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PIERS MORGAN LIVE
Interview with Donald Trump; Syria Analysis; Interview with Ricky Gervais
Aired September 13, 2013 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PIERS MORGAN, CNN ANCHOR: This is PIERS MORGAN LIVE. Welcome to our viewers in the United States and around the world. Tonight, who's got the upper hand, Vladimir Putin or President Obama? I'll ask New York Times columnist Nick Kristof, and the co-hosts of "CROSSFIRE," S.E. Cupp and Van Jones. Also, a man who never holds back, Donald Trump, tells people what he thinks the president should do about Syria, not to mention his thoughts on Mr. Putin. And America's first tattooed beauty queen. Has that cross its own red line? Plus, the return of the wickedly funny Ricky Gervais. What he thinks of the idea of guns for the blind.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICKY GERVAIS, ENLGISH COMEDIAN, ACTOR, DIRECTOR, PRODUCER, WRITER: And FORMER RADIO PRESENTER: It's a difficult one, but, the short answer is, because they can't see what they're shooting.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: And his message for America.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GERVAIS: Dear America, please let Piers buy a Kinder Egg but don't let him buy a gun.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: And we're beginning now with our Big Story. President Obama and Vladimir Putin locked in a tug of war over Syria. Senior administration officials said they don't believe Russia would agree to any UN resolution that it includes authorization of possible military force against Syria. President Obama recalls what's to keep that option of military strikes on the table. Today, he said this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: Ultimately, what's needed for the underlined conflict is a political settlement that allows ordinary Syrians to get back to their homes to rebuild and to relieve the enormous suffering that's taking place.
(END VIDEO CLIP) MORGAN: New York Times' Nicholas Kristof is here. I want to get his view on this. But we'll begin with Donald Trump. His thought about Vladimir Putin and President Obama, he says, "This country's never look so weak." And Donald Trump joins me now on the phone.
Donald, you're angry about this. Tell me why?
DONALD TRUMP, AMERICAN BUSINESSS MAGNATE, INVESTOR, TELEVISION PERSONALITY AND AUTHOR: No, I'm not angry. I'm disappointed. We have a president that's not looking very good. He is being outplayed by, you know, Putin to an extent that nobody has ever seen and it's making us look very bad as a country and certainly he's looking very bad.
MORGAN: In terms of the leadership element here, because it's a scenario which you're an expert. What is he doing wrong? Because it seems to me that he's being zigzagging all over the place and not really sticking to a firm game plan and that -- that's never strong leadership.
TRUMP: Well, it all began when we he used the term red line, he's going to draw a line in the sand essentially and don't cross. That they crossed but he didn't do anything and then it became very late, and he decides to go back to Congress, and Congress is having fits over it, and it looks like he wasn't going to even come close to getting to vote and he started looking very, very ineffective. And then, of course the letter or the editorial that Putin wrote at the New York Times was amazing. It was just amazing. He said so much. And he said it in a very nice way but it wasn't really nice at all, it was tough, about as tough as you're going to get. And Obama is having a very, very hard time competing.
MORGAN: I mean, you know, well I read that Putin thing, it had a kind of Trump feel to it. It was a brilliant stunt. It created huge noise and maximum damage to his rivals while he's actually appearing to be smiling and charming.
TRUMP: Well, the letter was very well crafted because, I'm a great believer in crafting things, and this was about as well crafted as you can imagine. Now, I don't know that he wrote it. But certainly, it was his thoughts and covered so much territory, and as an example, American exceptionalism. Obama likes to use that term, some others like to use that term. And you know, you think of the term is being find but all of a sudden you say, "Well, what if you're in Germany or what if you're in Japan or what if you're in any one of 100 different countries, your not going to like that term. And it's very insulting. And Putin really put it to him on that.
But then he talked about why are we exceptional, why would we be -- we've just went through a disaster in Iraq where we spent $1.5 trillion where we lost thousands of our people's lives and lots of other lives by the way, and what if we get nothing. In fact, it's going to be taken over by Iran or of course a lot of things can happen in the mean time. But, as it is right now, Iran is already controlling it. They're flying over it to go to Syria. They've been given permission to fly, not that they needed the permission because Iraq has basically been wiped out. So, you know, it's been -- it's a very sad thing. But the letter was amazing and that it covered so much territory. Covered it with respect and with a smile and it was about as tough as you could do.
MORGAN. What would you do Donald with Syria? And indeed with the wider issue of America's place on the world stage and in the Middle East in particular?
