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DR. DREW

Hot Car Toddler Death

Aired July 7, 2014 - 21:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. DREW PINSKY, HLN HOST (voice-over): Tonight, new and alarming details in the hot car death case. Police say dad was sexting while his

little son was baking to death.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was having up to six different conversations with different women.

PINSKY: And that the baby was actually injured trying to free himself from an oven.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There were several marks on the child`s face that would have come from the child or a scratch being made while the child was

alive.

PINSKY: Plus, did the basement boy have a secret Twitter account and a hidden stash of cash? The behavior bureau wants to know.

Let`s get started.

(MUSIC)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PINSKY: Good evening. My co-host is Samantha Schacher.

And coming up, did sex addiction have anything to do with the hot car case? I, Sam, disagree with some of what Nancy was saying. I tell you

what I think and why I disagree and we`ll have in a second a friend of the dad who was speaking out.

SAMANTHA SCHACHER, CO-HOST: Yes. And also, this is our most tweeted about story of the day, Dr. Drew, as you can imagine.

So, please keep those tweets coming. I`ll be monitoring our Twitter throughout the show.

PINSKY: Excellent.

But, first, new details about the father accused of killing this baby by leaving him in a hot car, he`s been charged with murder. Today, police

searched his house, they combed through his personal electronics, and they want to look at his medical records.

You have to look at this.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s got this whole second life that he`s living with alternate personality.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Tragic accident or premeditated murder.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The father says that he forgotten to take the boy to daycare, leaving him strapped in his car seat in an office parking lot

in 90-plus degree heat for close to seven hours.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: More search warrants were released this morning and may reveal more information about the death of 22-month-old Cooper

Harris.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stunning claims of raunchy text messages.

JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HLN: She`s allegedly sexting six women, sending his erect private parts, his erect penis, to some of them while his son is

dying.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Suspicious Internet searches, Harris watched videos online about the dangers of being trapped in a hot car.

VELEZ: When you`re a parent and you`re surfing the web for child-free lifestyle and then your kid ends up roasting to death in a hot car, I think

that is just damming.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He also did a search on how to survive prison.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PINSKY: Joining us, Evy Poumpouras, security expert, former special agent for the Secret Service, Vanessa Barnett, social commentator and host

of HipHollywood.com, and Loni Coombs, author of "You`re Perfect and Other Lies Parents Tell".

Evy, this guy is sexting with six different women. It`s disgusting, it`s startling, but it doesn`t mean he intentionally killed this child,

does it?

EVY POUMPOURAS, SECURITY EXPERT: No, it does not by itself, but that couple with everything else gives you a really strong probable cause. So,

they will allow that as part of the evidence pool because it can show intent if he`s having a relationship, if he`s looking to basically leave

his wife to be with somebody else.

PINSKY: Now, Evy, they were looking through his --

(CROSSTALK)

PINSKY: What`s that? What?

POUMPOURAS: It will play a role in this investigation.

PINSKY: Oh, I have no doubt. Listen, I`ve got a lot of thoughts about it. But also, they were looking through his medical records. Nancy

went off on how they were going to look through the child`s medical records, which, of course, they want to see if the child has any antecedent

evidence of abuse or mishandling or dehydration, or malnourishment, that kind of thing. But they were looking at his medical reports. Nancy missed

on that point.

Then, Evy, what would they be looking for in his medical records. It seems to me concerns of physicians, psychiatric problems. Aren`t they

looking for a way to make sense of all of this whole thing?

POUMPOURAS: There`s two things. They are going to look at his mental history, but there was also looking at, there was information that he might

have been deaf in one of his ears and that`s what they`re saying. And they want to corroborate is that true and supposedly could he have gotten in the

car open, not heard the baby in the car when he drove to work and then went to work.

So, you`re looking at mental health history, but also, they want to corroborate whether he`s got hearing issues.

PINSKY: Interesting, Sam.

SCHACHER: Yes. So, did he lose the sense of smell then too? Because I find it quite fascinating that he drove from his work to the shopping

mall 10 minutes and didn`t smell anything in the car when the police, when they smelled the car immediately after, they described it as -- I don`t

even want to say the words because of the decomposing body.

PINSKY: Well, listen, (INAUDIBLE) decomposed in ten hours.

SCHACHER: They said it smelled terrible, the police, right then and there.

PINSKY: The full diaper, the kid has been sitting in his filth all day and cooking.

And while he was dying in the car, the dad is sexting, get this, not only with six women, a a 17-year-old.

Take a look at this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did she send him a picture that day?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She did.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Of what?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She sent a picture of her exposed breasts.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And did he send any pictures to her?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He did. He sent a picture of his exposed, erect penis.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHACHER: Oh my gosh.

PINSKY: Vanessa, it`s almost beyond belief.

VANESSA BARNETT, HIPHOLLYWOOD.COM: Look, this guy is a pervert, he is a pedophile, he is disgusting, he`s a poor husband. But what I don`t have

is the evidence that he is a child killer.

Look, everything looks really bad. I am the first one in line to say that. But I am not OK with throwing a man in jail without concrete

evidence.

PINSKY: Well, OK, Loni -- Loni, hold your horses. I`m going to load up your case, Loni, with some other evidence. He searched on the Internet

prior to his son`s death the following thing -- put a screen up there, child deaths inside vehicles, dangers of leaving someone in a hot car,

child free, an Internet page about life without children, how to survive prison and, of course, age of consent. He`s got to worry about that 17-

year-old.

