Return to Transcripts main page

NANCY GRACE

Anthonys Resist Release of Videotaped Civil Suit Depositions

Aired February 4, 2009 - 20:00:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight in the desperate search for a beautiful 2-year-old Florida girl, Caylee. Six months of searching culminates when skeletal remains found in a heavily wooded area just 15 houses from the Anthonys` confirmed to be Caylee, manner of death homicide, the little girl`s remains completely skeletonized, after a utility meter reader stumbles on a garbage bag containing a tiny human skull (SIC) including a skull covered in light-colored hair. The killer duct tapes the child`s mouth, then finishes off by placing a child`s heart-shaped sticker over the duct tape, little Caylee`s tiny skeleton double-bagged like she`s trash.

Bombshell. Tot mom Casey Anthony takes the 5th, refusing to answer questions under oath in a suit by Zenaida Gonzalez, who the tot mom accuses of kidnapping Caylee. And tonight, brother Lee Anthony`s lawyer announces he, too, may refuse to answer questions. In fact, the whole Anthony family vows they`ll refuse to answer questions if their answers are not kept secret. It`s all set down in just days to be videotaped and released.

And tonight, a date set for a public memorial for Caylee, with grandmother Cindy hand-picking location, flowers, music at 1st Baptist Church, Orlando, seating capacity 5,000. The catch? Every single person attending Caylee`s memorial subject to search. But when will little Caylee actually be put to rest? Caylee`s remains sit alone in a box at a local funeral home, the Anthonys still planning to grieve together with tot mom behind bars via video.

In the last hours, George Anthony walks out of a hospital psych ward after multiple text messages he wants to end his life to be with Caylee. He is home tonight, home but under medical care after staging an elaborate escape plan using side exits, multiple decoy vehicles. And is the investigation of tot mom`s lead defense lawyer reopened? The defense still planning to get out of town, moving the trial out of Orlando, but who`s going to foot the massive bill for the tot mom`s change of venue?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: More developments today in the case of 2-year-old Florida toddler Caylee Anthony. The attorney for grandparents George and Cindy Anthony is reportedly trying to stop the videotaped depositions of George and Cindy from being released.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mitnik and his partners at Morgan and Morgan are planning to invite the media to these depositions and also videotape them.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The attorneys representing the alleged baby-sitter Zenaida Gonzalez say they intend to videotape the questioning of George, Cindy and Lee Anthony and reveal the tapes to the public.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Everyone is going to take their 5th Amendment rights, but in most jurisdictions, you`re allowed to videotape and those videotapes are allowed to be released.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: George Anthony is still scheduled to be deposed by Gonzalez`s attorneys after being released from Halifax Medical Center last night.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s been under close observation since the 23rd of last month after threatening to kill himself.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Cindy Anthony brought George home from the hospital. The family`s attorney says George plans to continue his recovery with outpatient counseling.

GEORGE ANTHONY, CAYLEE`S GRANDFATHER: Is there anything else that you want to say directly to me at all?

CASEY ANTHONY, CAYLEE`S MOTHER: I need to be looked at as a victim. I`m just as much of a victim as the rest of you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: And tonight, a close-knit southwest Florida community reeling after a 6-year-old boy vanishes into thin air, playing on his front lawn with his grandmother. Where is 6-year-old little Adji?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Collier County sheriff`s office has received over 200 tips in the search for missing 6-year-old Adji. A task force of investigators from the local sheriff`s office, the Florida Department of Law Enforcement and the FBI are all assisting in the investigation into what happened to the little boy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Once is hasty. The second time is good. The third time, you`re probably -- you`re probably done. But we`ve done five searches in some of these areas.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thousands of flyers with Adji`s photo and the updated reward of $33,500 will be handed out all across southwest Florida. Nearly 1,500 people have searched 216 square miles for the boy, who was last seen playing with friends just outside his grandmother`s home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This search is not over, and it`s just changing its method of operation. We`ve searched the ground. Now we need to search information.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being us. Tot mom Casey Anthony takes the 5th, and brother Lee Anthony following suit. But now the whole family insists they`ll refuse to answer questions if their testimony is not kept a secret. Why?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: New details emerge in the case of 2-year-old Florida toddler Caylee Anthony. Attorneys representing the alleged baby- sitter, Zenaida Gonzalez, say they will release the videotaped depositions of George, Cindy and Lee Anthony, expected to be completed this month.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How long have you known Zenaida?

CASEY ANTHONY: Almost four years. It`ll be four years Christmas this year.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Anthony family attorney reportedly does not want the tapes to be released and intends to file a protective order to try and keep the tapes from being exposed.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`re telling me that Zenaida took your child without your permission and hasn`t returned her.