TRUMP: Well, first of all, you know, the old days, we had generals like Patton and Robert E. Lee and we had some great ones, General Douglas MacArthur, Grant. They must be just spinning in their graves when they see what happened because you know, if you're going to fight, you fight. And if you're going to do something, you do. The elements of surprise has turned out to be one of the great jokes of all time. Here we are having our generals talking about exactly what they're going to be doing. Where we're going to be hitting them? When we're going to be hitting? It's not going to be a hard hit. It's going to be very soft hit. We don't want to change the regime.
It's the most incredible thing I've ever witnessed as opposed to just either doing it or nothing. You know, I don't think it should be done any way. I think that this country, our country has tremendous problems that we have to solve and we cannot be the policeman of the world. These are not people that like us in anyway shape or form. And you have others out there. Not that we're backing away from Russia and China and others, but we have problems in this country that we have to solve before we start helping people that hate us. We have no idea who the rebels are, absolutely no idea. If we think they're probably perhaps is bad as Assad, maybe worse. And so, we should be attending really attending to our own business as straightening out the United States.
MORGAN: And final point. A complete segue here for one red line to another, but a red line was crossed. In the world of beauty pageants, and Miss America, we had Theresa Vail who has, sports a very large tattoo. Would you ever allow such a thing in your pageants Donald Trump?
TRUMP: Well, we allow them but we don't encourage it. I am not a fan of tattoos. I've seen many people get the tattoos and I don't know what's going on nowadays, but just -- everybody's getting tattoos. Many of them regret it later on. Many of them are, you know, done by people that aren't even artists. They have no talent. They have less talent than I would have in putting on a tattoo.
And I see these people with TicTac billboards on their arms, and legs, and I don't understand what's going on with the tattoos. I would certainly not want it. I would not want anybody that I'm close to, to have it. If it's done it's done, but it's a pretty tough thing and it's an amazing trend. I look at some of the NBA players and I say, "What the hell are they doing to themselves?"
MORGAN: Donald Trump, it's always good to talk to you. Thank you so much for joining us.
TRUMP: Thank you very much Piers. MORGAN: Now, I'm bringing New York Times' Columnist Nick Kristof not to talk about beauty pageants or tattoos ...
NICK KRISTOF, NEW YORK TIMES COLUMNIST: I'm really ...
MORGAN: ... by all means, chip in. Let's talk to the serious point of Syria there. Donald Trump and his own individual style, but lot appoints said. But a lot of points resonate with the American people right now.
What do you think of where we are with Syria?
KRISTOF: Well, I mean first of all. I disagree with Donald about how well the Putin Op-Ed was captured. In fact, I think the fact they did antagonize so many people suggest that he over reached. I mean, you know, when he just exuded hypocrisy when he talks about the importance of avoiding force. This coming from somebody who presided over the death of 200, 000 people in Chechnya, and who talks about how God created everyone alike unless they're gay.
I mean I think that that just antagonizes people in, and I thought it was authentic. I thought he actually wrote it because no PR agency in the world would allow him to insult American exceptionalism.
MORGAN: But what he has done -- it has brought him a little bit closer to his dream scenario which is 2 for 1 keeping Assad, his mate in power. But secondly, perhaps removing a lot of chemical weapons which could have had ended up with the rebels. You shifted to somewhere like Chechnya and used against it.
KRISTOF: That's true. And also whenever potentially buys into a possible solution. I mean now, he has a stake, he has some ownership over this possible deal. And we'll see where it goes. I'm still skeptical. My best bet is that it will fall apart, but it's not impossible. And that would be such a stride for an international security if we were to get, you know, in the bulk of those chemical weapons removed.
MORGAN: Is that enough? When you're President Obama and you create your own red line. You say it very stated, very publicly. Is it enough to then not take any action if that red line is crossed? Military action?
KRISTOF: I mean, I think that while we have peace process in place that may lead to the removal of chemical weapons, then I don't think we should strike. But I think that it may well fall apart and in that case I think that we should, and indeed I think we should be also more aggressive in helping the rebels. I think that there is some hope that we can turn the tide enough on the ground, not that the Assad regime will fall but that he will, it will leads to Syria's peace talks and that is going to be the way they end this.
MORGAN: A part of the problem it seems to me is that with the mess in Iraq and the mess in Afghanistan is kind of clouded the whole view of any type of military action. With you rightly -- I read you were writing a piece about this. You sight, you know, Sierra Leone, Marly, the Ivory Coast in Bosnia, and Kosovo all of were examples of short military strikes have been pretty effective in saving lives.
KRISTOF: You know, 10 years ago, it broke my heart to see so many of fellow Liberals embracing the Iraqi invasion. Today, it breaks my heart to see how many people are so against the use of force in any situation that they're willing to acquiesce in the slaughter of Syrians.
MORGAN: That's exactly how I feel. I mean I feel the British Parliament for example has now made the wrong call twice.
