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CNN NEWSROOM

Oregon Rampage; Interview With Florida Senator Bill Nelson; Ridding the NFL of Performance-Enhancing Drugs

Aired December 12, 2012 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Now this. Here we go, top of the hour. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

I want to begin in Oregon, where people there still very much so in shock after a shooting rampage inside a mall. We now know who the shooter was, 22 years old. Here's a picture. This is what Oregon authorities released just a short time ago. Investigators are saying he acted alone. Listen to the Clackamas County sheriff describe the shooter.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CRAIG ROBERTS, CLACKAMAS COUNTY, OREGON, SHERIFF: His name is Jacob Tyler Roberts. He's born March 16, 1990.

Based on all the evidence that we have gathered so far, it appears that he die of a self-inflicted gunshot wound. We're also prepared to release additional information about the suspect.

During this attack, he was armed with an AR-15 semiautomatic rifle. The rifle was stolen yesterday from a person known to the suspect. At the time of the attack, he was wearing a load-bearing vest, not a bulletproof vest, that was earlier reported by some outlets.

He was also wearing a hockey-style face mask, and we have not yet been able to establish how many shots were fired during the attack, though we believe he was carrying several fully loaded magazines.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Clackamas County sheriff there. Before we get more on the shooter, I just want to take a moment to listen to the sheriff's spokesman describe the victims and the requests from their families.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SGT. ADAM PHILLIPS, CLACKAMAS COUNTY SHERIFF'S OFFICE: This first statement comes from the family of Cindy Yuille, age 54, from Portland.

"Cindy was everybody's friend. She was a wonderful person who was very caring and put others first." The family has advised us they want time and space to grieve their loss and will not be giving interviews at this time. The family will make a statement at an unspecified later date through the sheriff's office. This is a statement from the Forsyth family. "Steven Mathew Forsyth, was a loving husband, father of two children, a son, a brother, an uncle, a longtime youth sports coach, and a friend to the many people who had the privilege to meet him. Steve was one of the most passionate people with a true entrepreneurial spirit that drove him to start his business, Coastums. He had a great sense of humor and a zest for life. He had a vision and a belief in others that brought great joy and value to many lives. He will be sorely missed by all who knew him."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: We're getting more information here now from Dan Simon, who is our correspondent there in the Portland, Oregon, area.

Dan Simon, what more do you know?

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Brooke, the shooter, according to shorts, stole the gun that was used during the attack. He took it from a friend just yesterday.

The gun is described as an AR-15 semiautomatic rifle, and at one point it actually jammed and they believe that's why more people weren't killed during the attack. We can tell you that the shooter, Jacob Tyler Roberts, age 22, had no significant criminal history.

Authorities are still trying to figure out what may have set him off. Here is some of what the sheriff had to say.

ROBERTS: The suspect pulled his vehicle in front of Macy's, parked his car, exited, and moved in a rapid manner toward the food court. A lot of folks reported that he was running, moving quickly, left his car, opened fire in this general area.

He ended up striking two victims that both died of their injuries. There were some medical staff and other people that rendered aid. Following this, the individual fled down this -- along this corridor, out down the back hallway down to some stairs, which is -- this is actually on the upper level. He came down the stairs to the lower level, and back in the corner is where he shot himself.

And one of the things that we located a victim that was transported to OHSU, this is her. We believe she was up in this area, but was able to come out through the front Macy's, work her way down to near REI. That's where law enforcement officers met with her and she was subsequently transported.

SIMON: Authorities say they searched Roberts' home and they also searched his car found in the parking lot. They did recover some evidence. But they're not saying what was found.

At this point, still no motive for this shooting. No clues as to what may have set this suspect off. "The Oregonian," the newspaper here, is reporting he was evicted from his apartment last summer, but certainly that doesn't begin to explain why this may have happened -- Brooke.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: Dan Simon, thank you.

Just in now to us at CNN, we're getting word that the Syrian regime has been using Scud missiles against its people, Scud missiles, Soviet era missiles used by Saddam Hussein during the first Persian Gulf war.

Jill Dougherty is following this for us live at the State Department.

Jill, this is a first, correct, a first that we're hearing that the Syrian regime is doing this?

JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN FOREIGN AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, although I have to tell you, Brooke, that there have been reports, you know, coming from the State Department that as I say the lethality of the weapons that the Syrian regime has been using against the forces, the opposition forces, has been increasing.

And in fact in the briefing today they were talking about missiles. The spokesperson, Victoria Nuland, wouldn't go so far as to call them Scuds. However, sources that we're talking to are calling them Scuds, but she also mentioned another thing that is very disturbing, and that is what are called barrel bombs. That's another thing.