CASEY ANTHONY: She`s the last person that I`ve seen with my daughter, yes.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: While the details of the public memorial for Caylee are still being finalized, grandfather George Anthony returned home late last night after being released from a Daytona Beach hospital where he was undergoing psychiatric treatment after allegedly attempting suicide.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The grandfather of the murdered toddler reportedly sent text messages to family members implying he wanted to end his life.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is going to be a very long recovery for George.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It remains unclear whether George`s mental condition will affect his ability to give a deposition in the defamation lawsuit filed against his daughter, tot mom Casey Anthony.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Straight out to Natisha Lance, our producer, standing by at the Orlando jail. Behind those jail walls the tot mom is sitting. Wonder what her reaction has been, Natisha, to he story about her father having to plan an escape route to get out of the hospital all because of her?

NATISHA LANCE, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: That`s a good question, Nancy. But one of the things also that`s going on tonight is that the family does not want the information made in these depositions to go out to the public. What they are saying -- their attorney, Brad Conway, is saying that he will file a protective order in order to keep those depositions out of the public`s hands. And also, the attorney for Lee Anthony, Thomas Luca, is saying that this goes against criminal procedure and that Lee Anthony would cooperate, however, he would not answer questions that have to do with the criminal case because he doesn`t know a lot of details regarding Zenaida Gonzalez to begin with.

GRACE: To Kathi Belich with WFTV. What can you tell me about George Anthony`s escape, essentially, from the hospital?

KATHI BELICH, WFTV: Well, if the family`s private investigator was involved -- we`ve seen this time and time again, with -- sometimes with Casey and sometimes in other situations, where they`ll use several different vehicles and they`ll use different doors. And I think they had a plan to do that. They probably didn`t realize that nobody was camped out at the hospital, and they did this just in case. But they have done it on various occasions to try to circumvent us.

GRACE: To Drew Petrimoulx with WDBO. I understand that side exits were used, and several decoy vehicles?

DREW PETRIMOULX, WDBO: That`s right. There was an exit around the back that they used, a couple of cars that contained, you know, not George Anthony, just so that they could achieve this privacy. The attorney for George Anthony said he really wants some privacy now. The family is trying to heal. Lee Anthony is back at home. So they`re really trying to get back on track. They`re looking forward to the future, to some of the serious things that they`re going to have to face up. And basically, now is a healing time for George and his family.

GRACE: Drew Petrimoulx with WDBO, also joining us at the jailhouse -- Drew, what can you tell me about the whole family saying they`re not going to answer questions under oath if the questions and answers don`t remain secret?

PETRIMOULX: Well, they`re not going to answer questions in front of media cameras. The attorney for Zenaida Gonzalez had said that he was going to actually have media present during the questioning of George, Lee and Cindy. The attorneys say, Not on our watch, we`re not going to let that happen. The only way that they will testify is if the media cameras are not there.

Now, the lawyers for Zenaida Gonzalez can tape it, but the attorney for Lee Anthony has said that that -- releasing that to the media would, in fact, be a violation of the Florida bar. From what I understand, the only way that that could eventually get out to the media is if it was released as part of discovery evidence later on -- that is, if a judge does not block that from being released. So at this time, it doesn`t look like the media will be able to tape those depositions.

GRACE: Right now, those depositions are set to take place in just days. They will be videotaped, and according to many sources, that video will be released to the public. We are taking your calls live. Why doesn`t the Anthony family want their answers to be made public?

Out to Kristen in Canada. Hi, Kristen.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I`m just wondering (INAUDIBLE) George`s recent psychiatric problems, can he still be expected to testify against Casey?

GRACE: Excellent question. Let`s unleash the lawyers. Joining us tonight, Susan Moss out of New York, Richard Herman, veteran defense attorney, Alan Ripka, veteran trial lawyer, as well, also out of New York. What about it, Richard?

RICHARD HERMAN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, I can`t even believe these depositions are going to take place. The lawyers should go in and get a stay, stop the civil case pending an ultimate determination in the criminal case. These people rights. They have 5th Amendment rights. They are potential subjects or witnesses in the criminal case. They should not testify. They should say their name and then take the 5th, period. It`s outrageous.

GRACE: OK. To Susan Moss. Everything Herman just said is contrary to the Constitution. They are not targets. They have not been charged or indicted. The sheriff`s office has given indication the family will not be charged. So how can they avoid answering questions? There`s no privilege between brother-sister or mother-father-daughter. They have nowhere to hide. They`ve got to answer these questions.