KRISTOF: Yes.
MORGAN: They were wrong about Iraq.
KRISTOF: Yes.
MORGAN: Where there was no evidence of WMD, and none turned up. And I think they'd be wrong about this because I think that when somebody has so brazenly use chemical weapons against all international law. You have a moral duty to take action.
KRISTOF: Yes, and, you know, I think that people bring up the hypocrisy issue that we intervened in some place as we don't in other ,and that's absolutely true. You know, I wish we had done more in dire for elsewhere. But at the end of the day, if we can consistently save some lives against some threats that's much better than acquiescing consistently in every, just kind of suffering.
MORGAN: However much is dividend and did then and changed his mind over this as President Obama clearly has. If it ends up with the chemical weapons being removed and being seemed to be removed from Assad but he stays in power, is that still a victory at any time?
KRISTOF: That would be a real win for international security if those chemical weapons were removed. If he were deterred from using it again, yes that would be a stop forward, but, you know, make no mistake. I mean I'm a fan of President Obama's foreign policy in general but this has not been his finest hour.
MORGAN: OK. Kristof good to see you.
KRISTOF: Good to see you, thanks very much.
MORGAN: When we come back, who really has the upper hand in Syria's tug of war? Crossfire's S.E. Cupp and Van Jones are here go head to head.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: CNN Monday night. A test of faith for Rick Warren. Now Piers talks exclusively with America's Pastor and his wife. Their first interview since the suicide of their son, how they are coping and what everyone should learn from their loss. Piers Morgan Live, Monday night at 9 on CNN. (END OF VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Monday, Senator John McCain live in the New Day Studio. He argues that the US should get more involved in Syria's Civil War. Could he convince you? Join Chris, Kate and Michaela on New Day, Monday morning on CNN.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CONAN O'BRIEN, HOST OF CONAN: President Vladimir Putin wrote an editorial in the New York Times, asking the US to avoid brute force and be more civilized. That's what he said, unfortunately Putin couldn't finish writing it as he had to go take his shirt off and arrest gay people.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: On horseback.
O'BRIEN: On horseback. "You come with me."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MORGAN: Conan O'Brien poking fun at the expense of Russian President, Vladimir Putin but who will get the last laugh when it comes to Syria? Joining me now from the set of CNN's new Crossfire co-host S.E. Cupp and Van Jones. Welcome to you, now we're going to get to Syria in a moment but I was just watching your guns debate there, fast ending debate between all of you and I wanted to ask you S.E. Cupp about this issue of the blind being given gun permits in Iowa. Are you a fan of that?
S.E. CUPP, CO-HOST OF CROSSFIRE: You know, I'm not a fan of arbitrary rules that target certain classes of people, except criminals. And all of this laws do nothing but burden law abiding people who follow laws and they don't strengthen gun legislation, they don't prohibit crime. And so, keeping a blind person from having a gun frankly isn't what we need to be worried about or talking about.
MORGAN: S.E., I love you work and I love your style. But when somebody like you with your intelligence looks at me down the camera and says, "Blind people having guns is not an issue," I think you've gone stark raving mad.
CUPP: Well to be frank, gun owners and it's not your fault for not knowing this, most people who talk about gun control don't really no much about it but most gun owners have to take safety classes were incredibly responsible with our firearms and a blind person who might not all the way be completely blind by the way, would have to go through the same kind of training and safety courses both on how to shoot his gun, use his gun, keep his gun, protect his gun, secure his weapon.
MORGAN: But they can't see, S.E...
CUPP: You're treating blind people like they're all 100 percent blind. This is a class of people, some of whom wear glasses. Some of whom maybe considered legally blind but can still see, and why should they not have the opportunity to defend themselves the way every other American citizen can.
MORGAN: Van Jones am I loosing the plot?
VAN JONES, CO-HOST OF CROSSFIRE: Look on first blush it does sound totally preposterous and ridiculous. However, I think what there should be is there should be a standard. And if somebody who's been classified blind can meet that standard then I think there's no problem. I don't think we should lower the standard to make it easier...
MORGAN: How can somebody who's classified blind even meet the standard, it seems far of.
JONES: Hey, now listen but we're having a very different conversation. If somebody can't meet the standard they shouldn't be given the license and the standard should be, you should be able to shoot straight. There may well be people who are legally blind but who are able to meet the -- listen, all I know is the big problem in America, is not too many blind people have guns. The big problem is America is that there are too many kids out here in the community who have no hope, who have no role models, have no economic future.
MORGAN: No I agree with that, I agree with that Van and actually...
JONES: And that's the bigger problem, I think we are blind to the poverty and blind to the young people, that's the blindness I'm worried about.
