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NANCY GRACE

Van Der Sloot`s Peruvian Prison Termed One of the Worst in the World

Aired June 15, 2010 - 20:00:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight in the disappearance of Alabama beauty Natalee Holloway, missing off her high school senior trip, Aruba. Aruban police refuse to make a case against judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot, even after he describes Natalee`s death and admits he hid the body.

Tonight, live, Peru. Van Der Sloot kills again. Another young girl meets him at a resort casino, found dead just hours later, brutally beaten, bloody, her neck cracked, broken, partially clothed on the floor of Van Der Sloot`s hotel. Van Der Sloot goes on the run to Chile. After a massive manhunt, Van Der Sloot captured. Spine-chilling video of Van Der Sloot with 21-year-old Stephany just before she`s found dead. Bloody clothes from the murder found with Van Der Sloot on the run. U.S. feds busting Van Der Sloot on a quarter-million-dollar scam to sell the location of Natalee`s body.

Killing machine Van Der Sloot confesses to Stephany`s murder. And after beating her to a pulp and breaking her neck, Van Der Sloot kicks back with a cup of coffee and Danish just feet from Stephany`s dead body. We obtain Van Der Sloot`s confession verbatim.

Bombshell tonight. Van Der Sloot charged with murder one and booked into Castro Castro, one of Peru`s most notorious jailhouses. We have the photos. Aruba and Peru in talks to arrange Aruban police to question Van Der Sloot about Natalee. Van Der Sloot`s defense attorney quits after death threats. Van Der Sloot in isolation in a Peruvian jailhouse, angling a free trip home to Aruba in exchange for the location of Holloway`s body.

But wait a minute. What about the dead Peruvian girl and two other girls missing from casinos in Bogota possibly linked to Van Der Sloot? What, they`re going to let him go home to Aruba for a home-cooked meal and a "get out of jail free" card? No!

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "I only hit her once on top of the nose with my right elbow."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Van Der Sloot confessed to the killing of 21-year- old Stephany Flores Ramirez.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "I think she started to faint. It affected me so that I grabbed her from the neck and strangled her for a minute."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She sees the e-mail, questions him about Holloway, hits him. He elbows her, strangles her, suffocates her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "So I took my shirt and put it on her face, pressing hard, until I killed Stephany."

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I thought about what I was doing. What am I going do now? Those are the words of Joran Van Der Sloot.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Aruban and Peruvian authorities have agreed to, quote, "help each other."

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It looks like Peru is looking for a formal request to come from Aruba so that they can send a prosecutor and a chief police investigator from Aruba down to Peru to interview Joran Van Der Sloot.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He says that he would like to talk to the Aruban authorities and tell them what he knows.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "I would prefer to talk with the Aruban police, and if there is a possibility to close the case, I will be willing to solve the case."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If his lips were moving, he was telling a lie.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Joran is a stone-cold killer.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s not the serial killer, sociopath, psychopath you guys -- the media makes him out to be.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: And tonight, live, rural Oregon. A 7-year-old little boy goes to school, walks down the hall to class. He`s never seen again. How does a 7-year-old go missing from his own classroom? Tonight, where is 7-year- old Kyron?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With the search and rescue mission completed at this time, we are moving operations towards the criminal investigative end of the spectrum.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The search continues for a missing Oregon boy but is shifting to a criminal investigation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Kyron`s stepmom brought him to school Friday morning, took this picture of him at Skyline Science Fair, and last saw Kyron near his classroom at about 8:45.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The divers wading waste deep in the murky water of the Multnomah Channel, but what they hope to find here and how it`s connected to the disappearance of Kyron Horman, Multnomah County investigators won`t say.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They`re going to start a secondary canvass. This means they`re going to go back to the houses they`ve already done canvassing in the vicinity of the school and they`re going to take a look, maybe with a set of fresh eyes...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The sheriff`s office, working with the FBI, confirms hundreds of searchers have looked over and over in every area where 7-year-old Kyron Horman could have wandered off from his school a week ago Friday.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We will be continuing this investigation. It is not going to stop, and I am not going to cease in dedicating resources to locating Kyron.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The hunt for Kyron moves from a search for a missing and endangered child to a criminal investigation. Law officers will not comment on whether there are any suspects.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. Van Der Sloot charged with murder one and booked into Castro Castro, one of Peru`s most notorious jails. We have the photo. This as Aruba and Peru in talks to arrange Aruban police to travel to Peru and question Van Der Sloot behind jailhouse walls about Natalee.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "The only case I have been involved in is the case of Natalee Holloway five years ago in Aruba for different suspicions."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Authorities in Aruba and Peru are joining forces, and they investigate Joran Van Der Sloot in two cases now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "The possibility exists that I can be extradited to Aruba."