Loni, have at it.

LONI COOMBS, FORMER PROSECUTOR: You know, I love that you put this list of searches up. If you move the order around a little bit, you see

exactly what he was thinking.

First of all, what does he want? He wants a child free life. He went to this internet search, he looked up four articles about this lifestyle.

Then he says, OK, well, how do I get it? He looks up how to kill a child in a car. How hot it have to be? OK. What do I do if I get caught?

Well, I better know how to survive in prison. And what if I don`t get caught?

Well, I want to know the age of consent so I can know how young my next girlfriend can be. He had it all lined out and he was doing all of

the searches he needed to figure out where he was going to next.

PINSKY: Vanessa, I know you`re skeptical and I kind am too, I got to tell you. But when the wife was brought in to be spoken to by detectives,

she -- her husband was weeping, the first thing she says to the husband is, quote, "Did you say too much?"

SCHACHER: Wow.

PINSKY: Vanessa, so all this stuff, when you add it all up, there she is with the emotionless face and we`re going to talk about it in just

minute, but you add all of that up and it starts to look really horrible.

BARNETT: It looks really horrible. But on the flip side, couldn`t this be fuel for the defense? If you are -- if you know that you have

something so heinous, wouldn`t you work harder at being convincing that you didn`t do it? She is like emotionless, she is chewing bubble gum.

Wouldn`t she cry more?

PINSKY: Oh, yes. Or wouldn`t you have done something else other than try to cook your child if you really had intent to kill a child.

It jus seems to me, but I know Vanessa is channeling her inner Anahita right now and everything is defensible in their world.

But, all right, listen, next up, I`ve got my human lie detector Janine Driver. She`s joining the behavior bureau.

And later, more hot car cases of children in trouble in cars over the weekend. The question is, what`s going on? Is this a trend? Are parents

just completely -- we`ve lost our ability to parent? We`ll get into it after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Leanna Harris, the baby`s mother, also part of the investigation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She`s like, why aren`t you crying? Why aren`t you reacting to this?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And what did Leanna say?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She said, "I must be in shock."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The couple had money problems, and that they both done Internet searches on child deaths in hot cars.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She had him sit down and he starts looking through this and she looks at him, and she`s like, "Well, did you say too much?"

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PINSKY: I`m back with Sam. We`re talking about the toddler.

This is a case that is almost too much to believe. He died after being in a car overheating for over seven hours. Father charged with

murder. Wife has not been charged with anything, but the police say she`s exhibited some strange behavior.

Let`s bring in the behavior bureau. Evy is back with us. Judy Ho, clinical psychologist and professor at Pepperdine University. Colleen

Long, clinical psychologist.

This woman has shown no emotion throughout the entire ordeal, at least that we can see publicly here.

Judy, what do you make of this?

JUDY HO, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, Dr. Drew, everybody wants to be the expert and like analyze what`s going on with his wife, why is she

reacting this way? And, of course, everybody grieves in a lot of different ways. But one of the most telltale signs for me is that her own son`s

funeral, she immediately went to the stage of acceptance.

Now, I know that people were to grief in different ways and go through the stages in different time frames. But immediately, talking about how

it`s better that the child hasn`t survived because it`s a terrible world, very, very unmotherly, I think, you know, in terms of the type of reaction

she had.

And as far as her demeanor in the courtroom, not even reacting at all when people are telling her about the fact that her husband sexting --

well, that just shows that their relationship has had so many cracks under the foundation, and it`s not what people thought they were.

PINSKY: Well, Colleen, not just Sam scalping at that, but I agree. Not only cracks in the foundation, Colleen, but I think the wife knows

clearly she`s been dealing with a disturbed man who is probably a sex addict.

COLLEEN LONG, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Absolutely. I don`t think -- I don`t think that the wife -- I think the wife is implicit in this whole

thing and I think this is evidence that both of them are functioning at the level of teenagers basically.

PINSKY: Oh, that`s interesting.

LONG: You`ve got a guy that`s sexting 16 or 17-year-old olds and what do teenagers want? They want to be free.

SCHACHER: Yes.

PINSKY: Interesting.

Sam?

SCHACHER: Yes, I think that the wife is complicit in all of this, Dr. Drew. I think that they both premeditated this murder. I think that she`s

--

PINSKY: Then, why didn`t they do something -- how dumb do you have to be to set it off like this? They really had it premeditated.

SCHACHER: Well, you know what? They --

PINSKY: It`s disgusting. Doesn`t it feel like people are just out of control?

SCHACHER: Yes, it does. And it`s the things that keep you up at night, things like this. The more we research the story, the more it

nauseates me. That poor little boy, what he had to endure, and for these parents to plan out such a heinous death, it makes me want to stick both of

them in a hot car until they die so they can see what it feels like.

PINSKY: Evy, you get what I`m getting at here, though, that if it`s a premeditated affair here, why be sloppy? Why be so bizarre in the way they

execute this thing? They don`t seem like foolish people to me. Maybe they are.

SCHACHER: I think a lot of times you plan it and envision what you`re going to do it and it turns out a different way. Also, Dr. Drew, if you`re

deceptive, you`re stressed out about it. It`s very hard to lie, so to speak.

Typically, most people lie through omission. And a lot of this analysis that we`re doing on the mother, on the wife, you know, you can see

her. She`s probably not knowing how to react. She knows everybody is watching her. She`s not comfortable with what`s happening.