SUSAN MOSS, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: Absolutely. That`s why their lawyers are going on all the media outlets, saying that they are subject to obstruction charges or they think they might be arrested. It`s all a big ruse so that they don`t have to answer any questions.

GRACE: Now, Alan Ripka, you know, you know your way around a courtroom. It`s all different for the tot mom, Casey Anthony. She cannot be forced to testify. In fact, if she doesn`t testify at trial, the prosecution cannot even comment on her failure to testify in front of the jury. That would be a comment on her exercising her 5th Amendment right to remain silent. But not so for just a witness. Witnesses have to answer questions, or they`re held in contempt.

ALAN RIPKA, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: They do, Nancy, but the problem here is the following. If the Anthonys are forced to testify at a civil deposition and it goes out to the public, the jury pool, the future jury pool here could be tainted by what`s been said. And what the Anthony attorney should do is make a motion to the court to at least stay those proceedings until after the trial.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She is the light for our day. She`s the brightest little star. She has the most amount of energy. She is extremely curious.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Dear Lord, please watch over our little girl and keep her safe until we find her.

CINDY ANTHONY, CAYLEE`S GRANDMOTHER: Are we going to be able to find her, do you think?

CASEY ANTHONY: I hope we can, Mom.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: With regret, I`m here to inform you that the skeletal remains found on December 11 are those of the missing toddler, Caylee Anthony. The cause of death will be listed as homicide by undetermined means.

CINDY ANTHONY: What do you want me to tell Caylee?

CASEY ANTHONY: That Mommy loves her very much.

I didn`t want to upset Mom, but I mean, I -- for once -- I`ve let you guys talk. I`ve wanted to hear everything that you guys have had to say and more. But at this point, I mean, I can only hold so much back now and hold so much and not show my little bit of frustration with stuff because I`ve been very good about not doing that and about staying calm.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Now the entire Anthony family saying they will refuse to answer questions under oath, to tell the truth under oath, if their answers are made public. We`re talking not about the criminal trial right now, but about a civil case enacted by the real Zenaida Gonzalez, who has apparently lost her home and job because people think she is part of the kidnap of little Caylee.

We`re taking your calls live. Out to Betty in North Carolina. Hi, Betty.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. Love you, love your show and your darling twins.

GRACE: Thank you very much. And thank you for calling in. What`s your question, dear?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nancy, my question concerns evidence. Do you think the state has DNA fingerprints from the duct tape? And if they do, do you think that will be held by the state and set forth at the trial? And is that going to be the final nail in Casey`s coffin?

GRACE: Betty, may I ask you, are you a lawyer or an investigator?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, but I`ve always wanted to be.

GRACE: It shows! Somebody`s been watching court cases!

(LAUGHTER)

GRACE: Out to Tom Shamshak, former chief police. He`s an instructor at Boston University, private eye. Tom, it`s really tough not to leave fingerprints, period, all right? The problem with fingerprints of Casey Anthony is they`re rightfully in that car. They`re rightfully in that car trunk. But on the duct tape, how the heck could you apply duct tape, unless you`re wearing gloves, and not leave fingerprints?

TOM SHAMSHAK, FORMER POLICE CHIEF, PRIVATE INVESTIGATOR: Hi, Nancy. You`re absolutely right. The transfer of fingerprints, perhaps even with a glove, a latex glove, would be able to be identified through forensic analysis. That would be very difficult for her to overcome. How would she explain that? I think that is the nail in the coffin that the caller has just alluded to.

GRACE: And it`s not just that, Tom Shamshak. Remember the child`s heart-shaped sticker that was placed on the duct tape? There could be a fingerprint on that, as well.

SHAMSHAK: I agree with you. You`re absolutely right.

GRACE: You`re going to have more of a problem if you try to look for fingerprints on, for instance, the toy horse inside the bag because her prints may rightfully be on that if she had played with the toy with Caylee in the home. But if her prints are on that bag, on the inside of that bag -- and listen, I know that it was under water for a period of time, but fingerprints, Tom, are actually left by the oil in a person`s hand. And you catch the ridges of someone`s fingertips because of the oil. That`s why, very often, water does not erase fingerprints.

SHAMSHAK: Once again, you`re correct. That`s Fingerprinting 101.

GRACE: So a lot right here. I want to go to the lawyers on Betty`s question. Let`s talk about fingerprints, possible fingerprints, on that duct tape. Then we`re going to be joined by John Morgan, counsel for Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez. Susan Moss, Richard Herman, Alan Ripka -- Richard, fingerprints are treated as scientific evidence, all right, like DNA or drug results. So they`ve got to be handed over to the defense X number of days prior to trial. We don`t know if it`s been handed over yet or not.