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... a meeting by telephone between Aruban prosecutors and Peruvian prosecutors...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They are going to be drafting a formal request, which is what the Peruvian government has asked for.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Investigators in Peru and Aruba hope this cooperation will lead to new information about Natalee`s disappearance.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He has the leverage of that case that remains unresolved.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "I think I wanted to kill her because I wasn`t thinking."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s not like he met her in the casino and then lured her to his room with the intent to kill her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... word-by-word transcript of Joran Van Der Sloot`s confession...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He seems to admit that those coffee cups -- that he got the coffee after she was dead.

GRACE: He`s, like, Knock, knock. He knows nobody`s...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "Why did you leave the room and come back with two cups of coffee?"

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "I don`t know. I didn`t know what I was thinking."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Castro Castro is a terrible prison. He may never make it to trial.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Straight out to Jean Casarez, standing by there at the Justice Ministry, Lima, Peru. Jean, he is formally charged with murder one, which is different from regular murder in Peru, and is booked. What can you tell me?

JEAN CASAREZ, "IN SESSION": Well, what I can tell you, Nancy, is that he`s been processed, and we`ve got the pictures to show it. Number one, he had a mug shot taken. And I don`t care if you`re in Lima, Peru, or the United States, that`s exactly what it`s called. Secondly, he had his fingerprints taken. And Nancy, for the first time that I`ve ever known, fingerprints have now been collected and are on record for Joran Van Der Sloot. He already had his handcuffs, and he had shackles put on his feet.

GRACE: We are showing you shots of the jail system there in Peru. That`s a Lurigancho prison from National Geo`s channel "Inside" airing June 23, 9:00 PM. Take a look at the prison conditions there in Peru. Joran Van Der Sloot, it`s a far cry from the cushy setting you had in the Aruban jailhouse, where you played cards with your father all day long and figured out how to beat the rap!

Back to you, Jean Casarez, standing by at the Justice Ministry Lima, Peru. Tell me about Castro Castro.

CASAREZ: Well, Castro Castro is a large facility. They`ve got over 1,500 people. We went there, at least to the outside, on Sunday. It is right in a very poverty-stricken area outside of Lima, Peru. But everyone is adjoining in that cell according to their offense. That is, unless you`re Joran Van Der Sloot because he is in protective custody. His neighbor is an alleged Colombian hit man. They go and watch television together. They go to the exercise room together. The food he`s getting, for security reasons, is what the jail personnel are getting because they`re concerned he could be poisoned. But the end-all thought is to have him assimilate into general population. But that will happen in time, they say.

GRACE: We are taking your calls live. With us live in Peru, Jean Casarez and Victoria Macchi (ph), investigative reporter. Right now joining us is Michael Griffith, international law attorney, criminal defense lawyer, who has handled cases in Peru. Michael, tell me about Castro Castro.

MICHAEL GRIFFITH, INTERNATIONAL ATTORNEY (via telephone): Nancy, Castro Castro is the smaller version of Lurigancho. It`s kind of like comparing Dachau to Auschwitz. Castro Castro prison is also entering the gates of the hell. Three or four years ago, the inter-American court had a lawsuit where 450 male inmates and 135 female prison inmates were subjected to violent attacks by guards. The women were humiliated. They were made to strip down. They were subjected to physical and psychological torture. The court ruled against them and told Peru that they had to apologize.

There were inmates who were killed. The bodies were not returned to the families. And the inter-American league (ph) court has made them make reparations and apologize. This is truly a terrible prison, and this will be a holding prison, I believe, until he`s found guilty and then sent to Lurigancho, which I`ve told you I was a lawyer in "Midnight Express" with Billy Hayes. The Turkish prison in Turkey made this look -- made this look like a Ritz-Carlton.