So, the one thing that Judy mentioned before was her statement at the funeral, that was key. And then, obviously, that coupled with her detached

behavior, you know, gives us an indication that something really is amiss here.

PINSKY: All right. Well, let`s bring in Janine Driver. She`s our human lie detector. She`s author of "You Can`t Lie to Me."

Janine, we`re speculating about this wife but we`re all weirded out by her sort of detached denial and weird acceptance early in the course of

this. What do you make of her behavior?

JANINE DRIVER, HUMAN LIE DETECTOR (via telephone): First of all, I want to smash her in the face, because a father and I`m pregnant with my

third son, if you don`t know that, Dr. Drew.

PINSKY: Congratulations, Janine.

DRIVER: And we`re planning on calling him Baby Cooper. So, this case is like striking my heart beyond belief.

PINSKY: Oh my goodness.

DRIVER: A bunch of stuff here.

First, the body language in court is nauseating to me. You see no sadness which you know, Dr. Drew, from having me on so often, is sadness is

the inner eyebrows are pulled together and pulled up. We don`t see the mother imploding.

So, usually, think about Cindy Anthony, the grandmother of Casey Anthony. Casey Anthony`s daughter who was found dead, right, Caylee

Anthony. Cindy Anthony was sobbing, she was imploded, she was devastated when they were talking about how little Caylee was found. The little

sticker of her mouth buried in the woods. That whole entire drama, we see no sadness.

Here`s something very suspicious. I`m a big fan of what`s called statement analysis, Dr. Drew. The mother of little baby Cooper said this,

quote, "I miss him with all my heart. Would I bring him back? No. To bring him back into this broken world would be selfish." She said, "Am I

angry with God? No. This is part of his plan for Ross and I."

What the heck is that?

PINSKY: That`s right. Exactly. Like we all listen to that and go what the hell.

DRIVER: What is that?

PINSKY: This case, I either fluctuate from disgust, like, oh my God, this guy is out of control, his behavior to just shaking my head, like what

is that? What do they -- what is she talking about? She`s a mother who has lost a child.

Janine, I think that`s an excellent point.

Evy, let me float something. Is it possible that all of this detached -- and, Judy and Colleen, you think about this, too -- this detached

quality we see about her in court is effectively the behavior of somebody that -- I`m going to float a term that I`m going to use sort of liberally

here, a survivor of domestic violence, I don`t mean domestic physical abuse. I mean, some kind of domestic abuse, that she`s standing for a long

time and now she`s in court going, I`m beaten and I knew we`d get her.

Evy, what do you think?

POUMPOURAS: You know, I don`t know about that one. I think she`s got a lot of her own issues going on internally. She maybe could have had

abuse starting from a young age perhaps. I do think -- look, I have a couple of different theories while she`s involved in this. One of it is

maybe they had the baby and things didn`t go well in the marriage and she`s thinking, I`m going to lose my husband, he`s flirting with these other

women are doing, whatever, I need to get, and I apologized for saying this, but I need to get rid of the baby to try to save my marriage.

That`s possibly one of the reasons why --

PINSKY: It`s unthinkable.

SCHACHER: It`s so disturbing.

PINSKY: My head doesn`t do that.

Colleen, you know what I`m getting at here? Is this somebody who is just, you know, abused to passivity?

LONG: Dr. Drew, I have to disagree. I think that water rises to its own level when you`re in a marriage and they have found each other and they

are the same, of the same cloth.

PINSKY: Teenagers and sick. Yes?

LONG: I`m sorry.

PINSKY: Teenagers and sick.

LONG: Teenagers and sick. I think there`s a level of malice to her that`s more than him and I think she`s the black widow behind the scene

pulling the strings.

PINSKY: Oh, that`s interesting.

SCHACHER: Dr. Drew, you saw her control him at the police station by saying, did you do too much? I definitely think that she`s the leader in

this relationship.

PINSKY: Evey saying yes, Evy saying yes. Colleen, you floated a theory that everybody buys. Judy, what`s your vote?

HO: I actually think that it still starts and ends with the man in this relationship. I think that she is resigned. I think she`s resigned

to a terrible relationship with this man and she thought maybe in some small way, by killing her child that her life would be better again because

they are this picture of happiness in a good couple.

And so, how do you work yourself out of that if you admit to people, I don`t want this child can we give them up to Child Protective Services, or

get them and adoption? They can`t live with that.

PINSKY: Whichever of our interpretations you think may be true, they`re all disgusting. They`re all terrible. There`s no good option

here. It`s all a deep tragedy and these two, whether whoever is the ring leader, whoever is the sickest, whoever is the most evil, it`s all -- none

of it`s good. It`s all going to end up, once we figure out what`s really going on here. It`s all going to look real bad.

You`re going to hear from the dad`s friend in an exclusive interview.

And later, secrets revealed about money and Twitter in the basement boy case. We`re going to get into that as well.

We`re back after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sex and messages, talking about the fact that his wife knew he had cheated on her before?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, there were.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He talks about being a guitar player with this girl. She asked him about cheating on his wife. Did she ask him a

question about his conscience?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She said something to the effect of, do you have a conscience?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And what was his response?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Nope.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PINSKY: Back with Sam.

We`re discussing the father accused of killing his 22-month-old boy by having left him in a hot a car for seven hours.