They are incendiary bombs. They set off fires and create burns that human rights groups say are extremely painful, can burn right down to the bone, and it is very, very hard, especially from people who don't have hospitals or health care at this point to be treated for it.

So this is, as we know, coming right on the heels of those reports just a week or so ago about chemical weapons.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Yes. That was my first thought when I first heard about this report of the Scud missiles. I thought, my gosh, if they're using these, chemical weapons could be another step.

DOUGHERTY: Yes. Well, the administration is saying that Bashar al- Assad is increasingly desperate. And that is the concern, that as he grows more desperate, he will resort to more and more frightening things. And these certainly are frightening. You know, the Scud missiles as we're talking to Spider Marks, who is our security adviser, who is a former general, retired general, who was saying when the Scuds hit the ground, that they disperse over quite a large area.

And let's say if you marry, as he put it, chemical weapons with Scuds, you would have a very dangerous situation. So the one thing that also has been happening is don't forget that Turkey, the neighbor of Syria, fearful that something -- some type of attack could come from Syria, asked for Patriot missile defense systems. And they have been approved as we reported by NATO, and now we're told that the United States part of that should be coming online relatively soon. So that could be, let's call it an antidote for it, but it is very, very worrisome and increasingly difficult for the people who are on the ground.

BALDWIN: Right. How do you protect yourself from this? Clearly, a sign that the violence is escalating.

Jill Dougherty, thank you.

Want to take you to New York City now, where police have a murder mystery on their hands here. This happened in broad daylight, Monday afternoon, Midtown Manhattan, right around Columbus Circle and Carnegie Hall. Want you to take a close look at this still picture. This is what we have from surveillance cameras. NYPD says this is just moments before this suspected gunman here, the guy on the left- hand side of the screen with the hoodie pulled over his head, this is right before he pulls the gun and fires, putting a single bullet in the back of his target's head.

The target, a California law student visiting the city. Police say the suspect then got into his Silver Lincoln MKZ. Here is the car. You see him coming or going, coming. This is also obviously surveillance video, the suspect simply disappeared after that single shot into New York traffic.

So many questions here. I want to bring in "New York Times" reporter David Goodman.

David, excellent reporting. All these details in your piece this morning. I guess one of the first things when I read it I thought, you have this victim, Brandon Woodard, law student, apparently according to his attorney had a law school exam the next day back in Los Angeles, but he didn't have a return ticket. Tell me more.

DAVID GOODMAN, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": Well, yes, thanks for having me, Brooke.

So that's -- the police say he doesn't have a return ticket. His family was under the impression that he was coming back on Tuesday and that his mother told us that she had plans to pick him up at the airport. So that's another one of the mysteries that surrounded this death that really has been intriguing from the beginning.

Just the very fact of having a man shot in what appears to be a targeted killing, a kind of assassination almost, murder, on the streets of one of the tonier areas of the city in broad daylight, basically during lunchtime, holiday shoppers everywhere, and the fact that this shooter who we now have seen on camera, witnesses at the time, he disappeared so quickly into the car that people said it was like a ghost. They heard the shot, they turned around and there is one there.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: No, I was just going to say, in addition to the fact he was such a ghost, I know you're trying to figure out exactly who is this, you know, Woodard. We're hearing some a little bit from his childhood friends. Let me play this sound.

GOODMAN: I'm sorry?

BALDWIN: I wanted to just roll a sound bite.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRISSY ROUSSELL, FRIEND: Deeply saddened, shocked. There are no words to describe how we're feeling. But he was a wonderful young man and his memory will live on in all of his family. He has a young daughter who is his spitting image, very sweet little girl.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: So he has a daughter. But, David, let me read, you quote -- someone -- quote -- "As a partier and promoter, Mr. Woodard made himself part of a world of expensive alcohol and private tables where friends said people with elite pedigrees rubbed elbows with stars and professional athletes as well as with a rougher crowd."

Rougher crowd. What do you mean by that?

GOODMAN: Right. Well, so we talked to more than a dozen of his friends in addition to his family and the picture that started to emerge over those conversations, everyone is very distraught and shocked by the killing.

They didn't -- you know, didn't know Woodard to be involved in this serious level of activities.

BALDWIN: Violence.

GOODMAN: But he had been arrested before and the police say he had been arrested 20 times, although in all those cases he didn't serve very much jail time, and apparently he was only convicted of misdemeanors, though some of the charges did include drugs.

But a lot of his friends were wary of talking to us on the record. We got a few of them to do that, but a lot of them on background and off the record said this was a very promising young man in high school. He played basketball, he was a star, he was a great -- apparently a very capable student if not always the most attentive.