MORGAN: No I agree, I agree, I agree with...
CUPP: That's all been called the Constitution Piers...
MORGAN: That's what I'm coming to.
CUPP: And in the second amendment it does not say, "You have the right to bear arms if you can shoot them well." That is not part of the constitutional, the confines...
MORGAN: Well you have actually, you've actually answered the very question I was about to ask you, which is actually the reason the blind thing is so relevant. It is actually, it comes down to constitutional rights and I cannot imagine that any of the founding fathers who were hugely intelligent people sat there and thought, yes it is perfectly correct and reasonable that somebody who's blind should be able to buy an AR-15 (Walmart) for example.
CUPP: Well Piers they didn't sit there and dream of the internet either. There are a whole list of complications in a progressing, modern, evolving world that the founding fathers didn't anticipate, it's up to us, sober minds to sort of sort through those things. But the constitution is what it is, it is clear on this and it's not up to me or a blind person to tell you why I deserve the right to my second amendment rights. It's up for you to tell me why I don't.
JONES: Hey listen, here's what I want to just point out. Only because I know this is because I saw the little documentary about this thing. You know, we think about somebody, you're running down the street blind, you know, shooting up in the air whatever. This is a sport. You could imagine for instance a veteran, who, this is a part of their life, part of their upbringing. They've been injured in the war, they want to be able to go with assistance to a shooting range to be able to shoot and be able to...
MORGAN: What if they want to drive a car? What if they want to drive you? What if they want to be a cab driver in New York.
JONES: It's your constitutional right to drive a car but my point is simply this.
MORGAN: But that's my point about, my point about the constitution...
CUPP: I think he wants to change the constitution.
MORGAN: Wait a minute, wait a minute, yes I do. Because guess what, it's already been amended numerous times. I the to break to you Americans but your constitution has been amended numerous times for a reason, some of them with the time. I ask you both again, would you be happy for the veteran in the scenario that Van Jones just pictured for me to be a New York cab driver if they so wanted?
JONES: No I wouldn't but I'll tell you what Piers...
MORGAN: Why wouldn't you? You wouldn't because he will be danger to you and to himself as would any blind person as Stevie Wonder told me...
CUPP: But you're acting like that blinds veteran could show up at TLC in New York City and be given keys. He has to apply. He has to prove he's confident. I mean we actually have gun safety classes that the NRA backs by the way for just this sort of bizarre completely weird hypothetical scenario ...
JONES: I love you more than I can possibly say and if you want to lead a movement to start amending the constitution, I would suggest you don't start with the blind people thing but they're might be a piece of stuff that we might want to work on this, you know, I mean listen I think education should be ...
MORGAN: There's a reason I love the - the reason I love the Constitution. I love your Constitution but I would say to you this - that when the Supreme Court ruled about this in 2008 whenever it was, they made it very clear there should be reasonable restrictions right? On what kind of firearms are in people's hands and whose hands they should be in.
I don't think that by any criteria you could say that reasonable restrictions would include the constitutional right of somebody who's completely blind having an assault rifle.
JONES: Piers ,listen to me. Here's the deal, if you want to change the Constitution, that's fine but let me tell you, two more things to do. Two more things. We'll do the blind people if that's makes them happy but can we also ...
MORGAN: I know you get blind people. I love blind people. I don't want them onto the team.
JONES. We don't have a constitutional right to vote. We don't have a federal constitution right to vote and we don't have a right to a quality education. If we're going to change the Constitution, I think also bigger problems than your blind person thing. That's just me.
MORGAN: Well, I actually thought you're show was fascinating and it's great that the debate's still being had, that is the one plus of all these and it will continue to rage. I was going to talk about Syria with you both but you know what, we run out of time but I found out a fascinating debate so come back again.
CUPP: All right.
JONES: Thank you.
MORGAN: Coming up, the always outspoken Ricky Gervais is here I'm going to ask him what he thinks a blind people having guns. I've got a feeling I may know the answer. Also, I talked to him about Miley Cyrus and the twerking just on the Chair, all of it. He's next in the Chair.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MORGAN: Look out America he's back, Ricky Gervais and if you think he's going to let you off easy this time, well think again. The most dangerous man in comedy has a new Netflix Original Series, Derek and he's with me in the chair tonight. In the chair.
GERVAIS: And so and this is me.
MORGAN: What we now call it.
GERVAIS: I saw your tweet as well.
MORGAN: Which one?
GERVAIS: Watch tonight when Ricky Gervais enters my lair.
MORGAN: Yes.
GERVAIS: That's -- that's worrying isn't it?
MORGAN: The chair in the lair. What does it conjures up to you?
GERVAIS: Well it's scary because there is a man in a pink tie. So, that's...