So, we talk about the wife, what role she had in all this, and I`ve got some theories I`m going to tell you about what I think is going on with

this husband.

Joining us, Adrianna Costa, entertainment journalist. Judy and Vanessa, back with us as well.

Now, I want to show you the father`s Internet searches. Here we go, child deaths inside vehicles, dangers of leaving someone in a hot car,

child free, how to survive, age of consent. All stuff I`ve told you. But there was also, look at the bottom, people dying. He looked at videos of

people being slaughtered and killed, disgusting videos.

Sam, you`re showing your hands up.

SCHACHER: I cannot believe that. I didn`t know that part of it, Dr. Drew. That just throws a whole other bomb in all of this. I love the fact

that he researched how to survive in prison.

Yes, good luck, buddy, because I`m sure those inmates are going to have their way with you as they should.

PINSKY: Adrianna, what do you make of this?

ADRIANNA COSTA, ENTERTAINMENT JOURNALIST & HOST: It`s a terrible story. I`m a new mom. And I -- you know, it hits even closer to home when

you hear something like this. Horrific -- it was difficult to read the details about how the kid was suffering in the car. And my question is,

does anyone actually think they`re still innocent?

PINSKY: Well, depends on what you`re calling innocent. I mean, we don`t think -- no, we don`t think they`re guiltless in any way here.

Anybody else feel like, we really think they`re -- the question is was this premeditated?

OK, this is -- a great question, Adrianna.

My question is this -- and, Judy, let me start with you on this. Is this premeditated? I mean, is this evil? But I would expect if we`re evil

we`d see a long history of evil behaviors. That`s usually -- remember that guy -- weren`t you on the panel, Judy, when we had that kid that was

playing with fire and having some stashes of guns, planning to kill his family, remember that? And it`d been that way since young teenage. That`s

evil. That`s a brain problem, that`s a genetic problem and environmental problem set up evil.

We don`t hear anything like that in this case but we hear out of control, bizarre behaviors. People, listen. If we said alcohol or cocaine

or heroin and described a bunch of weird behaviors, everybody would go, OK, I understand, it`s a drug addict, and he doesn`t know what he`s doing. But

sex addiction can do the same thing. I know it`s hard for people to accept that, I`ve seen altered sensorium from sex addiction. Is it possible

that`s what`s going on with this guy?

HO: Well, possibly, Dr. Drew, and I think that this is a couple where they have kept a lot of family secrets. So, even if we don`t have the

public knowledge of this family having their problems, that just means that the wife was covering for him all of this time. I mean, she wasn`t shocked

that he was sexting --

PINSKY: Well, but is she? Is she battened down by all that craziness that she`s like completely she disassociated all the time?

Adrianna, what do you say?

LONG: Dr. Drew, I think that this -- OK, here`s my theory, OK? I think that because she knows that he was cheating on her, maybe this was

her attempt to win him back.

PINSKY: To get rid of the kid?

LONG: I back you up in this. I`m going to do this with you. Does that make sense?

PINSKY: Let`s go back to Sam, where she is mastermind of this.

But, Vanessa, you`re actually holding your head. What`s going on?

BARNETT: I just don`t get it. And I am the type of person that I need to see the pieces to put somebody in jail for the rest of their lives.

You have this couple where no one in the community can say an ill word about them and we think they faked all of that but can`t even -- you didn`t

think they can fake the appropriate sadness for this case? I just don`t get it.

HO: Vanessa --

BARNETT: My heart can`t take that they would leave this two-year-old child in the car. She was scratching to get out. I physically can`t even

conceive of that. I can`t.

PINSKY: Judy?

HO: Well, Vanessa, I think this couple has a really great sense of how to present themselves to the public, not the mention the fact that they

here in a tight-knit community and they`re very, very religious people. And so, there`s some standards that they must feel like that have to

operate on to be accepted by that.

PINSKY: But, Judy, let me again say that people of a sex addiction that are sort of hiding behind the veil of religiosity, they`re so

profoundly ashamed by it. They double down on their religion and their faith and everything else, trying to compensate for the loss of control

they have in their weird, bizarre, sex-addicted other life.

And, listen, inevitably with every addiction, people get hurt. Look at poor Travis Alexander. That was kind of a weird sex addiction he had

going. He ends up dead. Now, not that he`s in any way responsible, for that, but that`s where these secretive, bizarre behaviors take people.

They take it to terrible places.

LONG: Dr. Drew, then don`t have kids.

SCHACHER: Right.

HO: Thank you.

SHACHER: Yes.

BARNETT: What if the sex addiction is why he was neglectful?

PINSKY: The point is, there`s not a justification. I`m not saying they shouldn`t put this guy away. This -- I`m just saying, we`re trying to

understand what this was. This is not a defense. This is an explanation.

LONG: How about more than put him away?

PINSKY: Fine. I know you`re thinking of castration, Adrianna. I can feel it in your voice.

But let me hear what a long time friend of Justin Harris who spoke to Jane Velez-Mitchell just a little while ago. Here`s what he said when Jane

asked her about all the graphic sexting. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRIS WILKINSON, FRIEND OF JUSTIN ROSS HARRIS (via telephone): This is someone I don`t know. This is someone morally bankrupt. This is

somebody that, you know -- I`m sure more people and probably more people do it than we know and probably there are folks we know who do it. But it`s a

private thing and, of course, it`s not publicized on national television because they`re not accused of a crime.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PINSKY: Sam, hear what she says there, I don`t know this guy. Well, that`s him. He`s the bizarre guy behaving in that bizarre way. That`s

where his life took him. That`s where his addiction took him.