GRACE: Back to Jean Casarez. Isn`t he getting special treatment? Isn`t it true they`re not even making him wear a prison uniform because they don`t want to denigrate him as a person?

CASAREZ: Nobody wears a prison uniform, and we saw that firsthand when we saw some local video shot inside the prison. And that`s because they say that this is a situation that`s too degrading for the prisoner, and they want to...

GRACE: Wait a minute! Wait a minute!

CASAREZ: ... uphold their rights...

GRACE: I just saw a group of men fighting over -- it looked like a trash can of rice. And you`re right, Jean, they don`t have on uniforms. But I find it hard to believe it`s to uplift the souls of the prisoners. We`re taking your calls. Everybody, you`re seeing video of Lurigancho prison, Peru, from National Geo`s channel "Inside" airing June 23 9:00 PM.

Jan in Texas. Hi, Jan. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK, Nancy, I know this, that when the maid lets Van Der Sloot back into the room, he`s already come out of the room with the two cups of coffee, and then he gets her to let him back in the room. And I thought I was seeing things, but I watched it over and over and I do see him come out of the room first and then she lets him back in the room.

GRACE: Hey, we`re showing it right now, Jan in Texas. He does come out of the room with two cups of coffee. Take a look at this. We`ll be back with Jean Casarez to explain. Jan in Texas just hit the nail on the head.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... Castro Castro...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s one of the highest security prisons in Peru. Very violent felons are there.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s only in protective custody for the moment.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "At that moment, Stephany hit me in the head. I lost control of my actions."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: His Peruvian attorney abruptly quit.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: His lawyer just quit.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He said, I have a lot of problems with this case. I don`t want to be a part of it anymore.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... Joran Van Der Sloot`s murder confession...

GRACE: ... total B.S.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: New transcripts give shocking new details to the crime.

GRACE: ... full of lies!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "I lost control of my actions."

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In this alleged confession...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The confession is unimportant.

GRACE: ... he recounts the murder moment by moment.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "I don`t know why I did it."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They`ve got the blood on him. They`ve got the video. And they`ve got his flight to Chile.

GRACE: ... just feet from Stephany`s dead body on the floor!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think Joran is a stone-cold killer.

GRACE: Van Der Sloot kicks back with a cup of coffee and Danish!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "I didn`t know what I was doing. I remember what I was doing but not the motive."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I believe that confession is a total lie, as well.

GRACE: ... Van Der Sloot`s confession verbatim. It is not the truth!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "Honestly, I don`t remember. I have no idea."

GRACE: It is an air-brushed version of murder.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Straight back out to the calls. Jayme, Oklahoma. Hi, dear.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. It`s a pleasure to talk to you. Thank you for taking my call.

GRACE: Likewise.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. I have a two-part question.

GRACE: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If Joran tells the Aruban authorities where Natalee`s body is located, won`t he be able to be prosecuted for her murder, thus being charged with double murder? And will the Aruban authorities do DNA testing to make sure that they are Natalee`s remains? Because we know he is a psychopathic liar.

GRACE: Well, I know that if they find remains, they will DNA test them. But my concern -- let`s unleash the lawyers. Then we`ll go to Rupa Mikkilineni standing by there in Aruba, from our staff. Tonight with us, international law attorney Michael Griffith, Meg Strickler, international law attorney, criminal defense attorney, Atlanta, and Raymond Giudice, defense attorney, Atlanta.

First of all, Ray, the problem with him telling where Natalee`s body is he could go back to one of his many stories where somehow, he`s with her, she just dies. He`s standing there, she dies, and he hides her body because he panics. Of course, that story is a lie. But if he goes home to Aruba and tells that story, they`ll probably throw him a parade and say, Thank you for showing us her body. You`re wonderful."

RAYMOND GIUDICE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, I think that`s what he`s counting on, Nancy. He and his lawyers are looking to structure a three- part deal -- a sweetheart deal in Peru, a confession to the Holloway murder, get transferred to serve his time in Aruba and maybe get extradited for the extortion case in the States.

GRACE: OK, Ray Giudice, here`s a technical/legal term you may not be familiar with -- cold day in hell! Weigh in, Meg Strickler.

MEG STRICKLER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, one thing just for -- one comment about Ray. There`s no prison transfer treaty between Dutch countries, Netherlands and Aruba, with Peru. So he will serve his time in Peru, if convicted there. That`s one issue.