MORGAN: No I was checking but obviously Googling you to -- pretty up to date last minute big news. And the biggest news story about you connected to New York was on the mail online website which had pictures of you and your charming lady walking along the street, under the headline, "Ricky Gervais is thinner than ever."
Did you ever think in your early chubby days, ever have that kind of headline in this six months?
GERVAIS: I could only hope.
MORGAN: Yes you hare thinner than ever.
GERVAIS: No I'm not, no, I lost weight I'd say two or three years ago and I'm about the same, I did it. I did all the work in a, you know, a few months and I've sort of, "Gee a white shirt."
MORGAN: Look at that. Look at that. At the left a Robbie Coltrane.
GERVAIS: There's nothing wrong with that. There you go, see.
MORGAN: When you look at the guy on the left.
GERVAIS: I like him.
MORGAN: What do you think?
GERVAIS: I like him, he's enjoying his food.
MORGAN: Would you see him as a figure of fun?
GERVAIS: Yeah, no, not at all. I'm never worried about my weight. I never worried about my weight. I knew I was fat because I ate too much, I didn't do enough exercise, that's why I was fat, right?
And then when I decided I'd rather be fit than fat I still eat too much and drink too much but I work out, I work out everyday.
MORGAN: Now how can you work out, given that I couldn't shake your right hand because of this terrible tendonitis you've got?
GERVAIS: Well I can run, I can run and it strapped up but I can't be wasting money so I ran, I still ran everyday.
MORGAN: You're in agony right?
GERVAIS: I'm on pain killers so...
MORGAN: So, how many months have you have this?
GERVAIS: Don't know.
MORGAN: But literally like nearly a year?
GERVAIS: No it started in February, so I've been to so many specialists OK? I've had x-rays, MRI's, I've had ultrasound, I've had steroid injections, never again, so painful. There's nothing they can do, it's a frozen shoulder, I've never heard of this. OK?
MORGAN: A frozen shoulder.
GERVAIS: That's what it's called, and the other name for it which is really rubbing salt in the wound is 50 year old shoulder. Well I didn't say that. And every doctor, they say, "Well we don't know what happens but we know it just gets better by itself," it's not some sort of weird curse, where's the medical science? Why aren't all these drugs working but I could have an operation if I wanted which would speed it up.
But, you know, I'm not big on hospitals and things like that. I think I tried -- whenever I may I think I'm going to die right? Everything's terminal but I think it might get better if I just wish it away.
MORGAN: But also for you, because anyone who follows you on Twitter and you have a huge following, they'll know that you are a pathological atheist and therefore the thought of death is very final for you, and for me, the good Irish Catholic boy it's the start of something new and glorious. For you, that's it.
GERVAIS: To me it's the end of something glorious so I have to pack it all in. But, you know I'm not depressed about it, I don't want to die any more than anyone else and I think there's a strange myth that atheist have nothing to live for. That's the opposite, we have nothing to die for.
MORGAN: You have more to live for because...
GERVAIS: We have everything to live for.
MORGAN: Yes, I would have mentioned you have a more focused attention to life because you think it ends when you die.
GERVAIS: I think it's precious, I think it's beautiful. I think the world is amazing, I love people, animals, art, every hobby. I can't believe my luck that I'm alive for at least 70 or 80 years, it might be less. But you know, I'm not long for this world, right now I'm used to saying that, actually live through 83. I think it was 40 years ago and I'm not long for this world.
MORGAN: What are the, you said the things you like, what are the things that really annoy you?
GERVAIS: Only two things really, really make my blood boil I suppose. I suppose in general as I get older injustice. Injustice quietly makes my blood boil. Either personal, social, political, you know, personal. I suppose the two main categories are, are religious intolerance, this arrogance that you think arguing over who's god is right sort of gets me down a little bit. You know, and I've got no problems with spirituality. I really haven't, you know, that's another myth and I always try to make a difference clear between spirituality and religion.
One is a very personal feeling, a journey, a hope or ever a need, you know, a joy and the other is an organized body that use that for power and corruption. In many cases, in many cases and, you know, I don't have either but I suppose, I think that, when it affects me that's when I have a say in and religion affects me, religion's very real. Spirituality doesn't really affect me.
MORGAN: You know, what's funny, there's an irony isn't it? When the people that attack you on Twitter for challenging them about their religious beliefs they showed this total disrespect to you for what is your belief, your belief because you're an atheist and you just don't happen to believe in a deity or a god. I can respect that completely while choosing myself to have a different belief.