HERMAN: I don`t think so. And I think the telltale sign is if her fingerprints are on that duct tape that was around the child`s skull, I think you`re going to see a death penalty in this case.

GRACE: Alan?

RIPKA: Well, I think if there were fingerprints that could be exculpatory -- not hers -- they have to be turned over to the defense, as well.

GRACE: Right, under Brady v. Maryland. Explain the case, Susan, quickly.

MOSS: Well, it`s that all relevant evidence that they come together with has to be brought over to the defense so that the defense can put together what they`d like to present to a jury to explain it away.

GRACE: Under Brady versus Maryland -- it`s a very old case that`s gone up to the U.S. Supreme Court, it originated in Maryland -- the Court ruled that all exculpatory evidence, evidence that suggests the defendant is innocent, must be handed over upon discovery of that evidence to the defense to aid them in their defense at trial.

I want to go back out to Natisha Lance, our producer there at the jail. Natisha, before I go to Gonzalez`s lawyer, what do we know, if anything, about potential fingerprints on that duct tape?

LANCE: Well, we don`t know anything, at this point, Nancy. We`re still waiting for a lot of lab results to come back from the FBI. But there is some discovery that we are expecting to come out next week, so possibly, there could be some results in those documents that come out next week.

GRACE: Yes, and that should be one of the first things to come back because fingerprints are relatively easy to read. And when you`re talking about duct tape, unless she`s wearing gloves, they should be covered in prints.

I want to go back to John Morgan. Everyone, you know John Morgan by now. He is the co-counsel for the mysterious Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez. This is the lady that just rolls into town looking for an apartment, and bam, she`s in the middle of a murder case.

John Morgan, the whole family now saying, We`re not going to answer questions if our answers are made public. What do you make of it?

JOHN MORGAN, CO-COUNSEL FOR ZENAIDA GONZALEZ: I think it`s outrageous. And you know, one of the things everybody`s got to focus on -- and Herman seemed to get agitated up north in New York, but remember this. Not only have we filed a lawsuit, but Casey Anthony has filed a countersuit against Zenaida Gonzalez.

GRACE: For what?

MORGAN: Well, it`s -- the pleadings are kind of weak, but...

GRACE: But what`s her claim against Zenaida Gonzalez? What did she do besides show up?

MORGAN: Oh, potential infliction of emotional distress, damages, you know. And so they filed this lawsuit, and then they say, By the way, we have filed a lawsuit. We`re not...

GRACE: So they want their cake and they want to eat it, too.

MORGAN: Bingo.

GRACE: They don`t want to answer questions, but they want to sue your client.

MORGAN: They want their cake and they want to eat it, too, Nancy.

GRACE: OK. When we come back, we`re going to get to the bottom of it. Does Morgan have a right -- this guy you`re looking at -- have a right to videotape these depositions, then release them to the public? We are taking your calls live.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: George Anthony is back home from the hospital. His little granddaughter, cute little Caylee, is dead and his own daughter, Casey, is charged with the murder. Now he`s going to have to deal with a public memorial.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He`s going through a lot of psychological trauma, and he`s going to have a long journey.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: To Alexis Weed, our researcher. Alexis, does Morgan have a right to depose, ask the Anthony family all these questions under oath and then release that video to the public?

ALEXIS WEED, NANCY GRACE RESEARCHER: Well, Nancy, he can go ahead and depose them, and he can even do that by video. There is no court order needed to take the deposition that way. But Mr. Morgan is the one, if he`s requesting that deposition and that videotape, he is responsible for the safeguarding of that video.

GRACE: So is that a yes or a no? Can he release it to the public?

WEED: He can`t just release it to the public. It would have to be made part of the court file.

GRACE: The civil court file or the criminal court file?

WEED: The civil court file.

GRACE: Well, John Morgan, of course, it`s going to be part of the court file.

MORGAN: Exactly. I don`t know what the big to-do is. We take the deposition, and then we file the deposition and the video with the court file, and then it becomes public. I`m not going to release it to the media.

GRACE: You`re going to put it in the -- you`re going to file it, like you do every other document or item that is part of the civil case or criminal case.

MORGAN: Exactly.

GRACE: So to Ripka, Herman and Moss -- Herman, what`s your beef? Because that makes perfect sense. There`s no way to keep these secret.

HERMAN: My beef is this. Ask Mr. Morgan how many commercials he runs an hour down there in the middle district of Florida?

GRACE: You know what? Just answer the question. Like you -- like you`ve got a leg to stand on. You know, stop it!