GRACE: Although, they may -- they may want to clear out the jailhouse. In a lot of crowded jails, they`re only too happy to kick somebody to another country when they`re sick of them.

But I want to go now to Jean Casarez. Jean, Jan in Texas noticed he comes out the door -- let`s rewind that up, Liz, if you don`t mind. She`s right. He comes out the door with two cups of coffee in his hand. Keep running it, Liz.

CASAREZ: That`s right.

GRACE: And then he starts knocking again. It leads me to believe he comes back with the coffee, she`s either dead or he kills her then, then he does this set-up because, see, now he`s already dressed in his new outfit.

CASAREZ: That`s right. And Nancy, if you look really closely, there are two cups of coffee in his hand. But guess what? There`s only one bread in his hand Nancy. Look very closely right next to the coffees in the hand. He turns around. There`s only one bread.

And Jan in Texas hit it on -- right on because that`s the key part of that video, when he comes out, knocks and then gets a maid to let him back in. And in the confession, he admits he doesn`t know why he did it at that time, that there was no reason to do it. He admits in the confession, according to the police, that she`s already dead when he gets that coffee.

GRACE: Take a look at this. I know that he was plotting some kind of scenario to come out with the coffee. Here we go. Look. He`s got the two coffees with him, one Danish. He looks around. Now he starts -- he knows she`s dead. But he`s doing this seemingly for the benefit of the camera. This must have been somehow part of his story to police that he was concocting.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sociopaths are manipulative. They can tell you what they want. They can be charming.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... a homicidal maniac...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Cold disregard for anyone else except for himself.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He thought he was off the hook. He considered himself as a winner.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He`s not just a liar, he`s a braggart.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The jail conditions in Peru`s Miguel Castro Castro prison have been described as the worst in the world.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... very violent felons...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The warden got murdered.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... overcrowded...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And 50 percent of the population has AIDS.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... old-fashioned toilets without running water, seldom an opportunity to shower...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... Joran Van Der Sloot in a very exclusive wing right now...

GRACE: He has access to TV, in a room by himself. Hello? What is this, a country club?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Many have described the food as virtually guaranteed to make a foreigner ill.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They`re very poor.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Inmates might be willing to murder a fellow prisoner.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Once he gets into population, he`s got a problem.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`ll be some street justice.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Back to Jean in Lima. I understand we`ve gotten some lab results back on Stephany Tatiana`s body?

CASAREZ: Well, that`s right. Now, this is what we were told. We were told that there were no drugs found in her body at all, no drugs in Joran Van Der Sloot`s body. Cause of death is pending, but during the interrogation of Joran Van Der Sloot, he was asked about Stephany and said that amphetamines were found in her body. Now, that may have been just a question posed to him to try to get information because of all those pill wrappers that were found later on in her car.

GRACE: To Dr. Howard Oliver, former deputy medical examiner, forensic pathologist out of LA. If he had given her GHB, the date rape drug, how long would that be in her body? Because that drug, the wrappers were found in her vehicle that he was last in.

HOWARD OLIVER, FMR. DEPUTY MEDICAL EXAMINER/FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Had he given her that drug, it would still be present in her body even now. There`s no way to -- for her to eliminate it once she`s deceased.

GRACE: To Clark Goldband. Clark, explain to me what you know about the jail.

CLARK GOLDBAND, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: (INAUDIBLE) talking about the Castro Castro prison there in Peru. It was constructed in 1984. And to say it`s one of the word in the world may well be an understatement. But Van Der Sloot not in the worst of the worst right now. He`s being kept in isolation, Nancy, for security reasons. He is in the high-security area of the prison, with just 10 cells. His only other inmate in that area is an alleged Colombian hit man.

We`ve gotten word the two of them are watching television shows together in the same area, and he`s getting three upgraded meals per day. And Nancy, that`s important because from what we`ve heard, if you`re not from the area and you eat the food that`s served at the jail, you will get ill.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Van Der Sloot calls it an impulsive act.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "It was an impulsive act after I received the hit in the head."

JEAN CASAREZ, CORRESPONDENT, "IN SESSION": She hit him, he says, on his left temple.