One told me an anecdote where he would fall asleep in class and then a teacher would call on him and he would wake up and know the answer. This was a very bright young man, but one who was very lured by the club scene and what we heard from people that had been out with him a lot is that he started to drift and move towards some people in the club scene that were known to be more engaged with this sort of what we're calling the darker side, the more illicit side of the club world.

(CROSSTALK)

GOODMAN: And this was told to me he was the kind of guy that had a lot of girlfriends, and so it was -- the theory among his friends is that, you know, as they started to think about it, this could have been -- they thought it was very possible it could have been related to a girl, related to drugs, so the mystery is completely -- we have no idea.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Total mystery. NYPD on it.

You think about New York, all the cameras, hopefully they will get to the bottom of this. I'm sure they will.

David Goodman, "New York Times," thank you so much.

(CROSSTALK)

GOODMAN: Thanks so much.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: An ex-Marine is behind bars right now in Mexico. And what's happening to him in there is causing one senator to sound the alarm. We will talk to that senator live in just a matter of moments.

I'm Brooke Baldwin. The news is now.

(voice-over): A meteorologist says she was fired for responding to a viewer's Facebook post. But is that the whole story?

Plus, a sudden about-face from the Obama administration on school lunches. Why? Because of a silly viral video.

And the life of Ravi Shankar. The legacy of a Beatles mentor and the father of Norah Jones.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: The road trip one war veteran was taking was supposed to be about fun, and relaxation, but turned into torment and threats against Jon Hammar and his family. You see, for the last four months he has been in this Mexican jail for allegedly trying to take an illegal weapon into the country.

The weapon here, this was the family heirloom, a shotgun he intended to hunt with and he even got paperwork from the U.S. customs to take it across the border into Mexico. But Mexican officers still arrested him when he tried to cross from Brownsville, Texas, into Matamoros, Mexico.

That was back in August. His parents say that's when some of these phone calls, these calls started coming in from drug cartels, apparently began.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) JON HAMMAR, FATHER: We get calls from inside the prison saying, you know, this is not about the police, this is about us, and this is our house, and if you don't do -- send money, we're going to kill your son. Here's your son on the phone.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: A Marine, Jon Hammar, had survived Iraq, Afghanistan. He was discharged, suffering from PTSD, post-traumatic stress disorder. And to help deal with it, he just wanted to go surfing. And he wanted to do it in Costa Rica. That's where he and a friend were headed when this whole nightmare began.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OLIVIA HAMMAR, MOTHER: We keep telling him, you know, what we're doing and we think it is going to end soon, but you can only say that for so long. We're afraid. We're afraid.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Joining me now, live, is Senator Bill Nelson of Florida.

Senator Nelson, welcome. Thank you so much.

I know you have gotten involved at the family's request. You in fact recently spoke with the Mexican ambassador to the U.S. I'm going to ask you about that in a moment, but I have to ask about these phone calls that Jon Hammar's parents got all from these drug cartels. What happened in those phone calls?

SEN. BILL NELSON (D), FLORIDA: Well, that was last August.

And it's at that point that we interceded to get him out of the general prison population. He is now being kept in a low kind of intensity place, more like an administrative place. And because it doesn't have a lot of bars, according to the ambassador, that's where they have actually, if you can believe this, chained him to the bed.

BALDWIN: Why?

NELSON: But at least he's out of that prison population that -- where he was getting the threats. That was last August. He's been in this facility.

BALDWIN: Got it.

NELSON: A judge has not ruled on it. There is no excuse for this. And that's why we have got a very good Mexican ambassador to the U.S., and I think he's working it hard right now.

BALDWIN: Senator, from everything you know about this story, did Jon Hammar do anything wrong?

NELSON: No. As a matter of fact, when he went through the United States part of the border, he showed them the antique shotgun. He registered it so when he brought it in, back into the U.S., they would know that this was not a stolen weapon. And I hope that our U.S. officials told him that it is against the law to take weapons into Mexico.

So he goes from the U.S. line, right across the line into Mexico to the customs border officials there, and that's where they arrest him. He had another Marine with him. They let this Marine go. And yet this Marine has been in Mexican custody since August. There is no excuse for this.

BALDWIN: But, Senator, I know as you mentioned you talked to the Mexican ambassador to the United States. Where is this going? Is Mexico helping you in the family's plight to get this guy out?

NELSON: I hope so. And I believe that the Mexican ambassador is trying that right now, through their department of justice, through their attorney general's office, because it is against the law to take weapons into Mexico.