SCHACHER: Right. And here`s the thing -- so many people describe him as the doting husband, this loving father. Yes, clearly, they did not know

him because they didn`t know that he was sexting all these people. I mean, his sexting made Anthony Weiner`s sexting look tame. So, they did not know

him whatsoever.

PINSKY: And I`m saying, when somebody is that ashamed and that into it, I mean, think about it, he`s going this horrible disgusting path and

he`s presenting himself as a paradigm of virtue, that is a tough thing, to live with in day in and day out basis.

And what addicts do when they get that horrible, horrible shame going is they double down, they double down until they lose control and they

don`t just lose control over their behavior and sexting and their -- I think we`re going to hear about prostitutes and other things, too.

I swear to God. I`m sure we`re going to hear about crazy stuff. But they lose control over everything in their life and they do horrible things

in their altered state. That`s just a theory I`m floating. It is not -- don`t Twitter me about me making excuses for him. I`m not making excuses,

I`m just trying to understand how this is possible. It`s possible to break this down.

Vanessa, does that seem plausible to you?

BARNETT: It does. But will this in turn become his defense because he was so focused --

(CROSSTALK)

BARNETT: He was neglectful because he was so focused on his --

PINSKY: Who cares why he was. He was what he was. And, listen, he should have spoken up along time about his behavior. He`s just as guilty

as if he had just simply been neglectful that day. It`s all on him.

Anybody who has -- give me the camera a second -- anybody who is dealing with these sorts of things, learn from this. Let`s say that`s not

what`s going on with this guy, but you can still learn from it and speak up early, because horrible things inevitably happen when people let these

shameful problematic behaviors spiral out of control.

There`s help out there and you can get it.

Next up, more hot car cases over the weekend, another death.

And later, secrets in the basement boy case revealed after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE REPORTER: El Paso, Texas, a 2-year-old girl died after she was left in a hot car at her house. We move to Tennessee, a

toddler was pulled from inside a hot car while her parents went grocery shopping. Her parents said, quote, "They screwed up and had a momentary

lapse in judgment."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE REPORTER: The mom was apologetic and remorseful for what the police say she did, and that was leaving her child inside a

hot car while she and a man claiming to be the stepdad were drinking. Police found two-year-old son locked in a hot car, unresponsive, sweaty and

slumped over.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PINSKY: Back with Sam. Over the holiday weekend, more cases of children being left alone, locked in overheated vehicles. Parents are

forgetful, neglectful, what is their excuse? In one case the parents left a 2-year-old boy locked in a car while they were drinking in a bar.

Perfect. Someone spotted the boy and called 911. When the mom came out of the bar, she tried to jump in the car, Sam, and drive away. It is almost

comical --

SAM SCHACHER, HOST OF "POP TRIGGER": Oh my God, she tried to drive in the car? What? Buzzed up? So, now, you are putting the kid in danger yet

again?

PINSKY: Right. You left the kid to drink and now you are driving drunk with the kid in the car. Evy, Vanessa, Loni with us. Should these

parents be punished, whether this is an accident? All right, Vanessa, let me ask you the question because you have been the skeptic here.

So, my thing was back when I was trying to understand how somebody could possibly leave their son in a car and cook. I came up with the

theory about possibly sex addiction. And, by the way, if it turns out to be sex addiction, then he has no defense.

There is no defense then for what he did. He should be punished to the fullest extent of the law. It was explained. No defense. You were

out of control with your sex addiction just as if you driven a car and ran people over. There is no defense. Now, if somebody is in that situation

should they be punished, or should they be educated? Should we be making an example of these peg cases?

VANESSA BARNETT, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: Absolutely make an example. Look, a child has died. There is no way to take this lightly and there is

no way to say, "Oh! Well -- you, like, looking at kitty born or you like dating 17 year olds or whatever" --

PINSKY: Right. Who cares? It is what it is.

BARNETT: Absolutely, throw him under the jail.

PINSKY: OK.

BARNETT: -- But the difference in this other case is way worse and the problem is because -- not the problem. I am thankful their child did

not die. But, had their child died and they are in the club drinking, they would be punished to the full extent of the law. But because their child

survived, they are going to get out and they could potentially do this again.

PINSKY: OK, panel, I just got so upset. I popped a button on my coat.

(LAUGHING)

SCHACHER: Did you?

PINSKY: Yes, I did. I popped a button. So, my coat will be open the rest of the show.

SCHACHER: Oh! My Gosh! Wow! OK!

PINSKY: Yes. Here, I will show you.

SCHACHER: Wow!

PINSKY: All right, we have got another case in Texas, a 2-year-old girl left strapped in her car seat out outside of her home or a home in El

Paso. This girl found unresponsive. Paramedics attempted to resuscitate this toddler, but she died. We do not have details about the parent yet or

what was going on there. Loni, is this different as a crime from the neglect say of a child drowning in a pool or other accidents at home?

LONI COOMBS, LEGAL COMMENTATOR: You know, Dr. Drew, that is such a good question. And, every one of these cases really has to be take on a

days by case situation because there are true accidents. And, then there are cases that are criminally negligent where perhaps the parents thought

we could run into the store really quickly and get back in time. But, they intend to leave the child there.