MIKE BROOKS, HLN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST; FMR. D.C. POLICE DET., FBI TERRORISM TASK FORCE: And he took his right elbow and hit her in her nose. And he said that there was blood everywhere.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: His version that it was an impulsive act.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "I remember what I was doing but not the motive."

BROOKS: Premeditation can be made in the blink of an eye.

CASAREZ: He knew he had to flee. He knew he had to leave.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "I feared that she would go to the police and they would detain me for what was an impulsive act."

BROOKS: Whether he we see him captured we see him with light-colored hair.

NANCY GRACE, HOST: Dying his hair to hideout.

BROOKS: He obviously was trying to make an escape and to disguise his appearance as he went.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: He confessed to impulsively killing Flores.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "I lost control of my actions. I didn`t know what I was doing."

GRACE: That is all a lie.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: How much of this confession to authorities believe?

BROOKS: Everything he said before, if his lips were moving he was telling a lie. So what to believe from here, it`s hard to tell.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: We are taking your calls live. And joining us right now is a very special guest. It is the brother of Stephany Tatiana. Enrique Flores is with us

Enrique, thank you for being with us. Sir, I understand that you and your family actually contacted police to tell them that you thought Stephany was with Joran Van Der Sloot. How did that happen?

ENRIQUE FLORES, BROTHER OF MURDERED GIRL, STEPHANY FLORES: I didn`t understand that we asked the police to tell -- I didn`t understand the question.

GRACE: When you realized -- when you realized that Stephany was missing, did you and your family try to find her yourself?

FLORES: Yes. The thing was, we thought she was kidnapped. It wasn`t only us. I mean we -- the police -- we informed the police. The police came to our house because they found her truck, her vehicle in the street in (INAUDIBLE).

And that`s why the police came to our house and say if that was our family`s car. And we say yes. So the police make -- and everybody thought it was a kidnapping.

GRACE: To Jean Casarez, isn`t it true that the family went looking for her and put the pieces together, found someone that knew Joran Van Der Sloot?

CASAREZ: That`s right. Because Mr. Flores is a very respected businessman here. He knew the owner of the casino where she had been. And her father knew that she was playing in the poker tournament.

Someone at the casino gave them the name of Joran Van Der Sloot. And the family took that name, looked it up on the computer and was horrified. Enrique`s wife looked it up and was horrified who the person was that everyone was saying she was with that night.

GRACE: So did they go to police with that knowledge?

CASAREZ: From what we understand, they did go to police, but as we know, it wasn`t until two days later that her body was found by a fluke because a call came in for Joran Van Der Sloot.

Nobody answered at the door. The hotel attendant realized he hadn`t paid his rent in two days. So she went into the room with the spare key.

GRACE: Back to Enrique Flores. This is Stephany Tatiana`s brother.

Mr. Flores --

FLORES: We found her four days later.

GRACE: Right. Since the last time that we spoke to you here on this show, so many more details about Stephany`s death have emerged. How are her parents dealing with all of this?

FLORES: We`re never going to be OK. I mean, our sister isn`t coming back. We`re trying to hold up but it`s -- every day it`s very difficult for us.

GRACE: Mr. Flores, would your family consider a plea deal if Joran Van Der Sloot would agree to truthfully solve the Natalee Holloway case?

FLORES: We`re not the ones to decide how it`s going to be that justice made. We only want -- if it is going to help Natalee`s body to be found, we`ll be happy. But we want justice.

If they give him 20 or 30 years here, I mean, we don`t -- we`re not going to be happy. I mean, our sister is never coming back. We don`t want a person like this on the streets. He can be here. He can be in the United States, in Aruba prison. We don`t really -- we don`t really care.

GRACE: With us is Enrique Flores. This is Stephany Tatiana`s brother.

Let`s go live to Aruba. Standing by Rupa Mikkilineni.

Rupa, now emerging out of Peru, we learned that Aruban and Peruvian authorities had a conference today about Arubans traveling to Peru to question Joran Van Der Sloot behind bars. What`s the word in Aruba?

RUPA MIKKILINENI, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: That`s right, Nancy. Finally today Aruban prosecutors were able to reach Peruvian prosecutors. They had a conference call. And they discussed how they could cooperate in the future.

The bottom line is that Peru is asking the Arubans to make a formal request. And after their investigation in the Flores case is over, they are going to permit the lead prosecutor in Aruba to come down along with a lead investigator to interrogate Joran Van Der Sloot.