GERVAIS: Of course, of course and, you know, I think people do, well first of all we're on to Twitter now so we're not into rational discussion. Everyone takes everything personally in Twitter. You know Twitter is like standing by a notice board in the town center and someone comes and put a sign, guitar lessons and they go, I don't want guitar lessons. Even though it wasn't to you, you know, and the one of the tweets I've ever had is everyone is entitled to their opinion so keep quiet about your atheism. The view of an irony in that is wonderful. You know.
MORGAN: But also you and I got into once when we were just having a joke or anything when I was pretending to be offended by something you'd said. And we carried this on all day and the number of people who were just completely deludedly (ph) believing that we had genuinely fallen out was extraordinary.
GERVAIS: Well I think the world is sort of loosing their sense of humor, particularly in terms of irony over the last few years but Twitter never have it. Irony doesn't work on Twitter, because there's always someone. Again we're talking about the sentiments, you know, I've got 5 million followers and there's probably one or two idiots a day, which isn't bad, you know, that's probably better than the high streak, you know, and that's the wonderful thing about Twitter particularly as an observational comedian.
I usually have to actually meet this strange dangerous people but now I can learn about them from the safety of my homestead mansion.
MORGAN: Let's take a short break, let's come back and talk about your fast earning new project, Derek, which has been getting rave reviews in America, better reviews I think than it had in Britain where they were more cynical and that's an interesting observation about the two cultures.
GERVAIS: Yeah.
MORGAN: I want to get into that with you after the break. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MORGAN: This is Ricky Gervais' Netflix Original Series, Derek and he's back with me. It's fascinating to see the way it's gone down in America. Because in Britain there was a certain dose of the normal British sinister might felt in the way it was received by the media in particular.
I haven't detected that here at all, they've taken it as Americans often do, face value.
GERVAIS: Yeah, well that's the big difference, I think the reviews eventually were good in England as here but what happened here was it didn't have that pre-seeing it review. I mean in England there was a couple that said, "I haven't seen this show but I'm not holding up much hope." And they're bad review was based on not seeing it and I think that's the end of the article. A few times, I haven't seen this new show but that's the end of it.
MORGAN: But how can you possibly review it?
GERVAIS: Yeah I had that ones in the tabloid, they were saying about Rick Gervais should be banned from television, his life I think disgust me, talks about just all of the holocaust right and it's then, my friends went to see him in Brighton, well no that's it...
MORGAN: Yeah I've never seen him.
GERVAIS: Yeah.
MORGAN: Then tell me about Derek, because he's a care worker and he's, you know, he's slightly back well, I guess you would describe him as a, in terms of his intellect and so on. But what was the purpose of this creation?
GERVAIS: Well wanted Derek. Derek is sort of based on those guys you see them. They're the, they're sort of outsiders, he's not an autograph hander (ph) but it could be an autograph hander or it could be a trained spot and I've always looked and I thought, "What do they do when they go home? What's their home life like?" You know, you see them a little bit scruffy, you know, and I made Derek like that and Dougy (ph) and Kev (ph). I made them outsiders and scruffy and not too bright because I wanted kindness to come along and trump everything.
And that was really important. I want even not to see them coming, I didn't want it to be, you know, those wrong cons you see where it seemed to be beautiful man well it seemed to be and see beautiful girl and they hate each other by they love each other by the end. You know, you see it coming a mile off.
MORGAN: But you told all the reporter, really interesting quote I thought. You said, "As you get older, you start realizing that when you're young the most important thing is being popular. Then when you hit adolescence its being clever, then it's being funny and now it's about kindness and that trumps everything." Which is the kind of journey you've gone on yourself. But also it's where you've ended up comedically with Derek I think because he is essentially a force for kindness.
GERVAIS: That's right, it's a show about kindness, yeah, and, you know, again I've written about what I know. It's based on experience, you know, everything I've done has come from character first. So, I had David Brent (ph) way before the office and he was based on people that I've met growing up, you know, wanting to be, they wanted to be the center of attention.
I've watched a lot of docu soaps, normal people becoming famous overnight. So, that one and to, and I worked in an office for 10 years so that was the, now with this I had Derek the character and I thought the perfect backdrop was a care -- and all my family were care workers growing up. My mom, my sister, my sister in law in Austerlitz, my niece is now a care workers. So I got like 30 or forty years of anecdotes about -- and it's fascinating.
And also, I suppose I wanted to leave that veil of irony behind. Originally, Derek -- I used the -- all rough hunting a bit more. It was going to be to dispense satire against, you know, the rich and famous. And it's going to be out of awful babes. So, he's going to say the wrong thing and that was going to be funny. I thought I didn't like death. I did the office which was all about fame, extras overtly about fame, the Golden Globe's, you know, "I'm in the fame. I do this," you know. And I thought I want to return to normal people because most people you meet aren't Johnny Depp and Brad Pitt. Well, you -- they are with you. But the rest of us, we meet more Dereks, and Kev's, and Dougy's, and hammers (ph) in our life.