And, then there is the rare case, like the Harris case, where I believe there is premeditation going on there and that is the intentional

murder. But, this line between criminal negligent and straight accident is sometimes very blurry. And, so you have to look at all of the surrounding

circumstances.

Were they going to a bar to drink versus did they think somebody else was getting the child out of the car, it was late, it was dark, and they

ran in and all of the sudden they realized in the morning that no one got the child out of the car, which is a horrible situation, but was it truly

negligent or was it really an accident.

PINSKY: And, so much of this really goes quickly into the realm of depravity, does not it?

EVY POUMPOURAS, ON-AIR SECURITY AND INVESTIGATIVE ANALYST: Yes. You know, I am going to say one thing, Dr. Drew. I know a lot of the

discussions we have we talk about mental illness and why would people do this and we debate all of these things. I believe that there is a lot of

people out there, this is based on my interviews and interrogations, that are just purely dark. They have dark thoughts and evil thoughts and a lot

of people test these thoughts.

PINSKY: But, do not they usually have that for -- Evy, but do not they usually have that for a long time? Even though they may be hiding all

this craziness, there is usually some evidence along the way that that is who that person is.

POUMPOURAS: You know what? Yes. Sometimes, yes, but sometimes life pushes people in a certain direction that they never thought they would go.

And, they get darker and darker. And, then sometimes they get into that ditch and they cannot get out.

PINSKY: Fair enough.

POUMPOURAS: It is not always the same for everybody.

PINSKY: All right. We are going to keep the conversation going with a dad who went shopping at Marshals, left that child in another car. And,

I read some data over the weekend that there was something like 20 child overheating car deaths a year in this country. That means there is got to

be hundreds of episodes of people parenting -- there is my button, by the way -- parenting by leaving their child in the car.

Reminder, thank you all, for liking us on Facebook. Keep those coming. We are nearing a big milestone. Again, like us at

Facebook.com/hlndr.drew. We are back after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER: As two traffic police officers pulled a toddler out of a locked parked car.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE SPEAKER (1): She is all red and she was drenched like with water.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER: Cops had to break the windows to free the toddler who had been strapped into her car seat in the back seat of a

pickup truck estimated to be about 120 degrees.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE POLICE OFFICER: He told me he initially forgot.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE SPEAKER (2): Oh my God, that is crazy. I mean who for gets a child?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE POLICE OFFICER: He eventually admitted that he did leave his daughter in the car.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: Twenty-five minutes, that is insane. He should definitely get jail time for that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PINSKY: I agree. Police say in a few more minutes and that little girl would have been dead as well. So Sam, should the dad get jail time,

you think? Yes?

SCHACHER: Yes. I do. And, I think Loni hit the nail on the head that every case should be investigated but also examined uniquely to that

scenario.

PINSKY: Back with Sam, Evy, Judy and Colleen. So, do we blame -- You know, Colleen, there is this thing called parental stress, the people have

been talking about, as a reason parents get distracted and developed false memories about what they did with their child. To me, that is a case that

is way too pad and seems like a copout to me. It is sort of like, "Oh! OK, so, you forget." That is not OK.

DR. COLLEEN LONG, PSYCHOLOGIST: Exactly.

PINSKY: Yes. I mean how much more can we say. It is like saying, "You did a bad job of parenting." It is like saying, "Well, I was driving

the car and I got kind of tired and nodded off because I did not get enough sleep the night before." OK, if you hurt somebody, you are responsible for

that.

DR. LONG: Right. Listen, I am a mother of 7-month-old twins, I get that. It is inconvenient to take your kids out of the car seat that each

one in a car seat and bring them into a store. But, nothing about being a parent is ever going to be convenient.

Your life is never going to be convenient again. And, I think the theme all of these parents have is the idea that I get to still live my

life the way it once was before my kids were here and that is not the case.

PINSKY: Well, that is not the case at all.

SCHACHER: Yes.

PINSKY: Another case in Tennessee, parents went grocery shopping leaving their 1-year-old daughter behind in the vehicle. Witnesses saw the

baby sweating and crying in the car seat. Fire fighters, again broke in that window to get her out. Those parents were arrested. Evy, have you

ever been dealing with these kinds of cases?

POUMPOURAS: Look, there is a lot of different cases. I want to say something. There is a difference between forgetting your child

legitimately and there is a difference between saying, "You know what? I am going to leave my kid locked in the car and I am going to go shopping.

I am going to go drinking."

PINSKY: That is crazy. Yes. You are right.

POUMPOURAS: I mean that is just --

PINSKY: By the way, I would take issue with there being a legitimate forgetting. I mean the actuality of forgetting is not legitimate in my

mind. But, yes, you are right --

POUMPOURAS: You are responsible for that child. What are you thinking? I know typically I do not get emotional on our show, but you

know, this is disturbing through the weekend we see all these cases. I mean what are people thinking? There needs to be laws set so people do not

do this. You do this, you get punished for it severely. This is unacceptable.

PINSKY: And, that -- Evy is getting to the core of the problem here. So, Judy, would jail time solve the problems? Do we need to make examples

of these parents? Reminding ourselves we be disrupting these homes and causing more trauma to the poor kids we are concerned about.

JUDY HO, PH.D., PSYCHOLOGIST: I do not think jail time is a solution, Dr. Drew. I think the solution is to discipline these parents through

treating them, giving them the parental classes that they need.

PINSKY: You are a softy, Judy.

DR. HO: I am not softy.