GRACE: Rupa, where is the mother? Where is Joran Van Der Sloot`s mother in all of this?

MIKKILINENI: Nancy, we know she is not in Peru. We believe she`s here on the island in Aruba. She has not been seen in public in Aruba for about a week. She`s trying to get down to Aruba desperately to see her son and AP is reporting that she needs funds and that is what she`s looking for.

She needs -- she needs money to go down to Peru and hire a proper attorney. Now I understand that there is a private attorney already being hired in Peru. We don`t have his name yet.

GRACE: Back to Jean Casarez joining us in Lima. Jean, what do we know about Joran Van Der Sloot`s attorney quitting the case?

CASAREZ: Well, the first one quit and he told us that he feared for his life. That he was getting so many threats by phone, by e-mail, by Facebook. He was hiding out actually last week when Joran Van Der Sloot was taken from the police headquarters to the prosecutor`s office.

But we confirmed this morning that there is a new attorney. It is a private attorney. But here in Lima, just like in the United States, private attorneys are on a list and can be appointed also.

That is what we believe has been the situation here, not a situation of money exchanging hands. He`ll be paid for by the state.

GRACE: Out to the lines, Doris in Delaware. Hi, Doris.

DORIS, CALLER FROM DELAWARE: Hi, Nancy. How are you, honey?

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

DORIS: I actually have a concern. I think that because of Natalee Holloway`s case going cold and everything else I kind of think that Van Der Sloot knew because of it being five years of Natalee Holloway`s disappearance, could it have possibly been that he wanted to be caught, that it could have been an anniversary killing for him to get back into the media?

GRACE: To Dr. Leslie Austin, psychotherapist joining us out of New York. You know, I always say, Dr. Leslie, that there is no coincidence in criminal law. This girl dies five years to the day of Natalee Holloway. How can that be a coincidence?

DR. LESLIE AUSTIN, PSYCHOTHERAPIST: I don`t think it is a coincidence. But I also don`t think he necessarily specifically planned it. This is a guy who goes into rages who just kills when somebody crosses him.

And the fact that the murdered girl Flores talked about Natalee Holloway triggered his rage and he just killed her just like he did Natalee Holloway. I think he was very aware of the date.

GRACE: We are taking your calls live. Back to Michael Griffith, international law attorney, U.S., practiced in Peru.

Michael, I understand that you think there`s a theory that the U.S. can try Joran Van Der Sloot for Natalee`s murder?

MICHAEL GRIFFITH, INTERNATIONAL LAW ATTORNEY/CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY (via phone): Yes. You know, the U.S. has a Department of Justice office in the Peruvian embassy that works closely with the Peruvian counterparts. We have an extradition law against them now so we get the next shot at him.

I believe that we`re building a case now, you know, under U.S. law. It`s called the passive personality theory where we can prosecute those people who have killed U.S. citizens overseas. So we could theoretically try him here in the states.

What I would propose that the family does is have a deal made that if he gives up the body now and if he told where the body is, this way the parents will have closure and they will only try him on the extortion charges. That`s what I would propose.

GRACE: Everyone, as we go to break, we are learning that his claim she attacked him has been disproven by the forensic evidence. We`ll be taking your calls live when we get back.

And as we go to break, a very happy birthday to New York friend, Donald. Set to complete a dual masters in education. He loves to read. He loves to go out on a boat. And he loved the Bravo`s "Real Housewives."

Now there`s a catch, people.

Happy birthday, Donald.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The Aruban and Peruvian authorities have agreed to, quote, "help each other in the murder investigation of Stephany Flores."

CASAREZ: Aruban officials can help. Joran Van Der Sloot started his trip from Aruba through Colombia to here in Lima.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you know why you are being detained?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`ve been told it`s because of the homicide of Stephany Flores.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A very dramatic confession here in Lima, Peru.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: It`s official now. Joran Van Der Sloot, as you know, the prime suspect in that murder case in Peru.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Why you kill her?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s got an account to settle and I hope he settles it on this earth.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: And the suspect in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway five years ago in Aruba.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What was the real reason why you victimized Stephany?

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Straight back to Enrique Flores, the brother of Stephany Tatiana.

Mr. Flores, at any point has your family wanted the death penalty in this case? I think I`ve got Mr. Flores with me.