HERMAN: I do. I do. But let me tell you something. The reason there was a counter claim against him is because his case is frivolous.

GRACE: So you`re not answering. Ripka, is there a way to keep it secret under the law?

RIPKA: You have to go to the court and ask for an order to hold these documents until after the criminal trial, and then afterwards, they will be released.

GRACE: What will happen, Sue Moss?

MOSS: I think they`re going to let it go.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE ANTHONY, CASEY ANTHONY`S FATHER: My wife fell apart. She said, "George, we lost her. We lost her." I said, "Lost who? Lost who? She said, "Caylee. Caylee."

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: An incomplete family has this grandfather struggling to hold together what`s left of it.

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING CAYLEE: Our family`s broken and we want to have that fixed.

G. ANTHONY: There`s never normalcy at all. I don`t think there was ever actually normal. Just what we consider normal for ourselves.

C. ANTHONY: We know what that means to have our family broken apart by something like tragedy.

G. ANTHONY: I would give my life right now for you and for her, to have you together.

C. ANTHONY: We don`t want this any longer be a tragedy.

G. ANTHONY: My heart is killing me right now to say it to you because if it`s going into my granddaughter is not -- no longer alive, I`m going to try to handle it the best I can. But I need to be there for my wife and my son. We, we need to -- just because it`s only us three left the way I`m looking at it right now. Because if we lost my granddaughter, I`ve lost my daughter.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK, you said he had a couple of bottles of medication.

BRAD CONWAY, THE ANTHONY FAMILY ATTORNEY: Yes. Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you know what kind of medication it was? OK. Are any weapons missing?

CONWAY: No.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK.

CONWAY: But he had a weapon that was confiscated so.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. But nothing that he had on his person or in the house, correct? I just want to verify.

CONWAY: No, no, no.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. All right. All right, we will definitely be sending out a deputy for you. If anything changes or he happens to return.

CONWAY: I`ll call you right away.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Please give us a call right away.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NANCY GRACE, HOST: As the date looms for depositions to be taken, the whole Anthony family insists they will not answer questions under oath, telling the truth under oath, unless those answers are kept secret.

We are taking your calls, out to Gina in Canada. Hi, dear.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. A question. You keep making references to the fact that Caylee has not been laid to rest yet. Could that be a legal issue? Or could it be a financial burden right now for George and Cindy?

GRACE: A legal issue in what sense?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That the child has not been buried yet?

GRACE: Oh you mean could they be sued in some way or held accountable?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, is there a legal reason why -- have they released Caylee for a memorial service?

GRACE: To Drew Petrimoulx with WDBO -- Drew, the defense wanted a second defense autopsy. They got it. It`s been done for weeks. The only thing they`re waiting on are the results from tissue analysis. That does not involve the skeleton. The tissue is already at the crime lab.

Is there any scientific or legal reason they can`t go ahead and have a funeral?

DREW PETRIMOULX, REPORTER, WDBO RADIO: The only thing that I can think of is that if you remember in the court hearings last week, they were given permission to search for themselves the area where Caylee`s remains were found.

If they`re thinking that they may be find something there and then compare it back to the remains that were found, maybe that`s a reason why they are still holding.

GRACE: Drew.

PETRIMOULX: . those remains, but the defense team -- yes?

GRACE: They`ve already been there. The defense converged at the scene where her remains were found days ago.

PETRIMOULX: The only thing that I can think of is maybe they`re still in the process of comparing what they found there to those remains but, again, they haven`t been released to the family for the memorial service yet, so it`s not exactly.

GRACE: They`re sitting at a funeral home. The funeral home can`t keep the remains away from the family? They`re released by the state. The district attorney, the police, the medical examiner, they don`t have the remains anymore.

A private funeral home has the remains. There`s no release to it. The remains belong to the Anthonys, Drew.

PETRIMOULX: Well, it`s the defense team that is holding them at this point and, you know, not letting this funeral go through.

GRACE: Says who?

PETRIMOULX: It`s not the prosecution, it`s the defense team.

GRACE: Says who? Why is the defense not releasing the remains? Are you sure the defense is not releasing them?

PETRIMOULX: As the way I understand it.

GRACE: OK.

PETRIMOULX: . the defense has not yet released the remains to the family.

GRACE: To Leonard Padilla, bounty hunter who helped looked for Caylee, what about it, Leonard? Why aren`t they going forward with burying little Caylee?

LEONARD PADILLA, BOUNTY HUNTER, HELPED LOOK FOR CAYLEE ANTHONY: You know, I know you don`t like my answers usually.

GRACE: Oh, lord, you`re not blaming Cindy Anthony again, are you? If you are.

