioned, all we can do for patients is give them fluids and lots and lots of pain relief, but there is no specific treatment.

BROWN: We have seen Ebola outbreaks over the past few months. And what's the best way to avoid an Ebola infection? Especially we have these aid workers over there that are trying to treat it and they're now getting infected. Two Americans, we've learned, are now infected with Ebola.

YASMIN: So this is the largest Ebola outbreak we've ever seen in history. And I have friends and colleagues who are serving at the front lines of this epidemic and they tell me that it's spreading faster than we've ever seen. The key really to stopping transmission is to isolate people as soon as they show any signs of Ebola. But that can be really challenging in these situations. There's so much fear and distrust. We're hearing about doctors being attacked. So that really stops them from being able to do their job properly and isolate people early on.

BROWN: Yes, I was just reading a "New York Times" article that talked about that, how, you know, residents in these three nations where we've seen Ebola are now blocking the aid workers, they're superstitious of them, thinking that they're the ones spreading this disease. We have seen in the past Ebola outbreaks controlled. What will it take this time around, doctor, given the fact that it is covering such a large area across three nations?

YASMIN: Well, the scary thing, Pamela, is in the past we've had Ebola outbreaks before but they've been a lot smaller and they've actually be in quite remote villages in central Africa. The worrying thing this time is it spread so quickly to capital cities and that makes it really challenging to try and control and it's spreading to countries that we've never even seen Ebola reported in history. So what we really need is a concerted effort, governments working together with these aid organizations, with the CDC and the World Health Organization, really getting out this message that if you have symptoms, you must seek medical treatment really quickly and be isolated.

BROWN: Yes, just a frightening situation. And those aid workers, Doctors Without Borders over there right now, so courageous, risking their lives to combat this situation.

Thank you so much, Dr. Seema Yasmin. We appreciate you coming on.

And thank you, everyone, for watching. Wolf, live from Jerusalem, starts now.