Liz, do we still have Stephany`s brother with us?

FLORES: Hello?

GRACE: Mr. Flores, can you hear us?

FLORES: Yes.

GRACE: OK, everyone, Mr. Flores is joining us from Lima.

Mr. Flores, any point has your family wanted the death penalty in this case?

FLORES: No, no, because we don`t have death penalty.

GRACE: Everyone, we are taking your calls. I want to go to Victoria Macchi, investigative reporter joining us there at the justice ministry in Lima.

I understand that part of Joran Van Der Sloot`s defense is that she, the victim, struck him and he hit back in a moment of rage. But now police are looking at the forensics saying that`s not what happened.

VICTORIA MACCHI, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER ON LOCATION AT JUSTICE PALACE IN LIMA, PERU: Correct. According to his initial confession to the police, he said that he reacted violently to when she struck him. Now the -- now they`re saying that that wasn`t in fact true, that he hit her first.

GRACE: Now could you explain to me who the judge will be on this case? What is the judge`s reputation and when will it finally go to trial, Victoria?

MACCHI: Carlos Morales has been named the lead judge. And as of late this week or early next week, he will actually question Joran Van Der Sloot again.

He has a reputation here as a judge who has worked a lot of anti- corruption cases. So this is going to be a really big high profile defense case -- criminal case for him. Now the trial will actually start in about four to six months.

GRACE: That`s pretty fast according to American standards.

Out to Laura in New York. Hi, Laura.

LAURA, CALLER FROM NEW YORK: Hi, Nancy, how are you?

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

LAURA: I have a question. A while ago you had mentioned that Stephany`s father had said that there was DNA evidence underneath her fingernails. And as I`m watching my show over the weeks they showed him being examined -- Joran being examined, and they didn`t show any scratch marks or any mention of him being scratched.

GRACE: To Jean Casarez, do we know whether there was DNA under Stephany`s fingernails?

CASAREZ: That has not been released. But, you know, we`ve seen pictures of him without his shirt on when he was getting medical exams. And if you look all over him, there`s really not a scratch on him that I can see with the visible eye. But remember what he said in the confession. He went straight for her throat.

GRACE: And, Ray Giudice, where does this all leave the U.S. feds case on extortion against him for trying to sell the location of Natalee`s body?

RAY GIUDICE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, it`s clearly secondary to the murder and homicide investigation and prosecution in Peru. The issue becomes -- and I`m a believer that both Peru and Aruba can`t wait to ship him back to Birmingham for prosecution on that federal charge.

GRACE: Right now, everyone, I want to talk to you about a 7-year-old little boy that is dropped off at school. He`s walking down the hall into school. He`s 7 years old. To his classroom. He is never seen again. The 7-year-old boy Kyron Horman.

Janine Wolf joining us, news reporter with 750 KXL News Radio, out of Portland.

Janine, what can you tell me about this little boy?

JANINE WOLF, NEWS REPORTER, 750 KXL NEWS RADIO: Well, it happened 12 days ago, Nancy. Friday June 4th, and again he is 7-year-old Kyron Horman. He was driven to school by his stepmother Carrie Horman.

They got to school we think about 8:00 a.m. We`re not sure about that. It was a science fair day so it wasn`t a regular day at school. It was open doors and anyone could pretty much walk in.

All of the science fair projects were set up in separate rooms so they weren`t in a big room. They were all in the children`s classrooms. His stepmother Carrie did take a picture of Kyron. In fact there`s a -- it`s a picture you`ve seen a whole bunch of times everywhere.

Today they actually removed his glasses so you could see him a different way. But he was in front of his exhibit at the fair. And that was one of the last times he was seen 8:45 that morning. After the fair, Kyron and his stepmother were seen walking down the school hallway toward a classroom and he was seen by a teacher and two staff members.

His friends, his best friend, in fact, also saw him at the fair. But when school started he wasn`t there and his teacher marked him absent. That`s what happened. And then at 3:30 that afternoon he didn`t get off the school bus. He was scheduled to get of that bus.

His stepmother called the school. At around 4:00 p.m. the secretary at Skyline School called the Multnomah County Sheriff`s Office and by 5:45 search and rescue teams started scouring the area right around the school.