(LAUGHTER)

PADILLA: No, no. Let me see if I can explain it. I flew in today.

GRACE: Don`t make me come over there.

PADILLA: No, I`m not going to do that, honest. I don`t -- you know, I like your show. I flew in today from California and there was a lady that flew all the way from California today because she heard the memorial was going to be sometime this week.

Another young lady from Maitland was in Hawaii on vacation. She flew back here because she doesn`t want to miss the memorial. So here you have Janet and Dina that fly in for the memorial service, I mean, that`s how it`s affecting a lot of people in this country.

GRACE: What is your point?

PADILLA: Well, the point is that somebody should get their act together and have the memorial. I don`t know if Cindy has the authority to do it or if it`s still in the hands of Jose through his client. I don`t know.

GRACE: Gotcha.

PADILLA: I think -- you know, I don`t want to say this, because I don`t want to upset you but I think Cindy`s the one that has the authority.

GRACE: Oh lord, here you go again.

PADILLA: I know.

GRACE: OK. Hold on. Kathi Belich, with WFTV, a memorial date, apparently, has been set there at the First Baptist Church. In fact, anybody attending is subject to search. But that`s not a funeral. That`s a memorial. That`s not burying or cremating Caylee.

KATHI BELICH, REPORTER, WFTV, COVERING STORY: Right. And I don`t even think that memorial is for sure on the 10th. That was a date that was floated around.

GRACE: Got it.

BELICH: And then we heard that that`s not a sure date. But what -- as I understand it, Casey is Caylee`s mother. She is the one who`s in control of those remains through the defense and the last I heard, the defense was saying that they were waiting for toxicology tests to come back through the autopsy, because they might want to perform their own toxicology tests on the remains.

GRACE: But that`s tissue.

BELICH: And that`s.

GRACE: But that`s on tissue. All that`s -- to be buried as a skeleton, the tissue is at the lab. That`s going to be buried. That remains in evidence. So everything there is to be buried is sitting in a box at a funeral home. But you`re saying it`s up to the tot mom to decide?

BELICH: That`s my understanding.

GRACE: Got it. OK. Now it`s starting to fit together for me.

I want to go back to George Anthony at home. He is still, however, under medical psychiatric treatment.

To Dr. Caryn Stark, psychologist joining us in New York -- what would that be, Caryn?

CARYN STARK, PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, he would be in individual psychotherapy, which would be talk therapy which everyone knows and definitely medications. He would need something that would work right away, so maybe it would be a tranquilizer like a Diazepam, Valium or Librium. And then he would.

GRACE: Whoa, whoa, whoa. Diazepam.

STARK: Diazepam.

GRACE: Valium or Librium. Go ahead.

STARK: And those are addictive so you would want to also switch over to an SSRI or in conjunction which would be a serotonin reuptake inhibitor such as.

GRACE: Serotonin reuptake inhibitor. What is that?

STARK: Prozac, Zoloft, well, the newer ones such as Lexapro. They work within two or three days. So.

GRACE: Don`t some of those, Dr. Marty Makary, joining us from Johns Hopkins. Don`t some of those cause suicidal ideation?

DR. MARTY MAKARY, PHYSICIAN, PROF. OF PUBLIC HEALTH, JOHNS HOPKINS: Yes, the concern is if they`re not given under the direct supervision of a psychiatrist, they can actually make you act on your thinkings, so if you`re incredibly depressed and these anti-depressants make you act on your emotions, you can actually commit suicide or go out and do something.

That`s why psychiatrists keep you away from anything that you can use to harm yourself when you start these medications.

GRACE: So would you advise medication if he is still depressed and -- there`s no way he can`t be depressed with all this going on?

MAKARY: Yes, he definitely needs medication, but it`s a very delicate balance to give it. He needs medication.

GRACE: Well.

MAKARY: . and psychotherapy.

GRACE: Sorry, I didn`t mean to interrupt. To the lawyers, Sue Moss, Richard Herman, Alan Ripka -- now George Anthony, Alan Ripka, is the one in my mind in the Anthony family that stands out that has a reason not to go - - undergo an immediate deposition?

ALAN RIPKA, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, in the state of mind that he`s in, he`s certainly not going to be able to give competent and reliable answers, so just on that alone, or with a medical note from a psychiatrist or psychologist, he could be prevented from doing so.

GRACE: What about it, Richard?

RICHARD HERMAN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I agree with Ripka on that. Absolutely. Are you kidding? He`s probably going to fall asleep in a deposition. He`s going to be medicated. He`s not going to understand the questions. He`s going to slur his words. It`s no good. This guy is not going.