PINSKY: Wait until Twitter takes off after you. Evy is throwing her hands up.

DR. HO: I am not a softy.

POUMPOURAS: Judy. You know, what, Judy? In theory, I get it. But, how are you actually going to execute that. There is a difference between

theoretically we would like to do something and there is a difference between can we actually execute it.

How are you going to educate all of these people? And, do you think some of these people want education? Some of them, do not.

DR. HO: No. They do not.

POUMPOURAS: Do you think they are going to want you in their home saying, "Sure, come on in and tell me how to raise my child." That is the

problem.

DR. HO: You are absolutely right about that. I mean, it is not that everybody is going to take to it but they all should be required to do it.

And, then they should be assessed on a case-by-case basis about who is actually still able to parent and who should have their children taken away

from them.

PINSKY: Got to go. We are not going to be able to solve it tonight but we better start making some examples because this ship -- this aircraft

carrier we have got of crappy parenting in the United States has got to get turned around somehow. Next, did the basement boy have a secret Twitter

account, speaking of bad parenting, and a hidden stash of cash? Reminder, you can find us anytime on Instagram @dr.drewhln. We will be back right

after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE INTERVIEWER: Would you have noticed any disturbing of the property? I mean you would have noticed he was coming in and out,

would not you?

CHARLES BOTHUELL IV, FATHER OF THE MISSING BOY: You know, I could think I would have, but I would think that I would have noticed that he had

a Twitter account that I did not know about, which the FBI told me and some additional money that they found.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER (1): It was implied that perhaps that your current wife might have been keeping him down there and hiding him

perhaps from you.

BOTHUELL IV: That is absurd.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER (2): Does your ex-wife have access.

BOTHUELL IV: That is absurd.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER (1): Does she say -- Does she told you point blank that she does not know where he is?

BOTHUELL IV: Yes, she has, period. My wife would not do that.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER: Monique Dillard-Bothuell is accused of putting little Charlie in their basement and baracading him behind boxes

and totes. Sources state Mr. Bothuell failed his polygraph. His wife refused to take one.

MONIQUE DILLARD-BOTHUELL, STEPMOM OF LITTLE CHARLIE: I did not trust to be treated fairly.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PINSKY: Back with Sam, Evy, Vanessa and Adrianna. New details in the case of the basement boy, Charlie Bothuell. The DA has told us, they have

not as yet received a request for police to charge the father. In the meantime, Dad says he had no idea, as you heard there, about the secret,

so-called twitter account, about the child`s hidden cash.

I tried to find out how much money, we probably do not know yet. And, he did not know about either of those things until the FBI told them.

The FBI has told us that they are not in a position to confirm any of this. Adrianna, I have not heard from you in this story yet, come on as a panel,

what do you think?

ADRIANNA COSTA, AMERICAN TELEVISION PERSONALITY: I do not trust one thing this guy says. Like my visceral reaction is that he is a big fat

liar. And, also he is a control freak. He called Charlie`s biological mom to try to talk to Charlie. She rejected that call, thank goodness. So, he

says he did not know about the Twitter account. He did not know about the additional money.

I do not believe any of that. This is a guy who monitored how many steps his poor kid ran on the elliptical. Yes, I do not believe one thing

he says. I think he is so much more involved in what he is letting on. He loves the spotlight. He is becoming -- this is an odd comparison, perhaps,

but a michael lohan, holding his own press conferences and listing the media to perform a lie detector case for him. What are you talking about?

Stay away.

PINSKY: Evy, what about the wife was saying not trusting she would be treated fairly. How much more objective and fair can a lie detector test

be than the fact in.

POUMPOURAS: Well, you know, when you are dealing with individuals perpetrators offender, that is what they are going to say, I do not want to

take one because, you know, it is not fair; because they are worried that they are going to fail it. Obviously, he did not get through his exam.

So, she is just throwing in further justification.

And, regarding what Adrianna was saying. A lot of the things he said, I watch that video clip, highly deceptive comments that he is making.

There is a lot of red flag with his speech patterns. Dr. Drew, if I may, at one point he says, "My wife did not do anything to my son." Just like I

have been saying that I did not. You catch that? He is saying my wife did not do anything. That is a commitment there. But, he is saying just like

I have been saying I did not. He is not saying the same thing for himself.

PINSKY: Sam, what do you think?

SCHACHER: Yes. Listen, I think that there is definitely something very odd here. I have said that from day one. I was just reading on your

Facebook as well as on Twitter that a lot of people are saying, "Well, how do we know that this kid is not lying, that perhaps the stepmother did not

place him there."

I tell you why I think he is being honest. Because, when he admitted to the police, when he was in isolation that he was beat with that pipe,

they wanted to see, "OK, is this kid exaggerating, is he lying?" They went and corroborated the story by finding that PVC pipe, by questioning the

father. So, I think that if he can be forthright about that, it is most likely that he can be honest about other things too.

PINSKY: And, Vanessa, should we be concerned about this Twitter account that the kid had on his own. He is 12 OK, on the twitter and to

have done so without the parents knowing about it? Do you have trouble with that?

BARNETT: I am not so much worried about the son being on Twitter as I am about the father not knowing about it. He is a big fat liar in a lot of

departments. But, I actually believe him here. I think he phoned it in completely oblivious as to what his son was doing online.