MORGAN: You tweeted today, I love the fact that so many Americans are happy to inform me that they were surprised that had a kind streak.
GERVAIS: Yes.
MORGAN: And it has been the reaction...
GERVAIS: Yes.
MORGAN:... in the sense that wow, Ricky Gervais does kindness.
GERVAIS: Yes. Well, I think that they see your persona. They see me on chat shows like this taking that you have a man in a pink tie. They see me at the Golden Globe's. And I think people forget that even though you're working under your own name on chat shows or stand up, you are a brasher more confident, egotistical version of yourself and, you're -- you know, home like doesn't come into and I try to keep my private life private.
MORGAN: Let's take a short break, when we come back, I can talk to you about three things. One is Iowa State giving gun permits to totally blind people which sort of any level is comedic as it happens to be fatally true of us but also in Miley Cyrus and twerking. I don't know if you twerk. And in Golden Globe's...
GERVAIS: I'm doing it now.
MORGAN: Are you?
GERVAIS: You can't. I just want to see the cameras not got...
MORGAN: Subliminal twerking?
GERVAIS: Underneath I'm like a duck. The legs are going crazy.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MORGAN: Right now Ricky Gervais. Iowa has been giving up gun permits to blind people, not just partially blind but completely blind people who aren't allowed legally to drive cars.
GERVAIS: Well -- well I learned about this through one of your tweets and I understand you, you thought this a bad idea?
MORGAN: What are -- or could you, you love American? I love America.
GERVAIS: Yes. Well I tweet you too.
MORGAN: Let's talk from that position.
GERVAIS: It says, next to have you saying, "Blind people shouldn't drive cars." Which interesting I thought because I think people who got to see the difference, they were talking about as in a quality issue on blind people allowed to defend themselves.
MORGAN: Well they're constitutional right?
GERVAIS: Yeah.
MORGAN: Would be damage if -- and they gave an example of, you know, if they were fully sighted and used the gun just because they lost their sight, why should they lives to constitutional right to continue having a gun?
GERVAIS: Yeah. Well, it's a difficult one but the short answer is because they can't see what they're shooting. That's what I'd say.
MORGAN: This is the thing. You see when I tweeted about this, British people who followed me thought I was making this up, they thought it was joke.
GERVAIS: Yeah.
MORGAN: If they know about my gun campaign but actually thought this was just a wind up and I said, "No it really is happening, people are not just applying for permits to a blind, they're getting permits and that completely blind.
GERVAIS: Yeah. Yeah, it's strange, that's a strange law but who -- but hold on wait a minute. So, the constitution covers everyone, does it? MORGAN: Yes. In fact it covers, I'm a US residence. So, I'm technically also covered by the constitution that's why I'm allowed to criticize the second amendment about guns because of the first amendment about free speech.
GERVAIS: But tell me, you are not allowed to carry a gun?
MORGAN: I would not be allowed to carry gun here in New York, but I could carry one in, you know, Dallas or I can carry one anywhere. If I go to Walmart in Houston and buy one, they'd be on the wall. I can't buy Kinder Egg, you know, those little eggs with little toys in because it may choke me. So, they're a health hazard but where the Kinder Egg would be sold in and British store then instead have an AR-15 assault rifle.
GERVAIS: Dear America, let please buy a Kinder Egg. But, don't let him buy a guns.
MORGAN: Let's talk about the cultural differences. We've talked about the difference between that the humor on sight Derek is a good example the lack of sinister in most Americans allows them to take Derek at face value and see the charm of it in a way that British people who are traditionally more sarcastic, more cynical. So, it took a bit more time to do that. What are the other cultural differences that you...
GERVAIS: Well, that that...
MORGAN: Pick up?
GERVAIS: That is the big one. I think the big difference between America and British people it is their positivity and it was reflected in the remake of The Office, you know, and Steve Carell's character happened to be a little bit more positive than David Brent. The difference is in upbringing, Americans are brought up to believe they can be the next President of United States and they sort of can.
We are told it won't happen to you so don't bother and I never really had that. I was, you know, born a very working class, my dad was a laborer, mom is a housewife, but I always thought I'd go to college and I could have everything as long it was to do with school, you know, and I was sort of like, I don't know I was thought it would be OK, but I do know people that, you know, they were asked not to go to university because they're now was able to be something and that's very sad and, you know, it does you no good or least goal. And I think, "Oh wow, how sad is that? That your ambitions are squashed at such an early age.