But, obviously, the law, you have to look at it under the circumstances. And this is an innocent bystander victim. He obviously was not roaming around Mexico with evil intent. He was right there at the border. And for five months, for a Mexican judge not to take up this case is inexcusable. So I'm hoping that Ambassador Sarukhan is going to be able to get to the bottom of this and get some results right away.

BALDWIN: Right away, because I'm thinking, you know, look, Hammar was home, he was suffering from PTSD, wants to go surf in Costa Rica. Here he is in a jail cell in Mexico.

Everything I can tell, these phone calls to his parents, you have these drug cartels trying to extort them, beating up their son, again, according to the parents so clearly, you would agree with me, time is of the essence?

NELSON: Five months is enough. It should have been disposed of within a few days. And what would Mexican officials expect of us in our justice system? And that is speedy justice.

BALDWIN: Five months is enough. Five months is enough, so says Senator Bill Nelson.

(CROSSTALK)

NELSON: Of course.

BALDWIN: Thank you so much, sir. We appreciate it. We are going to follow this. We appreciate it.

NELSON: Thanks, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Tonight, that Marine's parents will be talking to Anderson Cooper. Do not miss that, 8:00 Eastern right here on CNN. The NFL agreed to start testing for a powerful steroid nearly two years ago. But that never happened. And now Congress is getting involved. Hall of Fame linebacker Dick Butkus is testifying. We're going to talk to him live next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Performance-enhancing drugs in the National Football League, it is a problem. It's a problem that's been around for years and years and a congressional committee here is taking steps to try to get something done about it. Already, Major League Baseball, the Olympics, they regularly test for human growth hormone or it's known as HGH.

Now, today, a House committee heard testimony on the need for the NFL to follow suit. You see the man. Let's listen to what Hall of Fame linebacker Dick Butkus had to say about whether the players want to be tested.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DICK BUTKUS, FORMER NFL PLAYER: I believe a lot of them want it. Nobody wants to be playing and have that shadow hanging over, well, did he or didn't he take the juice? Did he or didn't he?

I think they all want them, a majority of them want to do the testing. So why it is held up, I don't know.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Dick Butkus joins me now on the phone from Washington.

Mr. Butkus, thank you so much for calling in. I know that more than a year ago the players and the league, they signed that new labor agreement that included testing for HGH. You say most players want it. So what's the deal? What's the holdup?

BUTKUS: Well, I don't know. They wanted to check the validity of the test, because, you know, if it is a false positive, you know, you could destroy someone's reputation.

But, as far as I know, the scientific people brought up that the tests are reliable. And I think the whole thing stems -- for me, it really revolves around my I Play Clean campaign, the effect on kids. I'm trying to get the point across to kids that it is the wrong thing to do and, you know, they look up to NFL players. So that's my part in it, is trying to get the kids educated about performance-enhancing drugs, because there is -- you know, there are surveys that we have been privy to, it is over 400,000 kids experimenting with performance- enhancing drugs.

BALDWIN: Over 400,000.

(CROSSTALK)

BUTKUS: I think that's important. BALDWIN: So you're talking to the kids, with this I Play Clean campaign, which I know you founded. But I just want to ask you personally, look, you're a legend, started with the Bears '65 to '73. When you think of this drug abuse, how do you compare it to when you were playing vs. today?

BUTKUS: Excuse me. Say that again?

BALDWIN: How do you compare? When you talk about HGH abuse, comparing what is going on today compared to when you were playing in the '60s and the '70s.

BUTKUS: Well, when I was playing, I don't think it was around. At least I didn't know of it?

BALDWIN: Really?

BUTKUS: I think it just became prevalent to the Olympic weight lifters from East Germany. I think they're the ones that introduced it to the States.

And no one knew what the consequences or the ramifications were for it as far as your health by taking steroids. But now we do.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: But do you think that the players sit as some of them are using this and abusing this, are they thinking, oh, this is what it might do to me down the road? Are they worried about that?

BUTKUS: That, I don't know. I really haven't personally asked any of them if they're worried about their health down the road.

But I'm trying to steer this toward the kids, high school athletes and everything else. Like I say, there is over 400,000 teenagers experimenting with it, and they see a professional player that has been caught or busted. You know, we're trying to convey the message that, hey, this stuff is detrimental to your health, and if you get caught, you will not be able to play at the next level.

And that's what I'm trying to do is get this education to kids. You know, the pros (INAUDIBLE) so if they think they need it, I know I would love to play on an even field. But I'm mostly concerned about the kids, the youth of today who look up to the NFL players.

BALDWIN: Hall of Famer and co-founder of the I Play Clean campaign, Dick Butkus.

Dick, thank you so much for calling in from Washington. We appreciate it. Appreciate hearing your voice.