I have said it before, I will say it again. You have to stalk your children online. I am sorry. We are in a day and age where it moves so

fast and parents think they are up-to-date because they know snap chat. That was a day ago. You got to --

PINSKY: Yes. You need to be one step ahead. No matter what. When you think you are up, they are ahead of you.

BARNETT: And, you are not. Yes. Stalk your children. It may be a twitter account today but it could be a tender account tomorrow.

PINSKY: Evy?

SCHACHER: Tender.

(LAUGHING)

POUMPOURAS: I do think he may not have something to do with his son disappearing because he was very adamant about it, I did not murder my son.

I did not do this to my son. However, I do think he is very deceptive when it comes to child abuse.

PINSKY: Yes.

POUMPORAS: Because with his press conference, he kept trying to steer everybody towards, like, "Hey! I did not murder my son. I did not do

that to my son." But when they talked about child abuse, his speech pattern and all of that completely shifted.

PINSKY: And, again, no charges of abuse, no charges of really wrongdoing against this dad yet. And, I have still started to wonder to

what extent the child`s behavior has contributed to these circumstances, just an interesting thought. Listen, I am not blaming the victim here at

all. I just have to wonder what is going on with that kid. Got to go. Got great news for our friend Leeann Tweeden and her husband. We will

share that with you after the break. We will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER: Court records show that Charlie`s father, Charlie Bothuell, IV said he disciplined the boy with a PVC pipe.

The feds found the pipe be with blood on it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: I do know he tried calling the mother and she hung up on him.

CHARLIE`S COUSIN: To my man, Mr. Charlie, his father, you are a coward, dude.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PINSKY: Back with Sam, Evy, Vanessa and Adrianna. Hey, Evy, you have taught us that the way the cops behave -- the police behave during an

investigation informs us at least partially what is going on here. They went after Harris very aggressively, did not let him go on bail. In this

case they are not filing charges. Does that tell you anything?

POUMPOURAS: It tells me that they probably do not have enough on him to charge him. That is the problem. So, they are probably digging and

looking for information. But you know what, Dr. Drew? He wanted to take a polygraph for the media. I tell you what, bring him in, I will give him

the polygraph.

SCHACHER: I love it.

POUMPOURAS: Bring him to the studio, Dr. Drew.

COSTA: I think the next place we are going to see him is on a daytime talk show during the polygraph. But, you know what? It is so interesting.

I believe that he wanted to talk to his son. The reason he called the biological mother to talk to his son is so that he could get to him to sort

of coach him.

PINSKY: Change the story.

COSTA: Yes. Before he got to the FBI and they questioned him.

PINSKY: Sam, agree?

SCHACHER: I agree, Adrianna. And, I think -- I want to comment on something you mentioned on the last block, because you believe that he was

lying about the whole twitter thing. I could not agree with you more. A father that is this controlling. All he has to do is pick up his kid`s

phone. Twitter is an app that you download, so as Facebook, so as Snapshots. You pick up their phone and you see all of those on the phone.

I do not buy anything that comes out of this dad is mouth. I am sorry.

PINSKY: But, Vanessa is still skeptical?

BARNETT: No. I am not sceptical. I am confused. How is a bloody pipe and scars all over this boy`s body not enough to charge him with

something? Why is he still walking around, able to do these kinds of things? I do not get it.

PINSKY: Yes. I think -- You know, listen. This was some kind of abuse here and regardless of how this relationship between the dad and the

son devolved to the point that there was serious, serious physical abuse, sort of it does not matter. It is got to be charged, I think. But, you

know, we will see if that is in fact the case. Evy, is there any point -- does anybody -- well, Evy, I will go to you. Do you think that the child

may have some pathology of his own that needs to be kind of thought about in the context of how this got so bad so fast?

POUMPOURAS: Yes. I mean you have to analyze what the child has been through. I think that is why they brought in those experts to speak to the

child. You want to make sure that the information the child gives you is accurate. And, they take that and have to corroborate it, because it just

cannot be he said this and he said that. But, you also have to deal very delicately with the child. Is there problematic behaviour? How has he

been dealing with him? You know, he probably needs a lot of mental health, psychological health.

PINSKY: That is right. Not a PVC pipe. Not a PVC pipe.

SCHACHER: Right.

POUMPOURAS: No.

PINSKY: All right. Thank you, panel. Sam, I want you to join me here. We are going the auk about our friend Leeann Tweeden. I think, Sam,

you know what I am going to get into here. Vanessa is going to have tears, she tells me. Leeann could not be with us tonight and she will not be here

for a little while because her husband who you see pictured here -- Vanessa stop the crying.

(LAUGHING)

Pilot Chris Daugherty, is just home from serving our country in the Middle East. He has been away from Leeann and their 3-month-old -- wait!

The baby is how old? 6-month-old? And, he has been away for three months. So, a third of the child is life. Here is a look at their reunion today.

You are seeing pictures of that. I want to thank you Chris and of course Leeann, both of you, for your sacrifice for our sacrifice. Sam?

SCHACHER: I cannot, Dr. Drew. I mean where is the box of tissues. But, Yes, I mean --

PINSKY: Do not worry, Vanessa got the whole box. She is here going nuts.

SCHACHER: I mean help a sister out, Vanessa. I need some too. But, no, he is such a hero and you know, I commend her because essentially she

is to be a single mom while he is serving our country.

PINSKY: Please DVR us right now, so you can watch us any time. "Forensic Files" is the show that follows us and it begins right now.

END