GRACE: I -- don`t know if he`s going to be that bad off. But I think that inflicting a deposition on him right now would just be wrong.

HERMAN: I agree. I don`t think there should be depositions. They should move to dismiss the case.

GRACE: Why?

HERMAN: Why? All she has to say is.

GRACE: Can you put it in a nutshell, just this one time?

HERMAN: All she has to say is, all Casey has to say that`s not the Zenaida I`m referring to and it`s over. He -- call.

GRACE: John Morgan, would that make you happy if she would say on record that much?

JOHN MORGAN, CO-COUNSEL FOR ZENAIDA FERNANDEZ-GONZALEZ, ALLEGED BABYSITTER: Yes. Let me tell the know-it-all from up in New York so he gets his facts straight. We`ve sent her interrogatories, we`ve attached this picture. All she needs to do is say that`s not her. Go ahead and say it.

GRACE: Everybody, we`ll pick it up when we get back. We`re taking your calls live and, of course, the search for 6-year-old Adji. But right now a special hello to a Georgia friend of the show, Missy.

Missy, please stay strong and keep the faith.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CINDY ANTHONY, CASEY ANTHONY`S MOTHER: Do you think that she could be out of the country or anywhere? I know. I know.

C. ANTHONY: Mom, I don`t -- the cops are going through the same thing that has always been, so please stop it. This is why I chose, this is one of the main reasons that I chose dad because he won`t sit there and keep asking the same questions 500 times over like you and Lee have done.

Mom has dominated a lot of the conversation (INAUDIBLE). I mean, you and I, we have been separated for a while and we were just -- I want to see all of you, but I want to see the one person that I have been so far disconnected for the longest and that`s been you.

G. ANTHONY: I`ll think over that. Thank you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Out to the lines, Kathy this Missouri. Hi, Kathy.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. If Caylee`s biological father really died in a car accident, wouldn`t the family have figured that she might have been able -- eligible for Social Security payments?

GRACE: Excellent question. What about it, Sue Moss?

SUSAN MOSS, CHILD ADVOCATE, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: Exactly right. Apparently, though, she didn`t apply for them.

GRACE: But Sue, did that suggest that`s not the true story about the father?

MOSS: Oh there`s no -- more people believe about Zenaida Gonzalez than they believe that this mythical father died in a car crash.

GRACE: You know her story has changed several times regarding the bio-dad of little Caylee, but to Natisha Lance, our producer -- Natisha, isn`t there a DNA parentage report under seal?

NATISHA LANCE, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: That`s right, Nancy. And this is one of the items that the defense has asked for recently, they actually want the DNA results from Jesse Grund who, at one time, was made to believe that he was Caylee`s father. He had a DNA test done which says that he was not the father. But this is one of the things that the defense wants to rule out and figure out probably once and for all who is the father of Caylee.

GRACE: And to Kathi Belich with WFTV -- Kathi, apparently, the memorial that may take place on the 10th is going to be videotaped. So why is everyone attending, every single person attending the memorial subject to search?

BELICH: I -- I don`t know the answer to that question. I know that church is a big church and it handles a lot of the high-profile memorial services in our area and so they are very prepared technically to handle those types of things. Maybe that`s the request of the family for security reasons. I`m not really clear about that.

GRACE: And to Caryn Stark, psychologist -- Caryn, if tot mom is responsible for the delay in Caylee`s funeral, why?

STARK: Well, she`s responsible for everything so far, Nancy, and none of what she does makes any sense. So I would think that she wants to delay as much as she can any kind of closure or finality to this.

GRACE: And Dr. Makary, we know that all`s left -- all that`s left are skeletonized remains, no tissue. There have been two autopsies. What could possibly be the hold on the little girl`s funeral?

MAKARY: You know, I can`t imagine any other evidence coming out of this with all of the forensic experts that have been involved, an amazing dream team in the first autopsy, and then the second autopsy confirmed that. So I think there`s nothing more that`s going to be learned from a forensic medicine standpoint.

GRACE: Right now those depositions set to go down in just a couple of days. The Anthony family insisting they won`t answer questions under oath if the answers are not kept secret.

Right now I want to tell you about a missing little boy. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Calm and quiet. Something this community has been anything but. Helicopters, ATVs, 30 law enforcement agencies and more than 1,000 officers have covered this area desperately searching for 6- year-old Adji Desir.

But the ground search for Adji is over. Deputies say they have covered every inch of this village and the surrounding area. Deputies drove down the mobile (INAUDIBLE) unit in the center of Immokalee`s Farm Worker Village, transitioning to the next phase in the search for Adji.