And I try and encourage everyone I say, "It's never too late." I'm really trying to say, "You know, just go for it, don't listen to people." You know -- everyone knows these amazing stories but it doesn't seem to rub off on them, they seem to be beaten down.
MORGAN: Don't tell me encouraging people, Tina Fey and Amy Poehler are going to be doing the Globes this year. You are the king of the Globes, they're obviously doing it for the second time. You've done it three times, right?
GERVAIS: Three times, yeah.
MORGAN: What is the -- what is the technique to handling that notoriously difficult crowd?
GERVAIS: I think -- worry about the TV audience, do it for them. I made a decision, you know, there's 200 people in the room, do you panic to those people or the 200 million people watching at home? And for a comedian there's no competition, you know. I think its people being offended on other people's behalf's. That's what happens. And -- and controversy, the word controversy makes people look at the headline, right? Then it's how controversial it is. And if you say it enough people believe it is. I don't think anything was particularly controversial.
If I we're to see my stand up that the...
MORGAN: Well I -- I look to the outrages, you know, something like Miley Cyrus and her twerk. And you know, it was obviously done very deliberately by her to try and make that move from young star Hannah Montana to something else. And it's was brilliantly executed in my view. And I found the outrage so fake.
GERVAIS: Well I -- I find -- yeah, it's too easy to offend. Anything you say, someone will find it offensive. Again particularly in your case, but -- but it's just too easy, why bother, you know, you -- you could be on the news every night. If you wanted to come out, get drunk and shout down a paparazzi's lens or come on here as say outrageous thing all the time. It will be so -- but I don't know what the cash eye is in that. I don't care for it. I know I don't go out there to try and shock, you know. But if anyone's offended by anything I say, so be it, because just 'cause you're offended it doesn't mean you're right.
MORGAN: What is the moment, if I had the power to let you relive a moment from your entire career again? What would you choose?
GERVAIS: The one that sprang to mind was the first Golden Globes.
MORGAN: Why?
GERVAIS: I don't know, 'cause I shouldn't have won it. We are out there a little show called The Office, no one had heard of us. I really -- I didn't even bother listening -- do you see America telling us who to thank, because I thought we're just making the numbers here. This is a little trendy show. And then I won for best actor and the show win it and that's been old style, I think that was 2004. I wouldn't -- apparently went --went up. Clint Eastwood was overheard to say -- this is fantastic.
MORGAN: What is the joke you would tell on your death bed? As offensive as you like. You're dying, now who cares. You're about to die it does matter, no matter how many people you offend.
GERVAIS: Why does Piers Morgan wear a pink tie?
MORGAN: What's the answer?
GERVAIS: (inaudible)
MORGAN: Ricky Gervais. I -- I normally end interviews by saying what a pleasure it's been, but in you case (inaudible).
GERVAIS: CNN.
MORGAN: Please watch Ricky Gervais.
GERVAIS: Down the drain.
MORGAN: ...the seven episodes of Derek on Netflix. Now get out of here. You're left hand grip.
GERVAIS: That's the public school face (inaudible).
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PIERS MORGAN: Monday night I'll sit down with the man that many people called Americas pastor, Rick Warren. It's his first interview since the tragic suicide of his troubled son, Matthew. Now Rick Warren is making it his mission to end the churches stigma against mental illness. He joins me exclusively along with he's wife Kaye (ph) that's Monday night. Now this weeks CNN hero Robin, a woman determined to solve a food problem in her North Carolina community.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBIN EMMONS: There's a magic in gardening that you can drop a seed into the earth and from that there's an amazing fruit that is delicious and so good for your body. That's a miracle to me. Here in Charlotte 73,000 people live in low income neighborhood that don't have access to this fresh fruit. You can call this the miracle mile. Pretty desolate in the way of health food options.
There are barely any supermarket, once they get there by bus or a neighbors car or on foot, they are paying a very high price for the food. I'm Robin Emmons and I believe everyone should have access to fresh food, so I grow it and bring it to communities in need. We want our market to be abundant tomorrow, so let's hit it. We have about 200 volunteers that come out and help us harvesting food. These are heirloom tomatoes over here.
We're bringing the food to the community and cutting the cost in half, compared to what they would pay in the grocery store.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Six months ago, I was diagnosed with diabetes. Let's see if we can find something a little better. I am unemployed right now. So, sometimes you have to buy the cheaper things. These are beautiful. I couldn't believe all the fresh vegetables and the price was phenomenal. It's making me and my family healthier.
EMMONS: I started growing foods in my backyard. Today I grow on nine acres of land. Since 2008 we have grown 26,000 pounds of food.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bye.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have a good day. Bye bye.
EMMONS: I feel like I'm giving them a gift. A healthier, longer, more delicious life.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