By the way, there were no cameras at the school. Some schools have cameras set up for surveillance basically. No one had to check in to attend that science fair, Nancy.

GRACE: To Marc Klaas, a special guest joining us out of San Francisco, president and founder of KlaasKids Foundation.

Marc, what do you make of it?

MARC KLAAS, PRESIDENT AND FOUNDER, KLAASKIDS FOUNDATION: Well, I wish that the family was more forthcoming. I don`t like the idea that they`ve been holding back.

On the one hand, you have the family saying that law enforcement has told them not to make any statements. But on the other hand you have law enforcement saying that the family will speak when they`re ready to do so.

Now in any of these kinds of cases the families are the number one advocates for the child. They`re the ones who make them come alive, they`re the ones who inspire volunteers and the public to search for the child.

There`s also a problem in my mind -- and this just might be a matter of semantics. But the fact that law enforcement did a search for seven days, then ended the search, which was very comprehensive, and only then announced that they were launching a criminal investigation. Typically, those investigations are launched simultaneously.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: You are seeing a shot of Kyron Horman. He`s only 7 years old. Tip line, 503-261-2847.

Weigh in, Paul Penzone, joining us out of Phoenix.

PAUL PENZONE, DIRECT OF PREVENTION PROGRAMS, CHILDHELP.ORG, FMR. SERGEANT, PHOENIX PD: The factors contributed to a difficulty for law enforcement, the lack of any kind of filter or security at the school which allowed too many people to come in that day unnoticed.

No attendance policy where they can notify someone to let them know the child was missing. And even with all that being said, victimology, when a child is missing, always starts with -- in the home, the people closest to them and working out because it`s always why that child, why that day, why that opportunity.

So not to cast any disparaging statements, but you have to start with the family and work out and see their opportunity there or who else might have had access. Is there any conflicting issues?

GRACE: Natisha Lance, has the family been cleared?

NATISHA LANCE, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: No, they have not been cleared, Nancy. In fact, police are saying that nobody has been cleared although they are not specifying specific suspect --

GRACE: Who was the last person with him?

LANCE: Last person with him was his stepmother. And police are saying that she is the last person saying that she saw him walking down the hallway.

GRACE: OK. But Matt Shelby, PIO, Portland School District -- thanks for being with us, Matt. Isn`t there a photo of him in front of his science fair project or was that not at the school? Was that photo taken at the school that morning?

Matt Shelby, are you with me? OK. Liz, let me know when you get Shelby.

Natisha, what about that photo? Was that taken at the school that morning?

LANCE: That photo was taken at the school, Nancy. And that is in his classroom. So the science fair wasn`t happening in a designated area like the gym. It was happening in specific classrooms all over.

So Kyron`s exhibit It was in his classroom and he was walking around the school with his stepmother looking at other exhibits in different classrooms.

GRACE: So, Marc, can we establish that he was, in fact, at school that day? There`s no cameras. We`ve got the stepmother saying so.

Marc Klaas, can we establish that he was there?

KLAAS: Oh, no, I don`t know -- I don`t know what we can be established. I thin it`s very unclear. I`ve not heard any real clarification of exactly what happened that morning. And usually in these types of cases, things become very clear from the get-go.

Law enforcement says that the family either is or isn`t involved, and then they move on from there.

GRACE: Right.

KLAAS: But this is just gray area.

GRACE: I think I`ve got Matt Shelby with me.

Matt Shelby, the photo that was taken of him in front of a science fair project, was that taken at the school that morning?

MATT SHELBY, PIO, PORTLAND SCHOOL DISTRICT: Yes, the picture was actually taken in the classroom before the start of the school day. That was Kyron next to his science project. He was seen at the classroom before school with his stepmother.

He was seen again by staff members touring the school and looking at the other science projects.

GRACE: Right.

SHELBY: And that`s the last time anyone from the school actually saw Kyron.

GRACE: Everyone, let`s stop and remember Army Specialist Travis Virgadamo, just 19, Las Vegas, killed Iraq. Also served Civil Air Patrol, a military cadet, got the good conduct medal.

Loved computers, boating, water skiing, sports, animals, dreamed of making his family proud. Leaves behind parents Mary Jane and Bob, godmother Marcy, sister Nicole.

Travis Virgadamo, American hero.

Thanks to our guests but especially you for being with us. I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.

END