The sheriff`s office is creating a task force with members of the FBI and Florida Department of Law Enforcement to continue investigating Adji`s disappearance. So far more than 200 tips have come in, none turning into significant leads for investigators who still don`t know if Adji wandered away or was abducted.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: This little boy cannot verbally communicate. He has the mind of a 2-year-old child.

Out to Ryan Mills with the "Naples Daily News". Ryan, the fact that police have called off a ground search, does that mean they believe the child has been kidnapped?

RYAN MILLS, REPORTER, NAPLES DAILY NEWS, COVERING STORY: To be honest with you, at this point, they have not -- they aren`t giving us a word either way. I mean they`re saying that they`re still investigating it, both versions that this kid could have wandered off, he could have been taken.

I think that they`re doing all they can in both directions.

GRACE: To Lieutenant Tom Smith with the special crimes bureau, Collier County Sheriff`s Office. Lieutenant, thank you for being with us. Lieutenant, he has not been found in an extensive ground search. Does this suggest to you Adji was kidnapped?

LT. TOM SMITH, SPECIAL CRIMES BUREAU, COLLIER CO. SHERIFF`S OFFICE: Well, you know, first, let me thank you for keeping Adji fresh in everybody`s mind by updating his story. And you know, I believe, to say that he`s been kidnapped or to assume that he`s been kidnapped, whenever (INAUDIBLE) that we`ve got something that leads us in that direction and we don`t.

GRACE: What do you have?

SMITH: Well, you know, we`ve got a missing 6-year-old that`s developmentally delayed. That`s, you know, we have -- he was last seen 100 feet outside of his home just as dusk was approaching. And we have no witnesses to indicate that he walked off or was taken off.

And so as, you know, Ryan Mills stated, we`re running both avenues but we`ve concluded our ground search.

GRACE: Lt. Smith, you state he was last seen basically in his front yard. Was that witness his grandmother?

SMITH: His grandmother had seen him just prior to that. But we`ve actually identified the last few children that he was playing with in the front yard, playing football, when the young lad who was called home by an older brother. And he was last seen standing just in front of his house.

GRACE: You know, to Dr. Marty Makary, the kid, the child is in his front yard, now he`s gone. It makes me want to not let the twins get out.

MAKARY: Yes, it is highly unlikely at this point that this child could really survive on his own. Occasionally we hear stories of children taken in by families or somebody who doesn`t really realize what`s going on and they don`t watch the news or TV.

GRACE: Back to Lt. Tom Smith. Lieutenant, the reward is up to nearly $35,000 for this little boy. Are tips still coming in?

SMITH: We`re getting a few tips. We`re not getting, obviously, the right tip to lead us in any one direction. We`re asking the community to really start to come forward and try to help us out with giving us some information.

GRACE: I mean, Tom Shamshak, how far could this little boy who`s got the mental capacity of a 2-year-old get on his own?

TOM SHAMSHAK, FMR. POLICE CHIEF, PRIVATE INVESTIGATOR, INSTRUCTOR AT BOSTON UNIV.: That`s a very good question, Nancy. I think that they have conducted an extensive search with all the manpower from the local, state and federal authorities.

I firmly believe, from looking at the map, that that Route 29 that goes through there, this child could very well have been abducted.

GRACE: And, Lieutenant, all the family has been checked out and cleared, right?

SMITH: Yes. They`ve taken polygraphs and their background -- their stories have all, you know, concealed to the point where we`re pretty assured of that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The more eyes out there and the more times this little guy`s face is shown, it`s just the more that, you know, possibilities of somebody actually finding him.

This has never happened in my family so I feel very fortunate but this has happened to this family and.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: . news. Has the family spoken out at all?

MILLS: Nancy, they spoke out, especially the first week this case broke, we had reporters out there, and so did all the other local media, had reporters out there on a daily basis, I mean, from sun up to sun down. And the family came out. I know we had reporters in their home. And obviously they`re very concerned about their son.

GRACE: I know the mother is beside herself.

Everyone, the tip line 800-780-8477, 780-TIPS. There`s a nearly $35,000 reward on little Adji. Please help us.

Let`s stop and remember Army Specialist Steven Fitzmorris, 26, Columbia, Missouri, killed Iraq. Loved traveling, restoring cars, adventure. Once joined the carnival. Charming with a twinkle in his eyes. The sister says he could sell ice to an Eskimo.

Leaves behind mom, Rosemarie, stepdad Michael, sister Michaela, widow Samantha, a 3-year-old son and 2-year-old daughter.

Steven Fitzmorris, American hero.

Thanks to our guests but especially to you for being with us. I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.

END